# Baby mouse/rat



## Destben

Hi please don’t make fun of me but my husband bought a feeder for our snake and she wouldn’t eat it. I don’t usually look at them because it breaks my heart. But oops to late now I have a fuzzy (age/stage of development) that I just can’t let him feed to our snake. I managed to get him to eat some puppy formula and am keeping him warm. Does anyone on this forum have any idea what I should do next??


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## Melis

Ahhh I am a sucker for baby mice. I worked at a pet store where we would breed them, so I've seen lots of rejections. They need to be fed often. And depending on the age, have to be stimulated to go to the bathroom. I would always wet a qtip and wipe it on their bottoms. Good luck!


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## Tom

Euthanize it and put it in the freezer until its time to feed the snake again. Then defrost it and feed it out. This would be the humane thing to do.

That baby is to young to be separated from its mother if it was intended to survive and grow up.


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## Destben

Melis said:


> Ahhh I am a sucker for baby mice. I worked at a pet store where we would breed them, so I've seen lots of rejections. They need to be fed often. And depending on the age, have to be stimulated to go to the bathroom. I would always wet a qtip and wipe it on their bottoms. Good luck!



I tried with warm water and a q tip but he’s still a little freaked out.


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## Destben

Tom said:


> Euthanize it and put it in the freezer until its time to feed the snake again. Then defrost it and feed it out. This would be the humane thing to do.
> 
> That baby is to young to be separated from its mother if it was intended to survive and grow up.



Tom I respect your opinion and i in no way want this baby to suffer even if that means that I have to feed him to my snake to put him out of his misery. But I am how ever going to try and give him a chance to live. This is exactly why I am not usually allowed to be around when the feeding is taking place and I know it is ridiculous that I care so much but I just have to try.


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## Destben

Destben said:


> Tom I respect your opinion and i in no way want this baby to suffer even if that means that I have to feed him to my snake to put him out of his misery. But I am how ever going to try and give him a chance to live. This is exactly why I am not usually allowed to be around when the feeding is taking place and I know it is ridiculous that I care so much but I just have to try.



If it ends badly then lesson learned


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## tortoiseplanet

I understand your care as I really love animals too, but that is a bit extreme, It’s just a mouse. That is nature, mice are meant to be pray. You aren’t doing harm by feeding it to your snake. Mice are also a mess to keep and they are extremely unintelligent. Unintelligent animals don’t have feelings and they could care less about you. I know this sounds gross, but if you were dead, the mouse would have no problem eating you.


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## tortoiseplanet

I wouldn’t even worry about “misery” for a mouse.


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## Tom

Destben said:


> Tom I respect your opinion and i in no way want this baby to suffer even if that means that I have to feed him to my snake to put him out of his misery. But I am how ever going to try and give him a chance to live. This is exactly why I am not usually allowed to be around when the feeding is taking place and I know it is ridiculous that I care so much but I just have to try.


You are not alone. Many people are that way.

Sometimes it is hard to know what is the most humane thing to do. I think this little guy will suffer at this age, but I understand your feelings and motivations.


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## Tom

tortoiseplanet said:


> I wouldn’t even worry about “misery” for a mouse.


I don't agree. Not at all. Prey species, and food animals should always be treated with the utmost respect and dignity. Their welfare right up until the moment of humane euthanasia should be of paramount concern, and their lives and well being are just as important as the animals they are being fed to.

There is absolutely no excuse for mistreating food animals or allowing them to suffer. None.


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## Melis

tortoiseplanet said:


> I wouldn’t even worry about “misery” for a mouse.


Out of curiosity, when would the worry of an animal in "misery" come into play for you? A rat? A rabbit? A ferret? A cat? If we talk about "feelings", turtles also don't have "feelings". I've grown up receiving grief from others for trying to save things that aren't worth saving. Always interesting to see where people draw the line.


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## wellington

tortoiseplanet said:


> I understand your care as I really love animals too, but that is a bit extreme, It’s just a mouse. That is nature, mice are meant to be pray. You aren’t doing harm by feeding it to your snake. Mice are also a mess to keep and they are extremely unintelligent. Unintelligent animals don’t have feelings and they could care less about you. I know this sounds gross, but if you were dead, the mouse would have no problem eating you.


That is a bit extreme. It's a living thing and can feel pain just like you. The OP has a very big heart and I don't blame her. Reason I would never have any animal that has to be fed live animals. Bugs I can do. 
When it comes to animals or any kind and someone's heart/feelings, little more tack would be more appropriate.


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## Destben

Tom said:


> You are not alone. Many people are that way.
> 
> Sometimes it is hard to know what is the most humane thing to do. I think this little guy will suffer at this age, but I understand your feelings and motivations.



I’m am doing all the research possible and got in contact with some breeders and they said he has a good chance but it’s going to be hard work. I’m keeping an eye on him for now but if he takes a turn for the worse I won’t make him suffer and will give him to my other snake. So far he has been fed and is sleeping comfortably. So I’m just hoping for the best.


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## Destben

wellington said:


> That is a bit extreme. It's a living thing and can feel pain just like you. The OP has a very big heart and I don't blame her. Reason I would never have any animal that has to be fed live animals. Bugs I can do.
> When it comes to animals or any kind and someone's heart/feelings, little more tack would be more appropriate.



The snakes are my husbands for this reason I am a big baby about this stuff. Luckily my tort eats veggies.


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## wellington

Destben said:


> Tom I respect your opinion and i in no way want this baby to suffer even if that means that I have to feed him to my snake to put him out of his misery. But I am how ever going to try and give him a chance to live. This is exactly why I am not usually allowed to be around when the feeding is taking place and I know it is ridiculous that I care so much but I just have to try.


