# Baby rattlesnake in CDT enclosure



## thatrebecca (Jun 8, 2014)

Pretty sure I just saw a baby rattlesnake in one of my CDT enclosures, sunning about a foot from one of the burrows. It was probably 5 or 6 inches long, had the diamond-shaped head, no rattler though. 

Uhhh... so... now what? Does seeing one mean there are likely more? Is he apt to bother my 6- to 7-inch CDTs? I also have a dog. 

I like reptiles, but I didn't invite this particular fella over for Sunday brunch.


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## wellington (Jun 8, 2014)

Wow. Well most likely there is more, like the mommy for one, some place not too far. I don't know that they would hurt your torts, but am interested in what the more experienced will have to say.


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## bouaboua (Jun 8, 2014)

I don't like any snake at all. If it is in my yard I only have one way to "take care" of it.

Sorry! ! The snake lover.


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## leigti (Jun 8, 2014)

I'm no expert but I think rattlesnakes Gromore rattles as I get older. I have also heard that the babies are actually more poisonous than the adults. I don't know if either one of those are true because I try not to get close enough to Rattlesnake to find out! But if I were you I would definitely be getting rid of that snake in any others you find. Maybe there are some snake experts in your area that would come and find them and take them away for you. Sorry I couldn't be more help, I'm sure somebody with more knowledge will come along soon. Definitely keep your dog away from the snake and the snake may bother your tortoises if they get close to it.


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## Yvonne G (Jun 8, 2014)

Don't quote me on this, but I THINK that tortoises and rattlesnakes occasionally share the same burrows in the wild.


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## Team Gomberg (Jun 8, 2014)

Yvonne G said:


> Don't quote me on this, but I THINK that tortoises and rattlesnakes occasionally share the same burrows in the wild.



I've heard this, too. I believe it was from the DTPS.


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## thatrebecca (Jun 8, 2014)

They are definitely roommates from time to time...

http://fieldherper.com/2011/01/31/roomies-desert-tortoises-and-rattlesnakes/


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## ascott (Jun 8, 2014)

For your reference;

http://www.californiaherps.com/identification/snakesid/snakes.id.html

Also, you may have a simple case of mis id.....not saying you did not see a rattler, but often;

http://www.bcreptiles.ca/rattler_vs_westterrgarter.htm

Many creatures rely on the CDTs excavation skills;

http://www.unce.unr.edu/publications/files/ho/other/fs9555.pdf


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## Tom (Jun 8, 2014)

Rattlesnakes are born bigger than 5-6" and new borns will have a little nub on the end of their tail, as opposed to the tip tapering to a point as in most snakes.

I'd love to see a pic.

Our commonly seen native gopher snakes can also have a somewhat triangular head and to confuse the matter more, they will often "rattle" their tail amongst the leaf litter. I can't tell you how many emergency rattle snake calls I've responded to only to find a harmless gopher snake. They are so tame that you can pick up the wild ones with your hand and not get bit.

Did your snake appear yellowish or brownish at all?

If it was truly a newborn rattler, be on the lookout. The moms can drop 20-30 babies at a time. Its a little early in the season for them to be dropping babies though.


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## Tom (Jun 8, 2014)

Here are some random internet pics. Does one of these look like yours?


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## thatrebecca (Jun 8, 2014)

I looked at the link Angela posted and I think what I saw was a gopher snake, like you say, Tom. It was yellowish brown, and pretty skinny. Its head seemed to flatten out when it spotted me, which may be what made it look like a rattler. I wish I'd gotten a pic, but I turned around to bring the dog inside and when I came back out with my phone he'd gone.

If it is a gopher snake, will it hurt the torts? I'm delighted at the prospect that this guy might eat some of the gophers that wreck my lawn. In fact, I'm tempted to put out a welcome mat.


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## thatrebecca (Jun 8, 2014)

We were typing at the same time, Tom. The guy slithering around the camera lens looks just like what I saw.


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## Tom (Jun 8, 2014)

It is unlikely that either species will harm your tortoise.
Gophers are a bit of a generalist. They will eat anything small enough to overpower. As babies they eat mostly lizards. As they gain size they will eat smaller rattlers and eventually move up to mammals and birds. They are really cool snakes and I must admit to being a fan.


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## thatrebecca (Jun 8, 2014)

Tom said:


> It is unlikely that either species will harm your tortoise.
> Gophers are a bit of a generalist. They will eat anything small enough to overpower. As babies they eat mostly lizards. As they gain size they will eat smaller rattlers and eventually move up to mammals and birds. They are really cool snakes and I must admit to being a fan.



Last fall we found what looked like a gopher skin in our wood pile. Wonder if this is the same guy. (We've actually moved that wood pile to the DT enclosure he was in today). At any rate, welcome to the neighborhood, my slithering friend.


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## lisalove (Jun 8, 2014)

I just caught a tiny king snake in my yard. About the diameter of a pencil. 
I guess it's that time again!
Of course I wished it well and let it go...hopefully to kill any rattlers that want to enter my yard!


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## lisalove (Jun 8, 2014)

lisalove said:


> I just caught a tiny king snake in my yard. About the diameter of a pencil.
> I guess it's that time again!
> Of course I wished it well and let it go...hopefully to kill any rattlers that want to enter my yard!


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## lisalove (Jun 8, 2014)

thatrebecca said:


> We were typing at the same time, Tom. The guy slithering around the camera lens looks just like what I saw.



A diamond back rattlesnake is what appears to be slithering around the camera lens.


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## Moozillion (Jun 9, 2014)

I've read that the reason immature rattlesnakes are actually more dangerous than adults is because the adults have better control of their "venom delivery." That is, they often choose to just inject SOME, while reserving some. The immature ones haven't developed that kind of control yet and just unleash the whole load with their first bite. 

I don't know if this is true or not, and I do NOT intend to find out in a field trial!!!!


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## N2TORTS (Jun 9, 2014)

Here is just a Lil' guy ......


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## thatrebecca (Jun 9, 2014)

lisalove said:


> A diamond back rattlesnake is what appears to be slithering around the camera lens.


 
Crud, really?


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## keepergale (Jun 10, 2014)

Lisalove the snake in your picture is not a king snake. It is a shovelnosed snake. Harmless but not a rattlesnake eater.


Sent from my iPhone using TortForum


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## DeanS (Jun 10, 2014)

If it truly is a rattler...it's most likely a Southern Pacific...given that you're in LA. When they're young...they can be dark brown, gray or black. But, this is what they ALL look like when they mature...this would be mom.


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## lisalove (Jun 10, 2014)

Little cutie!!!


keepergale said:


> Lisalove the snake in your picture is not a king snake. It is a shovelnosed snake. Harmless but not a rattlesnake eater.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using TortForum


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