# H.R. 511 and other Reptile Laws



## StudentoftheReptile (Feb 29, 2012)

The bill H.R. 511 was scheduled for a Markup Hearing before the US House Judiciary Committee yesterday (Feb 28, 2012). This bill allegedly seeks to add 9 constricting snakes to the Injurious Wildlife List of the Lacey Act.

Here is the text:



> *To amend title 18, United States Code, to prohibit the
> importation of various injurious species of constrictor snakes.*
> Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled,
> SECTION 1. IMPORTATION OR SHIPMENT OF INJURIOUS SPECIES.
> ...



Update from Andrew Wyatt of the U.S. Assoc. of Reptile Keepers (Facebook post):



> After an outpouring of opposition calls to Congressional Members by the Reptile Nation, and a bevy of amendment proposals, HR511 was unanimously reported out of the US House Judiciary Committee today. It is not completely clear what the next step for HR 511 will be, but the bill has passed out of the Judiciary Committee today. US House Natural Resources Committee Staff has filed a memo to have the bill properly heard with expert testimony given before the House Natural Resources Committee. Whatever happens HR 511 still has a long way to go before becoming law. This is a set back, but we have overcome setbacks like this before. Check out Herp Nation News tomorrow for a more detailed report and analysis from USARK CEO Andrew Wyatt. Stay Tuned!


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Guys, I put this thread here because it relates to all reptiles, not just snakes. Whether you like snakes or not, everyone needs to realize a few things. First of all, these lawmakers and the agenda-driven groups behind them that support these bans and laws are doing so because they are pushing the belief that these snakes can live in the lower 2/3s of the U.S. Think about that for a second. Red-tailed boas and pythons...these are tropical species that hail from equatorial climates. Despite what you see on Animal Cruelty Planet or the news, Burmese pythons are barely eeking out an existence in extreme southern Florida and their numbers are dwindling with every passing winter. These clowns in Washington would have you believe these snakes can invade over half the country, gobbling up poodles and kindergartners and established themselves as far north as New York. Does that seem accurate or plausible? I mean, it gets below freezing for a few weeks here in southern Alabama. I guarantee pythons aren't going to make it here. They sure as heck aren't going to make it any farther north. Yet bills like this one can get passed without any foundation of real, accurate scientific evidence.

Take another look at that bill. It mentions Boa constrictor sp. That's red-tailed boas...ALL red-tailed boas. Not just the large 8-9 ft Columbians, but the smaller localities like Hog Islands and Central Americans that rarely get over 5-6 ft. Anyone know how popular red-tailed boas are? They're argubly the most commonly-bred constrictor next to ball pythons, with all the morphs and mutations. At a max of 9 ft, they're not THAT huge compared to the other species mentioned on the bill. I mean, there's a handful of other python species that get larger that are not mentioned. This shows that they're not necessarily interested in banning all big snakes; they want to ban the snakes that will the most effect on our industry. Just watch...they'll come for ball pythons soon enough. They want to destroy the reptile hobby.
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This kinda goes hand-in-hand with the "enlightening" thread someone posted about PETA, as well as my previous threads about USARK. People, the reptile community is at war whether you realize it or not. You have to open your eyes and see what is happening. These non-govt organizations, namely HSUS, PETA, Defenders of Wildlife, & the Natures Conservancy are no friend to the pet community. If you keep any kind of exotic pet, you should not support these organizations. Look at the trend. It's the classic military strategy: take out the obvious targets first; i.e. the "hot topic" serious threats. What are those? Invasive species like burmese pythons, lionfish; dangerous beasts like big cats, bears, primates; bully breeds like pitbulls, etc. Once those are done, they move on to the next tier. They're already targeting all big snakes now, not just the Burmese python. Some states are jumping on the bandwagon and trying to ban all reptiles, even big lizards like monitors and iguanas. Then what? All reptiles? All tropical fish? It's a lot easier to take down your enemy in slices piece by piece than one big shot (they tried it with H.R. 669 back 2008).


_*What can you do?
*_
Donate to USARK and PIJAC. These battles are won with two major weapons: money and influence. HSUS, PETA and their ilk have plenty. That's why USARK and PIJAC needs the support of the ENTIRE reptile community, not just snake-keepers. According to statistics, 1 out of every 25 Americans own at least one reptile. However, only a mere fraction of that demographic currently makes up the membership of USARK. I don't know about you, but there's something wrong with that.

In my little poll a while back, roughly 2/3 of the people here (or at least the people who participated) didn't even know what USARK was.

What else can you do? Continue to educate others about herps, and share with them how wonderful and fascinating these creatures are. If you're not already, get involved with a local herp club or society.


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## Weda737 (Mar 1, 2012)

I don't even have words for this. I think you can all see how dumb this is, with as many snakes that get respiratory infections in captivity, how are they supposed to survive our winters. There was some dumb show on tv, I didn't see it myself, but someone told me they said that since an adult python survived a winter in florida, that now it's in their dna to survive winters. Really? this is the kind of crap they are spreading? If animals adapted and evolved that quickly, nothing would have ever went extinct. All I can say is I hope hope hope, that USARK can do something, Sue or something. If I had money I'd do it myself.


