# Newest farm additions :)



## chadk (Aug 2, 2010)

We picked up our piglets a few days ago. They are fitting right in on the little 'farm'.













I'm still working on their pen, but for now, they have run of the place. They definately add a different element to the little farm. New sounds, new antics. Should be interesting to see what trouble they get into...


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## Missy (Aug 2, 2010)

You forgot new smells, LOL. The piggies and the kids are super cute


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## spikethebest (Aug 2, 2010)

love those tails!


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## chadk (Aug 2, 2010)

Well, so far, there have been no new smells... But when they reach 200lbs, I'm sure that will be a different story... Just in time for a trip to the butcher....


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## Isa (Aug 2, 2010)

Congratulations Chad, they are sooo cute 
Beautiful pictures!


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## Itort (Aug 2, 2010)

No names, right. I picture two 500 pound yard pets. LOL


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## chadk (Aug 2, 2010)

We go back and forth on names. Not whether to have them or not, as we like to give things names, even if they will end up as dinner... But what names to give.

I was leaning towards Ham-let and Keve Bacon. One kid like Sausage and McMuffin.

But in the end, they are Olivia and Hagrid. 

These pigs won't get past the 200-300lb range. My kids know and agree to the fact that farm animals have a different life than our pet animals. They live a great life filled with many great days and then one bad moment. We treat them well while they are alive and respect them (as in never abuse them, and ensure their needs are met). When it comes time to kill them, it is a serious matter, but a necessary matter. It is done quickly and humanely. We then continue respecting the animal by valueing the meat it produced for us and handling it well - not being wasteful or sloppy with it.

We are doing what we can to grow our own food. We still have a long ways to go, but we have a garden, fruit trees, berries, and animals (chickens for meat and eggs, goats for milk, etc).

After my recent road trip back from LA, and seeing all the commercial farms being sprayed by planes, and realizing that they are forcing the dessert lands to grow crops (must be tons of chemicals and fertalizers to make that happen), and then also seeing the commercial feedlots that hold thousands of head of cattle on bare dirt and manure.... Well, lets just say I enjoy eating food that I grow and know what I put into it and how it was treated, who handled it, etc etc.


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## RichardS (Aug 2, 2010)

I've seen some pretty fat pigs. Is there any difference is flavor between a lean pig and a fat one?


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## chadk (Aug 2, 2010)

It is more related to what they were raised (feed wise) on - especially the last month or so.

The huge pigs tend to be breeder pigs. They get huge (500-800lbs) and are not great for meat. They are often referred to as 'sausage pigs' because that is the best way to utilize the meat of an older animal. 

For raising pigs as we are doing, there is a point where the input (feed) to weight gain drops off. This is in that 200-300lb range. This tends to be the optimal time for butchering for small scale 'farmers' like me. Now the farm I got mine from sell small weiner pigs like mine to be used for many things. They may be sold to folks like me wanting to raise our own meat. And others buy them for summer bbq season - many cultures roast small whole pigs as part of certain parties, festivals, etc (wiener pigs and up to 100lbers). The 200 on up sized pigs are popular around the holidays for their large roast ham cuts. 

My pigs will be raised fairly lean, and with only a little commercial feed provided. They will mostly eat pasture (we have lots of grass and weeds they are welcome too), extras from my garden, and extras from my family and friends who have volunteerd to bring over their extra apples, pears, plumbs, veggies, etc that they often have to toss out or throw in the compost bin. 

Now we won't feed them anything rotten and moldy, just stuff that may be beyond our personal high standard of quality (bruised, over-ripe, etc).


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## DoctorCosmonaut (Aug 2, 2010)

Cute piggies!


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## Tom (Aug 2, 2010)

People think sulcatas are destructive. Wait til you show 'em what those piggies can do!

I admire what you are doing and commend you for it. You have some lucky kids there to get such a well rounded education.


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## Candy (Aug 3, 2010)

Educate the kids?....Oh it's going to educate them alright!


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## terryo (Aug 3, 2010)

Thank you God for letting me be a city gal. To each his own........I guess it would be a boring world if we were all the same...thought the same...etc. To me this is a horror. I can't begin to imagine naming something, playing with it, watching it grow from a baby, and then eating it. No one has to answer this post, as it's not a debate. I'm just sitting here thinking how happy I am to NOT live on a farm where this is such a natural thing to some.


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## Stephanie Logan (Aug 3, 2010)

Yeah, I've always been ambivalent about that too. I've wondered about the ranch kids who bring their prized steers/calves to the Stock Show here in Denver, where the animals are bid on and then sold--usually to a restaurant chain--and end up as delicious steak dinner for their customers! I wonder if they feel any pangs of emotion and regret when these animals they raised from babies are then led away to slaughter.

