# tortoise tragedy :(



## russian tortoise boy (Dec 8, 2012)

hi guys, im so sad right now because my russian tortoise was attacked by my dog.

okay here is the story, i put my tort outside for some sun light so i locked the backyard door so my dog wouldn't go outside. then i went to my room to do some stuff. then, after a while i was calling my dog and she didn't came so i was worried.
and it was my sister's fault because she let my dog outside but i told her not to like 20 minutes ago, then i saw my dog chewing on my tort  . i grab my tort and saw her belew shell the upper part of it was like white and some blood on it, and the upper shell was gone and she lost a nail. can you tell me what medicine or what do i do!

and should i put her in a substrate or no, and about my dog, she tasted some of my tort she will get salmonella or no? please helppppppppppppppp!


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## Yvonne G (Dec 8, 2012)

You can just practice first aid on the tortoise, but it will need to see a vet to get some antibiotics.

The dog is not going to be harmed by chewing on the tortoise.


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## wellington (Dec 8, 2012)

So sorry this happened. I would deff take it to a vet. Sounds bad. Post pics, it might help us to help you more. I also wouldn't use substrate, only paper towel for now.


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## shellysmom (Dec 8, 2012)

Oh my gosh, how awful. When you say, "the upper shell was gone," that really sounds bad, like you need the Emergency Vet ASAP. But maybe you don't actually mean the entire top of its shell is gone??? Can you post some photos of the injuries???


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## russian tortoise boy (Dec 8, 2012)

shellysmom said:


> Oh my gosh, how awful. When you say, "the upper shell was gone," that really sounds bad, like you need the Emergency Vet ASAP. But maybe you don't actually mean the entire top of its shell is gone??? Can you post some photos of the injuries???


oh i didn't mean the whole upper shell was gone i mean the shel near the head was a little bit torn off,

i was just shaking when i typed this so i don't know what to write


here is the pictures

warning : kinda gross for some people


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## shellysmom (Dec 8, 2012)

russian tortoise boy said:


> shellysmom said:
> 
> 
> > Oh my gosh, how awful. When you say, "the upper shell was gone," that really sounds bad, like you need the Emergency Vet ASAP. But maybe you don't actually mean the entire top of its shell is gone??? Can you post some photos of the injuries???
> ...



OK, whew! If the amount of physical damage is not too much, the biggest thing you have to worry about is infection in the puncture wounds from the dog's teeth. If you have iodine or betadine solution, you can mix that with 50/50 with water and give your tort's wounds a good rinse with that. the 50/50 solution is also safe for the eyes, if you happen to drip a little in while trying to rinse the front of the shell. Then use paper towels for his substrate so he doesn't get any dirt or anything in the wounds, and make sure he has a heat source on all night so that he can stay nice and warm. Do you have a CHE or black light or something? 

You should probably take him to the vet to get him checked out, to make sure nothing was crushed or punctured internally, and maybe get some antibiotics. What kind/how big is the dog that got him?


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## russian tortoise boy (Dec 8, 2012)

shellysmom said:


> russian tortoise boy said:
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> > shellysmom said:
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did you saw the pics?? its right there you will see how big is the damage. and my dog is a pitbull . and my tort is fine right now he is walking like nothing hsppen


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## shellysmom (Dec 8, 2012)

shellysmom said:


> russian tortoise boy said:
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Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, just saw the photos. Not good. If it were my tortoise, I'd consider taking it to the ER vet ASAP for a couple of reasons: 
1) It's probably in a lot of pain, having that much of its shell scraped off; and 
2) It looks like the dog may have had it for a while, and it's entirely possible that the force of the dog's jaws damaged something internal, like an important organ... You might want to get him some x-rays


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## mainey34 (Dec 8, 2012)

Oh, my...im so sorry...try to be calm. Just glad she is alive...


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## shellysmom (Dec 8, 2012)

Pit Bull. Ugh. They have such freakishly strong jaws... If my pittie got a hold of a tort like that, I'd definitely rush it to a vet to get looked at. Is there even an ER vet in your area that sees reptiles? Probably not, huh?  

Your tort may also be walking around looking like normal because it's in shock... I don't know... It's hard to tell from photos. Maybe the damage is not as bad as I'm thinking???? Whatever you decide to do, good luck.


