# Why do people say they've "adopted" a tortoise when they've bought it?



## GBtortoises (Apr 23, 2010)

Why do many people on this site and others say that they've "adopted" a tortoise that they've walked into a pet shop (or other source) and purchased? Does it make them feel better than saying they "bought" it? Why? 
You don't "adopt" your groceries from the grocery store or "adopt" you clothes from a clothing store, you "buy" them don't you?


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## Kristina (Apr 23, 2010)

Not sure on this one. I bought my four Russians and 3 of my Hingebacks - the other three Hingebacks I *did* adopt, from Suburban Jungle Rescue. Oh, and guess what? There was no fee for adopting them, imagine that....


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## terracolson (Apr 23, 2010)

I dont think there is any controller out there saying you have to use adopt this way or that way.

Should there be? I dont know..

When you adopt a child, you have to pay fees! its not fre

Yet when you go to a rescue you adopt and a pet store you buy. 
BUT you could buy from a rescue if its a hatchling, and you do adopt pets such as kittens from petsmart...

You have to fill out adoption papers....

So i think its the persons preference


I bought Temperance for 55 dollars
I was given salty and BB for my volunteer work with the local rescue.....
I adopted LG from a person on CL
I bought CoCo as my frist tort from a petstore
I was given mommas for working at the local rescue


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## pugsandkids (Apr 23, 2010)

I think it has something to do with the terminology used by the business/rescue. I know of many petstores/brokers around here that ask for an adoption fee (sale price) they think it sounds better. Therefore maybe people are tricked into thinking its an adoption, or rescue. Now, I'm all for rescues charging some kind of fee, especially once you consider food, vet bills, and time. It just depends I guess, on if what word the person feels fits the situation. I have a dog I was given, I consider her a rescue! (16lb pug, living under a trailer and competing with Great Danes for food?) 

Sometimes, you just read posts, or hear people talk and you just gotta smile!


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## TylerStewart (Apr 23, 2010)

GBtortoises said:


> Does it make them feel better than saying they "bought" it? Why?
> You don't "adopt" your groceries from the grocery store or "adopt" you clothes from a clothing store, you "buy" them don't you?



Eeeexactly. It gives them the warm fuzzies that they saved this poor creature from the harshness of the pile of tortoises at PetCo. 

I think in other cases, it makes people think they're getting around the 4" rule, since it's not a "sale," kinda like how the Craigslist system makes it ok to "adopt" a pet for $500, but not "sell" one for $100.


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## egyptiandan (Apr 23, 2010)

Like Tyler said using the word "adopt" kind of lets a business "sell" turtles and tortoises under 4 inches. That or sell you everything you need for an outragous price and say they are "giving" you the turtle or tortoise free.

Adopt is the fuzzy word for the 21st century. It makes people feel more "green" 

Danny


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## TylerStewart (Apr 23, 2010)

egyptiandan said:


> Like Tyler said using the word "adopt" kind of lets a business "sell" turtles and tortoises under 4 inches. That or sell you everything you need for an outragous price and say they are "giving" you the turtle or tortoise free.
> 
> Adopt is the fuzzy word for the 21st century. It makes people feel more "green"
> 
> Danny



Well, and interestingly enough, at the reptile show up in San Mateo a few weeks back, they gave out this big warning about how the govt would be showing up to enforce the 4" rule.... The "law" allows the sale of baby tortoises between turtle or tortoise "fanciers," which could in theory apply to every person that walks in the show. They showed up early on Saturday to bust some balls, and after myself, Waterland (who asked them to define the law and confused the guy) and a few others basically ignored them because of this line in the law, they couldn't do anything to enforce it because they couldn't define the law. We had our hand sanitizer out and didn't sell anything small to any kids. Beyond that, we just sold baby tortoises to turtle "fanciers" all weekend.


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## egyptiandan (Apr 23, 2010)

True "hobbiests" can sell to other "hobbiests" Tyler, but in the letter of the law it says that you can't sell in conjunction with a business. The sticky point is how the state your in and the federal government defines a business. Though if you have a tax ID number for your "business" you really don't have a leg to stand on. Yes they are all going to all the major shows now. 

