# Redfoot rack



## fluffypanda17 (Sep 2, 2012)

What If someone had a rack with let's say full grown boa sized tubs and set them up for baby redfoots. Got the heat/humidity right and took great care of them but the only difference would be that they're in a tub, in a rack, with zero UV. I personally wouldn't want to try this and see but I'm curious if the babies would grow up healthy because from what I've read and experienced baby redfoots like to hide a lot and I'm sure that not a lot of UV gets through all of the thick foliage in the wild. I'm on the "give them UV" side but I'm still curious. What do you guys think?


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## ascott (Sep 2, 2012)

Soft, squishy lethargic--then dead. This would be my prediction. While the Redfoot are from a place that they do not have intense direct sun light as a major part of their day---they do get filtered uva/uvb and while their needs for intense rays absolutely is different from a desert type species they do need uva/uvb.....plus I believe you would also have an animal that is very fearful due to being housed in such a stimulant free environment....Also, uva/uvb rays travel into shade and have been recorded as being present as much as four feet into a shade area....my uncle learned this first hand while at the river and was sitting under a tree for hours and ended up going home with third degree sunburn--he never left the shade...


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## JeffG (Sep 2, 2012)

I think it would be possible to raise baby redfoots ths way, but probably not ideal. They would definitely need either periodic exposure to unfiltered sunlight, or calcium and vitamin D3 suppliments. Having access to real sunlight would always be best. I would never try this myself, but I would not say it is impossible either. [/i]


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## fluffypanda17 (Sep 2, 2012)

ascott said:


> Soft, squishy lethargic--then dead. This would be my prediction. While the Redfoot are from a place that they do not have intense direct sun light as a major part of their day---they do get filtered uva/uvb and while their needs for intense rays absolutely is different from a desert type species they do need uva/uvb.....plus I believe you would also have an animal that is very fearful due to being housed in such a stimulant free environment....Also, uva/uvb rays travel into shade and have been recorded as being present as much as four feet into a shade area....my uncle learned this first hand while at the river and was sitting under a tree for hours and ended up going home with third degree sunburn--he never left the shade...



Haha I've heard stories like that before! And I've heard about the uv rays still getting through. That's why I wouldn't go without using uv



JeffG said:


> I think it would be possible to raise baby redfoots ths way, but probably not ideal. They would definitely need either periodic exposure to unfiltered sunlight, or calcium and vitamin D3 suppliments. Having access to real sunlight would always be best. I would never try this myself, but I would not say it is impossible either.



Are you saying they might be able to not need uv if you give them calcium and vitamin d3? Yeah I couldn't try it either~



ascott said:


> Plus I believe you would also have an animal that is very fearful due to being housed in such a stimulant free environment....



what if you put stimulating things in the environment? And had other tortoises in there? And let's just throw in "what if you kept them in a rack but let them outside every once in a while?"


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## Floof (Sep 3, 2012)

There are racks out there designed for lizards/tortoises, with a place for lighting to be placed above the tubs.

As far as repurposing a large snake rack... What if you mounted a UVB bulb in the tub itself? Just a thought. I couldn't speak to whether it's really feasible even with UVB--but it's certainly possible to supply UVB inside a tub like that... Just have to find a good way to mount the UVB on the tub itself, and make sure the cord is long enough not to cause issues when you pull the tub in and out.


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## N2TORTS (Sep 3, 2012)

Honestly I donâ€™t think any tort of any species should be raised and kept in a tank, tub or rack â€¦.it can be done â€¦ but â€¦ â€œ ever spend the night in jailâ€ ?


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## Madkins007 (Sep 3, 2012)

The primary benefits of racks is for the keeper, not necessarily the animal. I think you could create a good rack system that met the key needs, but I am less sure I see a real benefit of a rack over just a decent tank.

I don't know that there is any proof they need UV as little babies- after all, they got a lot of nutrients from the yolk sac- just like the baby snakes did- who have almost identical UV/vit d needs- but I would still feel better offering at least SOME uv to any young reptile.

As for stimulation, I suspect that a good burrowing/snuggling substrate is about all they would want or need for a bit.


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## shellysmom (Sep 3, 2012)

This is what I picture tortoiseshack.com doing with all the baby torts in their big warehouse. Just putting them in drawers for a while and then sendin' them out sickly because the weren't raised in optimal conditions.


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## fluffypanda17 (Sep 3, 2012)

Madkins007 said:


> The primary benefits of racks is for the keeper, not necessarily the animal. I think you could create a good rack system that met the key needs, but I am less sure I see a real benefit of a rack over just a decent tank.
> 
> I don't know that there is any proof they need UV as little babies- after all, they got a lot of nutrients from the yolk sac- just like the baby snakes did- who have almost identical UV/vit d needs- but I would still feel better offering at least SOME uv to any young reptile.
> 
> As for stimulation, I suspect that a good burrowing/snuggling substrate is about all they would want or need for a bit.



Good point. I think at one point BHB Reptiles did a tortoise rack kinda like what you guys are saying. It's a rack but it has UV and everything else. It's just tortious tubs instead of tortoise tables~ 



shellysmom said:


> This is what I picture tortoiseshack.com doing with all the baby torts in their big warehouse. Just putting them in drawers for a while and then sendin' them out sickly because the weren't raised in optimal conditions.



O.O do they do that?


