# Asking new posters their real names.



## Shelly (Jan 2, 2012)

Like many of you, I have children that spend a lot of time on the internet.

It's important to monitor your children's activity on the internet, and teach them how to use it safely.
When my kids first asked me if they could post on forums and message boards, I set some rules.

Rule #1. DON'T tell anybody your real name!
Rule #2. DON'T tell anybody where you live!

When somebody new posts here, the first thing that happens is a bunch of people chime in with "Hi! What's your name? Where do you live?"
This question is asked before we know if the poster is a 50 year old man or a 10 year old girl.
Let's pretend a pedophile who lives in Flower Clump Texas,and he likes to lurk massage boards to look for kids.
Some kid comes here and posts about his tortoise, and then, ONLY after being asked by several people, says I'm Jimmy, I'm 10 years old, an I live in Flower Clump, Texas!
Pedophile thinks "Wow, big chance!!" He sends Jimmy a PM , and asks him "Hey, wanna ride your bike over to my house and see all my super rare tortoises?"

The internet should be as safe for kids as we can make it. Asking kids to reveal their identities online is not a good idea.


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## jaizei (Jan 2, 2012)

I think the more important thing would be asking why a 10 year old child is on the internet unsupervised. Parents need to be responsible for their children.


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## lynnedit (Jan 2, 2012)

I think they want a first name only so we don't have to call people by their forum name which are often long and, well, strange.
No last names are expected.
To give advice about torts, members need to know the general area they live in. It could be a county and state, for that matter. But you can't give advice w/o it. No addresses are expected.
You sure are right, however, in that parents need to be vigilant about their kids' internet use. 
No person of any age should communicate personal information w/o some verification. Those under 18 should not do it w/o parents' involvement, period.


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## Shelly (Jan 2, 2012)

jaizei said:


> I think the more important thing would be asking why a 10 year old child is on the internet unsupervised.



Because maybe their parents aren't as vigilant as they should be? Does that mean that you consider them "Fair game"?


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## lynnedit (Jan 2, 2012)

I certainly did not get that message from the post. Just to be cautious.


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## CtTortoiseMom (Jan 2, 2012)

jaizei said:


> I think the more important thing would be asking why a 10 year old child is on the internet unsupervised. Parents need to be responsible for their children.



Exactly, I have kids and they are not aloud on forums, facebook or games that randomly pick people or have a chat option. I have seen people post pictures of their own children with their school name or worse! I personally think that children should not be on forums or in chat rooms. Sorry kids. I especially worry about these kids youthful mistakes being online for college admission departments to google. 



Shelly said:


> jaizei said:
> 
> 
> > I think the more important thing would be asking why a 10 year old child is on the internet unsupervised.
> ...



A pedophile certainly would.


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## yagyujubei (Jan 2, 2012)

I would be in favor of a "junior membership" for all members under 18. That way we would instantly know when we are addressing a minor child. Just the other day, there was a heated discussion between several adults and a 14 year old kid from Hong Kong.I don't understand why kids today have free reign pretty much anywhere with no apparant restrictions.


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## CtTortoiseMom (Jan 2, 2012)

yagyujubei said:


> I would be in favor of a "junior membership" for all members under 18. That way we would instantly know when we are addressing a minor child. Just the other day, there was a heated discussion between several adults and a 15 year old kid from Hong Kong.I don't understand why kids today have free reign pretty much anywhere with no apparant restrictions.



I feel that showing all the members that they are speaking to a child might endanger them even more if their is an unsavory character lurking around.


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## yagyujubei (Jan 2, 2012)

Then I recommend we ban all children from this site, for their own safety.


CtTortoiseMom said:


> yagyujubei said:
> 
> 
> > I would be in favor of a "junior membership" for all members under 18. That way we would instantly know when we are addressing a minor child. Just the other day, there was a heated discussion between several adults and a 15 year old kid from Hong Kong.I don't understand why kids today have free reign pretty much anywhere with no apparant restrictions.
> ...


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## llaperle (Jan 2, 2012)

I too think that it is only reasonable on this forum to ask for a first name and country of origin. It guides many discussions and much advice.

In each household with children the rules and parameters of internet use are the responsibility of the adults to both inform and enforce. It's no different than teaching safe biking or walking to school. To help with this there are also of course many parental controls that can be placed on internet viewing to keep things safe.

IMHO nothing that happens here is unsafe or inappropriate.


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## Tim/Robin (Jan 2, 2012)

My kids know how to answer both of those questions. NOPE, and NOPE. I am with you on this one Shelly. It is not a good idea to even ask. The person seeking advice can do so in a way that does not reveal location or age.

I also feel that if the content on the forum is kept appropriate and in accordance with the rules, there is no reason for a "junior membership". I must commend the MODS for keeping inappropriate content out of site!!


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## ascott (Jan 2, 2012)

> I would be in favor of a "junior membership" for all members under 18.



I think that this would be awesome....and great thread to come together on.


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## jaizei (Jan 2, 2012)

Shelly said:


> jaizei said:
> 
> 
> > I think the more important thing would be asking why a 10 year old child is on the internet unsupervised.
> ...



I think that many people do not understand the Internet. There are many times when it's like a whole new round of 'stranger danger' (thanks To Catch a Predator). Statistically, if a child is preyed upon, it will be by an acquaintance or family member. Something like your hypothetical from the OP is very unlikely.



yagyujubei said:


> Then I recommend we ban all children from this site, for their own safety.
> 
> 
> CtTortoiseMom said:
> ...



Technically, kids under 13 aren't supposed to be able to sign up without consent from parents. So in reality, anytime a new member reveals their age to be less than 13 they should be banned. 