Now I need to use the word "adopt" to stay on topic 

Danny


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## Jacqui (Apr 23, 2010)

GBtortoises said:


> Why do many people on this site and others say that they've "adopted" a tortoise that they've walked into a pet shop (or other source) and purchased? Does it make them feel better than saying they "bought" it? Why?
> You don't "adopt" your groceries from the grocery store or "adopt" you clothes from a clothing store, you "buy" them don't you?



I do think it makes them feel better and it saves them from the people who once they hear you bought from a pet store (or plan to) immediately ask "Why aren't you adopting?" like there is something wrong with you for not adopting.

To me, if a rescue asks for money, it too is selling not adopting out an animal. For me, adoption is free, selling is selling no matter if it's to make a profit or recover expenses or an exchange of items rather then cash changing hands.


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## chadk (Apr 23, 2010)

If you consider the animal a 'part of your family'... you adopt. No matter the fees...

I'm adopting my 4th child this year and you can bet it is anything but free... And this is a domestic adoption through state foster care...

Again, I think some folks just get their feathers ruffled too easily sometimes. Tom-A-toe.. tom-AH-toe...


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## Kayti (Apr 23, 2010)

For some reason it never bothers me when people talk about 'adopting' from pet stores etc.
But it REALLY bothered me when people would talk about 'buying' my foster kittens from the shelter- or ask a bunch of questions only about $$ (costs that didn't even come close to recouping our expenses).
I think using the word 'adopt' with animals is a sign that you respect them enough to understand that 'purchasing' an animal is more than just paying a flat fee and taking it home- there's an emotional component to adoption. 
I think it matters more with animals that need to be loved to be happy. If you say 'adopt', it sort of implies that your going to love that creature. 'Buying' implies that your going to add it to your collection. Which, you know, isn't a bad thing if it's a goldfish or a Crested Gecko. 
(Not that you can't love these creatures or that they don't benefit (indirectly?) from being loved, but you get the point- it's different with a kitten.)


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## Kristina (Apr 23, 2010)

Mmmm, see, to me, it ISN'T different with a kitten...

That is exactly the reason that I started focusing on reptile and amphibian rescue. I have rehabbed everything from rats to horses, farm animals, you name it, but there are a LOT of people that do that. Shelters just plain have no CLUE about how to handle reptiles. I see reptiles kept in conditions that would put someone in JAIL with a felony charge of animal cruelty - IF it was a dog, cat, horse, etc. If a cat turned up with burns on it like the baby iguana I just took in, it would be a closed case. But because they aren't cuddly and furry, reptiles get the short end of the stick. It sucks, frankly.


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## Kayti (Apr 23, 2010)

kyryah said:


> Mmmm, see, to me, it ISN'T different with a kitten...
> 
> That is exactly the reason that I started focusing on reptile and amphibian rescue. I have rehabbed everything from rats to horses, farm animals, you name it, but there are a LOT of people that do that. Shelters just plain have no CLUE about how to handle reptiles. I see reptiles kept in conditions that would put someone in JAIL with a felony charge of animal cruelty - IF it was a dog, cat, horse, etc. If a cat turned up with burns on it like the baby iguana I just took in, it would be a closed case. But because they aren't cuddly and furry, reptiles get the short end of the stick. It sucks, frankly.




I COMPLETELY agree with you. I worked at this one shelter that took in an Iguana as a rescue- and the care they provided was really inadequate. But they just didn't know any better, because they were primarily a cat shelter. That animal ended up being stolen in a break-in before I started working there.  And I definitely agree animal cruelty laws really need to catch up with exotics. Who should I write a letter to?

But what I meant with the kitten thing is you can still provide a good home for a reptile if you buy it. If you respect it and learn how to properly take care of it and have the means to do so, you can be a good reptile owner. But most kittens/mammals generally require the warm and fuzzy stuff- love, affection, attention, caring, etc. I think my reptiles are different. If I tried to give my Alligator Lizard affection, she'd freak out and probably urinate on me while dropping her tail. If I found someone else that was capable of providing the same standard of care for her as I do, she could care less if I "sold" her. (But I wouldn't, because I'm a mammal and have warm gushy feelings fer the stinker.)
And I know plenty of folks that see their animals as a collection that they can buy/trade/sell, but they still treat them with respect and knowledge. You can't do that with an animal that forms a strong emotional attachment to you/its life with you, like a cat. 