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## Redstrike (Sep 3, 2012)

ascott said:


> Soft, squishy lethargic--then dead. This would be my prediction. While the Redfoot are from a place that they do not have intense direct sun light as a major part of their day---they do get filtered uva/uvb and while their needs for intense rays absolutely is different from a desert type species they do need uva/uvb.....plus I believe you would also have an animal that is very fearful due to being housed in such a stimulant free environment....Also, uva/uvb rays travel into shade and have been recorded as being present as much as four feet into a shade area....my uncle learned this first hand while at the river and was sitting under a tree for hours and ended up going home with third degree sunburn--he never left the shade...





N2TORTS said:


> Honestly I donâ€™t think any tort of any species should be raised and kept in a tank, tub or rack â€¦.it can be done â€¦ but â€¦ â€œ ever spend the night in jailâ€ ?





Madkins007 said:


> The primary benefits of racks is for the keeper, not necessarily the animal. I think you could create a good rack system that met the key needs, but I am less sure I see a real benefit of a rack over just a decent tank.
> 
> I don't know that there is any proof they need UV as little babies- after all, they got a lot of nutrients from the yolk sac- just like the baby snakes did- who have almost identical UV/vit d needs- but I would still feel better offering at least SOME uv to any young reptile.
> 
> As for stimulation, I suspect that a good burrowing/snuggling substrate is about all they would want or need for a bit.





shellysmom said:


> This is what I picture tortoiseshack.com doing with all the baby torts in their big warehouse. Just putting them in drawers for a while and then sendin' them out sickly because the weren't raised in optimal conditions.



You guys rule!


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## Cowboy_Ken (Sep 10, 2012)

To help ya'all out with this, let me share a little story with ya. (I'll try to keep it readers digest version)!
If you've read my past posts you'll recall my first sulcata was 9 yrs old and the size of a softball. 
A large part of her life was spent in a snake rack system. Apparently, the uninformed owner thought all they needed was heat and salad greens. I got her at six years and she weighed in at all of 186 grams. 
So, I'll answer your question like this; can it be done? Sure. Can a snake rack be modified to keep torts? Sure. Can children be raised on pizza and ice cream? Sure. 
Is our job as keepers of animals and kids to give them the best possible life and not cut corners? H*ll to the yes.


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## fluffypanda17 (Sep 11, 2012)

Cowboy_Ken said:


> To help ya'all out with this, let me share a little story with ya. (I'll try to keep it readers digest version)!
> If you've read my past posts you'll recall my first sulcata was 9 yrs old and the size of a softball.
> A large part of her life was spent in a snake rack system. Apparently, the uninformed owner thought all they needed was heat and salad greens. I got her at six years and she weighed in at all of 186 grams.
> So, I'll answer your question like this; can it be done? Sure. Can a snake rack be modified to keep torts? Sure. Can children be raised on pizza and ice cream? Sure.
> Is our job as keepers of animals and kids to give them the best possible life and not cut corners? H*ll to the yes.



Amen.


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## Jacqui (Sep 11, 2012)

Depends on how you have your rack set up and what you mean by rack. I use "racks" myself. I keep my tortoises, when indoors, in the large sheep rubbermaid type tubs. The tubs then are placed on wooden shelves three layers high (yes I use a ladder to work with the top ones). They still get their lights, their air, and everything. They are not soft, squishy, nor lethargic and certainly not dead. The tortoises in my racks do as well as the ones scattered about in the same room in single layer enclosures. 

The only thing I see really wrong with the first posts statement, is absolutely no lights or was it only no UV lights?



Cowboy_Ken said:


> So, I'll answer your question like this; can it be done? Sure. Can a snake rack be modified to keep torts? Sure. Can children be raised on pizza and ice cream? Sure.
> Is our job as keepers of animals and kids to give them the best possible life and not cut corners? H*ll to the yes.



Just how do you think I am "cutting corners" by using my rack system?


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## Cowboy_Ken (Sep 11, 2012)

Jacqui,
In response to your post, I was posting in regard to the original post of this thread which suggests raising them in â€œfull grown boa sized tubs". Technically speaking, my torts are in a rack system in that their indoor habitats are water troughs, two high, on a shelf. In this loose translation of a rack system I would imagine pallet racks used at the large box stores could be construed to mean, â€œunsuitable for torts". Perhaps I should have been more specific when I said that my original Sulcata was raised in a rack system. What I meant to say is it was raised in a snake rack system. Oh, I did mention that. I'm truly sorry for any confusion this may have caused.


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## fluffypanda17 (Sep 11, 2012)

[QUOTEThe only thing I see really wrong with the first posts statement, is absolutely no lights or was it only no UV lights?

[/QUOTE]

I was asking if it's would be possible to raise a baby Redfoot in a tub with no UV lights. That's basically it. I would always give them UV but I was just curious because they hide a lot.


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## Jacqui (Sep 11, 2012)

fluffypanda17 said:


> I was asking if it's would be possible to raise a baby Redfoot in a tub with no UV lights. That's basically it. I would always give them UV but I was just curious because they hide a lot.



Any time outside at all?




Cowboy_Ken said:


> Jacqui,
> In response to your post, I was posting in regard to the original post of this thread which suggests raising them in â€œfull grown boa sized tubs". Technically speaking, my torts are in a rack system in that their indoor habitats are water troughs, two high, on a shelf. In this loose translation of a rack system I would imagine pallet racks used at the large box stores could be construed to mean, â€œunsuitable for torts". Perhaps I should have been more specific when I said that my original Sulcata was raised in a rack system. What I meant to say is it was raised in a snake rack system. Oh, I did mention that. I'm truly sorry for any confusion this may have caused.



I was going with the fact you also included "modified" snake racks.


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