Like Terry, I completely understand the necessity...I'm just not sure I'd want to be friends with my future dinner.


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## chadk (Aug 3, 2010)

Sometimes the real world is difficult. Learning to navigate reality is a life lesson clearly not everyone has mastered.

When you raise food, you can appreciate the cuteness of the young while understanding it is being raised for a specific purpose. You don't try to bond with as you would your lap dog or kitty cat. It is a working relationship.

I love watching fish and salmon in the wild doing their thing. It amazes me and I could watch it for hours and appreciate it. But I also realize the food value and have no problem harvesting a few for dinner now and then. Same for deer and elk. Beautiful animals I love to just sit and watch (as I'm lucky to be able to do where I live here in Washington). Yet I also have no issue eating deer or elk meat now and then.

Being aware and in touch with where your food comes from is very important. The alternative takes you and society down the fast food mass production road where you don't ask questions and just eat what they feed you (and you really don't want to know!).


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## RV's mom (Aug 3, 2010)

In a heartbeat I would be a country girl. If I didn't raise the vegetable, fruit, eggs, meat animal myself, I'd have trusted neighbors that I would purchase from. As it is, I do go to the organic pork store, and try to buy as much from the farmer themselves. Farm market. It is difficult in a large urban area, but we manage. I do not like the thought of excess hormones, excess pesticides, forced growth of animals. The animals are not healthy, not happy in feedlots, and they don't have any taste. High fives to you, Chad. I'm envious.

teri


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## terryo (Aug 3, 2010)

I'm sure I posted this before, but....when I was a kid my Aunt had a working ranch in Texas, and sometimes my sister and I would go spend the summer there. In the middle of the Summer, she would send a cow, calf, lamb, and a sow off to the slaughter house. Two weeks later a big truck would come to deliver her all this meat packaged to be put in her two big freezers in the big barn...(there was a little barn too). We would eat this for the rest of the summer and when it was time to go home she would send us home with two big insulated cases filled with meat. My parents loved this as we were kind of poor, and meat was a treat for us. I can honestly tell you that my sister and I hated the taste of this meat. It had a very strong, gamy taste to us. She also did her own canning of vegetables, from her garden, and fruit from the fruit trees. She made her own butter and ice cream. She worked from sun up to sun down. She milked the cows at the crack of dawn. If company came and she didn't want to part with her precious meat, she would go out and get a chicken and kill that. I couldn't wait to go home. Not for me! So I'm not a stranger to this kind of living. That's why I say thank God I'm a city gal. (Maybe this is what turned me off to eating meat.)


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## RV's mom (Aug 3, 2010)

We grew up canning in the summer. it was hard work, but it was good, tasted 'real'. We lived in suburban Detroit, so our veggies and fruits came from the farmers market. My grandfather ran a meat shop, so we were accustom to eating the cuts other 'regular' folks didn't eat... I've family that hunted, and I've had no quarrel with how the meat tasted. More I think that its a matter of how things are cooked, and our perception of what we're eating. I'm not criticizing you Terryo with regards to what we consume or our outlooks on food items.. Just I personally would like to be further removed from the city..


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## Candy (Aug 3, 2010)

That's all fine for you Chad, but don't expect the same from your children. My father had the same attitude and all of us kids turned out feeling different than he did about that. I would not ever introduce my children to something and then expect them to understand when it is sent to be killed for dinner. I think that is cruel not reality. I guess it's just your reality.  I do understand that you want to have organic food though and am not against that. I know as a child I would have nightmares if my father would have done that to me.


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## terryo (Aug 3, 2010)

Oh Candy...you just brought back a very vivid memory. This same Aunt sent us a little baby turkey to "fatten up over the summer" and to eat at Thanksgiving. My sister and I, living in the city thought this was the cutest thing. My Dad told us not to get attached, as he wasn't a pet, but Thanksgiving dinner. Unfortunately, my Dad got attached along with us, so he couldn't do the job. My Uncle came over to do it. My Dad took us for ice cream and when we came home our turkey friend was getting plucked by my Aunt and my Mom. We hated my Uncle after that and every time we looked at him, we thought of our little turkey, even though we were told that he was meant for the pot. So Chad........I hope your children do better than my sister and I did.


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## N2TORTS (Aug 3, 2010)

chadk said:


> We go back and forth on names. Not whether to have them or not, as we like to give things names, even if they will end up as dinner... But what names to give.
> 
> I was leaning towards Ham-let and Keve Bacon. One kid like Sausage and McMuffin.



Yes the kids and the lil piggys are way cute! .....but I see " ribs" all all the way! 

