# sad but interesting egg bound desert tortoise.



## dmmj (May 29, 2011)

So a member of our tortoise club gave us sad news about her desert tortoise being put down due to being egg bound. You can see the X ray here
http://www.flickr.com/photos/karolfranks/5735785942/

She said the liver was shutting down plus she had bladder stones, so I was wondering could the bladder stones be the reason she was egg bound?


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## hali (May 29, 2011)

owww how sad


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## Kristina (May 29, 2011)

Did they try oxytocin before resorting to euthanasia? Why not surgery?


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## dmmj (May 29, 2011)

I didn't get the whole story but I think they chose euthanasia because of the failing liver. They said her systems were shutting down.


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## Kristina (May 29, 2011)

Ah, I see.


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## zesty_17 (May 29, 2011)

This is very sad, and I am truly heartbroken for that loss. My little ornate gave me a scare this last year with egg bound issues. I had to aspirate & extract an egg from her because no vets were able to see her friday night, needless to say I was a wreck doing it all myself & all weekend before the only vet in the area with box turtle experience was able to see her! Ended up that 3 of the 4 eggs were about .25 the diameter of her plastron, so she was unable to pass them whole! It is an extremely scary place to find yourself ( and your turtle). Do you know if the tort had prior issues with this? or the Stones? It is sometimes possible to aspirate them through the femoral cavity by extracting the fluid inside the egg with a large needle and an ultrasound machine... however there are risks to this, with worst-case scenario being plastronectomy and complications. I do recommend Dr. Mader's "Reptile Medicine & Surgery," you can buy it from amazon- it is a little pricey- but worth every $ if you catch yourself in a bind with no vets around. 


After my boxie's issues last year, i put together a kit for eggbound/tort surgical issues that i can grab in a pinch if i have to do things myself. It includes, sterile syringes, clean white cloths, q-tips, organic honey, nolvasan (chelorihexidine you can get otc), plastic baggies, a biology student necropsy kit-cost about $15 & includes glass pipets, tongs, tweezers, a very sharp scalpel, and a pointed metal tool, as well as a heating pad & white towel... You can find the steps to do this online, however i do not recommend it unless you are in a TRULY EMERGENCY situation with no access to medical help. The highest risk of complication comes from leaking egg fluid inside the tort's reproductive tract, causing the build up of infection and ultimate death, so use extreme caution.


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## dmarcus (May 29, 2011)

Thats is horrible


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## bikerchicspain (May 29, 2011)

The bladder stones are usually crystals, females can usually pass them quite easily, males are more of a problem. They are usually caused through diet in dogs and cats, not sure about torts,
It might not of been crystals but urates that had hardened,

Unfortunately torts have a very slow metabolism and this takes the liver 3 times the amount of time to regenerate, thus causing more damage.

I know that with most reptiles egg binding can be caused through stress, or not finding the appropriate nesting site or substrate.

The problem with egg binding is even if you inject them to induce labour, if the eggs are calcified then she would not be able to pass them,
As for surgery it is only giving her a 50% chance as with torts infection can set in quite quickly, plus the stress to the animal having it's plastron cut open,

I think I would have done the same and had her put to sleep.
It's a hard choice to make, but that's what you sign up for when you have animals


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## Yvonne G (May 29, 2011)

That was an excellent X-Ray. I've never seen a tortoise X-Ray with that much clear detail. You can even see the bones in her feet. They're usually pretty smudgy-looking.

I have a rescued female desert tortoise here now that I'm thinking might be egg bound too. Same symptoms.


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## ALDABRAMAN (May 29, 2011)

One of my biggest fears!


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## DesertGrandma (May 29, 2011)

emysemys said:


> That was an excellent X-Ray. I've never seen a tortoise X-Ray with that much clear detail. You can even see the bones in her feet. They're usually pretty smudgy-looking.
> 
> I have a rescued female desert tortoise here now that I'm thinking might be egg bound too. Same symptoms.



What are the symptoms? Sounds terrrible. Can it be caught early?

Also, I am wondering since this female was 40 years old, had she been laying eggs with no problems before. What would cause this to happen? Just so sad...


