# Fluoride....should you use it or not?



## Candy (Sep 6, 2009)

I read this article yesterday and then I pulled up this other article that I had read about 2 years ago. What a difference in opinion from doctors. Has to make you wonder though whether we should use this or not. I don't myself because I've read to many conflicting articles on it, but I hope this helps you decide if it's worth it or not. Dr. Roizen is the co-author of Dr. Oz's book.

Floss and brush daily and you'll be rewarded with more than just a bright smile. "Your oral health has a major influence on your systemic health," says Dr. Roizen. "The same bacteria that cause gum disease in your mouth can set off an immune reaction that may lead to wrinkles, heart disease and even stroke." Several studies have linked periodontal disease to an increased risk of heart disease (some speculate that gum disease may cause chronic inflammation, which can in turn cause swelling around the arteries).

Drink Tap Water 
Most bottled water isn't just expensive and bad for the environment. It also typically doesn't contain fluoride, which can help prevent tooth decay. Can't stand the taste of tap? Use a carbon filter, which helps remove pesticide residue and other chemicals.



This second article is something that I read two years ago and saved. Two very interesting opinions, but completely opposite.



Prominent researcher apologizes for pushing fluoride 
by Barry Forbes, The Tribune, Mesa, AZ Sunday, December 5, 1999 

"Why'd you do it, Doc? Why'd you toss the fluoride folks overboard?" 

I had just tracked down Dr. Hardy Limeback, B.Sc., Ph.D in Biochemistry, D.D.S., head of the Department of Preventive Dentistry for the University of Toronto, and president of the Canadian Association for Dental Research. (Whew.) 

Dr. Limeback is Canada's leading fluoride authority and, until recently, the country's primary promoter of the controversial additive. In a surprising newsmaker interview this past April, Dr. Limeback announced a dramatic change of heart. "Children under three should never use fluoridated toothpaste," he counseled. "Or drink fluoridated water. And baby formula must never be made up using Toronto tap water. Never." 

Why, I wondered? What could have caused such a powerful paradigm shift? 

"It's been building up for a couple of years," Limeback told me during a recent telephone interview. "But certainly the crowning blow was the realization that we have been dumping contaminated fluoride into water reservoirs for half a century. The vast majority of all fluoride additives come from Tampa Bay, Florida smokestack scrubbers. The additives are a toxic byproduct of the super-phosphate fertilizer industry." 

"Tragically," he continued, "that means we're not just dumping toxic fluoride into our drinking water. We're also exposing innocent, unsuspecting people to deadly elements of lead, arsenic and radium, all of them carcinogenic. Because of the cumulative properties of toxins, the detrimental effects on human health are catastrophic." A recent study at the University of Toronto confirmed Dr. Limeback's worst fears. "Residents of cities that fluoridate have double the fluoride In their hip bones vis-a-vis the balance of the population. Worse, we discovered that fluoride is actually altering the basic architecture of human bones." 

Skeletal fluorosis is a debilitating condition that occurs when fluoride accumulates in bones, making them extremely weak and brittle. The earliest symptoms? 

"Mottled and brittle teeth," Dr. Limeback told me. "In Canada we are now spending more money treating dental fluorosis than we do treating cavities. That includes my own practice." 

One of the most obvious living experiments today, Dr. Limeback believes, is a proof-positive comparison between any two Canadian cities. "Here in Toronto we've been fluoridating for 36 years. Yet Vancouver Ã¢â‚¬â€œ which has never fluoridated Ã¢â‚¬â€œ has a cavity rate lower than Toronto's." 

And, he pointed out, cavity rates are low all across the industrialized world including Europe, which is 98% fluoride free. Low because of improved standards of living, less refined sugar, regular dental checkups, flossing and frequent brushing. Now less than 2 cavities per child Canada-wide, he said. 

"I don't get it, Doc. Last month, the Centers for Disease Control (CDC) ran a puff piece all across America saying the stuff was better than sliced bread. What's the story?" 

"Unfortunately," he replied, "the CDC is basing its position on data that is 50 years old, and questionable at best. Absolutely no one has done research on fluorosilicates, which is the junk they're dumping into the drinking water." 

"On the other hand," he added, "the evidence against systemic fluoride in-take continues to pour in." 

"But Doc, the dentists." 

"I have absolutely no training in toxicity," he stated firmly. "Your well-intentioned dentist is simply following 50 years of misinformation from public health and the dental association. Me, too. Unfortunately, we were wrong." 