JD~


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## chadk (Aug 3, 2010)

Thanks JD and others.

Candy and Terryo- my kids want to help in the killing and processing. I don't let them help in the killing. Someday when they are more mature. But my teenage daughers love helping me clean fish and helped me process our goose a few months ago - and I didn't even ask, they just wanted to. They were also excited about disecting animals in their biology classes. Not squimish at all.

My first chicken we killed - old red, was a mean dude. The kids were ready to see him go. I BBQ'd it and could hardly hold them back from the meat - they would eat it as fast as I could cut if off.

Guess I didn't let them watch enough disney and PETA proganda...


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## DoctorCosmonaut (Aug 3, 2010)

Just wondering, how many of the things on your pets/family members in your signature are going to be eaten?


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## chadk (Aug 3, 2010)

At some point, all of them... We are all worm food someday...

But I don't eat pets. Do you? I also don't eat family members. Do you? Strange question....


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## Candy (Aug 4, 2010)

I don't think that me or my kids would ever hate anything so badly that they or I would want to kill and eat it as fast as it got it off of the BBQ....that is a strange comment.  And might I add a sad one.


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## dmmj (Aug 4, 2010)

So the people who think chad is wrong do you live the vegetarian lifestyle? I think a lot of people who eat meat nowadays are removed from the process. Would I eat apet? no of cours enot, would i eat animals I raised for that purpose? yes, animals taste good, Even some vegetarians I know miss eating bacon. I think chad is doing a great service for his kids and when they grow up if they decide not to eat meat anymore, then that will be their choice, at least it won't be forced upon them. I will admit I have never butchered anything more than fish, but I am extremly interested in the concept and would like to visit a slaughterhouse one day, but there are not any near me. My grandma tells me stories of how her and her sisiters were given the runts (pigs) on the farm to raise knowing that they were eventually gonna be slaughtered, to this day her and her sisiters still eat bacon.


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## Candy (Aug 4, 2010)

Yes Dmmj a lot of the people on here don't eat meat. Are you telling us that the one thing you would like to do is visit a slaughterhouse? Really? And you say that my post was the scariest you'd ever heard on TFO,. I'm pretty sure you've outdone me on scariest post. People eat meat I realize that, but I don't ever think I've heard anyone ever say they'd like to go to a slaughterhouse to watch it be done. Why don't you just watch "Food Inc." it shows you all you need to know. Or maybe you could try slitting the throat of a pig and letting it bleed out and then cutting it's stomach open and then you can gut it yourself. Sounds really cool. Let me know when you have the guts yourself to do that O.K.?

These are some pretty sick people. I tell you I like PETA better every time I see something like this. And before someone says that you don't slit a pigs throat but you shoot it instead that is how my nurses family did it in Mexico when she was young and then she would have to go help gut it. 

http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/01/how_to_kill_a_pig


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## dmmj (Aug 4, 2010)

I would not slit a pig's throat because I would not know how to butcher it properly, as to the scariest thing posted on here your's still take the cake for one simple reason I would like to go to a slaughterhouse for the knowledge of how to properly butcher animals, just slitting a pig's throat for thrills does not sound like fun, I realize you might enjoy it since you brought it up, and I understand people who support PETA are a little off based in the first place since they equate animal with human life, still the scariest post by far, mine was meant for the knowledge not thrills like you seem to think, you trully trully still scare me with that post, but like I said I would like to learn how. I never said I would enjoy it or get a "thrill" from it, I always seek out new knowledge, my mind is not closed and I figured since I eat animals knowing how to properly butcher one would one day be useful if I ever decide to raise my own, not being a hypocrite I would enjoy learning how to properly butcher an animal. See the words I use, Properly, knowledge, hyprocisy. Hmmm sounds like someone is not happy?


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## terryo (Aug 4, 2010)

chadk said:


> Thanks JD and others.
> 
> Candy and Terryo- my kids want to help in the killing and processing. I don't let them help in the killing. Someday when they are more mature. But my teenage daughers love helping me clean fish and helped me process our goose a few months ago - and I didn't even ask, they just wanted to. They were also excited about disecting animals in their biology classes. Not squimish at all.
> 
> ...



This is what makes the world interesting....everyone is different...everyone raises their children differently too. I respect your opinion as I know you respect mine...we have discussed this in the past. When it was time for my son to dissect a baby pig in college, he refused. He told me it was the saddest thing he ever saw..all those babies laying in plastic bags. When he was in middle school and had to dissect a frog, he also refused as did all my other 4 sons. We had so many frogs in our pond and we used to watch they turn from little tadpoles...so that really hurt them also. They all refused to march for the march of dimes until they stopped testing on animals. (remember this isn't a debate...no feedback required) I never told them what to do, it's just how they were raised. Three of my sons don't eat meat, but the other two do. Everyone is different....that's what makes the world go round. I do agree with Candy. I think it's sad that children can't wait to kill. Just my opinion.