CtTortoiseMom said:


> jaizei said:
> 
> 
> > I think the more important thing would be asking why a 10 year old child is on the internet unsupervised. Parents need to be responsible for their children.
> ...



I think that's the way to go. Do you have an age when you think you'll ease the restrictions? If I had kids, it'd be 25.


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## CtTortoiseMom (Jan 2, 2012)

@ Jaizei: My rule is that they are not allowed to be google-able until they get into college. Harsh, I know but I believe it is necessary and I have been to enough police run internet safety courses to know that the danger is very real. I will never reveal their names and I have google alerts on all of our names in case one of their friends post's a picture of them on FB or something. 

On topic: I feel that asking a name and location is kind of welcoming.


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## SulcataSquirt (Jan 2, 2012)

I don't think anyone young enough to fall for the "hey you wanna see my tortoises" should be on the forum. But I also don't think only 18+ should be allowed. We have quite a bit of valuable members that are under 18, but above 13. 
Hopefully anyone that answers what's your name and your location should also know they can just say name and basic location - like Crystal from Missouri but leave out city. The location helps for those members requesting information for their outside tortoises and as Yvonne said before on another thread it's nice to call others by first name rather than usernames. 
If a internet pedophile really wanted to find you they could, I'm sure a lot have ways of computer hacking. At least that's all my opinion.


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## StudentoftheReptile (Jan 2, 2012)

I do have to say that this is the only forum where people are asked their names and locations. I have kinda pondered it occasionally, but never really felt that strongly about it one way or another until this thread.

Forums like this have usernames for a reason. Personally, if people wanted you to know their first name, they'd put it in their username (like Tom, Josh, etc...lol). Now personally, I don't care if anyone knows my first name and the city I live in (there are at least 5 other people who share my first and last name in the same city!). But all the concerns about internet safety and whatnot are absolutely warranted.

In retrospect, I have seen on numerous occasions where a new member joins and asks a question somewhere other than the Introductions section and the first thing anyone does before even acknowledging the question is "Can we know your name? And where you're from?" Perhaps I'm reading a little too much into it, but if I were on the outside looking in, it almost seemed like their question wouldn't be answered unless they told everyone their name. Now I know that is not the case, but that is the impression I get sometimes [shrugs].

I can understand why everyone wants to know, but at the same time, is it really that big deal? Once again, this is coming from someone who has almost always addressed fellow forum members by their usernames. In fact, I gave my name in my introduction thread, and if I recall correctly, I believe only one person has ever actually addressed me on this forum by my real name. Now again, I could care less either way...just sayin. How important is it really to have to type that question out everytime a new member posts?

On the flip side, a new member can always choose NOT to divulge their name or location, and IMHO, they are probably the wiser for doing so.


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## Jacqui (Jan 2, 2012)

ascott said:


> > I would be in favor of a "junior membership" for all members under 18.
> 
> 
> 
> I think that this would be awesome....and great thread to come together on.



If I were a pedophile, that is exactly the section I would be joining. There is no way to tell if a person is of a certain age or anything else on here. We have to go by what they (the member) decided to reveal to us. There are a few folks who are in here or have been members here, whom I think fabricate a lot of their information. Which is fine with me, as long as it is not being done to cause harm. I do not personally like lies, but I can understand the need some folks feel about doing so.

When (if I have even asked this question) ask where somebody is from on the open forum, I am wanting as a rule to know a general area, not a specific town. Also it seems often we ask, not so much for a name, but what do you want to be called. I always thought the name to be called was offering a friendship, the location is to help give the user better care information. Once more, anybody with any concerns can offer false information.


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## lynnedit (Jan 2, 2012)

Again, you need to know the general location someone lives in to be able to advise about tortoise care. People ask questions about their outside enclosures, temps, plants, on and on. That's all.
As far as a first name, it may be old fashioned, but calling someone 'tortoisejerk', for example, seems kind of weird. 
Those who are cautious can make up a first name, just something easy.


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## StudentoftheReptile (Jan 2, 2012)

lynnedit said:


> Again, you need to know the general location someone lives in to be able to advise about tortoise care. People ask questions about their outside enclosures, temps, plants, on and on. That's all.



I agree...only if they're asking questions about keeping their tortoise(s) outdoors. I personally don't think they have to tell everyone where they live right when they walk in the door, so to speak.



> As far as a first name, it may be old fashioned, but calling someone 'tortoisejerk', for example, seems kind of weird.
> Those who are cautious can make up a first name, just something easy.



Maybe its part of that disconnect the tortoise community has from the rest of the herp hobby. People have been calling me "ShiningSnakes" for years on other forums. 

And are you implying that everyone HAS to have a "real" name to be accepted into the forum?


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## lynnedit (Jan 2, 2012)

No, they can have a fake name, just make it easy. Shiningsnakes is easy. Some of them are not.
It is just personal preference.
I don't think either question is a big deal as long as it is kept general.


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## JeffG (Jan 2, 2012)

I know almost for certain that the moderator who always asks for a name and location has only the best intentions, but I must admit, when I first joined the forum it seemed a bit intrusive to me. After being around for awhile I understand that the main reason is just so Yvonne can address people by their first name in order to be polite. 

After being forced to contemplate the practice by this thread, I would say that it is probably not the best thing to do in my opinion. Minor safety is a real issue, and unfortunately, I think it may make many adults feel uncomfortable as well.


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## wellington (Jan 2, 2012)

I personally feel the constant asking their name and location before answering their question has pushed many to tell their name and location. I to believe it sounds like they won't be answered without divulging the name/location. Maybe if you are actually going to answer their question and location is needed then ask. A lot of the time the person asking the name and location doesn't even answer their question. Besides I don't really see many addressed by their name to begin with.
Making the internet safer is always a good idea. Just my opinion.