Don't feel silly at all. I'm with you. I couldn't do it either. I have to be really mad at the mice that lives in my shed to set traps for them. Like when they become to big in numbers. I even will be trying to trap them and save them at the same time. They either have to die a very quick death or they are allowed to live. If they didn't invade my torts shed, I wouldn't bother with them at all.


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## Tom

Melis said:


> Out of curiosity, when would the worry of an animal in "misery" come into play for you? A rat? A rabbit? A ferret? A cat? If we talk about "feelings", turtles also don't have "feelings". I've grown up receiving grief from others for trying to save things that aren't worth saving. Always interesting to see where people draw the line.



@Destben ,

@Melis raises an interesting question that I think is worthy of discussion on an animal husbandry forum, such as this one. Is it okay with you to philosophically explore and discuss this topic on your thread? It would be fine for us to start a new thread if you would rather not have this discussion on your thread.


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## Destben

wellington said:


> Don't feel silly at all. I'm with you. I couldn't do it either. I have to be really mad at the mice that lives in my shed to set traps for them. Like when they become to big in numbers. I even will be trying to trap them and save them at the same time. They either have to die a very quick death or they are allowed to live. If they didn't invade my torts shed, I wouldn't bother with them at all.



It’s understandable and I’m not against snakes eating or anything but he would have been waisted either way. And who could resist this face


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## Destben

Tom said:


> @Destben ,
> 
> @Melis raises an interesting question that I think is worthy of discussion on an animal husbandry forum, such as this one. Is it okay with you to philosophically explore and discuss this topic on your thread? It would be fine for us to start a new thread if you would rather not have this discussion on your thread.



I don’t mind at all


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## tortoiseplanet

Tom said:


> I don't agree. Not at all. Prey species, and food animals should always be treated with the utmost respect and dignity. Their welfare right up until the moment of humane euthanasia should be of paramount concern, and their lives and well being are just as important as the animals they are being fed to.
> 
> There is absolutely no excuse for mistreating food animals or allowing them to suffer. None.



I did not mean saying to torture the animal is right. But feeding it live to an animal isn’t something to be ashamed of, as that’s how it is in nature.


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## Destben

tortoiseplanet said:


> I did not mean saying to torture the animal is right. But feeding it live to an animal isn’t something to be ashamed of, as that’s how it is in nature.



I agree and he was put in the tank with the snake but she had never had a live mouse before (thanks petsmart) and my husband wanted to try. After the snake had no interest I had to give in to the impulse to try and save the little one.


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## Tom

Melis said:


> Out of curiosity, when would the worry of an animal in "misery" come into play for you? A rat? A rabbit? A ferret? A cat? If we talk about "feelings", turtles also don't have "feelings". I've grown up receiving grief from others for trying to save things that aren't worth saving. Always interesting to see where people draw the line.


I know you weren't addressing me, but it is an interesting question to me: Where to draw the line?

For me, I have to intentionally detach my emotions and heart strings and engage the logical portion of my brain. Is this animal suffering? Is there any chance of survival/recovery? Is survival/recovery likely? How much pain and suffering will be incurred if there is even a chance of survival/recovery? What will happen to the animal if it does survive or recover? What kind of life will it have? Is it a pest species? Is it an introduced, non-native species that shouldn't be loose in the wild anyway? What is the best course of action I can take for _this_ individual animal? What is the "right" thing to do?

Everyone is likely to have different answers for each of these questions, but these are the things that run through my mind when confronted with a situation like this. I have seen some people that I think were too quick on the draw, and I have seen some people who let an animal suffer too long because they can't overcome their own emotions. I try to exercise caution and be thoughtful about this sort of thing. I hate killing animals, but I hate letting them suffer unnecessarily even more, so I do what I have to do, and I do it correctly, quickly and as humanely as possible. Doesn't matter if it is an ant, cockroach, mouse, dog, horse, ground squirrel or gopher.


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## Tom

tortoiseplanet said:


> I did not mean saying to torture the animal is right. But feeding it live to an animal isn’t something to be ashamed of, as that’s how it is in nature.


I appreciate the further explanation, but there is more to it than simply "not torturing" the mouse. In my opinion, people who have predatory animals have a responsibility to see to it that prey animals suffer as little as possible. I haven't fed a live mouse or rat to a snake since the 80s. No need for it. It is better for predator and prey if the mouse is humanely euthanized, pre-killed, before being fed to the snake. Prey animals also need to be housed comfortably and fed well before being fed out. They should be in clean, sanitary conditions and not too hot or too cold. In short, they should be properly cared for.


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## Destben

Tom said:


> I appreciate the further explanation, but there is more to it than simply "not torturing" the mouse. In my opinion, people who have predatory animals have a responsibility to see to it that prey animals suffer as little as possible. I haven't fed a live mouse or rat to a snake since the 80s. No need for it. It is better for predator and prey if the mouse is humanely euthanized, pre-killed, before being fed to the snake. Prey animals also need to be housed comfortably and fed well before being fed out. They should be in clean, sanitary conditions and not too hot or too cold. In short, they should be properly cared for.



I tried frozen but my snakes are killers and are super picky.


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## wellington

Destben said:


> It’s understandable and I’m not against snakes eating or anything but he would have been waisted either way. And who could resist this face
> View attachment 231444
> View attachment 231445


Way too adorable!