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## russian tortoise boy (Dec 8, 2012)

can i put betadine in her wounds?


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## shellysmom (Dec 8, 2012)

russian tortoise boy said:


> can i put betadine in her wounds?



Yes, but mix it half and half with water, and you can sort of just rinse her off with it.


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## Baoh (Dec 8, 2012)

Are there any deep body puncture wounds? If not, you can probably get by with cleaning followed by topical antiseptic application. I would keep it on paper towels for a while. While the damage is done, it appears to be superficial and should heal over easily enough. Make sure it keeps drinking and eating regularly. Avoid soaks if it has antiseptic compounds on it. Let it drink from a very shallow dish for a while.

Take care.


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## russian tortoise boy (Dec 8, 2012)

oh wait, can i use hydrogen peroxide in her


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## laura13617 (Dec 8, 2012)

I hope she is ok. Our healing thoughts go out to her...


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## sibi (Dec 8, 2012)

I would NOT use hydrogen peroxide. It actually can cause pain and more damage to the soft tissue under the shell. Use betadine solution, and see a vet asap.


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## BodaTort1 (Dec 8, 2012)

As an Emergency Room nurse I will tell you what I tell my human Patients... Throw away the hydrogen peroxide!!! It is bad for new skin cells/wounds trying to heal. We ONLY use hydrogen peroxide to get blood out of our scrubs!! The rule for wounds is.. If you wouldn't put it on/in your eye then don't use it on open wounds.


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## arotester (Dec 8, 2012)

sorry to hear that,i wish the tort makes a speedy recovery.


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## Laura (Dec 8, 2012)

your dog will seek out this new chew toy.. :-( so you are going to have to be extra carefull. and build a dog proof enclosure...
good luck.. hope everything heals ok


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## russian tortoise boy (Dec 8, 2012)

shellysmom said:


> Pit Bull. Ugh. They have such freakishly strong jaws... If my pittie got a hold of a tort like that, I'd definitely rush it to a vet to get looked at. Is there even an ER vet in your area that sees reptiles? Probably not, huh?
> 
> Your tort may also be walking around looking like normal because it's in shock... I don't know... It's hard to tell from photos. Maybe the damage is not as bad as I'm thinking???? Whatever you decide to do, good luck.


it not that serious, its just her outer shell was removed but theirs no cracks or serious damage




BodaTort1 said:


> As an Emergency Room nurse I will tell you what I tell my human Patients... Throw away the hydrogen peroxide!!! It is bad for new skin cells/wounds trying to heal. We ONLY use hydrogen peroxide to get blood out of our scrubs!! The rule for wounds is.. If you wouldn't put it on/in your eye then don't use it on open wounds.


ohhhhhhhhh nooooooooooooo! i already putted hydrogen peroxide!!! but someone told me to put topical antiseptic on it and i saw on the bottle was topical antiseptic.

and i forgot to tell that it was written like this 

HYDROGEN PEROXIDE 3%

so it was only 3%


this is the antiseptic i used for her for the time being but i am gonna buy betadine for her safety.


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## jtrux (Dec 9, 2012)

My old roommate had a pitbull that would seek out and find box turtles in his backyard (no idea why but there was probably 1 a month back there) and wouldn't touch them. All dogs are different I guess. My dog on the other hand would destroy anything she could get ahold of, i'm very cautious with her.

Hope everything turns out ok.


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## Baoh (Dec 9, 2012)

russian tortoise boy said:


> shellysmom said:
> 
> 
> > Pit Bull. Ugh. They have such freakishly strong jaws... If my pittie got a hold of a tort like that, I'd definitely rush it to a vet to get looked at. Is there even an ER vet in your area that sees reptiles? Probably not, huh?
> ...






Calm down.


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## Yellow Turtle (Dec 9, 2012)

Hope he recovers soon and yes, no hydrogen peroxide, it hurts when you pour it on the wound, more over it also function as bleach, unless you want to turn your tort into a blonde.


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## shellysmom (Dec 9, 2012)

Baoh said:


> russian tortoise boy said:
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That's helpful.