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## Tom (Jan 2, 2012)

I can understand the name thing, but I agree that it is helpful to know the general area of the world the person lives in when they are asking for advice. Really I wish people would put some sort of location in their profiles, so nobody had to ask. I like to know where the person I'm talking to is. It sometimes will change the way I word things or give insight into a problem they are having. I would also like to know if I am talking to a child. It helps me to answer questions or make comments more appropriately. If a 13 year old english boy says something juvenile, I will cut him more slack than a grown man from NY, for example.


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## jaizei (Jan 2, 2012)

SulcataSquirt said:


> I don't think anyone young enough to fall for the "hey you wanna see my tortoises" should be on the forum. But I also don't think only 18+ should be allowed. We have quite a bit of valuable members that are under 18, but above 13.
> Hopefully anyone that answers what's your name and your location should also know they can just say name and basic location - like Crystal from Missouri but leave out city. The location helps for those members requesting information for their outside tortoises and as Yvonne said before on another thread it's nice to call others by first name rather than usernames.
> If a internet pedophile really wanted to find you they could, I'm sure a lot have ways of computer hacking. At least that's all my opinion.



It really doesn't have anything to do with age but with awareness. There are plenty of adults that would fall for that ruse. Just look at the crimes that happen in connection with Craigslist. 

I doubt most pedophiles are able to hack. Simply because most people can't. Hacking seems to have become a catch-all for being extremely computer literate. If I posted pictures from someones 'private' Photobucket, they would describe it as having their account hacked. But in reality all you need is their account name and a fusker program. No skill needed. Plus add in the fact that most people are completely oblivious to the amount of information about them that is available, which is weird considering that they themselves put most of it out there. It's like they haven't realized that using the same user name on every site isn't smart when some sites are connected to their 'real' identity (FB, myspace,etc) and others that are less desirable (ratemy____). Or that having the same exact avatar on every site makes it easy to cross reference. There are a lot of people that haven't realized the 'permanentness' of anything posted online. Once something's out there it stays out there. 




I think asking for someone's name is a nice touch, friendly. Don't get me wrong, having a bunch of strangers know my name is kinda creepy but, eh, oh well. Don't hold your breath waiting for a picture. 

I think any kind of danger or threat from asking for name/location is overstated. Knowing someone's first name and location isn't going to do most people any good. And those that could use it for some nefarious purpose probably have better things to do. If you are truly worried about Internet safety, then you shouldn't post anything. Because every little tidbit helps. Knowing that Jim is from Albuquerque isn't going to help me track him down. But when he mentions that he's a _________ in one thread or that he likes to _________ in another. Not to mention all the posts he made on a different forum 3 years ago, with the same user name. I'll have his dox in no time.


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## terryo (Jan 2, 2012)

A few years back I was having a problem with a scam where I lost some money, and there was a lawyer on here who helped me out, as he lived near the person who scammed me. I was really surprised when he called me on the phone to see how I was doing. He wouldn't tell me how he got my number, and this was way before there was a face book, so he didn't have much information about me.....except my name and what city I lived in. Even though he helped me, my husband wasn't too happy with the phone call and knowing that people on a forum could find out where we lived.


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## Talka (Jan 2, 2012)

Even an email address can yield the most frightening results! My friend was looking for an old buddy once, as he was late for some online game. She knew he lived in the UK somewhere, and she had his email address he had used to sign up on a forum. 10 minutes of Googling gave her his home address and phone number, as well as his parents' workplace address.


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## Melly-n-shorty (Jan 2, 2012)

maybe we should just ask where are you located and maybe "what would you like us to call you" in instances where the user name is long or odd. even looking at this thread there is really only a couple people i would want to ask "what would you like me to call you". everyone else seems to have a name or their name incorporated in their user name or signature.


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## ALDABRAMAN (Jan 2, 2012)

JeffG said:


> I know almost for certain that the moderator who always asks for a name and location has only the best intentions, but I must admit, when I first joined the forum it seemed a bit intrusive to me. After being around for awhile I understand that the main reason is just so Yvonne can address people by their first name in order to be polite.
> 
> After being forced to contemplate the practice by this thread, I would say that it is probably not the best thing to do in my opinion. Minor safety is a real issue, and unfortunately, I think it may make many adults feel uncomfortable as well.



 Ditto!


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## cherylim (Jan 2, 2012)

I have to say I agree with Jaizei (sorry, name? )

To me, this isn't about age - it's about the individual. All this talk of children needing to be protected on the internet, watched over and stopped from doing things frustrates me.

I've been using the internet since I was 11. I fortunately did have free reign - my parents 'threatened' that they knew all the ways to watch over what I was doing from elsewhere, but of course I knew they didn't because they'd never touched a computer in their lives.

I've always loved the internet. I played games on it for a year or so, and then I learned web design and started making my own websites. In my years, I've used it to socialise, to share things, to create things and to learn, and I've benefited from having that access to the internet throughout my childhood/teenage years.

I'm easy to find on the internet. I have a long, unique name, and I use a set number of usernames everywhere I go. One quick search, and you can see my life in great detail. That doesn't bother me, and it never has, because I'm not (and never was) going to wander off and meet anyone new without being very careful and checking things out, and because I keep those absolute vital details (specific location, etc) to myself. Rather than expecting people to stay hidden from the world online and offline, parents need to give their children free reign but invest time in teaching them to be careful enough not to give out their FULL address. Let's face it, people in your neighbourhood know more about your children than anyone on the internet that asks for a first name and a general location.

If I see that someone is from the UK, I do ask for a more specific location. I'm not trying to hunt anyone down, I'm simply interested to find other UK tortoise keepers and to know more about them. Nobody has ever responded with 'I live on 42 Wallaby Way, I go to this school and I'm out of the house between the hours of...'.