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## tortoiseplanet

wellington said:


> That is a bit extreme. It's a living thing and can feel pain just like you. The OP has a very big heart and I don't blame her. Reason I would never have any animal that has to be fed live animals. Bugs I can do.
> When it comes to animals or any kind and someone's heart/feelings, little more tack would be more appropriate.



Of course they can feel pain, anything with a properly functioning brain can. Nothing I said was meant to be offensive or embarrassing. This a forum is meant to express opinions and facts to better the knowledge of each other (no hard feelings). Although my opinion is that snakes eat rats and it should stay that way. If you got a rat to feed to your snake then I’d say feed it. But if nothing convinces you and you’re already attached to the little one then it’s your choice to keep him. If you choose to keep him as a pet I’d suggest a hamster/typical rodent setup with a “treadmill” and all the fun stuff lol. Good luck with him and keep us updated with the success.


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## Destben

tortoiseplanet said:


> Of course they can feel pain, anything with a properly functioning brain can. Nothing I said was meant to be offensive or embarrassing. This a forum is meant to express opinions and facts to better the knowledge of each other (no hard feelings). Although my opinion is that snakes eat rats and it should stay that way. If you got a rat to feed to your snake then I’d say feed it. But if nothing convinces you and you’re already attached to the little one then it’s your choice to keep him. If you choose to keep him as a pet I’d suggest a hamster/typical rodent setup with a “treadmill” and all the fun stuff lol. Good luck with him and keep us updated with the success.



No offense taken I know it seems crazy and this is the exact reason I don’t stick around for the feedings. I will definitely keep updating. From what I’m told he’s almost old enough to start weaning if he was much smaller I doubt I would be able to take care of him at all.


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## wellington

tortoiseplanet said:


> Of course they can feel pain, anything with a properly functioning brain can. Nothing I said was meant to be offensive or embarrassing. This a forum is meant to express opinions and facts to better the knowledge of each other (no hard feelings). Although my opinion is that snakes eat rats and it should stay that way. If you got a rat to feed to your snake then I’d say feed it. But if nothing convinces you and you’re already attached to the little one then it’s your choice to keep him. If you choose to keep him as a pet I’d suggest a hamster/typical rodent setup with a “treadmill” and all the fun stuff lol. Good luck with him and keep us updated with the success.


I know you didn't mean to offend. It was just a little harsh in my opinion. Believe me, I can get right to the point and sound harsh too, I do it a lot when a animals well being is in question. Just, have to check your thoughts when it comes to the love or care a person has for an animal they are caring for, specially when it's an animal most people just want dead.


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## Melis

Tom said:


> I know you weren't addressing me, but it is an interesting question to me: Where to draw the line?
> 
> For me, I have to intentionally detach my emotions and heart strings and engage the logical portion of my brain. Is this animal suffering? Is there any chance of survival/recovery? Is survival/recovery likely? How much pain and suffering will be incurred if there is even a chance of survival/recovery? What will happen to the animal if it does survive or recover? What kind of life will it have? Is it a pest species? Is it an introduced, non-native species that shouldn't be loose in the wild anyway? What is the best course of action I can take for _this_ individual animal? What is the "right" thing to do?
> 
> Everyone is likely to have different answers for each of these questions, but these are the things that run through my mind when confronted with a situation like this. I have seen some people that I think were too quick on the draw, and I have seen some people who let an animal suffer too long because they can't overcome their own emotions. I try to exercise caution and be thoughtful about this sort of thing. I hate killing animals, but I hate letting them suffer unnecessarily even more, so I do what I have to do, and I do it correctly, quickly and as humanely as possible. Doesn't matter if it is an ant, cockroach, mouse, dog, horse, ground squirrel or gopher.


Absolutely. I believe even the most minuscule creature deserves to be treated humanely. But I am also one of those people that have a very hard time determining when to turn off the emotional side of my brain, and turn on the logical side. I was a biology major, so the concepts always make sense, for example eradicating invasive species is a no brainer; that is until I have to see the animals in question lol. I grew up in a house where my grandmother would put out sticky traps to catch mice, and I would always get in trouble for throwing them away. But of course I understand that no one wants to live in a house infested with rodents, I would just hope they act humanely. 
I've come across people with the "it's just a ___, who cares" mentality. Even friends and family a few months back who questioned my decisions to spend a lot of money on care and having a feeding tube surgically inserted into my tort. It was "just a turtle". 
Although I may not always agree with all the opinions expressed here, I love reading the differing views from people all over the world


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## wellington

Melis said:


> Absolutely. I believe even the most minuscule creature deserves to be treated humanely. But I am also one of those people that have a very hard time determining when to turn off the emotional side of my brain, and turn on the logical side. I was a biology major, so the concepts always make sense, for example eradicating invasive species is a no brainer; that is until I have to see the animals in question lol. I grew up in a house where my grandmother would put out sticky traps to catch mice, and I would always get in trouble for throwing them away. But of course I understand that no one wants to live in a house infested with rodents, I would just hope they act humanely.
> I've come across people with the "it's just a ___, who cares" mentality. Even friends and family a few months back who questioned my decisions to spend a lot of money on care and having a feeding tube surgically inserted into my tort. It was "just a turtle".
> Although I may not always agree with all the opinions expressed here, I love reading the differing views from people all over the world


When people question what I do for my animals or how much I pay for them or how many I get, I always tell them that when they start paying my bills and caring for my family, that's when they can have a say about what I do with my money. 
Then if I can turn it back on them, because they "waisted" money or time on whatever, I will do that too.