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## Karol (May 29, 2011)

Hi, this is my photo of the xray of Fluffy, our 40 year old tortoise. I can give you the whole story.
It was difficult to diagnose her at first. My friends laughed when i said she was lethargic, as if tortoises are so slow, how would you know? I noticed she was not eating much, staying out of her shelter at night. The vet first did a blood panel and said her liver enzymes were very elevated. He did an xray and discovered the eggs. Three days of oxytocin and her uterus never contracted, so I brought her home and tried to find help. I wrote to our local CTTC and got this response from a member:

_Please do NOT give the oxytocin anymore. If your tortoise has not passed the
eggs by now it is not able to and the oxytocin will make it worse.
Unfortunately your tortoise can not pass the eggs past the stone. 

Surgery is probably your next option. With out it to remove the stone the eggs
can not pass and your tortoise may die from the toxins. Unfortunately if your
tortoise has a large stone and elevated liver enzymes, and now has been forced
to push the eggs via oxytocin, and is not eating, the Surgery is probably a
poor prognosis. There are hospital that can sometimes break up the stone and
remove the eggs via a proceedure that enters into the tortoise in front of the
rear leg. That would require a reptile veterinary._

I was tube feeding Fluffy at this point, and giving her antibiotics and giving her a warm water soaking and keeping her under a reptile lamp. She could barely move and was not having bowel movements. Her skin was peeling a little and she began to smell really bad. I called the vet who does surgery, but they said with elevated liver enzymes her prognosis for making it through surgery was not good.

It was an awful decision. My mom had Fluffy since she was born in 1971 and I had her the last 5 years. I also have her brother and her boyfriend, and a 3 year youngster (not from her, she never laid eggs since she's lived with us), and they all got along great. She was the leader, the boys followed her in and out of the shelter every day. She was really the most fit of the 3 adults. I felt she had been tortured enough. Believe me this was not an easy decision, we really loved her and took great care of her.

Her last day was spent out in the pen, basking in the sun with her family. Two of my kids and I brought her in to the vet and she was given an injection. I have not cried that hard in a long time, it was tragic, but in my heart I knew it had to be done.

We brought her home and buried her in the pen. My older daughter and I dug and dug until was deep enough. She lowered her in and we put nasturtiums and strawberry leaves in with her. We felt she should be in the soil, no box, just as natural as she had lived her life. I put a river rock on top of the burial mound and wrote her name on it in blue nail polish. We put a carved tortoise on the rock and a little leggo policeman we dug up when digging the grave. We said a prayer for her. 

I am glad she's out of pain, but i miss her still. Her boys seems lost so I am spending more time with them. I don't know if tortoises get depressed, or even know she's gone, but we'll still keep giving them some extra loving care.

The next day I decided to take a picture of her grave to send to my mom. I was shocked at what I saw when I looked at the digital image. My husband said that even tortoises have Jesus. I am attaching the photo here.


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## Candy (May 29, 2011)

I am so sorry for your loss. What a terrible thing to happen. Thank you for explaining the whole story to us. It made everything more clear.


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## terryo (May 29, 2011)

What a terrible loss. I'm so sorry. Your story was very sad, but it might help others with the same problem. I think all our animals have "Jesus".


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## dmmj (May 29, 2011)

Karol I hope you know I posted this to educate others and not in any way question your decision.


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## DesertGrandma (May 29, 2011)

Karol, I am so sorry for you. I appreciate you educating us on what can happen to our special friends. I would have done the same thing if she were mine.


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## Karol (May 29, 2011)

That's ok dmmj, I felt you just wanted to understand what happened.

Thanks everyone, for the support.


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## Yvonne G (May 29, 2011)

Hi Karol:

Welcome to the forum!!

I'm so sorry you had to make that decision. And I loved the picture. I'll bet that made you cry even more.

I hope you stay around and let us get to know you a little better. We're a good group of people and we love to talk tortoise.


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## Tom (May 29, 2011)

So sad. 

I can't even fathom 40 years...

So sorry for you Karol.


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## l0velesly (May 29, 2011)

That's extremely sad and painful. Hearing this made my heart ache. :'( It must've been a hard decision. I wouldn't know what to do if I was in that situation.


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