I do find it a little off-putting that Yvonne's responses now say 'Can we have your name and a location? You don't HAVE to give this information', or something similar. To me, that instantly says "we're not a very trustworthy, friendly bunch, you might want to spend your entire time here feeling nervous around us".


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## dmarcus (Jan 3, 2012)

cherylim said:


> I have to say I agree with Jaizei (sorry, name? )
> 
> To me, this isn't about age - it's about the individual. All this talk of children needing to be protected on the internet, watched over and stopped from doing things frustrates me.
> 
> ...



I agree with this, I was a bit confused with Yvonne's new way of asking for a persons name and location. I think it's too bad when things have to change to try and avoid offending someone even if what was being said is not offensive. 

Its so easy to just say, no I don't feel comfortable with giving out my real name or location, instead we have a debate and then things change to avoid the few that took offense. I understand the argument here but I think what's being asked is not gonna subject you to creepy person harm.


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## bubbles01 (Jan 3, 2012)

Hi

I can see this one getting hot..... however I wil put my point forward with a great big **IMHO** attached to it!!

I have 3 kids, aged 9,11 and 16. There is a computer in their bedrooms and they all have facebook accounts. I see it as MY responsibility to check that they are safe, so we set the parameters on the PC's to 'high' to stop them accessing certain sites but otherwise their time is their time. I go on to their facebooks, emails, and the couple of other sites they regularly use every other day. Our rule is that they are not allowed to change their passwords so I can always see what they are doing. The same would apply if they were members on here. Do they use their real names? - yes they do. But apart from facebook chat (where all their friends are pre-approved by either me or their Dad) they are not allowed to use instant messaging or chat sites.

As far as this forum goes, I remember joining and being asked my name and where I was. I had no problem with giving my name, BUT I could just as easily have given a different one if I wanted to.... My location isnt a secret, anyone with the smallest amount of computer savvy could look up my IP address, and I do think it helps to advise people about their torts if you know they are in a super hot climate as opposed to a cold one.

I like the fact that I can call regular posters on here by their names, and they can call me by mine. I think TFO differs from MOST forums in that it has more of a 'community' feel. We are wished Happy Birthday by the Birthday Fairy, have a forum wide calendar competition, and even a Secret Santa - not something you generally find on less friendly forums. I think that is the point, TFO is friendly - to people of all ages, owners of all torts, other reptile owners, non-owners doing research, breeders, retail outlets etc etc If you dont want to give your name then you dont have to - just because you're asked doesnt mean you have to comply!!! 

Also - Yvonne NEVER asks "CAN' she always says "MAY we know your name and where we are" I interpret that as 'Is it alright if we know you're name and where you are" not - 'we need it' 

As I said...... IMHO!

Helen x x


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## tyler0912 (Jan 3, 2012)

I agree with all the posts here.
No-one is forced to tell there name etc...no-one holds a gun to your head....
~I have no problems as im internet safe.
My parents let me have free reign of the computers in the house.
Im 13, (14 in 9 days) If i was notn aloud on this site i would cause a fuss....cause this is the only place that i got info on my torts! 


I also ask UK'ers where they are as im intrested on other UK owners.
I dont ask anyother people out of the UK as theyll' tell me and i dont have aclue Wher/What theyre talking about!


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## JoesMum (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm coming a little late to this thread, but am qualified to speak being 1) a Mum of teenagers 2) a school IT network manager and 3) a CEOP Ambassador (UK e-safety trainer)

I agree with OP's concerns about asking who you are and where you're from. In schools we spend a lot of time teaching youngsters not to give away their identities online... they shouldn't be encouraged to do so.

When training I talk about 3 generations of internet users
1) the youngsters who have grown up with the internet and are being taught to look after their personal information at the same time as they're being taught how to cross the road and not to talk to strangers. I think of these being aged up to around 10 years old.
2) the older generation - over 30s who didn't have the internet until they were all grown up (This includes me!) We naturally tick every box to prevent spam and junk mail and are a bit afraid and cautious of the internet
3) the middle "danger generation" - IT confident, know they're grown up, know EVERYTHING, can't/won't be advised * wry grin *... aged 11-29 in my mind. Teenagers are definitely in this category. After all, what do I know about this subject... I'm only Mum! 

Parents have to accept that no amount of supervision, or parental control software, will prevent their child from accessing material or websites that their parents think is unsuitable. If they don't use the computer, they'll use a cell phone, or a public computer in a library or their games console, or some other unfiltered source. Personally, I feel the bullying and fraud risks are greater than the grooming risks, but young people need to be aware of them all.

What parents have to do is keep channels of communication open. Here's some advice on e-safety at home which discusses privacy settings and social networking.

With regard to facebook, this document Suggested Facebook Privacy Settings is regularly updated to help teachers keep their information private. It applies to anyone.

If anyone has any specific concerns, I am happy to try and help or recommend material that you can share with your family to help them understand the risks... just PM me.

If you feel there is a risk to a person you can report this material
In the UK - via CEOP 
In the rest of the world - via the Virtual Global Taskforce


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## Jacqui (Jan 3, 2012)

I think if, we can not ask for their names or location, we should also not be asking them to even reveal what kind of tortoises they own. If I for instance were so paranoid of somebody finding me by my location, my worry would be for my tortoises (my children are grown now). 

Then my question also becomes, what should we even be able to ask them and not invade their privacy/security or make them feel like if they don't answer we won't help?

Another question or thought, if you were meeting these folks face to face, like at a tortoise club meeting, would you feel it would be wrong to ask where they live? Would you think twice about it? Perhaps, it is my small town upbringing, but to me that is normal conversation, normal friendliness, and normal information we share with other folks.