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## dmmj (Mar 1, 2012)

A snake that eats kindergartners, now that is not such a bad idea


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## Weda737 (Mar 1, 2012)

People just hate snakes, I have an ad on our local website looking for a corn snake and they've removed it twice now, I just sent them a message. They better have a good reason.


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## GeoTerraTestudo (Mar 1, 2012)

Well, exotic reptiles are competing with and preying on native animals in Florida.


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## Weda737 (Mar 1, 2012)

GeoTerraTestudo said:


> Well, exotic reptiles are competing with and preying on native animals in Florida.



Not as much as the bloated media is making it out as. They wouldn't survive in Most of the US at all.


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## StudentoftheReptile (Mar 2, 2012)

GeoTerraTestudo said:


> Well, exotic reptiles are competing with and preying on native animals in Florida.



Not as much as feral cats prey on native animals all across the entire country.
Not as much as feral hogs compete with native animals all across the southeast.
Not as much as kudzu competes and chokes out native species of plants all across the country.
...shall I go on? I can list dozens of more damaging examples of invasive flora and fauna of which the python problem in south Florida pails in comparison to.
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What people do not realize is that many of these so-called "decreases" in populations of native species down there are actually natural. Rabbit populations naturally plummet every 7 years in the wild, and it has nothing to do with the pythons in the everglades. The populations of deer, bobcats, coyotes, etc...all similarly go through peaks and plummets over the period of a multi-year span, not just a seasonal thing.

The media would have you believe that these pythons in Florida have no predators. Bull. Many animals eat the young snakes and raid the nests of these pythons, including raccoons, other reptiles, etc. Bird of prey also eat the younger snakes. Alligators eat the larger ones. Only a few pythons that survive long enough to reach adulthood can get a break from predators, but even then, the largest gators can easily crunch them down. Contrary to popular belief, these snakes are not invincible monsters. They have to put up with predators, parasites, injury and disease just like every other critter out there.

I've posed the question on other threads, but I'll say again: do you see any laws banning or restricting the ownership of cats? Livestock? Tropical fish? Very few, if any, and absolutely none, for the cats. Why? WEDA said it well: snakes are easy targets. The pythons are big and scary, and it's super easy to play on the general public's fear of them. Never mind the facts and the real science. Forget that feral cats are a much bigger problem to the environment.

With all that said, can _*you*_, as a fellow exotic pet keeper, sit there and tell me it's fair to pass a federal law restricting the freedoms of pet owners all over the country because of an isolated problem in one state (Florida)? Furthermore, do you really think it is fair to throw all the snake keepers under the bus, when the rest of the pet community is equally (if not more so) guilty of irresponsibility, negligence, escaped pets, misbehaved animals, dangerous pets, invasive/harmful species introduced into the ecosystem?

Someone on another thread made the claim that we're all on the same side. Are we really? The impression I've gotten from a few members here is that many members of the reptile community (mainly those who don't keep or even like snakes) are perfectly willing to throw us snake-lovers to the curb with the hope that the rest of you will be left alone. Maybe a lot of that stems from simple ignorance, to which my response is: stop watching Animal Planet and start educating yourself a little better on the facts. 

I have two more things to say to that. First of all, it's not fair to throw us under the bus, because a lot of snake keepers keep other herps, too. I love tortoises just as much as I love snakes. I got your back on defending your rights to keep your little shelled friends. Sometimes I don't think the feeling is mutual. 

Secondly, if you think you're safe because you don't keep "dangerous" animals and you and your tortoises are off the radar...you are sadly mistaken. They're after all of us. And after the big snakes are banned, and the iguanas and the tegus and monitors....they'll just keep peeling away at the reptile industry.



Weda737 said:


> There was some dumb show on tv, I didn't see it myself, but someone told me they said that since an adult python survived a winter in florida, that now it's in their dna to survive winters. Really? this is the kind of crap they are spreading? If animals adapted and evolved that quickly, nothing would have ever went extinct.



Seriously...they must be reading comic books or the Sci-Fi channel. Nothing adapts that quickly!



> All I can say is I hope hope hope, that USARK can do something, Sue or something. If I had money I'd do it myself.



Last I heard, the only hope for the federal rule change that put the Burmese python, both African rock python species and the yellow anaconda on the Lacey act...is to mount a federal lawsuit. It would cost USARK at least $150,000 to do that. They have about that much now...but they're also fighting little battles here and there on the state level as well. They need our help and our donation.


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## ALDABRAMAN (Mar 2, 2012)

dmmj said:


> A snake that eats kindergartners, now that is not such a bad idea







GeoTerraTestudo said:


> Well, exotic reptiles are competing with and preying on native animals in Florida.



True!


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## EricIvins (Mar 2, 2012)

GeoTerraTestudo said:


> Well, exotic reptiles are competing with and preying on native animals in Florida.



Please do your reasearch before posting stuff like this........Or atleast live and see how things work down here before forming your opinion.........Here in Florida, the Invasives eat the Invasives........And if your talking about Burmese Pythons, take everything you see in print with a grain of salt, including the latest "Mammal decline in the Everglades".........Utter BS.........


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## Weda737 (Mar 2, 2012)

You guys give me hope. I hate it when people get "specist." I'm donating to USARK as much as I possibly can at the moment. I will continue to do so in the future.


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