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## TechnoCheese

I feel you. I won’t even kill cockroaches because I feel bad for them! I’m going to have a hard time with euthanasia when I’m a vet.
I would personally do the best that I could to do as much research as possible to care for it correctly. That’s just me though, and you should definitely consider all options.


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## teresaf

My daughter has been successful in raising Rats from feeder pinkies.... She's also been unsuccessful. The trouble I think was keeping them warm. She's not here right now to ask. Sometimes she would put one on her chest (cleavage) to keep it warm while watching TV... Try you tube videos...


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## Destben

teresaf said:


> My daughter has been successful in raising Rats from feeder pinkies.... She's also been unsuccessful. The trouble I think was keeping them warm. She's not here right now to ask. Sometimes she would put one on her chest (cleavage) to keep it warm while watching TV... Try you tube videos...



Good to know. I’m using a reptile heat pad that’s keeping a small area he sleeps in between 80-86f and the rest room temp. I am feeding him puppy milk. He’s a fuzzy almost a hopper and the breeder I talked to said he’s real close to opening his eyes. We just got done with feeding 3 so far so good (knock on wood)


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## Turtulas-Len

Give it stale bread to chew on,


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## sara.michelle99

I don’t think you’re being extreme. I love animals and I would be the same, I haven’t read the rest of the post but I hope the mouse is ok


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## Destben

Turtulas-Len said:


> Give it stale bread to chew on,



He’s strictly milk till his eyes open but I will try that after they do I bet it would get mushy enough for him to eat if I mixed it with the milk.


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## Destben

sara.michelle99 said:


> I don’t think you’re being extreme. I love animals and I would be the same, I haven’t read the rest of the post but I hope the mouse is ok



Doing good so far (knock on wood)


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## Turtulas-Len

Destben said:


> He’s strictly milk till his eyes open but I will try that after they do I bet it would get mushy enough for him to eat if I mixed it with the milk.


I would start offering it now, but not mixed with anything, just old dry bread. Many years ago I was told this trick and used it many times when I was raising mice for the pet trade, at that time no one could explain why it worked, but it does help pre weened mice make it to adulthood. leave small pieces of the bread near it and it should find the bread start chewing on it even if it doesn't have teeth yet. You do as you please though this is only a suggestion.


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## Destben

Turtulas-Len said:


> I would start offering it now, but not mixed with anything, just old dry bread. Many years ago I was told this trick and used it many times when I was raising mice for the pet trade, at that time no one could explain why it worked, but it does help pre weened mice make it to adulthood. leave small pieces of the bread near it and it should find the bread start chewing on it even if it doesn't have teeth yet. You do as you please though this is only a suggestion.



Oh I see I will give it a try thanks [emoji16]


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## ColleenT

Melis said:


> Absolutely. I believe even the most minuscule creature deserves to be treated humanely. But I am also one of those people that have a very hard time determining when to turn off the emotional side of my brain, and turn on the logical side. I was a biology major, so the concepts always make sense, for example eradicating invasive species is a no brainer; that is until I have to see the animals in question lol. I grew up in a house where my grandmother would put out sticky traps to catch mice, and I would always get in trouble for throwing them away. But of course I understand that no one wants to live in a house infested with rodents, I would just hope they act humanely.
> I've come across people with the "it's just a ___, who cares" mentality. Even friends and family a few months back who questioned my decisions to spend a lot of money on care and having a feeding tube surgically inserted into my tort. It was "just a turtle".
> Although I may not always agree with all the opinions expressed here, I love reading the differing views from people all over the world



I was a BAT rehabber. Bats have always gotten the short end of the stick, so to speak. bc of myths and old wives tales, there was a lot of fear regarding these wonderful creatures. They can live up to 25 years, and their intelligence has been compared to that of dolphins. I raised orphaned babies from the time their eyes were still closed and they had an umbilical still on them, to the point ot release. These animals are amazing and yet, people still have no problem killing them. I don't think any animal deserves to suffer. A quick and painless death is not a bad way to go. But suffering just hurts my heart.


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## teresaf

She used Soy baby formula on her 6 day old rat. She named him Hercules.
Specifically soy. I think she used an eye dropper?


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## OMary

Have you been able to get it to urinate and poop yet? If not, try rubbing the warm, wet q-tip quickly (but not too hard). I volunteered at a wildlife center years ago and had to potty baby squirrels and raccoons. You can probably find a YouTube video of you aren't already rubbing like that.


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## Destben

teresaf said:


> She used Soy baby formula on her 6 day old rat. She named him Hercules.
> Specifically soy. I think she used an eye dropper?



I’m using a paint brush right now but I’m not use if he’s getting enough in his mouth


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## Destben

OMary said:


> Have you been able to get it to urinate and poop yet? If not, try rubbing the warm, wet q-tip quickly (but not too hard). I volunteered at a wildlife center years ago and had to potty baby squirrels and raccoons. You can probably find a YouTube video of you aren't already rubbing like that.