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## StudentoftheReptile (Jan 3, 2012)

Jacqui said:


> I think if, we can not ask for their names or location, we should also not be asking them to even reveal what kind of tortoises they own. If I for instance were so paranoid of somebody finding me by my location, my worry would be for my tortoises (my children are grown now).



Perhaps I'm being dense, but I don't see the connection. I mean, LOTS of people own say, Russian tortoises, but there's only so many people named Jacqui _____ from ______, _______. You know what I mean? The only exception is perhaps people with not-so-commonly-kept species not wanting to divulge their location.



> Another question or thought, if you were meeting these folks face to face, like at a tortoise club meeting, would you feel it would be wrong to ask where they live? Would you think twice about it? Perhaps, it is my small town upbringing, but to me that is normal conversation, normal friendliness, and normal information we share with other folks.



I think there's a significant different between your local herp club where most people are familiar with each other within a particular community, and a huge global messageboard spanding several continents where all we really have to go on is just a member's word, you know? At a herp club, you can see the person, get a feel for what kind of person they are, meet them face-to-face, etc. You simply do not get that on the internet. I can understand why we would want to know people's real names, but that anonymity swings both ways, for reasons already pointed out.
-----

I don't really have a problem with us asking people's names, as long as we're not pushy about it. And of course, last names are certainly not necessary.
I don't have problem with us asking where a person lives, as long as it pertains to helping a member with keeping their tortoises outdoors. I don't think anyone should have to divulge their hometown or city; the state should be sufficient. If it's a large state, an answer such as "northern Texas" should be fine.



Tom said:


> Really I wish people would put some sort of location in their profiles, so nobody had to ask. I like to know where the person I'm talking to is. It sometimes will change the way I word things or give insight into a problem they are having. I would also like to know if I am talking to a child. It helps me to answer questions or make comments more appropriately. If a 13 year old english boy says something juvenile, I will cut him more slack than a grown man from NY, for example.



I do concur with this! I don't have to know their age, just whether its a teenager or a someone old enough to be my dad!


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## dmarcus (Jan 3, 2012)

I put my city in my title and I dont have fears that someone will come track me down especially since I don't live in a tiny town. I have never seen or heard anyone be pushy and demand that someone divulges that info. It's always asked and never demanded... I also have no problems with giving my first name even though its not common but there is at least one other person that shares the name in the area, however I won't put my last name out there. I think it should be left up to the individual to decided what they want to share but I don't think the question should stop being asked.


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## SulcataSquirt (Jan 3, 2012)

dmarcus said:


> I put my city in my title and I dont have fears that someone will come track me down especially since I don't live in a tiny town. I have never seen or heard anyone be pushy and demand that someone divulges that info. It's always asked and never demanded... I also have no problems with giving my first name even though its not common but there is at least one other person that shares the name in the area, however I won't put my last name out there. I think it should be left up to the individual to decided what they want to share but I don't think the question should stop being asked.



Very well said.


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## Jacqui (Jan 3, 2012)

StudentoftheReptile said:


> Jacqui said:
> 
> 
> > I think if, we can not ask for their names or location, we should also not be asking them to even reveal what kind of tortoises they own. If I for instance were so paranoid of somebody finding me by my location, my worry would be for my tortoises (my children are grown now).
> ...



Even the more commonly kept tortoise could be stolen. I do know folks with the more "common" tortoises who fear them being stolen. I happen to know a few Russians, I would love to own... what if I were also the type of person who chose dishonest methods to get what I want? I also know of some really good and long time tortoise folks with lots of experience that could be so valuable to us here, but they won't join sites like this for fear for their tortoises.  

There is already so much information about each of us out on the web, why come into a tortoise site looking for "victims" unless it's tortoises your after?



SulcataSquirt said:


> dmarcus said:
> 
> 
> > I put my city in my title and I dont have fears that someone will come track me down especially since I don't live in a tiny town. I have never seen or heard anyone be pushy and demand that someone divulges that info. It's always asked and never demanded... I also have no problems with giving my first name even though its not common but there is at least one other person that shares the name in the area, however I won't put my last name out there. I think it should be left up to the individual to decided what they want to share but I don't think the question should stop being asked.
> ...



I agree!


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## Pokeymeg (Jan 3, 2012)

When I first signed up for this forum, I was put off by the request for my name and location. I think I skipped the self-introduction in the introduction section. As I spent time on here, I felt comfortable enough to put 'Boston' under my username and whatnot, and I understand now why people are asked--Now I see it as a welcoming, friendly gesture. But that's not how I felt when I first joined.

I think the message people should get from moderaters should be something like 'please feel free to introduce yourself in the intro section if you would like to share your name/general location/torts/etc'

Ultimately it's up to the new member to decide what they want to share. No one is forcing anyone to share anything. Like I said, I skipped the introduction stage because I was uncomfortable. I figured if that was a problem, I'd hear about it.


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## Sammy (Jan 3, 2012)

I thought it was rather nice, kind of a welcoming intro on getting to know you. Didn't asked for my age/sex or anything important.


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## Utah Lynn (Jan 3, 2012)

Personally, I include my picture as my avatar, because I got tired of getting "hit on" by men because they associate my name with being a female. Now, if the women want to hit on me, that's a whole different story.
My name is Lynn.
I am a Tortaholic.

Thank you for the welcome.


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## Sammy (Jan 3, 2012)

Mr. Lynn is funny! I wanna put my photo in too.


