# Earthworms??



## BrinnANDTorts (Jan 2, 2012)

So I have heard that some people on the forum like to put earthworms into the soil of their tortoises to keep their cages more clean and the soil fresher...my questions are 
1. I can't always find all of my tortoises feces to pick out of the cage , if I had earthworms running around in the soil would they eat and break down the feces if it got mixed up in the substrate? 
2. If food is mixed up in the substrate will the earthworms break this down and eat it as well?
3. Will earthworms keep my substrate fresher therefore making it way less likely to get moldy and smelly?
4. Is it hard to keep earthworms in the substrate of your enclosure? I don't want them to die and such


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## ascott (Jan 2, 2012)

http://urbanext.illinois.edu/worms/facts/index.html

Just for fun/learning


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## Madkins007 (Jan 2, 2012)

It is not just earthworms. The idea is the Bioactive Substrate System (https://sites.google.com/site/tortoiselibrary/the-work-shop/substrates-1 ), in which we basically recreate a mini-compost pile in the habitat.

By combing sand or kitty litter for micro-organisms to grow in, some humus or organic soil for food and a base, organic and inorganic materials to loosen/aerate/drain/retain moisture, some micro-organism rich garden soil (a few scoops) to 'innoculate' the habitat, and things like earthworms and sow bugs (rolly pollys, pillbugs, isopods), we get a lot of benefits.

The soil gets 'silky' and stops being sticky or smelly. The living organisms work together to decompose organic wastes- fecal and food (not to a huge degree, but still very helpful), they prey on other common pests like springtails and fungal gnats, etc.

It takes a bit more work to set up, and occasional tending, but it is a pretty sweet deal if you can do it!


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## BrinnANDTorts (Jan 2, 2012)

Madkins007 said:


> It is not just earthworms. The idea is the Bioactive Substrate System (https://sites.google.com/site/tortoiselibrary/the-work-shop/substrates-1 ), in which we basically recreate a mini-compost pile in the habitat.
> 
> By combing sand or kitty litter for micro-organisms to grow in, some humus or organic soil for food and a base, organic and inorganic materials to loosen/aerate/drain/retain moisture, some micro-organism rich garden soil (a few scoops) to 'innoculate' the habitat, and things like earthworms and sow bugs (rolly pollys, pillbugs, isopods), we get a lot of benefits.
> 
> ...



If I PMed u could u give me more details and such on how to do it cause that's what I wanna do ? Like step by step lol bioactive substrate for dummies. Or u can juat post It right here on the thread


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## dmarcus (Jan 3, 2012)

I put earth worms and red wigglers in mine and the box turtle eat them on occasion, I try to keep pill bugs in with them also but they never last very long..


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## Madkins007 (Jan 3, 2012)

The Bioactive Substrate is pretty easy.

- Make up a mix of about 50/50 sand or clay kitty litter and a good soil, like bagged top soil.
- Add your choice of shredded wood mulch, partially decomposted bark or leaf mulch, peat or sphagnum mosses, coconut coir, etc. to add organic elements to help keep the soil from compacting and to add 'sponginess' to hold moisture. I just generally use whatever left over garden or substrate stuff I have sitting around. Ratios are not important.
- Add a scoop, a few cups, or a shovel-full of good garden soil. The more you use, the faster the micro-organisms will invade the rest of the soil. 
- Toss in a handful of earthworms, red worms, isopods, etc. collected from your garden. The more you start with, the faster the colonies will grow. 
- Stir occasionally and keep at least a little damp. 
- The system should work for about 6-12 months without major issues, but replacing some of it every month or so will help it to keep 'fresh' longer. The soil will eventually 'sour' as it accumulates wastes and looses organic materials. It is a lot like a cat's scoopable litter box in this respect.

The ratios would vary based partly on the species- lots of 'sponge-like' material for humidity loving species, more sand, etc. for better drainage for those that don't like the moisture, etc.

You can combine the idea with other ideas as well-
- raise plants in the soil for food, shade, air quality, etc.
- add a layer of coarse pebbles, hydroballs, or lava rock in the bottom for drainage (although the action of compacting the soil by the tortoises tends to bring this to the surface)
- add a top layer of leaves, hay, etc. to provide a dry surface
- install a waterproof substrate heater to increase temps and humidity,
- etc.


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## BrinnANDTorts (Jan 3, 2012)

That was like awesome than u so much , I can pretty much all that except for the critters at lowes ? 
Can I buy the critters like earthworms and such online


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## Turtulas-Len (Jan 4, 2012)

Several years ago I got a couple pounds of red wigglers from New York Worms,(nyworms.com) and everything went fine.


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## conservation (Jan 4, 2012)

I recently setup a indoor Gulf Coast Bo turtle hatchling rearing pen. These hatchlings are small and very secretive so I tried to mimick there natural environment. I mixed chemical free soil, with leaf litter, a few different varities of moss and 100 earthworms. I added to earthworms as a food source and to help keep the cage clean. Has worked great so far


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## BrinnANDTorts (Jan 4, 2012)

I was just going to go buy some sand, organic top soil to mix together and then lots mulch and sphagnum moss and peat moss for moisture then add a shovel ful or so of organic compost to the mix for the micro organisms. Then I will buy like two hand fuls of earthworms from the bait shop. 
Do you think that is good enough? 
The sand, organic top soil, mulch, mosses, and compost are all being bought from Lowes gardening section.


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## Madkins007 (Jan 4, 2012)

That should work- bait shop is where I got mine! Just try to monitor them and replace as needed if they don't colonize.

The isopods are pretty easy to find in a garden under a rock or bark- I seem to find them even pretty late in the year if the weather is mild.


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## BrinnANDTorts (Jan 4, 2012)

Madkins007 said:


> That should work- bait shop is where I got mine! Just try to monitor them and replace as needed if they don't colonize.
> 
> The isopods are pretty easy to find in a garden under a rock or bark- I seem to find them even pretty late in the year if the weather is mild.



Thank u so much lol its kinda an odd that having worms crawling all throughout my enclosure but if they help clean it I am good with it


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## ShadowRancher (Jan 4, 2012)

WOAH...that first link just sent me off on like an hour long worm/composting tangent....think I'll get on that bio active substrate


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## Zouave (Jan 4, 2012)

I for one am very pleased with the way my BAS has preformed and with very little maintenance. Just till the soil once in a while (wave to the worms!) and keep it very well hydrated (a litre or 2 a day). Remove the turds by hand or stir them in, your choice. My hermann loves diggin out the burrow when i partially fill it in when cleaning up. Good exercise and keeps her from stage diving off the log .... well fer a few minutes at least.

Edit: And yeah I get my worms at the local sporting goods/fishing supply store. 

lol offtopic much,Z ?


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