# New Member in need of assistance....



## sharonland (Jul 16, 2010)

I'm so happy to finally be able to post on this forum, it took me a couple days to get the activation email and I was going crazy with worry... I promise to upload photos in a minute but wanted to at least get the ball rolling on the background and help I need. I have 2 torts, one russian that I have had for 3 years and a 11 month old desert I got as a hatchling. Both are keeped in seperate areas on my screened in porch. They both have been doing well UNTIL last sunday when I noticed a small crusty spot on the deserts left foot. I cleaned the area with distilled water and applied some bacitracin. Monday-Wed it looked the same, I keeped cleaning it and it seemed okay... No difference in eating or activity. ( they both eat tortoise mega diet with leafy greens mixed in.) Thursday morning the whole leg and muscle was swollen, my baby was just dragging his foot. I was horrified... I called the vet on your list which by the way is no longer in business (north carolina) so I settled on an exotic animal hospital I found. Doc said it looked septic and took him in the back for some blood work. When he returned my baby had a hole in his skin where the the doctor had peeled off an area that had pus under it. I hope I am getting all the details to you all as I am really worried and upset about all this... Instructions are to soak my DT in Chlorhexidine Disinfectant Solution (small amount mixed with water) for 5 min. Dry area, add a small amount of Gentocin to the wound. Also, inject 2 units of Baytril plus 8 units of saline into muscle once daily for 30 days. he said as long as my tort was still eating that it had a fighting chance of survival. So, here is where I need help... I need to set up a hospital tank. I would like exact instructions on how to inject into the muscle without causing to much pain. I have a med size rubbermaid container with papertowels for flooring as well as UVB light for now, but need to know exactly what to do and how to keep my baby alive. After the vet visit my baby seems more lethargic and does'nt want anything eat. I'm sure my baby is mad at me for that torture. By the way, my baby's name is speedy... I guess I should have mentioned that earlier. I have read this forum from top to bottom and have found nothing to compare to this wound. I love all the advise you give and am so happy to be on this forum for all my questions.... Okay, so start asking away.. I'm ready !!!!


----------



## spikethebest (Jul 16, 2010)

I am not 100% sure what is up, and I know you will post more pics, so I will wait for those, and see what everyone else has to say as well. I will ask around for you as well. 

I wish you and your tort the best. 

cant wait to see more pics.


----------



## sharonland (Jul 16, 2010)

A few more pictures showing more detail..






Uploaded with ImageShack.us




Uploaded with ImageShack.us


----------



## Yvonne G (Jul 16, 2010)

Hi Sharon:

My first question is how on earth did you manage to get a desert tortoise in North Carolina?

That leg looks terrible. I'm so glad you were able to take him to the vet. Did he have any idea how the original injury occurred? Insect bite? Foxtail?

Your idea for a hospital tank sounds good. Keep him in the house so flies can't lay eggs on it. Because of the infection, you want the habitat to be a little warmer than normal.

I'm afraid there's nothing you can do to ease the pain of those injections. Baytril, even mixed 2/8 like it is, stings like crazy. But not quite as bad as a straight Baytril injection. 

Sorry to welcome you under these circumstances, but welcome to the forum!!


----------



## Scooter (Jul 16, 2010)

I don't know what is wrong but wish both your and your little guy the best of luck for a quick recovery. Also welcome to the forum!


----------



## Yvonne G (Jul 16, 2010)

Hi Sharon:

I think I would be remiss if I didn't let you know that to take a desert tortoise out of his native state is against the law.


----------



## spikethebest (Jul 16, 2010)

emysemys said:


> Hi Sharon:
> 
> I think I would be remiss if I didn't let you know that to take a desert tortoise out of his native state is against the law.



I highly doubt this tortoise was hatched in california, then brought to North Carolina. 

I think the parents were transported, and they laid eggs, and the human caretakers gave the hatchlings away to people with little or no education at all. 

Just a guess.


----------



## Yvonne G (Jul 16, 2010)

spikethebest said:


> I highly doubt this tortoise was hatched in california, then brought to North Carolina.
> 
> I think the parents were transported, and they laid eggs, and the human caretakers gave the hatchlings away to people with little or no education at all.
> 
> Just a guess.



In another thread Sharon tells us that she used to live in Arizona, where she was given the desert tortoise.


----------



## egyptiandan (Jul 16, 2010)

You'll have to use the backs of the front legs for injections, with the back leg looking like that. Alternate front legs for the shots. 
Hospital tanks are good. Use a small enough container that you can heat to 86F day and night for the whole treatment time. A white terry cloth towel makes a good substrate. Have 2 so you can change every day and wash the dirty one. 
I have to tell you it's going to be very hard to save that leg, but make sure you keep up with everything. If the skin ruptures, get back to the vets right away.

Danny


----------



## spikethebest (Jul 16, 2010)

emysemys said:


> spikethebest said:
> 
> 
> > I highly doubt this tortoise was hatched in california, then brought to North Carolina.
> ...



yea now i see that. sorry, i stand corrected!


----------



## sharonland (Jul 16, 2010)

I totally understand your thoughts of me having a desert in North Carolina, in fact I contacted fish and game to get permission to take the baby out of state, but because I received it from a family that has raised deserts since 1981 and was given the baby as a gift I am not under the law of no transportation out of state. I have a letter from the owners that gives me ownership of the baby as a gift. I also contacted North Carolina Fish and Game and asked if I needed a permit to own it here in this state and they kinda laughed and said in their nicest southern draw... NOPE !!!