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## dmarcus (Jan 3, 2012)

Utah Lynn said:


> Personally, I include my picture as my avatar, because I got tired of getting "hit on" by men because they associate my name with being a female. Now, if the women want to hit on me, that's a whole different story.
> My name is Lynn.
> I am a Tortaholic.
> 
> Thank you for the welcome.


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## Pond_Lilly (Jan 3, 2012)

When I first joined the forum I was also asked for my name ( I put location in profile) and it made me very uncomfortable even though I've answered. I felt that I absolutely had to answer in order to get a reply to my question but also that the forum is being monitored for some reason to perhaps ban some people from posting, or something like that. 

I would say that in my opinion, it is absolutely not necessary to know person's real name or location. If you want to say it, then fine, but the specific question right from the very beginning made me uneasy and even a bit not welcomed in here and maybe others felt the same way too. 

EDIT: And by the way, nobody referred to me by my real name anyways, so what was the point of asking, really?


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## Jacqui (Jan 3, 2012)

Utah Lynn said:


> Personally, I include my picture as my avatar, because I got tired of getting "hit on" by men because they associate my name with being a female.



Were you hit on in here?


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## cherylim (Jan 3, 2012)

Pond_Lilly said:


> When I first joined the forum I was also asked for my name ( I put location in profile) and it made me very uncomfortable even though I've answered. I felt that I absolutely had to answer in order to get a reply to my question but also that the forum is being monitored for some reason to perhaps ban some people from posting, or something like that.
> 
> I would say that in my opinion, it is absolutely not necessary to know person's real name or location. If you want to say it, then fine, but the specific question right from the very beginning made me uneasy and even a bit not welcomed in here and maybe others felt the same way too.
> 
> EDIT: And by the way, nobody referred to me by my real name anyways, so what was the point of asking, really?




It's a shame you felt like that. I like to know what users' names are even if I end up forgetting. A few eventually stick, but they're usually the ones I end up talking to a lot.

I would say from my point of view there are a lot of times when people post a 'Welcome', perhaps with a request for a name, on a thread where somebody has asked a specific question. They don't have the answer to hand, but they're just being friendly. I suppose if I asked a question and the first ten replies were just people saying 'Welcome' and asking my name, I might wonder if I had to give that information up before I got my response, but usually it's just that people want to get to know you and don't have an answer.

That is something I've thought about lately, so if I don't have an answer to a question someone new has asked, I'll avoid welcoming them until someone has answered, or they've made a separate introduction thread.


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## Jacqui (Jan 3, 2012)

cherylim said:


> That is something I've thought about lately, so if I don't have an answer to a question someone new has asked, I'll avoid welcoming them until someone has answered, or they've made a separate introduction thread.



It's interesting, I have been talking to a few folks and we all are now kinda avoiding the welcoming thread for fear of in any way saying something not considered appropriate.  Then to see, your another one, feeling much the same way. It just seems to me, this is just pushing folks away from welcoming new folks and that is one of the best things about this forum... we welcome folks in a friendly manner the same as if you were walking into our homes, which in a way you are. So sad....


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## StudentoftheReptile (Jan 3, 2012)

I suppose it's part of the curse of communicating on the internet, where you cannot easily determine someone's inflection or tone...something easily done in person, or even on the phone.

Maybe the admins can add some kind of message when new members sign up, something to the effect of: "On this forum, many members will welcome you and probably ask for your name and your location. This is merely an attempt to be friendly, to get to know you better. It also aids us to better answer any questions you may have about caring for your tortoises, as your location and climate are often important factors in housing tortoises outdoors. Divulging this information is absolutely optional, and we understand perfectly if you choose to keep your name and location private."


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## dmarcus (Jan 3, 2012)

Cheryl makes a good point, I to will say welcome to someone even if I don't know the answer just to be friendly and welcome them to the forum. Maybe thats a mistake on my part and I should either not post until the question has been answered or just not at all. 

I think this is a no win situation because most of us are trying to be friendly and welcome people to this wonderl forum even if we don't have the answer to the question that was asked especially since not everyone post's a intro, some just ask a question. I don't want to make anyone feel unwelcomed because I didn't answer there question but instead only said hello or welcome...


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## Madkins007 (Jan 3, 2012)

Jacqui said:


> Utah Lynn said:
> 
> 
> > Personally, I include my picture as my avatar, because I got tired of getting "hit on" by men because they associate my name with being a female.
> ...



(Covering my face in shame) I am SOOOOOO embarrassed! It was an honest misunderstanding!


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## cherylim (Jan 3, 2012)

Jacqui said:


> cherylim said:
> 
> 
> > That is something I've thought about lately, so if I don't have an answer to a question someone new has asked, I'll avoid welcoming them until someone has answered, or they've made a separate introduction thread.
> ...



I do agree. I like to welcome people on this forum, and once they've been around a while and settled in I like to hear about their lives, their days, their families. I suppose it's all down to whether you see the forum as a simple source of information, or a place to meet and bond with likeminded people.

It's why I love the pretend chat thread. I really enjoy hearing what people have been up to, new things they've discovered, something as 'mundane' as what they've eaten or how tired they're feeling. I consider people on this forum to be friends, and I love saying 'hello' to new potential friends wherever I can, but I do understand that maybe some people just want to come in, get their answers and get on with things.


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## Utah Lynn (Jan 3, 2012)

Madkins007 said:


> Jacqui said:
> 
> 
> > Utah Lynn said:
> ...



@Jacqui...not yet
@Madkins...must have missed it. 's ok.


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## StudentoftheReptile (Jan 3, 2012)

Personally, I don't welcome anyone...not because I don't want be unfriendly, but because quite simply, there are so many people joining the forum all the time, and I will always invariably leave someone out or miss someone. And I do this on sites I moderate as well. I just can't keep track of every new member, so to be fair...I just stay away from the welcome/intro section.