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## Candy (Aug 4, 2010)

dmmj said:


> I would not slit a pig's throat because I would not know how to butcher it properly, as to the scariest thing posted on here your's still take the cake for one simple reason I would like to go to a slaughterhouse for the knowledge of how to properly butcher animals, just slitting a pig's throat for thrills does not sound like fun, I realize you might enjoy it since you brought it up, and I understand people who support PETA are a little off based in the first place since they equate animal with human life, still the scariest post by far, mine was meant for the knowledge not thrills like you seem to think, you trully trully still scare me with that post, but like I said I would like to learn how. I never said I would enjoy it or get a "thrill" from it, I always seek out new knowledge, my mind is not closed and I figured since I eat animals knowing how to properly butcher one would one day be useful if I ever decide to raise my own, not being a hypocrite I would enjoy learning how to properly butcher an animal. See the words I use, Properly, knowledge, hyprocisy. Hmmm sounds like someone is not happy?



This one scares me the most.


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## DoctorCosmonaut (Aug 4, 2010)

chadk said:


> At some point, all of them... We are all worm food someday...
> 
> But I don't eat pets. Do you? I also don't eat family members. Do you? Strange question....



I meant under that section, not family members, but was trying to eye you to the right place. But I mean your turkeys and all those other animals, they are to be consumed?


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## chadk (Aug 4, 2010)

Candy said:


> I don't think that me or my kids would ever hate anything so badly that they or I would want to kill and eat it as fast as it got it off of the BBQ....that is a strange comment.  And might I add a sad one.



Candy, that was just a stupid comment. Where did you get the idea hate hatred is what drove them to want to kill and eat it? All our farm animals have the potential to become food one day. When the hens stop laying, they don't go to a retirement home... All along, I was telling them that if a rooster becomes too dangerous around the twins, it would need to be culled. We all made the choice together when the time came. It was a choice of necessity. And I am a darnded good cook and they LOVED the meat.

Stop making this about you...



DoctorCosmonaut said:


> chadk said:
> 
> 
> > At some point, all of them... We are all worm food someday...
> ...




It isn't always black and white like that. 

But here is how it works.

We have pets. No other purpose. Well, dogs do have many puposes (guard dogs, keeping raccoons away, companionship, etc etc). But they are here as our pets. Same for the cat and the reptiles...

Then there are the farm animals. Farm animals, by the nature of true farming, need to pull their weight. Sounds harsh, but that is the difference between chooseing to get pet, or choosing to get a farm animal.

So the chickens must produce eggs. Any chicken that does not, including the roosters, are likely to become food. A farm cannot exist if everyone is given a free ride. That is just reality. Sure, there are little petting zoo type farms, but those are more sanctuary setups and they probably get by with donations. 

Turkeys - if they turn out to be a breeding pair (you don't usually know that when you get them), they may become breeders. Otherwise they become Thanksgiving and Christmas dinner.

Our goats are top of the line dairy goats - so they provide milk and milk products. They also do a great job of keeping the black berry bushes in check. And i decided to keep our new male (now a wether) around to be a pack goat - he'll help carry stuff when we go camping. A goats dream job...

Pigs... well, you know about them.

Ducks and geese, similar to the chickens and turkeys. But geese are also good 'guard dogs' and lawn mowers. Ducks are also good at keeping slugs and snails in check around my garden.



DoctorCosmonaut said:


> chadk said:
> 
> 
> > At some point, all of them... We are all worm food someday...
> ...




It isn't always black and white like that. 

But here is how it works.

We have pets. No other purpose. Well, dogs do have many puposes (guard dogs, keeping raccoons away, companionship, etc etc). But they are here as our pets. Same for the cat and the reptiles...

Then there are the farm animals. Farm animals, by the nature of true farming, need to pull their weight. Sounds harsh, but that is the difference between chooseing to get pet, or choosing to get a farm animal.

So the chickens must produce eggs. Any chicken that does not, including the roosters, are likely to become food. A farm cannot exist if everyone is given a free ride. That is just reality. Sure, there are little petting zoo type farms, but those are more sanctuary setups and they probably get by with donations. 

Turkeys - if they turn out to be a breeding pair (you don't usually know that when you get them), they may become breeders. Otherwise they become Thanksgiving and Christmas dinner.