He seems to be pooping and peeing on his own thankfully because he’s skiddish around me still. I was able to stimulate during our last feeding because I got a stuffed animal for him to cuddle and he flips over and tries to nurse it


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## teresaf

Destben said:


> I’m using a paint brush right now but I’m not use if he’s getting enough in his mouth
> View attachment 231483


Hi, I'm Teresa's daughter, I wanted to get on here and help you out. I've hand raised a few rats from infancy. The most important thing to remember is that you need to make sure he's being paced. If you're giving too much, he can aspirate it. Soy formula is the closest milk supplement and you're correct in using a tiny paint brush because it encourages them to eat on their own. They will generally start to try to turn away from the brush when they're done. I'd offer food every hour until he understands what it is and how to communicate with it. Also, make sure you're stimulating the belly after each meal and then use a q tip or cotton ball to stimulate him to pee and poo. There should be about 3 pees for every poo and make sure you do it religiously, it's incredibly important to toilet them as they can't do so themselves. Also, if he's not eating or you feel he may not be warm enough, stop the feed until you have warmed him (I use hot hands on the go or in emergencies). I hope this helps! Let me know if you have questions, my mom can relay! <3


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## Destben

teresaf said:


> Hi, I'm Teresa's daughter, I wanted to get on here and help you out. I've hand raised a few rats from infancy. The most important thing to remember is that you need to make sure he's being paced. If you're giving too much, he can aspirate it. Soy formula is the closest milk supplement and you're correct in using a tiny paint brush because it encourages them to eat on their own. They will generally start to try to turn away from the brush when they're done. I'd offer food every hour until he understands what it is and how to communicate with it. Also, make sure you're stimulating the belly after each meal and then use a q tip or cotton ball to stimulate him to pee and poo. There should be about 3 pees for every poo and make sure you do it religiously, it's incredibly important to toilet them as they can't do so themselves. Also, if he's not eating or you feel he may not be warm enough, stop the feed until you have warmed him (I use hot hands on the go or in emergencies). I hope this helps! Let me know if you have questions, my mom can relay! <3



This is very helpful thank you [emoji4]


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## Destben

Little Remy [emoji7]
I think Torterra might be jealous


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## Destben

Destben said:


> This is very helpful thank you [emoji4]



Hi,
Remy opened his eyes last night so I believe I’m supposed to start weaning him. I bought some baby cereal and put a tiny amount in his milk does that sound right?


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## Destben

teresaf said:


> Hi, I'm Teresa's daughter, I wanted to get on here and help you out. I've hand raised a few rats from infancy. The most important thing to remember is that you need to make sure he's being paced. If you're giving too much, he can aspirate it. Soy formula is the closest milk supplement and you're correct in using a tiny paint brush because it encourages them to eat on their own. They will generally start to try to turn away from the brush when they're done. I'd offer food every hour until he understands what it is and how to communicate with it. Also, make sure you're stimulating the belly after each meal and then use a q tip or cotton ball to stimulate him to pee and poo. There should be about 3 pees for every poo and make sure you do it religiously, it's incredibly important to toilet them as they can't do so themselves. Also, if he's not eating or you feel he may not be warm enough, stop the feed until you have warmed him (I use hot hands on the go or in emergencies). I hope this helps! Let me know if you have questions, my mom can relay! <3



Hi,
Remy opened his eyes last night so I believe I’m supposed to start weaning him. I bought some baby cereal and put a tiny amount in his milk does that sound right?


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## teresaf

Destben said:


> Hi,
> Remy opened his eyes last night so I believe I’m supposed to start weaning him. I bought some baby cereal and put a tiny amount in his milk does that sound right?



My daughter says.....
She can start intruding little bits of instant oatmeal, rice, and dry snacks (all from the baby isle) but to make sure he still has access to milk supplements around the clock for the next 2 weeks. In a day or two she can start introducing a shallow bowl (like a jar lid) with the formula so he can learn to feed himself that way but right now he probably can't see super well so make sure she's still feeding him by hand at least until tomorrow. Otherwise though, he's out of the woods. Hard part is over, just 2 more weeks of formula and he'll be healthy as a horse!

Hope this helps! Good luck. My daughter has another baby rat she's gotten at the Tampa Repticon yesterday.


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## Destben

teresaf said:


> My daughter says.....
> She can start intruding little bits of instant oatmeal, rice, and dry snacks (all from the baby isle) but to make sure he still has access to milk supplements around the clock for the next 2 weeks. In a day or two she can start introducing a shallow bowl (like a jar lid) with the formula so he can learn to feed himself that way but right now he probably can't see super well so make sure she's still feeding him by hand at least until tomorrow. Otherwise though, he's out of the woods. Hard part is over, just 2 more weeks of formula and he'll be healthy as a horse!
> 
> Hope this helps! Good luck. My daughter has another baby rat she's gotten at the Tampa Repticon yesterday.


I haven't been able to get him to pee since yesterday morning and I am taking him for a check up at the vet later today. He doesn't look dehydrated but hes been eating alot and not going number 1 only number 2.


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## Destben

Snuggling his hedgehog plushie under my desk at work [emoji7]


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## Lark_Tortoise

He's soooo cute- I have a dwarf hamster and love rodents (and tortoises) You brought him to work!Lol


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## Destben

He’s eating good


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## Destben

Lark_Tortoise said:


> He's soooo cute- I have a dwarf hamster and love rodents (and tortoises) You brought him to work!Lol



Yea lol I have him a set up under my desk


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## MrMarg&me

The little mouse is beyond adorable. He is very fortunate you saved him. I have loved rodents all of my life. My mom used to say it was because my first books were by Beatrix Potter!!!


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## Destben

Update
Remy is doing well. He went to the vet yesterday and got a clean bill of health and a little fluids just to make sure he’s hydrated. The vet even gave me a discount for my “frequent flyer miles” lol. I have 6 pets don’t judge jk lol. 
Remy is now eating baby cereal mixed with formula as well as his normal straight formula feedings. He is also going potty on his own so that’s a plus.


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## MrMarg&me

This is a very fun thread. Thank you for the update! I have 7 pets not including our pond with fish that expect their feeding every day at 4:30. But I haven't earned any "frequent flyer miles" yet.