Remember the main reason most people join this site: to get helpful advice and information on how to care for their tortoises. I mean, that's why I joined. I didn't join to make friends and chitchat and have buddies. Now there's nothing wrong with that, and I have met some nice, friendly people here and I always recommend others to check out this site. But whether or not someone "welcomed" me to the forum, or uses my real name isn't going to make or break my decision to remain here.

I say, if you want to welcome someone and ask for their first name, keep in the Welcome/Introductions section. I think if this is an important issue for the friendlier faction of the forum, we should have some sort of disclaimer somewhere, either as a sticky in the Intro section or better yet, as some message whenever a new member registers, so that they're a little more "prepared" for the overabundance of friendliness that is often lacking on herp messageboards.

Like I said before, I do concur that it is important a lot of times to know where someone lives to help them with outdoor housing issues, and you can always ask the location on those respective threads.


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## bubbles01 (Jan 3, 2012)

Cheryl - I too love the pretend chat thread, and I think you have hit the nail on the head here. Those of us that chat, talk about the weather, our home lives, Christmas, our kids etc use this forum as a community and we use our real names frequently.

If other members only wish to use TFO as an info source then they would probably find our familiarity a little strange.

The whole 'name and location' issue really is about the fact that we all welcome people to the site regardless of their age, location, name or gender and I believe that it originated as a means of including new members into our forum on a personal level. I am saddened to see that many people have stopped using the introductions thread to say welcome in case they dont answer an initial question - personally I LOVED being welcomed by so many people - made me realise what a friendly and open place this was...

I actually remember seeing a thread where Yvonne did her usual polite question - and got the reply - "I dont share my name or location on the internet" (I'm paraphrasing but it was words to that effect.) The member still got their question answered... No harm done, no hard feelings.....

Studentofthereptile - I agree with your idea - when new members join they could be asked to put a 1st post in the introductions thread and to include their general location and name they wish to be referred to as. On a separate subject it could also be made clearer that their first post is moderated and may not appear immediately!! I have joined other forums where your first post HAS to be in the intro's thread or you cant post in the rest of the site.

do I need to add another IMHO??? am doing it anyhow!!!

Helen x


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## Yvonne G (Jan 3, 2012)

Ok...I get it!!! I'm sorry if I offended anyone. I was just trying to be friendly.

Does this offend:


*Welcome to the Tortoise Forum!!*

What would you like for us to call you? 

Also, when we know *approximately* where you are, it helps us design our answers to better fit your problem.


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## Sammy (Jan 3, 2012)

No u didn't, ur welcome note was lovely.


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## CtTortoiseMom (Jan 3, 2012)

Jacqui said:


> cherylim said:
> 
> 
> > That is something I've thought about lately, so if I don't have an answer to a question someone new has asked, I'll avoid welcoming them until someone has answered, or they've made a separate introduction thread.
> ...


That is so sad Jacqui . I felt so welcomed when I joined here. I couldn't believe that anyone would want to know a novice like me or even see pictures of MY tortoise!! Everyone was and is so nice, I never felt threatened or like someone was invading my privacy.


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## Sammy (Jan 3, 2012)

This new one is like a 'help hotline' 
IMHO only


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## StudentoftheReptile (Jan 3, 2012)

Sounds fine to me (I never personally mentioned you by name, BTW!) : )
----------------

On a related note just show how far this could go, I was a member of one of the most popular herp classifieds websites out there. They recently instilled a rule where members were required to list their city and state in their member profile, which was displayed under their username. This, among other reasons, was why I left that forum (the head admin is, to put it mildly, a poophead).


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## Sammy (Jan 3, 2012)

That's not my name


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## Jacqui (Jan 3, 2012)

Okay, so is having the new sticky I put up, enough to satisfy everybody? Anything you think we need to add?

...and Student, I took most of what you had written and used it... is that okay?

http://www.tortoiseforum.org/Thread-Please-read-before-making-your-first-post#axzz1iQOVuwO3


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## StudentoftheReptile (Jan 3, 2012)

Fine with me, Jacqui.

And "Sammy" my last post was directed to Yvonne. You posted right before I did. Sorry for the confusion.


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## bubbles01 (Jan 3, 2012)

Jacqui - I think that just about covers it! 

The 'your' in the last sentence should be a 'you're' 

H x


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## terryo (Jan 3, 2012)

It would be so simple if everyone just put the name thay want to be called in their signature. Then we'd all know what to call each other. It wouldn't even have to be your real name, just the name that you want everyone to call you.


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## SulcataSquirt (Jan 3, 2012)

terryo said:


> It would be so simple if everyone just put the name thay want to be called in their signature. Then we'd all know what to call each other. It wouldn't even have to be your real name, just the name that you want everyone to call you.



Also agreed. I enjoyed being welcomed when we first joined, and came for advice but also to be able to converse with others that shared our passion of tortoises and animals. I don't think the way Yvonne originally posted was intrusive or demanding at all but friendly and welcoming. I felt like everyone was welcoming and very helpful. Lately the forum is filled with many threads challenging every bit of everything. And yes I know this is allowed on the forum and I enjoy debates but I almost feel like you have to tip toe around the forum a lot more than you used to. This is just my opinion. I think everyone has made great points on the subject from all angles though, just thought I'd share how I felt. IMHO.


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## CtTortoiseMom (Jan 3, 2012)

Jacqui said:


> Okay, so is having the new sticky I put up, enough to satisfy everybody? Anything you think we need to add?
> 
> ...and Student, I took most of what you had written and used it... is that okay?
> 
> http://www.tortoiseforum.org/Thread-Please-read-before-making-your-first-post#axzz1iQOVuwO3



That is great


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## Tom (Jan 3, 2012)

emysemys said:


> Ok...I get it!!! I'm sorry if I offended anyone. I was just trying to be friendly.
> 
> Does this offend:
> 
> ...



