# Desert Tort Fungal Treatment Question and General Update On Steven Q. Tortoise



## the_newzie (Feb 8, 2015)

So after monitoring what we initially hoped to be a mark left from rubbing or minor impact and allowing for time to heal, it looks like Steve's plastron weirdness is some type of fungus.


So I read up and figure I will try a course of 1% clotrimazole. My biggest question after reading is there a general consensus as to the best application method? Any guidance would be appreciated. 
On the brighter side if things, Steve is up 10g (he's a full 40g now!) from when I started weighing him a few months back. He's a ferocious little eater who seems tobe doing great aside from the plastron weirdness.


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## Yvonne G (Feb 8, 2015)

He's a beautiful color. Good luck on the treatment.


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## ascott (Feb 8, 2015)

the_newzie said:


> So after monitoring what we initially hoped to be a mark left from rubbing or minor impact and allowing for time to heal, it looks like Steve's plastron weirdness is some type of fungus.
> View attachment 117755
> 
> So I read up and figure I will try a course of 1% clotrimazole. My biggest question after reading is there a general consensus as to the best application method? Any guidance would be appreciated.
> ...




What is the substrate like and what is the enclosure like? What created the potential shell issue?


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## the_newzie (Feb 8, 2015)

Shell issue has been there since I got him this summer. Substrate is coco coir and enclose is 3x4 temporary winter habitat.


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## ascott (Feb 8, 2015)

the_newzie said:


> Shell issue has been there since I got him this summer. Substrate is coco coir and enclose is 3x4 temporary winter habitat.




Is the enclosure the high humidity method? Is the substrate moist/wet all over?


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## the_newzie (Feb 8, 2015)

60% avg humidity.


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## the_newzie (Feb 8, 2015)

The coco coir seems to hold moisture pretty decently without being damp. Usually top layer looks dry but the humidity gauge doesn't dip below 40%.


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## Yvonne G (Feb 9, 2015)

Hey! I see that it's your birthday today! I hope you have a wonderful day. Don't eat too much cake.


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## the_newzie (Feb 9, 2015)

Thanks!!!


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## Iochroma (Feb 9, 2015)

Since no one has mentioned it, this would be a good reason to change the substrate, and sanitize the habitat.


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## ascott (Feb 9, 2015)

the_newzie said:


> The coco coir seems to hold moisture pretty decently without being damp. Usually top layer looks dry but the humidity gauge doesn't dip below 40%.




So you keep the humidity up around 60% all of the time? in the entire enclosure? That is kinda high for the entire enclosure --especially for this species. But onward here---what type of objects do you have in the enclosure? Rocks, rough surfaces? If you keep a water dish in the enclosure, what type of material is the dish made from? and how high are the edges?


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## the_newzie (Feb 9, 2015)

Iochroma said:


> Since no one has mentioned it, this would be a good reason to change the substrate, and sanitize the habitat.



Both things are on my to do list for today. I wanted to hold off until I could build him a bigger better enclosure and just switch him over but life rarely works out the way I want.


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## the_newzie (Feb 9, 2015)

ascott said:


> So you keep the humidity up around 60% all of the time? in the entire enclosure? That is kinda high for the entire enclosure --especially for this species. But onward here---what type of objects do you have in the enclosure? Rocks, rough surfaces? If you keep a water dish in the enclosure, what type of material is the dish made from? and how high are the edges?


The addition of higher humidity has seemed to help him out a lot (started out much dryer, but gradually raised it upon research and advice of desert tort owners on this forum). The rot pre dates the inside enclosure humidity so I'm pretty sure that wasn't the cause (though it may have exaserbated the pre existing condition). Nothing crazy in the habitat, just a flat paver under the mvb for basking and the water dish is one of the small dishes that goes under a flower pot. He has 2 hides one on either side of enclosure. Everything gets cleaned regularly. I tried to make everything along the lines of the hatchling enclosure threads I've found here. It's not as fancy as some but it's my first winter. Next year will be bigger and better. Thanks for all the help and tips!


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## the_newzie (Feb 9, 2015)

ascott said:


> So you keep the humidity up around 60% all of the time? in the entire enclosure? That is kinda high for the entire enclosure --especially for this species. But onward here---what type of objects do you have in the enclosure? Rocks, rough surfaces? If you keep a water dish in the enclosure, what type of material is the dish made from? and how high are the edges?


Oh also I should say I don't have one of those temp/humidity point and click readers (maybe i get one for my bday?), so I can't say the 60% is for my whole enclosure, I just have one humidity gauge that floats between 40-60 depending on how recently I've moistened the coir.