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## Destben

MissMarg&me said:


> This is a very fun thread. Thank you for the update! I have 7 pets not including our pond with fish that expect their feeding every day at 4:30. But I haven't earned any "frequent flyer miles" yet.



I take mine to the vet a lot for check ups and stuff lol . I have 2 dogs (One is deaf and gets ear infections and had ear mites, worms and fleas when we picked him up from the pound) 2 snakes One we rescued Saturday (she’s under weight and sickly from petsmart care), a baby mouse (he went to make sure he’s hydrated mostly), and a leopard tortoise names Torterra who was a frequent flyer due to the wrong set up in the beginning (Tom straightened me out). I just like to rescue if I can and they seem to not always be in the best health.


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## ColleenT

2 appaloosa horses
5 dogs( 3American Hairless Terrier, 2 Chinese Crested)
4 box turtles
3 gargoyle geckos
1 grey tree frog.

I guess that makes 15. Unless you count my husband that would be 16.


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## Destben

ColleenT said:


> 2 appaloosa horses
> 5 dogs( 3American Hairless Terrier, 2 Chinese Crested)
> 4 box turtles
> 3 gargoyle geckos
> 1 grey tree frog.
> 
> I guess that makes 15. Unless you count my husband that would be 16.


I don't know how you do it! As it is I'm getting up at 5 am to take care of mine before work lol. that not including getting up every 2 hours to turn Remy's heating pad back on (stupid safety shut of lol) and one nightly feed.


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## teresaf

2 English bulldogs
Great Pyrenees Burmese mountain dog mix
Standard poodle 
Australian Shepherd cattle dog mix
Cat
2 leopard tortoises
2 Burmese black mountain tortoises
6 rats
2 Ohio toads
2 Sonoran desert toads
:-D
Oh I don't want to forget the husband, the teenage daughter and 3 year old granddaughter....LOL

HAHAHA HAHAHA


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## Destben

teresaf said:


> 2 English bulldogs
> Great Pyrenees Burmese mountain dog mix
> Standard poodle
> Australian Shepherd cattle dog mix
> Cat
> 2 leopard tortoises
> 2 Burmese black mountain tortoises
> 6 rats
> 2 Ohio toads
> 2 Sonoran desert toads
> :-D
> Oh I don't want to forget the husband, the teenage daughter and 3 year old granddaughter....LOL
> 
> HAHAHA HAHAHA


WOW!! I don't think I could handle that many! You guys must have super powers or something lol.


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## MrMarg&me

We have two dogs- Stella: a mix of German Shorthair Pointer, Boxer and Great Dane. 8 years. Adopted from a rescue 8 years
in June.
Howard: an Australian Cattle Dog like yours but red. He is 6 months old and was given to us in January.
two guinea pigs- Emilio: adopted from a rescue. We have had him 3 years, unsure of his age.
Mario: 3 years. Purchased as a companion for Emilio.
three three toed box turtles- Marg: we rescued from a lady that kept him on concrete with a margarine lid for water.
Lois: purchased a year ago yesterday.
Pearl: adopted last summer from the San Diego Turtle and Tortoise Society.
And then our pond with our fish. The whole system is like a huge pet because we must care for it constantly and arrange for someone to check on it if we are away!


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## Destben

MissMarg&me said:


> We have two dogs- Stella: a mix of German Shorthair Pointer, Boxer and Great Dane. 8 years. Adopted from a rescue 8 years
> in June.
> Howard: an Australian Cattle Dog like yours but red. He is 6 months old and was given to us in January.
> two guinea pigs- Emilio: adopted from a rescue. We have had him 3 years, unsure of his age.
> Mario: 3 years. Purchased as a companion for Emilio.
> three three toed box turtles- Marg: we rescued from a lady that kept him on concrete with a margarine lid for water.
> Lois: purchased a year ago yesterday.
> Pearl: adopted last summer from the San Diego Turtle and Tortoise Society.
> And then our pond with our fish. The whole system is like a huge pet because we must care for it constantly and arrange for someone to check on it if we are away!


I wish I had a support system like that lol I travel for work so I'm on my own and pet sitters are expensive!


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## ColleenT

Destben said:


> I don't know how you do it! As it is I'm getting up at 5 am to take care of mine before work lol. that not including getting up every 2 hours to turn Remy's heating pad back on (stupid safety shut of lol) and one nightly feed.



I board the horses, the dogs have a routine which helps and a fenced yard with a doggy door. the turtles are hibernating now, and the smaller pets are easy.


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## teresaf

We don't go anywhere....why would we? We're in FLORIDA already! LOL


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## Destben

teresaf said:


> We don't go anywhere....why would we? We're in FLORIDA already! LOL


Lol. I just moved from CA to PA. Such a difference lol.


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## Destben

Cuddling his hedgehog after a meal of baby cereal mixed with formula and enjoying a lazy day at the office.


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## Lark_Tortoise

He's soooooo adorable!


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## Destben

Snapples got that right


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## Destben

Remy is still doing good this is his first solid food


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## Destben

He was about 6 grams when I got him then when we went to the vet he had lost one gram. Now he’s 7 grams so he seems to be healthy. He still comes to the office with me because he isn’t quite weaned yet (still at least has another week) and I was told he won’t be able to regulate his temperatures good till he’s about 20g. So until then he’s stuck with me like glue, but it seems to suit him and he’s starting to enjoy cuddles and pets.


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## ZEROPILOT

Good job, @Destben


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## MrMarg&me

With all of the constant care he has received Remy will be a very tame companion mouse. I look forward to reading about his future adventures with you. He is very cute with his hedgehog comforter.