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## Baoh (Dec 9, 2012)

shellysmom said:


> Baoh said:
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> > russian tortoise boy said:
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Almost as helpful as dramatic overreaction or the rolling of eyes. He applied H2O2 sln. It is over. He should use a topical antiseptic that is more appropriate going forward. Getting upset changes nothing about what has already occurred.


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## LuckysGirl007 (Dec 9, 2012)

Baoh said:


> Almost as helpful as dramatic overreaction or the rolling of eyes. He applied H2O2 sln. It is over. He should use a topical antiseptic that is more appropriate going forward. Getting upset changes nothing about what has already occurred.



This last statement would have been more helpful added to the "calm down" remark.


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## Baoh (Dec 9, 2012)

LuckysGirl007 said:


> Baoh said:
> 
> 
> > Almost as helpful as dramatic overreaction or the rolling of eyes. He applied H2O2 sln. It is over. He should use a topical antiseptic that is more appropriate going forward. Getting upset changes nothing about what has already occurred.
> ...



Not my most pressing concern.


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## lovelyrosepetal (Dec 9, 2012)

I thought Baoh's comment was fine. I don't think he meant anything rude. Using peroxide was done. It wasn't the best choice but it won't do any more damage than was already done. Lesson learned.
russian tortoise boy, I would pm Maggie3fan or emysemys, they are really nice and like to help. They also have a lot of knowledge and experience with helping tortoises who have been injured or are sick. They could give you some specific advice that should help you out. I hope your tortoise is doing better. I would not do the betadine solution because you will kill the good blood cells that are helping to heal your tortoise. I think you use that solution when something first happens, you don't continue to use it. I could be wrong but I think that is how it goes.


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## Tortus (Dec 9, 2012)

Would human antibiotic ointment work for him, like Neosporin? And maybe wrap a bandage around it to keep substrate out as it heals?

When you watch nature shows and someone finds an injured animal they often smear ointment on the wound.


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## BodaTort1 (Dec 9, 2012)

@RussianTortoiseBoy.. No harm done sweetie. It was a one time deal and now everyone on the forum who didnt know-won't use it on their torties either. We all are here to learn from each other and our own mistakes. 
@LovelyRosePetal.. We actually use Betadine as an "antiseptic paint" for some wounds during every dressing change... But that is for humans and not sure if that care applies to torties as well and would not attempt till confirmed by someone experienced in animal/reptile wound care.


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## Baoh (Dec 9, 2012)

You can use that. I use Manuka honey. It has peroxides, some other lesser antimocrobial compounds, provides a barrier, and has a physical antimicrobial effect via osmotic shock. I prefer to keep such an animal off of any loose substrate for a bit to let the healing get going. Especially moist soil, coir, or similar substrates, which would harbor a greater bioburden than, say, dry paper towel or newspaper. Another good thing about the Manuka honey is you can still soak the animal without worrying about negative intestinal microfloral impacts of some topical antibiotics. Soak, blot dry, and apply a dab of honey, with a little going a long way. Other honey types may provide partial benefits (osmotic shock, a gentle barrier, and some smaller degree of antimicrobial compound concentration), but I went the extra mile and imported mine from New Zealand so I could keep the best on hand for my animals.




BodaTort1 said:


> @RussianTortoiseBoy.. No harm done sweetie. It was a one time deal and now everyone on the forum who didnt know-won't use it on their torties either. We all are here to learn from each other and our own mistakes.
> @LovelyRosePetal.. We actually use Betadine as an "antiseptic paint" for some wounds during every dressing change... But that is for humans and not sure if that care applies to torties as well and would not attempt till confirmed by someone experienced in animal/reptile wound care.



Betadine is reasonable for use on tortoises, too.


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## Tortus (Dec 9, 2012)

I've used manuka honey for a while now on myself. It seems to help with an upset stomach. I haven't tried it on anything topical yet. 

And it all comes from New Zealand as far as I know since that's where the flowers grow that the bees feed on. The good stuff is expensive.


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## Baoh (Dec 9, 2012)

Tortus said:


> I've used manuka honey for a while now on myself. It seems to help with an upset stomach. I haven't tried it on anything topical yet.
> 
> And it all comes from New Zealand as far as I know since that's where the flowers grow that the bees feed on. The good stuff is expensive.