----------



## spikethebest (Jul 16, 2010)

people are not the owners of desert tortoises. the state owns every desert tortoise. people are just the registered caretakers, and thats it.


----------



## sharonland (Jul 16, 2010)

emysemys said:


> spikethebest said:
> 
> 
> > I highly doubt this tortoise was hatched in california, then brought to North Carolina.
> ...



I feel that saying that "the human caretakers gave the hatchlings away to people with little or no education at all" a little harsh as you have no idea what kind of education I have about tortoises. I just like you had to start somewhere, I'm sure you asked for advise before you became a tortoise genius... Because I am asking for help for a baby desert that is sick I automatically become ignorant. I was ready for the big punches you all were going to give me and knew that even though it may hurt a little I would be better educated after the smoke blew over. So, I say thank you for your wonderful advise....


----------



## spikethebest (Jul 16, 2010)

I in no way intended to make it sound like I was talking about you. You obviously know what you are doing. 

In previous experiences, people hatch out desert tortoises (illegally), then just give them away to people, without informing them of how to properly take care of them. 

In no way, did I want you to think or assume I was saying you are uneducated or ignorant. My deepest apologizes.


----------



## sharonland (Jul 16, 2010)

spikethebest said:


> I in no way intended to make it sound like I was talking about you. You obviously know what you are doing.
> 
> In previous experiences, people hatch out desert tortoises (illegally), then just give them away to people, without informing them of how to properly take care of them.
> 
> In no way, did I want you to think or assume I was saying you are uneducated or ignorant. My deepest apologizes.



Thank You for your nice reply...


----------



## Maggie Cummings (Jul 16, 2010)

Please please don't leave...
Gopherus agassizii are my most favorite species and I am living out of California now and can't have any...so I was kinda hanging back until "the smoke blew over" as I knew Yvonne would have to say something...now did I miss the diagnosis? What caused this leg swelling originally? My heart is breaking for you and Speedy, and I feel helpless. I am good with sick and wounds but I haven't seen anything like what you have. A bot fly maybe?
Cover half of your hospital tank with aluminum foil to help keep in the heat. He needs to be kept warmer. Get some radicchio as no desert tort baby can resist the red and the stuff is good for him. I am confident that will get him eating again. He needs to eat. If he stops completely fan his nose with the radicchio...he most likely will bite at it. That's my experience anyway. If he were mine I would wrap him in a towel and hold him, or put him in front of the monitor just so he knows I am paying attention to him. Please keep us posted and know that not one of us doesn't feel for you. We all are praying for Speedy...


----------



## elvis (Jul 16, 2010)

Sharon welcome to the forum. So sorry about your little guy. Sounds to me like you are all over the situation, and rather quickly. Good for you. Please keep us posted on your little guys progress. Did the vet or does anyone else here have any idea what the cause of this could be? Tammy


----------



## RV's mom (Jul 16, 2010)

Welcome to the forum Sharon. I send along to you and your tort wishes for good recovery. Lots of us out here wishing same.

teri


----------



## sharonland (Jul 17, 2010)

Thank You for all the well wishes, Baby Speedy made it through the night and did eat a little last night before I tortured him with that big ol' needle.. I'm really unsure how he was injured, I don't have anything in or around him that could have done this. I do let both my torts play in the yard in the evenings under close supervision and think maybe something bit him. The Vet seems to think it was done some time ago and just now worked it's way through his body and into his joints. The wound on his leg was a solid white area that the vet took off. The vet stated that it was a pus pocket...


----------



## sharonland (Aug 11, 2010)

**Update* on Speedy *

Well it's been about 3 weeks and Speedy is still in his little indoor hospital. His original sore is almost totally healed but he has developed others on his body. Has anyone ever seen anything like this? He receives his Baytril each day with baths and ointment for his sores.. The sore on his front leg looks as if it is a scab and getting ready to come off. He is eating well and other than the sores, he acts just fine. He goes back to the vet next week for a check up... Here is the new photos taken today.





[/img]



[/img]



[/img]



[/img]



[/img]



[/img]



[/img]


----------



## travisgn (Aug 11, 2010)

Very interesting story. So his activity level and appetite have improved but the sores have persisted and spread? Seems very unlikely that an insect bite or infection could persist for several weeks. Possibly genetic? Just my intuition...

Best of luck!



Travis


----------



## Maggie Cummings (Aug 11, 2010)

Now that it's too late I am also giving injections for an infection like that with sores that open in different places but my cultures came back positive for TB. I have to give Baytril daily also but I can dilute the drug with sterile saline so it doesn't sting so much. Did your dr culture the sores like mine did?


----------



## dmmj (Aug 12, 2010)

Poor little guy, will keep him in my thoughts, hope to hear some good news soon.


----------



## Yvonne G (Aug 12, 2010)

Oh, Sharon: This is just heartbreaking news! I hate to see little desert tortoises in trouble like Speedy is. When you go back to the vet please ask him to culture the pus in one of the wounds. Baytril is a harsh antibiotic, but it is a good one. It really works. I hope Speedy gets well soon.


----------



## sharonland (Aug 13, 2010)

You all made me think and I do remember the vet doing a culture. I haven't heard anything back negative, but will make sure to ask next week when we go back. He is a stong little fella. I truly think he will come out of this okay.. I will keep everyone updated....


----------



## Madortoise (Aug 15, 2010)

Welcome Sharon.
I hope the Vet can get a clear diagnosis and treatment identified for him. Keep us posted.


----------