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## Destben

ZEROPILOT said:


> Good job, @Destben


Thank you


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## Destben

MissMarg&me said:


> With all of the constant care he has received Remy will be a very tame companion mouse. I look forward to reading about his future adventures with you. He is very cute with his hedgehog comforter.


I hope so! I just hope he doesn't change once he matures I hear they get territorial, but I also heard they aren't that bad if you don't invade their space.


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## Destben




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## ColleenT

This guy is a mouse, and not a rat? He looks like a mouse.


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## Destben

ColleenT said:


> This guy is a mouse, and not a rat? He looks like a mouse.



Yeah he’s a mouse. I was originally unsure but I figured it out after doing some research.


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## Melis

How is he??


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## Destben

He hurt his paws yesterday and bit his tongue trying to escape his baby cage. Scared me half to death seeing all the blood but he’s fine just a swollen tongue and some bruised paws. He’s eating mostly liquids till the swelling goes down but you wouldn’t know there was anything wrong just looking at him. Anyways he’s graduated into his big boy cage and is loving the extra room.


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## Destben

Remy in his big boy cage. His tongue is a lot less swollen today and he’s eating and drinking like a champ!


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## ColleenT

maybe you can get him an exercise wheel. They have a lot of energy.


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## Destben

ColleenT said:


> maybe you can get him an exercise wheel. They have a lot of energy.


I have a wheel but hes not heavy enough to turn it. I just had my husband pick up a flying saucer wheel and some chew toys so hopefully that will be good. I might upgrade his tank once hes not small enough to fit through bars.


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## Destben

So he’s not heavy enough for this wheel either [emoji24]


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## ColleenT

aww, poor little guy.


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## Destben

ColleenT said:


> aww, poor little guy.


He will get there. I'm going to switch him to mouse food pellets and start introducing fresh foods.


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## TammyJ

Totally understand your caring for this little pathetic looking guy/girl mouse.
Totally done LOTS of that myself!
All the best.
They do well on cooked "old fashioned" oats and cereal baby food until they are more grown, then they will enjoy raw oats and bran crackers, etc.


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## Destben

TammyJ said:


> Totally understand your caring for this little pathetic looking guy/girl mouse.
> Totally done LOTS of that myself!
> All the best.
> They do well on cooked "old fashioned" oats and cereal baby food until they are more grown, then they will enjoy raw oats and bran crackers, etc.



I’m just worried that it’s to much iron.


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## TammyJ

Destben said:


> I’m just worried that it’s to much iron.


Natural grass seeds and bits of lettuce and banana and cooked pumpkin are very much enjoyed too.
Don't ever give citrus.


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## Destben

TammyJ said:


> Natural grass seeds and bits of lettuce and banana and cooked pumpkin are very much enjoyed too.
> Don't ever give citrus.



I’m going to the store now so I will pick up some banana and lettuce


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## ZEROPILOT

Too cool


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## Destben

So update: Remy’s tongue is still swollen and he has lost 2 grams. He just got more fluids and some pain meds to coax him into eating a bit more. He is eating but not a bunch.


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## Destben

Destben said:


> So update: Remy’s tongue is still swollen and he has lost 2 grams. He just got more fluids and some pain meds to coax him into eating a bit more. He is eating but not a bunch.



So he’s perked up a lot and the pain meds worked like a charm and he filled his belly for the first time in like 2 days!! I’m so happy I could cry!


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## TechnoCheese

Destben said:


> So he’s perked up a lot and the pain meds worked like a charm and he filled his belly for the first time in like 2 days!! I’m so happy I could cry!
> View attachment 232450



Yay!!!


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## Destben

So this morning he wouldn't take his pain meds but he did eat a little i'm going to try giving it to him again later today. He was rubbing his bottom jaw raw and the fur was gone but I can tell its growing back a little and he has more use of his tongue.


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## Destben

So far he is still only 5g and i'm almost out of puppy formula so im going to try getting a soy formula (because mice are lactose intolerant). I might also try ensure because the vet brought it up to help Remy out a little. I believe his tongue is back to normal but hes still not eating a whole lot. I have got to fatten him up some how.


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## Destben

So hes going to the vet in a couple hours and I just barely got him to eat. Hes very dehydrated and seems to be sick and is sneezing. wish me luck guys this is a tough one.


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## ColleenT

good luck.


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## Destben

ColleenT said:


> good luck.



So it went good he got his first dose of meds for his cold or URI (not sure what he has). And I figured out he doesn’t want to eat unless he’s cuddled in my hand so I’m gonna try and get him to eat as much as possible. I got him mazuri mouse diet so hopefully that will fatten him up


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## Destben

Baby Remy has past over the rainbow bridge. He spent his last moments being comforted. I don’t regret trying to save him and believe he would have been fine if not for the cold he had. Please know he was not in pain because he was on pain killers at the time.


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## ColleenT

aww i am sorry.


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## MrMarg&me

You made a very gallant effort to save the helpless mouse. I'm sorry you did not get to experience him thriving. You will be lonely for him for awhile. Thank you for sharing the experience.


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## Big Charlie

I'm so sorry.


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## Jay Bagley

Destben said:


> Baby Remy has past over the rainbow bridge. He spent his last moments being comforted. I don’t regret trying to save him and believe he would have been fine if not for the cold he had. Please know he was not in pain because he was on pain killers at the time.


Very sorry to hear that. Remy was definitely a cutie.