Yes. My fiancee has added it to her tea to soothe an upset stomach. 

I was just saying that I got mine directly from there, as opposed to using a reseller. Worth it when you need it and not worrying about lead time, since it should effectively preserve itself well if kept refrigerated.


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## Carol S (Dec 9, 2012)

This summer my juvenile Russian tortoise was attacked by our dog. (You can read my posting on this.) I thought he was dead he looked so bad. I first soaked him in warm water to remove the dirt, grass and dog saliva. Then I flushed out the wounds with sterile saline (contact lense cleaner). Then I treated all the wounds with triple antiibiotic ointment. Next I wrapped the wounds with gauze. I then put him in his inside enclosure in his little stone cave. I kept the temperature a constant 80 degrees where he was at. I thought about taking him to the emergency animal hospital (attack happened on a Sunday late afternoon), but I felt that since they were not reptile specialists they really would not do anything more for him than I had done and actually could do something that would harm him. First thing the next morning I took him to the vets. The vet said I did the correct emergency treatment. The vet took him in the back and did some more flushing of the wounds and did some repair work on his shell (pulled out scutes that were pushed in and fixed with resin). The vet gave oral medication (which was later switched to injections as I could not get Turtle Baby to open his mouth and it was really stressing him). The vet also gave me an antibiotic solution to soak him in every day. He also gave me an antiboitic cream to put on his wounds every day. He had a scute missing on his shell, where I could actually see his insides, at the last row of scutes on the side toward the bottom. This was to be covered in a dressing after his daily antibiotic soak each day. The vet also said to keep the area where he sleeps 80 degrees to help boost his immune system. 

Turtle Baby is doing great now. It will be quit a while before the shell damage completely heals. The part where he has a scute missing is filling in with scar tissue (about 80-85%) as of today. It took a while for Turtle Baby to get over the trauma, as before he was outgoing and did not seem to be afraid of anything. After the trauma he would hide all the time. Around a month ago he has lost his fear and seems to be back to his old self. 

If I were you I would put some triple antibiotic ointment on his wounds and take your tortoise to the vet in the morning and get him started on antibiotics to keep the wounds from becoming infected. I would also keep the cool spot of his enclosure 80 degrees to boost his immune system. Are any of his scutes missing where you can see into his body cavity? If not, then I would just treat with the triple antibiotic ointment and not wrap with gauze. I would put paper towels in his enclosure instead of substrate. I would also keep him warm (80 degrees 24 hours a day). 

I hope this information helps you. I am sending you and your tortoises hugs good thoughts.


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## sibi (Dec 9, 2012)

Good to know. I didn't know about the honey. Thanks.


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## BodaTort1 (Dec 9, 2012)

Oh shoot... When I reread my last post it appeared as if I was saying I would not use Betadine on torties. What I meant was to tell LovelyPetalRose that in Humans we use it repeatedly on wounds as they are initially healing, but I would not use this same practice on torties until I spoke to someone who dealt with torty wounds. Is there anyone on this forum who does??


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## russian tortoise boy (Dec 9, 2012)

Carol S said:


> This summer my juvenile Russian tortoise was attacked by our dog. (You can read my posting on this.) I thought he was dead he looked so bad. I first soaked him in warm water to remove the dirt, grass and dog saliva. Then I flushed out the wounds with sterile saline (contact lense cleaner). Then I treated all the wounds with triple antiibiotic ointment. Next I wrapped the wounds with gauze. I then put him in his inside enclosure in his little stone cave. I kept the temperature a constant 80 degrees where he was at. I thought about taking him to the emergency animal hospital (attack happened on a Sunday late afternoon), but I felt that since they were not reptile specialists they really would not do anything more for him than I had done and actually could do something that would harm him. First thing the next morning I took him to the vets. The vet said I did the correct emergency treatment. The vet took him in the back and did some more flushing of the wounds and did some repair work on his shell (pulled out scutes that were pushed in and fixed with resin). The vet gave oral medication (which was later switched to injections as I could not get Turtle Baby to open his mouth and it was really stressing him). The vet also gave me an antibiotic solution to soak him in every day. He also gave me an antiboitic cream to put on his wounds every day. He had a scute missing on his shell, where I could actually see his insides, at the last row of scutes on the side toward the bottom. This was to be covered in a dressing after his daily antibiotic soak each day. The vet also said to keep the area where he sleeps 80 degrees to help boost his immune system.
> 
> Turtle Baby is doing great now. It will be quit a while before the shell damage completely heals. The part where he has a scute missing is filling in with scar tissue (about 80-85%) as of today. It took a while for Turtle Baby to get over the trauma, as before he was outgoing and did not seem to be afraid of anything. After the trauma he would hide all the time. Around a month ago he has lost his fear and seems to be back to his old self.
> 
> ...


