# Russian loss of appetite



## SailingMystic (Oct 18, 2011)

It's been cold out and now I have both my box and Russian inside. My box is still eating and active, but my Russian is now sleeping and well sleeping. He's not eating hardly anything. He has lamps, heat rock, water and tons of spring mix and Mazori food but stopped. He still loves to soak and poops tiny poops now. Is this simply hibernation? I'm concerned because he ate nonstop for a month and now he's suddenly hunkering down. It's just all of a sudden.


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## AnthonyC (Oct 18, 2011)

I know that we're dealing w/2 different types of torts here, but for what it's worth... When I stopped taking my Sullys outside I noticed a temporary reduction in their appetite. This lasted for about a week and now they're back to eating like baby hippos again. I tinkered around with the location of my MVB & their food bowl. When I put the MVB over the food bowl they started eating a lot again. Not sure it there's any correlation. Hope this helps a little bit. Good luck!


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## SailingMystic (Oct 18, 2011)

Thanks Anthony! Its so sudden and after seeing how he can eat I'm worried. But he still loves bathing. How long is too long? My box will lower her eating to twice a week then once a week ....


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## AnthonyC (Oct 18, 2011)

Sorry, Diane.  I really don't know much about Russians. I'm sure when everyone wakes up someone will help you out. Good luck... I'm willing to bet that everything will be okay. 



SailingMystic said:


> Thanks Anthony! Its so sudden and after seeing how he can eat I'm worried. But he still loves bathing. How long is too long? My box will lower her eating to twice a week then once a week ....


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## SailingMystic (Oct 18, 2011)

AnthonyC said:


> Sorry, Diane.  I really don't know much about Russians. I'm sure when everyone wakes up someone will help you out. Good luck... I'm willing to bet that everything will be okay.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks I hope so. He's such a little cutie pie. He didn't sleep much when I first got him, so this is new too. I think he's adjusting. He's been through a lot. I need to get some dandelions-- everyone keeps mentioning them !!  Then again- he may be prepping for winter. He's so cute- I never saw a turtle/tort eat as much as he can! I don't think he ever had fresh greens before (even his vet said that)....


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## GBtortoises (Oct 18, 2011)

What temperatures and light duration is your Russian being kept at? What kind of lighting? Many people (me included) sometime leave their Russian tortoises outdoors too long. They often begin to "shut down" way before the weather actually begins to get cold. This is due to light duration and intensity and less to do with temperature.
They can be "fooled" into thinking it's summertime indoors with increased light intensity, duration and temperatures.


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## SailingMystic (Oct 18, 2011)

GBtortoises said:


> What temperatures and light duration is your Russian being kept at? What kind of lighting? Many people (me included) sometime leave their Russian tortoises outdoors too long. They often begin to "shut down" way before the weather actually begins to get cold. This is due to light duration and intensity and less to do with temperature.
> They can be "fooled" into thinking it's summertime indoors with increased light intensity, duration and temperatures.



I am not sure (yet) about the exact temp but it's near 80 and the lighting is tricky- here's why: I am worried about the lamp as a fire hazard until I find a way to mount it well. The lamp is on early in the morning for 3 hours and off during the day until later afternoon and late night. During the mid-day Hemi is getting natural light. This may be too cold then?? I have the wooden tortoise house/pen. It's roomy with a hidden sleeping area and open space under a wire lid. If I mount the light to the wire lid can that pose a problem? What is the safest for mounting his light (with a timer)?

Also- I keep hearing so many opinions on what type of substrate to use or not use and I'd like to use the best for holding in heat. Can you recommend something particular? I'm new to having a russion tort and I'd like to get him happiliy settled 

Sorry for so many questions...but all of these elements impact each other...


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## babylove6635 (Oct 18, 2011)

my russians did the same thing when i brought them in but they are eager to eat now


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## pdrobber (Oct 18, 2011)

Hi Diane,

I have my Russians on cypress substrate because it holds humidity and isn't too messy. Coco coir and dirt are good options as well. 

Once we know what lights you're using and what temps are we can better help you...

You can buy what's called a lamp stand at a pet store or online or make one. it's a bit safer than using the clamp on the tank and you can control the light's height above the tortoise better (or even lower it into the tank more if you need)

here ya go...

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_n...aps&field-keywords=reptile+lamp+stand&x=0&y=0

or you can build one by screwing 3 pieces of wood together (base, height and extension over the enclosure) then wrap the cord around the wood snugly and have the fixture hang down over the enclosure at a height that gives you temps that you'd like, but be careful not to have it too close to anything it could burn/melt.


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## GBtortoises (Oct 18, 2011)

In order for your Russian to think it's "summer" indoors it will need to have a _minimum_ of 12-13 hours of intense light and 14-15 would be better. Ambient daytime temperatures need to be in the range of the low 70's-low 80's with a basking spot under a light at about 95-105 degrees. If the ambient temperature too hot, consistently above 85 degrees, itoften has the reverse effect of hibernation-aestivation. This also causes a tortoise to stop eating and go into an extended rest period.