Maybe I'm wrong. My tortoises seem to recognize me, and they sure appreciate me when it's breakfast time. Maybe they'd be upset if I died and someone else started taking care of them. And I know some reptiles can be more 'tame' for some people that others- and I've seen Tegus that certainly act like they enjoy affection. But I think when it exists, it's on a much lower scale that with most mammals. 

I think a lot of people get into mammals (and parrots) as pets because they need something to unconditionally love them. But reptile people are different, because we don't get nor expect love, generally, from our creatures. We are depended upon, and we get to watch and enjoy development- but there's no slobbering of kisses when we get home form work. 
And that's why I think it's okay when people 'buy' a reptile, but not a mammal- just looking at it from the kind of care you are implying you are going to provide, but not from the source of the animal. That's a whole different argument.


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## Tortuga_terrestre (Apr 23, 2010)

I posted a thread about this very topic; About people RESCUEING poor defenseless tortoises. Hahahahaha.. They just want to feel important. Someone who is truly is a Humanitarian/Samaritan does not inform the world of their good deeds.


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## dmmj (Apr 23, 2010)

Not to be harsh or stop the debate but I do not really see an issue here, if you got yours from a petstore you bought it, if you get it from a rescue it was adopted. I bought my first RES almost 29 years ago, since then I only bought one other tortoise (a pancake) and then it was all adoptees baby.


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## Kayti (Apr 23, 2010)

Tortuga_terrestre said:


> I posted a thread about this very topic; About people RESCUEING poor defenseless tortoises. Hahahahaha.. They just want to feel important. Someone who is truly is a Humanitarian/Samaritan does not inform the world of their good deeds.



That's not really true. I rescued and raised hundreds and hundreds of orphaned kittens when I lived with my parents- and all because this one girl and her mom brought her litter of rescues into my fourth grade class, as an outreach for the shelter. 
I think rescuers should shout it from the roof tops- it makes the jerks who breed animals for profit look bad, and it lets people know that there are people who care, and it helps people who care act on it and join the effort.

I am a huge fan of the 'adopt, don't buy' campaigns. I agree that those Tshirts, for example, that say "my dog is a rescue" do come off as a little douchy, but if it's helping spread the word about shelters, I'm all for it.


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## egyptiandan (Apr 23, 2010)

I'm lost  Why does "bought" mean you aren't going to "love" an animal, but "adopt" means that you are going to "love" said animal. I don't remember seeing in the defination of "bought" that there is anything there that says "unloved" or in the defination of "adopt" that says "loved".
Why would paying money for an animal or getting it for free making any difference in how "loved" or "unloved" the animal is.


Danny


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## Kayti (Apr 23, 2010)

egyptiandan said:


> I'm lost  Why does "bought" mean you aren't going to "love" an animal, but "adopt" means that you are going to "love" said animal. I don't remember seeing in the defination of "bought" that there is anything there that says "unloved" or in the defination of "adopt" that says "loved".
> Why would paying money for an animal or getting it for free making any difference in how "loved" or "unloved" the animal is.
> 
> 
> Danny



I think it's a cultural definition more than a literal definition. 
And in the case of kittens, 'buying' a kitten from craigslist or whatever is usually like 15 bucks, but when you adopt from a shelter and get a wormed, vaccinated, healthy, fixed kitten, it's generally like 75$. So I don't really attach any specific monetary scale to buying vs. adopting. 

But, now that you bring it up, I do know that there is a strong correlation to amount paid for an animal to quality of care. For example, for some reason people are more likely to take better care of a cat that cost 75$ than one they got for free. Screwy, but true.


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## TylerStewart (Apr 23, 2010)

Kayti said:


> I think rescuers should shout it from the roof tops- it makes the jerks who breed animals for profit look bad, and it lets people know that there are people who care



I think it makes the looney guy screaming from the rooftop look bad, personally. Are we once again demonizing the "jerks" that have made a profit from breeding animals? I care, and I breed for fun and profit.