Our goats are top of the line dairy goats - so they provide milk and milk products. They also do a great job of keeping the black berry bushes in check. And i decided to keep our new male (now a wether) around to be a pack goat - he'll help carry stuff when we go camping. A goats dream job...

Pigs... well, you know about them.

Ducks and geese, similar to the chickens and turkeys. But geese are also good 'guard dogs' and lawn mowers. Ducks are also good at keeping slugs and snails in check around my garden.



Candy said:


> dmmj said:
> 
> 
> > I would not slit a pig's throat because I would not know how to butcher it properly, as to the scariest thing posted on here your's still take the cake for one simple reason I would like to go to a slaughterhouse for the knowledge of how to properly butcher animals, just slitting a pig's throat for thrills does not sound like fun, I realize you might enjoy it since you brought it up, and I understand people who support PETA are a little off based in the first place since they equate animal with human life, still the scariest post by far, mine was meant for the knowledge not thrills like you seem to think, you trully trully still scare me with that post, but like I said I would like to learn how. I never said I would enjoy it or get a "thrill" from it, I always seek out new knowledge, my mind is not closed and I figured since I eat animals knowing how to properly butcher one would one day be useful if I ever decide to raise my own, not being a hypocrite I would enjoy learning how to properly butcher an animal. See the words I use, Properly, knowledge, hyprocisy. Hmmm sounds like someone is not happy?
> ...



Such drama. There is nothing wrong with wanting to learn how to process various forms of our food. The more we know about where our food comes from and how it is handled, the better. Dmmj is being perfectly reasonable.



terryo said:


> I respect your opinion as I know you respect mine...we have discussed this in the past. .... I do agree with Candy. I think it's sad that children can't wait to kill. Just my opinion.



Most kids have a curious side to them. And most boys will talk all brave about doing such things. But there is a reality to it that isn't about being macho or anything, or just trying to satisfy a morbid curiosity, that takes some maturity to handle. So we have lots of talks about it, but I won't let them help until they show they are mature about it. 

If you are going to participate as a consumer of animal food (of feed your dogs, cats, turtles) animal products, yet have such strong feelings about eating meat... well, it is sad to have to live like that and confuse the kids like that. Just my opinion.

What drives me nuts is that we live in a society that thinks it is fine to suck the brains out of a baby's skull just because it is not convenient to the mother's lifestyle - yet we get all worked up because people eat meat as we have for as long as we have existed. I choose to focus on human issues - helping the poor and starving, widows and orphans, those truly oppressed, etc. People are way more important to me than any animal, and that is how I will choose to raise my kids.

If you want to raise yours (or have) that animals and people are equal, and spend your resources helping animals instead of people, that is totally up to you. Again, we are free to think and act differently.



Candy said:


> Yes Dmmj a lot of the people on here don't eat meat. Are you telling us that the one thing you would like to do is visit a slaughterhouse? Really? And you say that my post was the scariest you'd ever heard on TFO,. I'm pretty sure you've outdone me on scariest post. People eat meat I realize that, but I don't ever think I've heard anyone ever say they'd like to go to a slaughterhouse to watch it be done. Why don't you just watch "Food Inc." it shows you all you need to know. Or maybe you could try slitting the throat of a pig and letting it bleed out and then cutting it's stomach open and then you can gut it yourself. Sounds really cool. Let me know when you have the guts yourself to do that O.K.?
> 
> These are some pretty sick people. I tell you I like PETA better every time I see something like this. And before someone says that you don't slit a pigs throat but you shoot it instead that is how my nurses family did it in Mexico when she was young and then she would have to go help gut it.
> 
> http://slog.thestranger.com/2008/01/how_to_kill_a_pig





Did you actually read the article? They DID shoot the pig in the head and THEN let it bleed out. Last I checked, WE are not Mexico (though some really seem to get confused with this for some reason...).

Also, "the stranger" is a disgusting excuse for a 'news paper'. They do put a few good articles in now and then, but that is akin to some dude saying he buys Playboy for the articles... Having lived in the Seattle area and the very commity that puts out 'the stranger', I speak from experience here. 

That said, this particular article was actually pretty good. And the comments pretty reasonable for the most part (aside from the expected terrible languange you get from 'the stranger' readers).

I don't like making a spectacle of killing, but I do understand that many cultures do. While I don't, it don't loose sleep over others doing it.

I do like the other parts about making it educational.

Here in Seattle there was the big debate about the 'art' exibit "bodies" where they used real human bodies on display to educate. Personally I don't like the whole idea, but I do understand why someone else would want to see and that they could learn a lot more about the human body that way vs reading about it in some book.

Thanks again for that link.