Safely mounting a light is very important too. It's hard to say what might be the best method for you. It really depends upon your resources and enclosure layout. I don't take anything for granted when it comes to making sure that my reptile lights are secure and not near anything flammable. Years ago a close friend of mine lost half his house to a fire from a clamp on light that was mounted above their new puppy's box. The light slipped down and fell into the puppy's box igniting it's bedding, killing the puppy and setting the back half of the house on fire. So I tend to be "paranoid" about that kind of stuff myself.

Many people use various types of substrates with good sucess. For years I used straw and/or hay indoors with fair satisfaction. It is cheap and easy to replace, all natural, non-toxic and Russian tortoises love to burrow in it. But the drawbacks are that it does mold easy it allowed to remain to damp and it can be a fire hazard if not kept far enough away from an ignition source. 
Like many other people, I now use cypress bark mulch. It is also easy to clean and replace and relatively inexpensive if you don't have to buy alot of it. It's all natural, non-toxic. Most tortoises have no interest in consuming it (which is a good thing). It does have a few drawbacks: Some pieces can be sharp, it's essentially splintered and milled wood. It can get very dry if not misted daily and if over saturated it will mold at the lower layers where there is poor air circulation. I spray it twice daily and churn the whole substrate once or twice a week. That way the moist bottom layer doesn't remain on the bottom too long.
Depending upon how large of an enclosure you have organic soil (potting or topsoil) can be a good choice too. I use that exclusively for young tortoises mixed at a ratio of about 60% soil, 25-30% coconut coir and the rest ground leaf litter and sphagnum moss. I've found this to be an excellent mixture for young developing tortoises because it does maintain moisture well while still proving them good footing and the capability to dig into and hide in the substrate. 

You may also want to check out this site on Russian care: www.russiantortoise.org


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## SailingMystic (Oct 18, 2011)

GBtortoises said:


> In order for your Russian to think it's "summer" indoors it will need to have a _minimum_ of 12-13 hours of intense light and 14-15 would be better. Ambient daytime temperatures need to be in the range of the low 70's-low 80's with a basking spot under a light at about 95-105 degrees. If the ambient temperature too hot, consistently above 85 degrees, itoften has the reverse effect of hibernation-aestivation. This also causes a tortoise to stop eating and go into an extended rest period.
> 
> Safely mounting a light is very important too. It's hard to say what might be the best method for you. It really depends upon your resources and enclosure layout. I don't take anything for granted when it comes to making sure that my reptile lights are secure and not near anything flammable. Years ago a close friend of mine lost half his house to a fire from a clamp on light that was mounted above their new puppy's box. The light slipped down and fell into the puppy's box igniting it's bedding, killing the puppy and setting the back half of the house on fire. So I tend to be "paranoid" about that kind of stuff myself.
> 
> ...



OK it seems the cypress is the winner. I hear more about this than anything.  Now the good news is that Hemi is getting 10 hours of light-- but what I realize now is that the quality of light he's getting stinks. It's to far from him. I can not thank you all enough-I'm going shopping on Amazon to find a holder. I'm so paranoid about causing a fire. It's exactly what was mentioned above with the home and loss of that poor puppy! Hay makes me nervous as well. Misting- no worries there. Hemi is going to be the happiest tort  He's such a sweetie and he's a fighter. He's doing so well- I just want to make sure he continues and gets his appetite back. 

I guess it will take a while for him to respond, but now I will focus on the temperature, light- safety with the mount light (not the clip that I'm using on wood now) and substrate that holds heat. The only thing that I'm confused about is that I hear that the Russian Torts do not like to be moist. My box turtle does (esp in the summer outside she loves to bask) - but isn't the moisture bad for the Russian Tortoise?

I would love to do a similar set up for Herbie my box turtle with the pen- but she's so stuborn and loves her glass. She loves to see what's going on. I put her in Hemi's wooden pen and she hated not being about to see out. She's so active...She's such a personable turtle 

One more.. What light bulb do you recommend? For the light stand.


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## SailingMystic (Oct 18, 2011)

SailingMystic said:


> GBtortoises said:
> 
> 
> > In order for your Russian to think it's "summer" indoors it will need to have a _minimum_ of 12-13 hours of intense light and 14-15 would be better. Ambient daytime temperatures need to be in the range of the low 70's-low 80's with a basking spot under a light at about 95-105 degrees. If the ambient temperature too hot, consistently above 85 degrees, itoften has the reverse effect of hibernation-aestivation. This also causes a tortoise to stop eating and go into an extended rest period.
> ...





P.S. This is the light bulb that I'm using now: http://www.thatpetplace.com/pet/prod/204566/product.web
Or:
Zoo Med Repti Basking Spot Lamp - 100W 

The Repti Basking Spot Lamps have a unique patented double reflector focuses 35% more heat and light into a tight beam. It is perfect for use with high heat basking reptiles, such as tropical and desert species. It also provides beneficial UVA rays which promote breeding, feeding, and are beneficial to your reptile's psychological well-being. Basking Spot Lamps also increase the overall ambient air temperature
Size:
100 watt
4.5" x 3"


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## Utah Lynn (Oct 18, 2011)

SailingMystic said:


> SailingMystic said:
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> > GBtortoises said:
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Be extremely careful using that ZooMed heat lamp. It gets EXTREMELY hot. Keep checking the temp beneath and adjust the lamp up or down as needed to obtain the correct temp.
I, unknowingly, just about cooked my little RT using this lamp. Needless to say, I chucked this lamp and I now use a regular 75W light bulb for heat .


