# Annual Checkups?



## smarch (Feb 24, 2015)

Just got an email from my vet since its been almost a year since Nank went to the vet (he was not eating and I panicked lol, he started eating again that night after being given fluids)
Anyways, I got an email telling me if I haven't already I could schedule a check-up. 

Who does yearly checkups? Is it a good idea? just overkill?

thankfully our vet is within 45 minutes of home so its not a huge travel or anything and Nank actually likes rides, we have fun. 

Nank is a Russian tortoise, if that matters for the sake of the argument. 

Wonderign if I should do the checkup when it gets a little warmer here, its only about $80 which is less than to bring my cat, but he seems in good health and reptiles don't get shots like cats and dogs need. 

(don't know if this is good for debate or health, figure it may turn into a debate so that's ok too)


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## Yvonne G (Feb 24, 2015)

I think it's a good idea for first time tortoise-keepers to take their tortoise in for a "well baby" check-up. This gets the tortoise's stats onto a record and if he ever has to go back because he's sick, it may help to know his stats. But I don't think he needs to go back for another check-up if he's not showing any signs that anything is wrong.


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## Jodie (Feb 24, 2015)

I don't disagree with Yvonne. I don't take mine to the vet though unless i have to. My vet is not knowledgeable for one, and mine don't enjoy rides. I will probably take my Russians in before the first time i hibernate them though.


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## smarch (Feb 24, 2015)

Jodie said:


> I don't disagree with Yvonne. I don't take mine to the vet though unless i have to. My vet is not knowledgeable for one, and mine don't enjoy rides. I will probably take my Russians in before the first time i hibernate them though.


 before hibernating is probably a very good idea, for the first time at least. I don't hibernate, and thankfully mine seems none the wiser when its winter and doesn't even slow down like Russians usually do


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## Anyfoot (Feb 24, 2015)

smarch said:


> Just got an email from my vet since its been almost a year since Nank went to the vet (he was not eating and I panicked lol, he started eating again that night after being given fluids)
> Anyways, I got an email telling me if I haven't already I could schedule a check-up.
> 
> Who does yearly checkups? Is it a good idea? just overkill?
> ...


Does your vet specialise in torts or even in reptiles. Over here there are a lot of vets that have good general animal knowledge but don't specialise in torts. I need to find a vet that specialises in torts. Think I found one that's about 30 mins away. Apparently one of the best in the UK. huh we'll see. lol
You made me smile when you said is only 45 mins away. Over here we brits moan and groan if things are not within 5 mins away. lol
Personally I wouldn't take any animal in if it seems healthy and happy. Its in the vets interest to get everyones business.


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## johnsonnboswell (Feb 24, 2015)

Your vet's computer is sending out the announcement. I don't do a yearly exam for my turtles or tortoises, just the dog & cat.


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## smarch (Feb 24, 2015)

Anyfoot said:


> Does your vet specialise in torts or even in reptiles. Over here there are a lot of vets that have good general animal knowledge but don't specialise in torts. I need to find a vet that specialises in torts. Think I found one that's about 30 mins away. Apparently one of the best in the UK. huh we'll see. lol
> You made me smile when you said is only 45 mins away. Over here we brits moan and groan if things are not within 5 mins away. lol
> Personally I wouldn't take any animal in if it seems healthy and happy. Its in the vets interest to get everyones business.


Yeah my car goes to a different vet right down the street because he is TERRIFIED of cars. I go to the one I do for Nank because they specialize. They do dogs and cats too but also reptiles and birds. It was interesting there's a cat entrance with its own waiting room and a dog entrance with its own waiting room and I had no idea where tortoise fit, so thinking tortoises and dogs don't mix I got to wait with the kitties lol. I actually knew about this vet because a coworker at a place I used to work took his sulcata there and recommended it. I love driving so I can't complain.


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## mike taylor (Feb 24, 2015)

I take fecal samples into the vets for testing every year . But its not putting 14 animals in my truck and heading to the vet . Its soaking my tortoises one at a time . Getting a sample then moving to the next one . You would be surprised what they find . Plus you get different wormers and learn the dosing . Don't ask me the names of wormers I am out and forgot the names . One starts with a p and the other a t I think . But this spring I'll have a new supply . It cost under one hundred bucks so its worth it .


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## peasinapod (Feb 24, 2015)

If you want to hibernate it is a good idea to get a fecal test. Fo it early enough in the end of summer, so you've still got a few weeks of activity left if something does show up. I think (depending on the medication) the tortoise needs to stay active and warm for 4-6 weeks after the last dose. And you might need to treat more than once to get rid of everything. 