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## ZEROPILOT

So sorry, Destben.
I often wondered how many of those "feeder" animals are healthy enough to survive a long life.
They have it rough right from the start.
I'm sad for you. But I completely understand wanting to help out a helpless animal.


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## Destben

ZEROPILOT said:


> So sorry, Destben.
> I often wondered how many of those "feeder" animals are healthy enough to survive a long life.
> They have it rough right from the start.
> I'm sad for you. But I completely understand wanting to help out a helpless animal.


Thank you. He was doing really well and was eating really good again, but Upper Respiratory Infections are deadly and he was still week from not eating so I believe he just couldn't handle it at that point. But I honestly believe he would have made it if not for both of those things happening so close together. I'm absolutely heart broken about it, but I have 5 other animals that need me so I have to keep moving and treat them all with as much love as possible, because you never know what will happen. This is the price we pay for loving these animals so much.


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## MrMarg&me

It's incredible to me that our species has the ability to commit genocide on their own tribe but our species is also capable of going to great length to save the life of a creature that has been considered vermin. It's heartbreaking.


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## Destben

MissMarg&me said:


> It's incredible to me that our species has the ability to commit genocide on their own tribe but our species is also capable of going to great length to save the life of a creature that has been considered vermin. It's heartbreaking.



I would like to stay in this side of the spectrum [emoji28]


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## TammyJ

RIP little mouse. Somebody cared a lot for you!


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## Lark_Tortoise

He lived a much longer and happier life than he would have as someone else's feeder animal! I'm glad he was able to have a nice end to his happy life. I'm really sorry for your loss!


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## Destben

Thank you all! I know its a part of life and a risk I accepted when I took the little guy in. I really do miss him.......


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## CarolM

Destben said:


> I take mine to the vet a lot for check ups and stuff lol . I have 2 dogs (One is deaf and gets ear infections and had ear mites, worms and fleas when we picked him up from the pound) 2 snakes One we rescued Saturday (she’s under weight and sickly from petsmart care), a baby mouse (he went to make sure he’s hydrated mostly), and a leopard tortoise names Torterra who was a frequent flyer due to the wrong set up in the beginning (Tom straightened me out). I just like to rescue if I can and they seem to not always be in the best health.
> View attachment 231671
> View attachment 231672
> View attachment 231673
> View attachment 231674
> View attachment 231675
> View attachment 231676


Oh my word. Your snakes are beautiful. I could never keep snakes as my husband would move out. You have quite the handful.


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## CarolM

Destben said:


> Baby Remy has past over the rainbow bridge. He spent his last moments being comforted. I don’t regret trying to save him and believe he would have been fine if not for the cold he had. Please know he was not in pain because he was on pain killers at the time.


Oh shame. I am sorry that he has gone over. You gave it everything you had.


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## Moozillion

Tom said:


> I don't agree. Not at all. Prey species, and food animals should always be treated with the utmost respect and dignity. Their welfare right up until the moment of humane euthanasia should be of paramount concern, and their lives and well being are just as important as the animals they are being fed to.
> 
> There is absolutely no excuse for mistreating food animals or allowing them to suffer. None.



Nicely said, Tom!!!!!! [emoji2][emoji106]


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## Moozillion

Destben said:


> The snakes are my husbands for this reason I am a big baby about this stuff. Luckily my tort eats veggies.



I’m with you. [emoji2][emoji106]


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## Moozillion

I just found this thread, Destben. So, SO beautiful of you to try and save this little guy. So sorry he passed.
But love is never wasted.
What a lovey thing you did.[emoji173]️[emoji173]️[emoji173]️[emoji173]️[emoji173]️[emoji173]️


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## Destben

Moozillion said:


> I just found this thread, Destben. So, SO beautiful of you to try and save this little guy. So sorry he passed.
> But love is never wasted.
> What a lovey thing you did.[emoji173]️[emoji173]️[emoji173]️[emoji173]️[emoji173]️[emoji173]️


thank you


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## TammyJ

CarolM said:


> Oh my word. Your snakes are beautiful. I could never keep snakes as my husband would move out. You have quite the handful.


Wow, that's true about the snakes being beautiful. Especially that little piebald python!


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## Destben

TammyJ said:


> Wow, that's true about the snakes being beautiful. Especially that little piebald python!


Her name is Anna. shes a cold blooded killer when hungry and a cuddle bug the rest of the time. I wouldn't hold her when I had Remy because she would smell him on me easy and perk up like she was getting fed. My husband didn't believe me so I walked up to her cage after feeding Remy formula and putting him away in his cage and I said "watch this". I opened the door and waved my hands toward the hide she was in and sure enough her little snake snoot popped out of her hiding place. My husband laughed so hard.


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## Destben

Destben said:


> Her name is Anna. shes a cold blooded killer when hungry and a cuddle bug the rest of the time. I wouldn't hold her when I had Remy because she would smell him on me easy and perk up like she was getting fed. My husband didn't believe me so I walked up to her cage after feeding Remy formula and putting him away in his cage and I said "watch this". I opened the door and waved my hands toward the hide she was in and sure enough her little snake snoot popped out of her hiding place. My husband laughed so hard.


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## Destben

Destben said:


> View attachment 233929


Her nickname is Danger noodle and our other girl the regular ball python her name is Macy but we call her skinny noodle.


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## Moozillion

Destben said:


> Her nickname is Danger noodle and our other girl the regular ball python her name is Macy but we call her skinny noodle.



“Danger Noodle:” LOVE.IT!!!!!!!!!! [emoji38][emoji38][emoji38][emoji38][emoji38][emoji38]


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