This is great. Now you can just copy and paste it. 





SulcataSquirt said:


> Lately the forum is filled with many threads challenging every bit of everything. And yes I know this is allowed on the forum and I enjoy debates but I almost feel like you have to tip toe around the forum a lot more than you used to. This is just my opinion. I think everyone has made great points on the subject from all angles though, just thought I'd share how I felt. IMHO.



This has happened a couple of times in my two years here. It seems to fade away and everything goes back to normal after a while. It seems unavoidable when you consider the number of personalities represented here. Overall, this forum is heaping full of nice, helpful, knowledgeable, intelligent, good intentioned people. I love it here and it does feel like a community of friends most of the time. We have a grump or two and the occasional troll pops up, but over all this is a fantastic group.


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## StudentoftheReptile (Jan 3, 2012)

Hey, I'm not a grump! I'm a realist...there's a difference!


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## Terry Allan Hall (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm of the opinion that *First Name *and *General Location *(state or country) is about as much info as is appropriate for Newbies, particularily youngsters, to share and feel that, should someone put in more, a mod should *** - X out the further details, and send the newbie a short explanation as to why. 

Or maybe put up a short "stickie" on online safety guidelines, whichever is thought to be the better idea.

This is a wonderful and SAFE site and I'm for all of us striving to keep it as such.


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## dmmj (Jan 3, 2012)

Terry Allan Hall said:


> I'm of the opinion that *First Name *and *General Location *(state or country) is about as much info as is appropriate for Newbies, particularily youngsters, to share and feel that, should someone put in more, a mod should *** - X out the further details, and send the newbie a short explanation as to why.
> 
> Or maybe put up a short "stickie" on online safety guidelines, whichever is thought to be the better idea.
> 
> This is a wonderful and SAFE site and I'm for all of us striving to keep it as such.


Terry if that is your real name.


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## Terry Allan Hall (Jan 3, 2012)

dmmj said:


> Terry Allan Hall said:
> 
> 
> > I'm of the opinion that *First Name *and *General Location *(state or country) is about as much info as is appropriate for Newbies, particularily youngsters, to share and feel that, should someone put in more, a mod should *** - X out the further details, and send the newbie a short explanation as to why.
> ...



OK, ya caught me...my name is _really_ Quazimodo Ezekial Faunbacher, but I've been living under "Terry Allan Hall" since the Dept. of Homeland Paranoia put me in the Witless Protection Program and shipped me off to The Republic (used to be a New Yawker)... 

Oh, darn...


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## Maggie Cummings (Jan 3, 2012)

I think Yvonne's greeting was fine when TFO was smaller and and it's members were closer and more friendly. Now we are big and the closeness is disappearing and even those of us who spend a lot of time here don't know most people. I do like to know someone's first name as some user names are hard to pronounce. I'd hate to get caught saying "did you read what ujujubee had to say today?" (I don't mean any disrespect, it was just a good example) It's easy to know my name from reading my user name and I wish that's how it was with everyone. 

Also I personally don't think children should be allowed to join. I am very tired of juvenile conversations on what should be a grown up forum. I also don't think that children should be allowed to own chelonia as it seems they end up dying every time.

I know some of us are not here to make friends or chat, but some of us are. We want to have conversations with others who own turtles or tortoises and talk about how big Bob and Aladar are getting.

Also with a forum this large there's always going to be someone who doesn't like something. Yvonne has been asking people their names for 5 or 6 years now and it's never bothered anyone before. So it's alright with me emysemys...


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## Yvonne G (Jan 3, 2012)

Well, maybe not 5 or 6 years, but for a long time! 

The trouble with stickys (and I agree that Jacqui's sticky is a good one), is no one reads them. We've had a couple of new members post their first post since the sticky and its obvious they didn't read it.


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## terryo (Jan 3, 2012)

Maybe when someone new joins, you should just ask them to put a name in their signature that can be used. They can put any name they want to.


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## Melly-n-shorty (Jan 3, 2012)

I went back to my first post and Yvonne didn't have to ask me my name or where i was from... I was a good girl and filled out my profile


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## Tom (Jan 3, 2012)

StudentoftheReptile said:


> Hey, I'm not a grump! I'm a realist...there's a difference!



Hahaha. I was NOT referring to you, goofball.


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## dmmj (Jan 3, 2012)

New welcome macro
Name Age Local Blood type Fear Weaknesses


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## Yvonne G (Jan 4, 2012)

You forgot how many fillings in your teeth!


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## Jacqui (Jan 4, 2012)

terryo said:


> Maybe when someone new joins, you should just ask them to put a name in their signature that can be used. They can put any name they want to.



Sorry, I can't do that. Would be wrong to ask them to do something, even I do not do.


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## harris (Jan 4, 2012)

Jujubees are my 2nd favorite candy next to Blow Pops.

I'm Mike from Cleveland Ohio and I love me some candy.


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## Laurie (Jan 12, 2012)

While I am very much enjoying this forum and the great knowledge that can be learned here, I was a little put off by being asked my name and location, especially since that information was included in my first post  


I do "get" why it is asked though. But it sure made me feel as though my first post wasn't read entirely. I must admit though that I double posted my initial introduction because I was unaware that the first five posts had to be "approved"

I see nothing wrong with asking these things, but as I states if they are already included in the first post, it makes posters feel as though those posts weren't really read.

I'm going to take this opportunity to say that there is a wealth of information provides on these forums and u am certainly thankful for it 

States was supposed to be stated... I'm on my phone! I love the app btw


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