Other than my tortoise showing sympthoms of an illness, I wouldn't take my tortoise to the vet.


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## ascott (Feb 24, 2015)

Jodie said:


> I don't disagree with Yvonne. I don't take mine to the vet though unless i have to. My vet is not knowledgeable for one, and mine don't enjoy rides. I will probably take my Russians in before the first time i hibernate them though.




I am curious...and only that (not starting any crap, just curious)...if the vet is not knowledgable...then what exactly would the vet be able to offer for a pre brumation "check up"....I mean, if the tort has been eating, sunning, exercising, hydrating and all --then what could the vet possible offer?


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## ascott (Feb 24, 2015)

peasinapod said:


> If you want to hibernate it is a good idea to get a fecal test. Fo it early enough in the end of summer, so you've still got a few weeks of activity left if something does show up. I think (depending on the medication) the tortoise needs to stay active and warm for 4-6 weeks after the last dose. And you might need to treat more than once to get rid of everything.
> 
> Other than my tortoise showing sympthoms of an illness, I wouldn't take my tortoise to the vet.



If the tort is going to be brumated then the tort should not have any medications administered just because...also, there is a need for some good "critters" to remain in the torts system....just saying is all...


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## peasinapod (Feb 25, 2015)

ascott said:


> If the tort is going to be brumated then the tort should not have any medications administered just because...also, there is a need for some good "critters" to remain in the torts system....just saying is all...



True, but if the fecal shows a HIGH count of parasites the tortoise should be dewormed. I am not advocating a yearly deworming or anything like that. I was just trying to say that a fecal should be done early enough so that if there are a lot of parasites the tortoise can be dewormed and still be active long enough for every trace of the medication etc. to be flushed out of the system. 



Medication should only be used if really necessary.


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## Jodie (Feb 25, 2015)

ascott said:


> If the tort is going to be brumated then the tort should not have any medications administered just because...also, there is a need for some good "critters" to remain in the torts system....just saying is all...


Fecal for one. X-Ray if I am worried about eggs. Mostly though for peace of mind. Another set of eyes and reassurance that they are healthy. Hibernation scares me, and I want to make sure I have all of the knowledge available to me when I do it. I shouldn't have said not knowledgeable. He has very little experience with tortoises, but he is a good vet, and listens. He also has access to confer with a vet who is a specialist.


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## ascott (Feb 25, 2015)

peasinapod said:


> True, but if the fecal shows a HIGH count of parasites the tortoise should be dewormed. I am not advocating a yearly deworming or anything like that. I was just trying to say that a fecal should be done early enough so that if there are a lot of parasites the tortoise can be dewormed and still be active long enough for every trace of the medication etc. to be flushed out of the system.
> 
> 
> 
> Medication should only be used if really necessary.



If you medicate the tortoise then the year in which you do the dosing...the tortoise should not be allowed to brumate....simple as that....that was all I was trying to point out....brumation is a HUGELY delicate dance....if you introduce anything foreign into the body of the tort---I would never support brumation that year....no waiver on that as far as I am concerned....that is all...


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## ascott (Feb 25, 2015)

Jodie said:


> Fecal for one. X-Ray if I am worried about eggs. Mostly though for peace of mind. Another set of eyes and reassurance that they are healthy. Hibernation scares me, and I want to make sure I have all of the knowledge available to me when I do it. I shouldn't have said not knowledgeable. He has very little experience with tortoises, but he is a good vet, and listens. He also has access to confer with a vet who is a specialist.






> He has very little experience with tortoises, but he is a good vet,



This makes all of the difference in the world....a good vet for dogs and cats has no place tinkering with a reptile...and that is not saying anything negative about the vet...not at all...


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## Jodie (Feb 26, 2015)

ascott said:


> This makes all of the difference in the world....a good vet for dogs and cats has no place tinkering with a reptile...and that is not saying anything negative about the vet...not at all...


I disagree. Mostly though becausecwe are defining good vet differently. He acknowledges his deficiency, and listens to me. He will seek the answers and confers with the vet he knows that is a specialist with tortoises.


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## Tom (Feb 26, 2015)

Jodie said:


> I disagree. Mostly though becausecwe are defining good vet differently. He acknowledges his deficiency, and listens to me. He will seek the answers and confers with the vet he knows that is a specialist with tortoises.



Not being mean here. Just having light hearted conversation with a friend...

So using the above logic, you would be okay with your general practitioner performing heart surgery on you, as long as he confers with another doctor that is a heart specialist first?

