# Only using Mazuri



## JohnR (Sep 30, 2015)

Have anyone experimented with using only Mazuri/ Zoomed pellets as their major diet with high humidity/ normal lighting/soakings etc?
I am curious to know how much effect nutritious diets (high protein) impacting pyramiding.


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## ZEROPILOT (Sep 30, 2015)

Feeding any species of tortoise only Mazuri is probably not advisable.
Diet wont in itself cause any pyramiding.


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## JohnR (Sep 30, 2015)

ZEROPILOT said:


> Feeding any species of tortoise only Mazuri is probably not advisable.
> Diet wont in itself cause any pyramiding.


Dont get me wrong. I am only talking in a hypothetical ground. To test the impact of high nutrient diet as the single variable to see the effects of it on pyramiding.


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## ZEROPILOT (Sep 30, 2015)

I'm sure that others will chime in on the conversation, but I think that the understanding has been that diet has little if any effect on pyramiding. (As was once thought)


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## SarahChelonoidis (Sep 30, 2015)

I think EJ/Ed feeds (or fed) Mazuri almost exclusively and he is certainly known for having impressive animals. Zoos rely heavily on it, but I don't know how many don't supplement with fresh stuff at all.

I would imagine between EJ and zoos, there must be something resembling a long term feeding study to see what the health outcomes are.


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## Prairie Mom (Oct 1, 2015)

A member of the forum (Tom) has done some pretty interesting testing on what causes and stops pyramiding. There are several threads about it on the forum as it is a topic that comes up often. Last year he was asked to do a presentation for the CTTC about Pyramiding and the forum admin recorded it and posted it on Youtube. It's a lengthy presentation, but if you have the time, I HIGHLY recommend watching it! It's interesting, discusses many of the theories regarding pyramiding (including whether diet is an influence), and you honestly get swept up in his enthusiasm for caring for tortoises.

Here's a link to the video. Please check it out! Great stuff!


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## Yvonne G (Oct 1, 2015)

Even the manufacturer doesn't recommend feeding a diet of only Mazuri. 

In the olden days pyramiding was attributed to too much protein in the diet. We have since found out that pyramiding is caused by being raised too dry during the first couple of years out of the egg.

Yes, you will see badly deformed tortoises that have been fed only cat/dog food and kept in a dark closet, but the MAIN cause of pyramiding is related to humidity.


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## JohnR (Oct 1, 2015)

Definitely checking out that video once I have time! Thank you for the feedback guys!


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## pepsiandjac (Oct 2, 2015)

I once bought a 1kg bag of mazuri and used to feed my 3 yr old Greek spur thigh mazuri once a week when he was small,and by Greek standards he is huge,don't know if it was the mazuri,but if it was I dread to think how big he would be jf i had kept using it or fed it to him everyday.
Last time i weighed him he was 2.2kg


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## Tom (Oct 2, 2015)

They did a study in Austria in 2003 that proved humidity prevents pyramiding and protein does not cause pyramiding. I don't have the link for it any more, but I know who can find it. Master of the internet @jaizei . Big J, would you mind linking that for us here?


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## tortoise5643 (Oct 2, 2015)

Prairie Mom said:


> A member of the forum (Tom) has done some pretty interesting testing on what causes and stops pyramiding. There are several threads about it on the forum as it is a topic that comes up often. Last year he was asked to do a presentation for the CTTC about Pyramiding and the forum admin recorded it and posted it on Youtube. It's a lengthy presentation, but if you have the time, I HIGHLY recommend watching it! It's interesting, discusses many of the theories regarding pyramiding (including whether diet is an influence), and you honestly get swept up in his enthusiasm for caring for tortoises.
> 
> Here's a link to the video. Please check it out! Great stuff!


Tried watching this but no audio is playing. I did have a small laugh at tom. I guess I just imagined him as much older. Either way, I'd like to watch that with volume some time.


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## jaizei (Oct 2, 2015)

*Influence of environmental humidity and dietary protein on pyramidal growth of carapaces in African spurred tortoises (Geochelone sulcata)*
C. S. Wiesner and C. Iben

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1046/j.1439-0396.2003.00411.x/abstract


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## Turtlepete (Oct 2, 2015)

I've never fed it exclusively, but I've certainly used it as a pretty huge staple. Last year, when I had a dozen or so red foots at yearling age, they ate probably 50-60% Mazuri. I feel growth may have been accelerated, but it was still perfect growth that resulted in quite active and healthy tortoises. They were always supplemented with fresh weeds, hibiscus and the like. 

I like Mazuri. Never tried it 100%, but I've relied heavily on it and seen nothing but good results.


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## domalle (Oct 2, 2015)

Tom said:


> They did a study in Austria in 2003 that proved humidity prevents pyramiding and protein does not cause pyramiding. I don't have the link for it any more, but I know who can find it. Master of the internet @jaizei . Big J, would you mind linking that for us here?



The full text of the paper can be accessed through Madkins Tortoise Library site.
While the paper does present evidence to support the humidity thesis, the results are more equivocal.
I would not characterize it as final proof of humidity as the sole cause of pyramiding. 
A major cause, yes.


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## domalle (Oct 3, 2015)

From the Austrian study:
"The combination of dry environmental conditions and comparatively high growth rates induced by a nutritionally dense diet led to
pyramidal growth in the African Spurred tortoises of this study. Humid conditions suppressed the development of PGS considerably."

Pingleton's Understanding Pyramidal Growth Syndrome (PGS) in Redfoot Tortoises gives a broader, more comprehensive
and balanced view of all the factors involved in the pyramiding process.
It is also available from the Madkins Library site.


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## pepsiandjac (Oct 3, 2015)

tortoise5643 said:


> Tried watching this but no audio is playing. I did have a small laugh at tom. I guess I just imagined him as much older. Either way, I'd like to watch that with volume some time.


I watched it earlier and the audio was fine


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## JohnR (Oct 4, 2015)

Turtlepete said:


> I've never fed it exclusively, but I've certainly used it as a pretty huge staple. Last year, when I had a dozen or so red foots at yearling age, they ate probably 50-60% Mazuri. I feel growth may have been accelerated, but it was still perfect growth that resulted in quite active and healthy tortoises. They were always supplemented with fresh weeds, hibiscus and the like.
> 
> I like Mazuri. Never tried it 100%, but I've relied heavily on it and seen nothing but good results.



I am curious. In that case how much pellet do you feed i.e. pellet to tortoise size ratio. My understanding of redfoot is that their diet requires more proteins than species like sulcata , stars. But interesting to see heavy diets of mazuri with success.


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## Prairie Mom (Oct 4, 2015)

tortoise5643 said:


> Tried watching this but no audio is playing. I did have a small laugh at tom. I guess I just imagined him as much older. Either way, I'd like to watch that with volume some time.


I'm sorry. It worked for me. It is quiet. Not sure what to do


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## Alaskamike (Oct 5, 2015)

Prairie Mom said:


> I'm sorry. It worked for me. It is quiet. Not sure what to do


I watched that video too. The audio is weak , I had to plug in my external speakers to my laptop to hear it. 

But good thorough information Tom !


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