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## Candy (Aug 4, 2010)

I didn't insult you by saying that your comments were stupid so let's try to be mature about this and not throw personal insults o.k.? You think it's disgusting yet you read it? I mean you do say it has some good arguments. Come on Chad it does have to do with being "Macho" "Manly" however you want to put it, same difference. That's one reason that you come on here and brag about it when you know that there's so many of us that think it's disgusting and tell us that your kids are fine with it. I find that hard to believe anyway. I will never be convinced that children want to kill anything if it was just left up to them. Mexico was just another example of a child being forced to do something she didn't want to do and now that she's all grown up she's a vegan, no surprise there huh?


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## chadk (Aug 4, 2010)

I'm sorry you had trauma as a kid. The girls parents screwed up by letting that happen. But you do realize that most people are not traumatized if they are raised in that sort of environment where everyone knows where their food comes and most participate in some way. It is just a part of life and death in this world that most peole come to understand and accept. A small percentage don't for various reasons and that is too bad, but undertsandable and their choice. They are just lucky to live in a country like the USA where you can live in your own little shelter and eat tofu, pretending that most people in the world live that way (or would even want to).

Brag about it? Don't read my posts if that is why you think I share pics and stories on here. Just because a few of you don't have the stomach for reality, that does not mean dozens more don't actually enjoy reading about them, learn something from them, and relate to them in a postive way.

Please, if it will cause you more trauma and drama, tighten those bliders and filter out my posts. Seems we'll both enjoy this site more that way...

This is the same event, not told by some PETA person from the stranger... 
http://www.seattleweekly.com/2008-01-23/news/what-i-saw-and-ate-at-the-pig-sacrifice.php?page=1
Much more balanced. A good read for anyone and glad you helped me find it 



Candy said:


> You think it's disgusting yet you read it?



Um, yeah, I read the article you posted (not sure you did though since you missed the part about it being shot humanely).

And many coffee shops and lunch places in the Seattle area have that rag sitting out to read for free (nobody would pay for it). Din't take long to figure out it was something worth avoiding. So just to be clear, I am familiar with it, as it is a local paper with a bad reputation, but no, I don't have a weekly subscription...


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## dmmj (Aug 4, 2010)

Let me apoligize to chad, this was a thread about his new piggies, which are cute BTW, and I hope your family enjoys them, this was not a debate thread and it has gone that way, I will say one more thing and then retire from this paticular thread, I live my life how I want and others live theirs, the main difference is I don't force my choice to eat meat on others, you want to eat meat fine eat it, you want to be vegetarian/vegan fine be vegan or veggie, I just don't support an org that tells me I cant eat meat, I cant go to zoos or I cant have pets, and I don't see how anyone can be a member of PETA and have pets, I just don't. once again sorry for hijacking this thread chad, i do enjoy pics of your farm.


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## spikethebest (Aug 4, 2010)

PETA = People eating tasty animals??


sorry just had to do it...


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## Yvonne G (Aug 4, 2010)

Chad:

Are you ok with the direction this thread has taken? Do you want intervention?


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## Candy (Aug 4, 2010)

I'm sorry you had trauma as a kid.

That wasn't me that I was talking about that was a nurse friend of mine and you are so wrong. She was raised on a farm and that's what her father did to survive. 

I didn't know that shooting anything was considered humane Chad, only to you and a few others I guess. Like I said before "Macho". You're right on one thing though as much as I've enjoyed reading your posts on other subjects this subject will never be one of them. I will do as you ask though and stay off of your threads.  Yvonne I've never know Chad to need any intervention from anybody.


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## chadk (Aug 4, 2010)

Candy said:


> I didn't know that shooting anything was considered humane Chad, only to you and a few others I guess.



When done correclty, of course it is humane. A quick clean kill is a humane kill. And no, not just a few others. Most people would agree with me on this one.



Candy said:


> . She was raised on a farm and that's what her father did to survive.


So she was lucky she did not have to make those choices to survive as her father did. I wonder, if she was in the same position as her father, and her family needed to do that to survive, would she choose to survive or not?





Candy said:


> Yvonne I've never know Chad to need any intervention from anybody.



Agreed. No intervention needed


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## DoctorCosmonaut (Aug 4, 2010)

Chad, were you referring to abortion? If so, I don't think the tortoise forum in any sense is the appropriate place to bring that issue up.


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## chadk (Aug 5, 2010)

I was reading the blog from the farmer I got my pigs from. It is funny how people like me and these farmers can be painted as heartless monsters. Yet what you find time and again is that is is really quite the opposite. We don't get any kick of out killing any animal. But we know it must be done. And we treat our animals with as much care as we can.