Forgive me and forgive Angela, but we've seen a lot of ignorant vets with good intentions do a lot of damage to a lot of animals. Many vets kill tortoises by following the advice in their little vet handbooks they keep in the back room, and now by using the same mis-information that they find on their vet web site searches. Get to know a real exotic vet or two and they will really make your head spin with horror stories.

I agree with Angela. A vet that has not done a long term internship and reptile apprenticeship with another knowledgable experienced reptile vet, has no business handling reptiles, and certainly no business accepting money for treating animals he/she is not qualified to treat.

To use another analogy: I have been around many lions. I've helped raise and train a few lion cubs. There is a lion cub on my current job right now in New Orleans. Same story for other big cats. I have been on many lion jobs as an assistant to the guys who actually handle the lions, or to run the job for the lion trainers and deal with the production people. Still, I am NOT a lion trainer. I have no business trying to work a lion on a film set and taking money for it. There are trainers in my business who would have no problem attempting such a feat with such minimal qualifications and these unscrupulous people are the ones who cause the "train wrecks" that you end up seeing on the news.

I'm on the other side of that coin with dog aggression stuff. Dog aggression cases and training have been my specialty since the early 90s. I did a formal 5 year apprenticeship with one of the all time greats and did not make a move without his over sight and blessing. After that I found another mentor who was even more amazing and did another 10 year informal "apprenticeship" while dominating our sport and our business. I am the guy who has to literally come in and save dogs from euthanasia that have been handled by idiot "trainers" and vets who know nothing about dog aggression and have come in and made a bad situation worse because of their ignorance and desire to make money. Most dog trainers and vets know very little about dog aggression. They are completely inept, and a phone consultation with me is not going to remedy their ignorance, any more than me having a phone consultation with a good lion trainer will suddenly make me a competent lion trainer.


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## Yvonne G (Feb 26, 2015)

Point taken.


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## Jodie (Feb 26, 2015)

Tom said:


> Not being mean here. Just having light hearted conversation with a friend...
> 
> So using the above logic, you would be okay with your general practitioner performing heart surgery on you, as long as he confers with another doctor that is a heart specialist first?
> 
> ...


Neither of you are listening to what i am saying. The nearest vet that knows anything about tortoises in 3 hours away. The vet i see confers with this vet. When my tortoise needed heart surgery, actually eggs removed, i drove the 3 hours because my vet talked to that vet and he wasn't able to handle that. I would not let an MD perform heart surgery on me either, but i go to him 1st. You don't need to ne a heart surgeon to do a fecal test or take an xray and send it to the vet that can absolutely read it.
I understand what you're saying, but a good vet will not assume they know, but admit they are not sure and seek help. He is not googling or relying on a handbook.


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## Tom (Feb 26, 2015)

Jodie said:


> Neither of you are listening to what i am saying. The nearest vet that knows anything about tortoises in 3 hours away. The vet i see confers with this vet. When my tortoise needed heart surgery, actually eggs removed, i drove the 3 hours because my vet talked to that vet and he wasn't able to handle that. I would not let an MD perform heart surgery on me either, but i go to him 1st. You don't need to ne a heart surgeon to do a fecal test or take an xray and send it to the vet that can absolutely read it.
> I understand what you're saying, but a good vet will not assume they know, but admit they are not sure and seek help. He is not googling or relying on a handbook.



Okay. I hear ya.

I've just seen a lot of tortoises die from inept vets doing the wrong thing. My intention in typing all this is to try and prevent anyone else from having this problem.


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## ascott (Feb 26, 2015)

Jodie said:


> Neither of you are listening to what i am saying. The nearest vet that knows anything about tortoises in 3 hours away. The vet i see confers with this vet. When my tortoise needed heart surgery, actually eggs removed, i drove the 3 hours because my vet talked to that vet and he wasn't able to handle that. I would not let an MD perform heart surgery on me either, but i go to him 1st. You don't need to ne a heart surgeon to do a fecal test or take an xray and send it to the vet that can absolutely read it.
> I understand what you're saying, but a good vet will not assume they know, but admit they are not sure and seek help. He is not googling or relying on a handbook.



No, I understand completely what you are saying....I just do not agree...but I don't have to right?


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## smarch (Feb 27, 2015)

I think I understand the vet not being a reptile expert but still good thing... at least to an extent, your vet has an x-ray machine and knows a vet who can read it and give back info, you're vet has access to medication and access to a vet that knows how much to administer and for what. Its like a middle man. I suppose it could work out well if it was the only option


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