there aren't any scutes missing i think because its her outer shell was a little bit torn off, right now she overcome her trauma and she can't walk normally because her nails was injured and she lost 1 nail  so where can i buy this triple antibiotic ointment and there are no reptile vets in our area i think, and is topical antiseptic hydrogen peroxide 3% fine here is the pic :


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## Mjdeisher (Dec 9, 2012)

cleanliness is going to be the most important thing in fighting off infection. keep it clean with what the people on here suggest (I've never had to clean an infection). Then one thing my reptile vet said when my Greek had an infection from a scratch underneath his shell, don't soak for a while or cut back on them. Spray them down so that they still get hydrated but its best to keep the damaged areas dry. Then my vet also suggested the reptile carpet instead of substrate. I was having issues with Paul eating the paper towel, the reptile carpet worked really well because he could still walk on it and was easy to clean. If you see any change in his behavior, get him to the vet asap! Becoming sluggish, not eating, not opening eyes, etc.


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## Carol S (Dec 9, 2012)

russian tortoise boy said:


> Carol S said:
> 
> 
> > This summer my juvenile Russian tortoise was attacked by our dog. (You can read my posting on this.) I thought he was dead he looked so bad. I first soaked him in warm water to remove the dirt, grass and dog saliva. Then I flushed out the wounds with sterile saline (contact lense cleaner). Then I treated all the wounds with triple antiibiotic ointment. Next I wrapped the wounds with gauze. I then put him in his inside enclosure in his little stone cave. I kept the temperature a constant 80 degrees where he was at. I thought about taking him to the emergency animal hospital (attack happened on a Sunday late afternoon), but I felt that since they were not reptile specialists they really would not do anything more for him than I had done and actually could do something that would harm him. First thing the next morning I took him to the vets. The vet said I did the correct emergency treatment. The vet took him in the back and did some more flushing of the wounds and did some repair work on his shell (pulled out scutes that were pushed in and fixed with resin). The vet gave oral medication (which was later switched to injections as I could not get Turtle Baby to open his mouth and it was really stressing him). The vet also gave me an antibiotic solution to soak him in every day. He also gave me an antiboitic cream to put on his wounds every day. He had a scute missing on his shell, where I could actually see his insides, at the last row of scutes on the side toward the bottom. This was to be covered in a dressing after his daily antibiotic soak each day. The vet also said to keep the area where he sleeps 80 degrees to help boost his immune system.
> ...



Neoporsin (brand name) is a triple antibotic ointment. You can get it at any drug store and most supermarkets have it. However, it is cheaper it you buy the generic brand at Target or Wallmart. I would NOT use hydrogen peroxide for the reasons that other forum members have stated. For now just use the Neosporin (triple antiboitic ointment) until you see a vet. Where do you live? I live in Alta Loma, CA and I use Dr. Greek whose office is in Yorba Linda. He is an excellent vet and specializes in reptiles.


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## sibi (Dec 9, 2012)

I wouldn't use it on humana either. It causes burning of the skin and doesn't help in healing.

What I meant was to tell LovelyPetalRose that in Humans we use it repeatedly on wounds as they are initially healing, but I would not use this same practice on torties until I spoke to someone who dealt with torty wounds. Is there anyone on this forum who does??
[/quote]


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## russian tortoise boy (Dec 9, 2012)

allright i have neosporin and it didn't write anything about being triple antibiotic ointment. well how do i put the ointment on her wounds? like just put it with my hands? and it says on it use use before 12/2012 so can i still use it is it still safe? 

here is the pic :


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## Tortus (Dec 9, 2012)

It's not that old and your tortoise probably needs it right away so it doesn't get infected.


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