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## ascott (Feb 9, 2015)

the_newzie said:


> The addition of higher humidity has seemed to help him out a lot (started out much dryer, but gradually ). The rot pre dates the inside enclosure humidity so I'm pretty sure that wasn't the cause (though it may have exaserbated the pre existing condition). Nothing crazy in the habitat, just a flat paver under the mvb for basking and the water dish is one of the small dishes that goes under a flower pot. He has 2 hides one on either side of enclosure. Everything gets cleaned regularly. I tried to make everything along the lines of the hatchling enclosure threads I've found here. It's not as fancy as some but it's my first winter. Next year will be bigger and better. Thanks for all the help and tips!




I personally would either remove the flat paver from under the basking spot (try out for a bit---if the paver is directly in line with the hot source, it can get pretty darn hot...and to a baby it can cause damage to the shell...perhaps you can try for a bit to maybe move the rock off to the side, just out of direct line with the hot source and see if that can also offer some help..... 



> raised it upon research and advice of desert tort owners on this forum


 so someone told you to put this species in a closed chamber with high constant humidity? That was bad advise then....period.

Pre existing condition would indicate that you are aware of the environment from which this baby came from? Where was the baby hatched? Captive or wild?


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## the_newzie (Feb 9, 2015)

Yvonne G said:


> He's a beautiful color. Good luck on the treatment.


Yeah, thanks to all the good advice, he's doing sooo much better nowadays!!!


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## the_newzie (Feb 9, 2015)

ascott said:


> I personally would either remove the flat paver from under the basking spot (try out for a bit---if the paver is directly in line with the hot source, it can get pretty darn hot...and to a baby it can cause damage to the shell...perhaps you can try for a bit to maybe move the rock off to the side, just out of direct line with the hot source and see if that can also offer some help.....



Sounds like something good to try. I will offset the stone when I redo the substrate today and see if that helps.



ascott said:


> so someone told you to put this species in a closed chamber with high constant humidity? That was bad advise then....period.


I'm not experienced enough to argue for or against, but I can say that the members who advised me to raise the humidity of my habitat are members who have given me good advice and therefor earned my trust. But then again, if I'm not mistaken, you've given me good advice too in the past, so I'll defer to your experience. Maybe 40-60% is too high, what would you recommend? Humid hide only? maybe take it down to 30-40% Any suggestion would be appreciated.



ascott said:


> Pre existing condition would indicate that you are aware of the environment from which this baby came from? Where was the baby hatched? Captive or wild?


Nope, pre existing condition means that when I got him, it was one of the first thing I noticed. Only background I have is this: an ex-co-worker mentioned that one of the captive desert torts she had (adopted to the best of my knowledge (we are not in contact any more)) turned out to be pregnant and she needed people to adopt the babies that hatched. I was too inexperienced to know to ask questions and get all the info that i could and now that I know better, I have no way to contact her to find out. Either way, when I got Steve, he was very small, had the soft plastron and ever since then it's been an uphill battle to get him back on track. I've finally got him to where he's energetic, eating like a champ and gaining weight steadily.


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## the_newzie (Feb 9, 2015)

Okay, substrate changed out, enclosure sanitized. Basking stone offset. 

But back to my original question, any advice for application of antifungal cream? Dilute it? Wash it off after x amount of minutes? leave it on but keep him in a dry box to keep it from getting dirty? I've read stuff saying a lot of different things, just wondering if anyone can give me pointers from first hand experience.


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## the_newzie (Feb 9, 2015)

Fresh and clean!!


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## ascott (Feb 10, 2015)

the_newzie said:


> View attachment 117916
> Fresh and clean!!




Hi....is the area at all moist/wet/smelly/oooeey gooey? Or is the area simply not the same pattern/texture as the surrounding area?


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## the_newzie (Feb 10, 2015)

On his plastron? Nothing moist or wet, overall, it's just not same pattern and texture. There are two small spots that are more prominent and appear more "off" & slightly raised. Those spots look decidedly fungus-y. If this antifungal doesn't work, I'm just taking him to vet.


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## ascott (Feb 11, 2015)

the_newzie said:


> On his plastron? Nothing moist or wet, overall, it's just not same pattern and texture. There are two small spots that are more prominent and appear more "off" & slightly raised. Those spots look decidedly fungus-y. If this antifungal doesn't work, I'm just taking him to vet.




Just keep in mind that the treatment can take a couple of weeks before you may notice any change....if indeed the different areas are an infection and not simply the difference in the shell....


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## the_newzie (Feb 11, 2015)

ascott said:


> Just keep in mind that the treatment can take a couple of weeks before you may notice any change....if indeed the different areas are an infection and not simply the difference in the shell....


I will. I was going to do a 2 week course and then see where we are. Hopefully it'll be simple for once. Lol.


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## ascott (Feb 11, 2015)

the_newzie said:


> I will. I was going to do a 2 week course and then see where we are. Hopefully it'll be simple for once. Lol.




You could also have the area swabbed and tested...this way you would know if you are indeed dealing with and issue vs a shell texture difference???? Just saying


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## the_newzie (Feb 11, 2015)

Yeah, that'd be the next step if antifungal cream treatment doesn't show results.


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