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## Leroy's_homeboy (Oct 18, 2011)

I just went through a similar situation. My Russian (Leroy) seemed to have simply lost his appetite, though he was still quite active. My girlfriend and I even made a trip to our local Fresh Market (pretty much a farmer's market) and bought an array of organically grown greens, but he didn't show any interest in anything. Sometimes Leroy would sniff at the food we offered him, take one tiny bite, then wander off as though he was full. Other times he would ignore his food altogether (even Mazuri). He too would take tiny little poops, and after a few days of this I grew quite concerned. Then this morning I offered him his daily greens, and to my astonishment he started chowing down! He ate for a solid 30 minutes, which was a major relief for me. I really hope your Russian snaps out of this little funk he seems to be in, be sure to keep us posted!


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## tyler0912 (Oct 18, 2011)

Sorry it may have already been stated...But it probably just a change of habitat and your Boxie does not want to give up his food lol....


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## SailingMystic (Oct 18, 2011)

Leroy said:


> I just went through a similar situation. My Russian (Leroy) seemed to have simply lost his appetite, though he was still quite active. My girlfriend and I even made a trip to our local Fresh Market (pretty much a farmer's market) and bought an array of organically grown greens, but he didn't show any interest in anything. Sometimes Leroy would sniff at the food we offered him, take one tiny bite, then wander off as though he was full. Other times he would ignore his food altogether (even Mazuri). He too would take tiny little poops, and after a few days of this I grew quite concerned. Then this morning I offered him his daily greens, and to my astonishment he started chowing down! He ate for a solid 30 minutes, which was a major relief for me. I really hope your Russian snaps out of this little funk he seems to be in, be sure to keep us posted!



Leroy is such a cool name! Thanks for the smile . I'll keep working on it- tomarrow he's going to be very spoiled with more variety and better substrate. I'm putting a shopping list together  I just hope he's back to normal by Thursday or I'll be super stressed. I will be working from home Friday and my bet loves him-- so I can take him at anytime if need be...



SailingMystic said:


> Leroy said:
> 
> 
> > I just went through a similar situation. My Russian (Leroy) seemed to have simply lost his appetite, though he was still quite active. My girlfriend and I even made a trip to our local Fresh Market (pretty much a farmer's market) and bought an array of organically grown greens, but he didn't show any interest in anything. Sometimes Leroy would sniff at the food we offered him, take one tiny bite, then wander off as though he was full. Other times he would ignore his food altogether (even Mazuri). He too would take tiny little poops, and after a few days of this I grew quite concerned. Then this morning I offered him his daily greens, and to my astonishment he started chowing down! He ate for a solid 30 minutes, which was a major relief for me. I really hope your Russian snaps out of this little funk he seems to be in, be sure to keep us posted!
> ...







SailingMystic said:


> Leroy said:
> 
> 
> > I just went through a similar situation. My Russian (Leroy) seemed to have simply lost his appetite, though he was still quite active. My girlfriend and I even made a trip to our local Fresh Market (pretty much a farmer's market) and bought an array of organically grown greens, but he didn't show any interest in anything. Sometimes Leroy would sniff at the food we offered him, take one tiny bite, then wander off as though he was full. Other times he would ignore his food altogether (even Mazuri). He too would take tiny little poops, and after a few days of this I grew quite concerned. Then this morning I offered him his daily greens, and to my astonishment he started chowing down! He ate for a solid 30 minutes, which was a major relief for me. I really hope your Russian snaps out of this little funk he seems to be in, be sure to keep us posted!
> ...


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## SailingMystic (Oct 19, 2011)

Not sure what happened here with multiple posts-- but my phone was being upgraded .. Sorry! Now for good news!! As I was leaving this morning Hemi was peaking out of his sleeping area and heading towards his food. I had to leave, but my husband is watching over him and we have his light on-- but not too close. Fingers crossed!! !


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## AnthonyC (Oct 19, 2011)

Ah! Great news! Hopefully this means "crisis averted". Isn't it amazing how much we worry about our torts? Good luck!!! 



SailingMystic said:


> Not sure what happened here with multiple posts-- but my phone was being upgraded .. Sorry! Now for good news!! As I was leaving this morning Hemi was peaking out of his sleeping area and heading towards his food. I had to leave, but my husband is watching over him and we have his light on-- but not too close. Fingers crossed!! !


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## SailingMystic (Oct 19, 2011)

AnthonyC said:


> Ah! Great news! Hopefully this means "crisis averted". Isn't it amazing how much we worry about our torts? Good luck!!!



Yes!! He ate this morning!!! Yippeeee! Gosh he made me nervous! So basically it was 5 to 6 days...


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