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## Tortuga_terrestre (Apr 23, 2010)

I have a shirt from Blue Beast Reptiles. I went to the Pasadena Show, last year. Awesome tortoises...very heavy, healthy appereance and very smooth.


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## dmmj (Apr 23, 2010)

So wait it is not ok to scream from the rooftops? better cancel my weekend plans then


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## Kristina (Apr 23, 2010)

TylerStewart said:


> Kayti said:
> 
> 
> > I think rescuers should shout it from the roof tops- it makes the jerks who breed animals for profit look bad, and it lets people know that there are people who care
> ...



I think she meant the jerks that are breeding ONLY for profit, without caring for the basic wellbeing of the animals. I breed animals too, for more fun than profit, but I take good care of them. It's a different story.


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## Kayti (Apr 23, 2010)

kyryah said:


> TylerStewart said:
> 
> 
> > Kayti said:
> ...



Exactly  When I say breeders, 9/10 I'm talking about the bad ones. There's just more to say.


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## Jacqui (Apr 23, 2010)

egyptiandan said:


> I'm lost  Why does "bought" mean you aren't going to "love" an animal, but "adopt" means that you are going to "love" said animal. I don't remember seeing in the defination of "bought" that there is anything there that says "unloved" or in the defination of "adopt" that says "loved".
> Why would paying money for an animal or getting it for free making any difference in how "loved" or "unloved" the animal is.
> 
> 
> Danny



I agree! To me, the ones I have been given as compared to those I have paid for, are all given the same respect, care, attention, and love. The price tag or place it comes from doesn't change my attitude or heart for them.



Kayti said:


> But, now that you bring it up, I do know that there is a strong correlation to amount paid for an animal to quality of care. For example, for some reason people are more likely to take better care of a cat that cost 75$ than one they got for free. Screwy, but true.



Not really so sure on this. See so many registered animals not cared for. Even expensive horses being starved to death happens often.


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## goodsmeagol (Apr 23, 2010)

Kayti said:


> *SNIP*
> But what I meant with the kitten thing is you can still provide a good home for a reptile if you buy it. *If you respect it and learn how to properly take care of it and have the means to do so, you can be a good reptile owner. *But most kittens/mammals generally require the warm and fuzzy stuff- love, affection, attention, caring, etc. I think my reptiles are different. If I tried to give my Alligator Lizard affection, she'd freak out and probably urinate on me while dropping her tail. If I found someone else that was capable of providing the same standard of care for her as I do, she could care less if I "sold" her. (But I wouldn't, because I'm a mammal and have warm gushy feelings fer the stinker.)
> And I know plenty of folks that see their animals as a collection that they can buy/trade/sell, but they still treat them with respect and knowledge. You can't do that with an animal that forms a strong emotional attachment to you/its life with you, like a cat.
> 
> *SNIP*



This is exactly how I treat all my animals.
I am a pretty cold hearted person, and would not say I 'love' any of my pets.
But they interest me, so my fascination draws me to reptiles.
I bolded my requirements for a suitable owner IMO.
In high school after a year I decided I was not 'capable' of taking care of a dragon, so I gave it out for ADOPTION. I GAVE it to a small family business that did school class reptile shows.
Years later, I became more mature and now I care for 6 animals, and feel I do a good job at it.
Last year I had a hedgehog for 6 months, I decided I was not capable of caring for it, so SOLD it for 1/3 the price to make sure it did not go to some ignorant kid.
I ADOPTED a Mali Uro from a co worker who was not capable of caring for it, I kept it until I found it a forever home and ADOPTED him out to a friend for free.

But I also agree that you adopt an animal that you grow super attached to and love like a child, dog cat, some torters I am sure...


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## nike22 (Apr 27, 2010)

I posted a thread about this very topic; About people RESCUEING poor defenseless tortoises. Hahahahaha.. They just want to feel important. Someone who is truly is a Humanitarian/Samaritan does not inform the world of their good deeds. 
??????