Here are a few examples from my farmer friend Bruce to show you what I mean. Bruce raises many animals for meat. A great source for locally grown, pasture raised, chemical and hormone free, meat. 

Saving a baby pig:
http://ebeyfarm.blogspot.com/2010/08/piglet-physical-therapy.html

Saving a full grown pig:
http://ebeyfarm.blogspot.com/2010/07/oink-oink-boomerang-pig.html

Saving a chicken:
http://ebeyfarm.blogspot.com/2010/07/luckiest-chicken-in-world.html


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## terryo (Aug 5, 2010)

Nice post Chad, but to me this makes it even harder to understand. Why is he saving these animals? To keep as pets? To breed for more profit? I can't believe it's because he has a heart of gold. Or is this part of his advertising? We are not in the dark ages where a person has to kill his food. Neither I, nor anyone in my family has ever gotten sick from a piece of meat bought from the butcher. (yes I used to eat meat from the butcher). So then, it's just because you enjoy growing, or raising your own animals for food? I guess it's like I ENJOY growing my own vegitables? I love watching them grow, and every day I go outside and look to see how big the squash is....should I wait for it to get bigger, or should I cut it off the plant now. (thank God they don't have a face) Is that how you look at your little pigs? Just trying to understand....even though it's very, very hard.


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## Isa (Aug 5, 2010)

Chad, I am wondering the same thing as Terry, what will he do with the animals? Keep them as pets?


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## chadk (Aug 5, 2010)

terryo said:


> Why is he saving these animals? To keep as pets? To breed for more profit? I can't believe it's because he has a heart of gold. Or is this part of his advertising?



First, I find it sad that you question his motives. But so be it. Maybe in the end, any of those critters will wind up on somebody's dinner plate. But if you read the posts, you'll see that it goes against the principles of farming. When you take time to be compassionate to an animal, it is taking money from the bottom line (which is very thin). Time and money spent to rehab an animal in hopes that it will recover is not what many farmers would do. It would be more cost effective to just put the chicken or piglet down and move on and focus on the others. But I really didn't expect a few of you to get it. 



terryo said:


> We are not in the dark ages where a person has to kill his food.



Actually most of us eat our food after it has been killed. That dog food or cat food or fish or chicken you consume (or your pets consume) had to come from an animal that had to be killed. And likely it was from a mass produced commercial operation. Do you know where your meat comes from? Maybe you don't care. 

I think our society would be better off if more of us used our small backyard to grow a garden, raise some chickens, and if you have a little more space, your own meat and other products for your family and maybe more to share to sell to others who may be stuck in an apartment... We'd spend less time on the computer, watching TV, getting into trouble, eating junk food and fast food, chasing our tails and throwing away money in the empty pursuit of 'personal entertaiment', and more time learning how to enjoy working together as a family and seeing\eating the actual fruits of your labor together.

Here some things to read that may or may not help...
http://www.ethicurean.com/2009/09/26/slaughterschool/
http://www.ethicurean.com/2008/01/30/downer-cow-video/
http://www.ethicurean.com/2009/07/26/food-inc/


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## DonaTello's-Mom (Aug 5, 2010)

Chad....thanks for sharing your pictures with us. I believe in 'to each his own' and I enjoy looking at your pictures and reading the stories behind them. At my barn there are a few pigs and steers being raised by kids (for FFA) and I have no issues with what they and their families choose to do....it's not my business......please keep posting your pictures for us to enjoy!


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## dmmj (Aug 5, 2010)

Right now I don't have room to raise my own animals, in my youth i worked on the family farm back east during the sumer, which is on reason why I grow my on fruits and vegetables as much as I can, when I hand out my home grown grapes or tomatoes, or radishes and people try them they are amazed at the taste. I live in a mobile home park so rasing my own meat animals is out of the question, but if i had a little room I would not object to it.


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## terryo (Aug 5, 2010)

DonaTello said:


> Chad....thanks for sharing your pictures with us. I believe in 'to each his own' and I enjoy looking at your pictures and reading the stories behind them. At my barn there are a few pigs and steers being raised by kids (for FFA) and I have no issues with what they and their families choose to do....it's not my business......please keep posting your pictures for us to enjoy!



I also believe the same...to each his own. I really am a big believer in respecting others opinions, (as long as it doesn't involve cruelty) as I hope people will respect mine. Oh...and BTW...I love seeing pictures of Chad's beautiful family too.


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## Yourlocalpoet (Aug 5, 2010)

Your pigs are gorgeous little things! I'd love to have some pigs, not to eat but as pets. I'm a vegetarian and I completely understand and respect what your doing, If people must eat meat then it's better that they raise and kill their own animals, not only will it be healthier but you also appreciate where your food comes from. It's just a shame there aren't more people like you who raise and treat their animals well before their unfortunate but inevitable fate.