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## Yvonne G (Apr 28, 2010)

Hi Nike22:





to the forum! This is actually the only post by you. The post in the reptile show thread doesn't have anything in it.


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## -ryan- (May 1, 2010)

terracolson said:


> I dont think there is any controller out there saying you have to use adopt this way or that way.
> 
> Should there be? I dont know..
> 
> ...



Just wanted to clear up one thing. You don't adopt kittens from petsmart. Petsmart does not adopt any pets whatsoever, especially kittens. They do give local animal shelters space in their store so that some of their kittens (and cats) get shown off to encourage adoptions. The money goes directly to the animal shelter. I know it's splitting hairs, but I think it's an important distinction because in your post it made it seem as though you were stating that people think they are adopting a kitten when they are actually buying it from petsmart. They are actually adopting them from the local shelters. Volunteers come in from the shelters to care for them and the petsmart employees have nothing to do with their care.

I have bought three tortoises, raised two from eggs laid in my care (and sold the other hatchlings), and I was given one by a family who didn't want her anymore. I have never adopted anything other than a cat, and I have only rescued one animal (a mali uromastyx), and I feel that use of the word 'rescue' is fitting because of the condition she was in (third degree burn scars on most of her back, advanced liver disease, etc.).

I think that the term 'adoption' should be reserved for animals that are actually adopted (including paperwork and fees) from shelters and similar organizations. But that's just my two cents.


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## TortieLuver (May 1, 2010)

I know from my experience, I "adopted" an adult male sulcata from a rescue organization about an hour away from here and they were asking $400 for him. Not exactly a price to be "adopted" but I guess he had pneumonia and a few other health problems when they got him, and with the vet and med costs, they were trying to recoup their costs? I guess perhaps animals can be adopted but you pay whatever fees the rescue place has paid out.


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## Maggie Cummings (May 1, 2010)

I got my latest cat as a kitten handed to me in a brown paper sack. I will care for her and love her crazy personality just as much as I would if I had paid a million dollars for her. Most of my turtles or tortoises were free as 'rescues' but I don't believe I say I rescued them. I just got them. How I got them makes no difference and I will give them the best care, free, or adopted or bought...


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## Terry Allan Hall (Jun 9, 2010)

chadk said:


> If you consider the animal a 'part of your family'... you adopt. No matter the fees...
> 
> I'm adopting my 4th child this year and you can bet it is anything but free... And this is a domestic adoption through state foster care...
> 
> Again, I think some folks just get their feathers ruffled too easily sometimes. Tom-A-toe.. tom-AH-toe...





kyryah said:


> Mmmm, see, to me, it ISN'T different with a kitten...
> 
> That is exactly the reason that I started focusing on reptile and amphibian rescue. I have rehabbed everything from rats to horses, farm animals, you name it, but there are a LOT of people that do that. Shelters just plain have no CLUE about how to handle reptiles. I see reptiles kept in conditions that would put someone in JAIL with a felony charge of animal cruelty - IF it was a dog, cat, horse, etc. If a cat turned up with burns on it like the baby iguana I just took in, it would be a closed case. But because they aren't cuddly and furry, reptiles get the short end of the stick. It sucks, frankly.



Well stated! 



Tortuga_terrestre said:


> I posted a thread about this very topic; About people RESCUEING poor defenseless tortoises. Hahahahaha.. They just want to feel important. Someone who is truly is a Humanitarian/Samaritan does not inform the world of their good deeds.



May I respectfully point out that you seem to be ascribing the "Christian" outlook to Humanitarian/Samaritan deeds, but there are other Faiths that see this matter differently...

Setting a good example _silently _doesn't always get the message understood.


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## Motara's Mom (Jun 9, 2010)

Once I was in a pet store that had a 10 gallon tank full of quarter sized red eared sliders. When I asked how much they sold them for the owner informed me real quick that they do not SALE anything under 4 inches, but they will ADOPT them to anyone for $10.


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## Angi (Jun 9, 2010)

I think it is because people think of pets as their children. If you don't give birth to them they are adopted. I was a foster parent once to a poodle. I tell my boys to feed their brothers and that means feed the dogs.


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