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## chadk (Aug 5, 2010)

Thanks everyone. This it turning into a great big love fest. I'm feeling all warm and fuzzy now. So nobody jump in and ruin this moment, OK????? 

(Seriously though, I appreciate the feedback, support, and debate. It is all good!)


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## ChiKat (Aug 5, 2010)

Yourlocalpoet said:


> Your pigs are gorgeous little things! I'd love to have some pigs, not to eat but as pets. I'm a vegetarian and I completely understand and respect what your doing, If people must eat meat then it's better that they raise and kill their own animals, not only will it be healthier but you also appreciate where your food comes from. It's just a shame there aren't more people like you who raise and treat their animals well before their unfortunate but inevitable fate.



I agree with this. If you find it necessary to eat meat then I think itÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s better that you are raising the animals and giving them a happy life.
More humane than factory farming where they live HORRIBLE lives and are then sent to slaughterhouses where the abuse continues before they are slaughteredÃ¢â‚¬Â¦

That has to be hard though. I canÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t imagine raising a sweet little piglet and watching it grow...and then eating it for dinner. Not something I could personally do, that's for sure!
My cousins grew up on a farm and we would always play with the baby bunnies. My cousins had favorites that they would name and play with all the time. And then one day my uncle would kill the rabbits and eat the meat  I canÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t even imagine.


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## chadk (Aug 5, 2010)

I certainly don't look forward to it. It is hard. I won't personally be killing or butchering my pigs though. For those reasons, and also, and primarily, for logistics - i'm just not setup for it. There is a local guy I'll work with on that. But anytime the day comes for one of my own animals to be killed, I get a little sick to my stomach and have to take a deep breath and do what has to be done. Same for the duck I had to put down the other day. I had managed to get out of my fence and the neighbors dog ripped it up pretty good. It was bleeding out and had zero chance of living another 10-20 minutes. So I put it down quickly and humanely. Didn't want to, but it needed to be done. And I never let me kids see me do it. They know it is happening, but they don't watch.


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## terryo (Aug 5, 2010)

chadk said:


> I certainly don't look forward to it. It is hard. I won't personally be killing or butchering my pigs though. For those reasons, and also, and primarily, for logistics - i'm just not setup for it. There is a local guy I'll work with on that. But anytime the day comes for one of my own animals to be killed, I get a little sick to my stomach and have to take a deep breath and do what has to be done. Same for the duck I had to put down the other day. I had managed to get out of my fence and the neighbors dog ripped it up pretty good. It was bleeding out and had zero chance of living another 10-20 minutes. So I put it down quickly and humanely. Didn't want to, but it needed to be done. And I never let me kids see me do it. They know it is happening, but they don't watch.



Well there ya go Chad. I wish you said this in the beginning of the thread. I feel a little better about all this now, not much but a little better.


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## zoogrl (Aug 5, 2010)

I personally had show steers in high school and it was not hard at all to turn them over to whoever bought them at the end of the day. I knew from day one though that it would happen and that it was a part of the process & just how things are. I did like the money I received at the end of the day too! We also had chickens that we would have for meat & eggs. I've always had animals and love my actual pets like they are part of the family but you do learn to separate the farm animals that you know will eventually be food, from the pets.


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## Isa (Aug 5, 2010)

terryo said:


> chadk said:
> 
> 
> > I certainly don't look forward to it. It is hard. I won't personally be killing or butchering my pigs though. For those reasons, and also, and primarily, for logistics - i'm just not setup for it. There is a local guy I'll work with on that. But anytime the day comes for one of my own animals to be killed, I get a little sick to my stomach and have to take a deep breath and do what has to be done. Same for the duck I had to put down the other day. I had managed to get out of my fence and the neighbors dog ripped it up pretty good. It was bleeding out and had zero chance of living another 10-20 minutes. So I put it down quickly and humanely. Didn't want to, but it needed to be done. And I never let me kids see me do it. They know it is happening, but they don't watch.
> ...



Same here  Great post Chad!


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## Madortoise (Sep 20, 2010)

When I traveled around Europe and saw how they display dead animals at market skinned sheep w/eyeballs and all, I actually felt more appreciation and respect for the animals' life than the disgust for the practice of killing and eating them. I think it's good for the big and little people to know where the food comes from and how much sacrifice has gone into it before it showed up as your dinner...whether it's a grain of rice or a certain kind of animal as so long as we remember that we are interdependent...just my opinion. Now, my headache and what keeps me up tonight is what do I do with the raccoon who may want to eat my tortoise.


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