Last week, Dr. Hardy Limeback addressed his faculty and students at the University of Toronto, Department of Dentistry. In a poignant, memorable meeting, he apologized to those gathered before him. 

"Speaking as the head of preventive dentistry, I told them that I had unintentionally mislead my colleagues and my students. For the past 15 years, I had refused to study the toxicology information that is readily available to anyone. Poisoning our children was the furthest thing from my mind." 

"The truth," he confessed to me, "was a bitter pill to swallow. But swallow it I did." 

South of the border, the paradigm shift has yet to dawn. After half a century of delusion, the CDC, American Dental Association and Public Health stubbornly and skillfully continue to manipulate public opinion in favor of fluoridation. 

Meantime, study after study is delivering the death knell of the deadly toxin. Sure, fluoridation will be around for a long time yet, but ultimately its supporters need to ready the life rafts. The poisonous waters of doubt and confusion are bound to get choppier. 

"Are lawsuits inevitable?" I asked the good doctor. "Remember tobacco," was his short, succinct reply. 

Welcome, Dr. Hardy Limeback, to the far side of the fluoride equation. 

It's lonely over here, but in our society loneliness and truth frequently travel hand in hand. 

Thank you for the undeniable courage of your convictions.


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## Laura (Sep 6, 2009)

We had it in our water growing up I think.. Im a crest kid tho...
and my teeth are wodnerful... genetics or that? will never know!!


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## ZippyButter (Sep 6, 2009)

Candy,

Flouride was an industrial waste of the atomic project and the metal industries during the WW2. You can get all these information in the book: "The Flouride Deception" by an award winning journalist Christopher Bryson. It's available on Amazon.com, I believe. It's important for us to know all the true facts so we can make an informed decision for us and our family. I asked my children's dentist not to apply the vitamin (mostly flouride product) treatment after their teeth cleaned by a hygenist. We also have the filtration system for the house water. For toothpaste, you can check out Trader Joe for a natural toothpaste without floride in it. I take my hat off to those who have courage to expose the lying of these industries to make PROFIT on the cost of innocent human being. Be informed and stay healthy.


Oh, if flouride is good, just read the warning on the back of a tube of toothpaste


Minh


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## Candy (Sep 6, 2009)

Exactly Minh. I had read similar things in the last two years about fluoride and I too do not allow the dentist or orthodontist to use it on my children when they go to them. They look at me like I'm crazy how could I pass up this opportunity? The orthodontist's hygienist just asked me why and I told her because I have read conflicting papers on it and I choose to go the other route. I will definetely look up that book. Thank you for the information. I've also read where they think fluoride and Chlorine (both are in your tap water) when ingested goes through the arteries and scars them. They think that this promotes cholesterol build up of the arteries. That's scary.  Oh and I also have a filtration system for drinking water and in my showers. I also use toothpaste with no fluoride from Whole Foods and good to say the boys actually like the taste of it.


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## stells (Sep 7, 2009)

I'm am one of those people that you are going to hate lol...

I just brush... don't even look at whats in anything.... my view is what will be will be and something has to get you in the end....


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## Stazz (Sep 7, 2009)

Lol Kelly, Im the same as you, I've never heard anything conflicting about flouride, but then again I've never taken the time to research it. I use Aquafresh  And have nice strong healthy teef


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## chadk (Sep 7, 2009)

A lot of these places (NOT ALL) that offer 'alternative' approaches to medicine and health care really just have something to sell. Filtration systems are big money (such as reverse osmosis filtration systems).

I'm skeptical of both sides, but don't feel the risks are high enough to make a serious blip on my 'loose sleep thinking about it' radar. Kinda like the electromagnetic radiation post someone did...


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## Candy (Sep 7, 2009)

stells said:


> I'm am one of those people that you are going to hate lol...
> 
> I just brush... don't even look at whats in anything.... my view is what will be will be and something has to get you in the end....



Kelly nobody is going to hate you for your opinion because nobody really knows all the facts. I just wanted to make people think about what we put in our bodys and what we're putting into our childrens bodies. I've told people before that it's not the quanity of life it's the quality that I'm looking to inprove. I do love reading everybody's view it makes it more interesting to see where people are coming from. Are you in England? And if you are do you guys use mainly homopathic medicine? Just curious. 



chadk said:


> A lot of these places (NOT ALL) that offer 'alternative' approaches to medicine and health care really just have something to sell. Filtration systems are big money (such as reverse osmosis filtration systems).
> 
> I'm skeptical of both sides, but don't feel the risks are high enough to make a serious blip on my 'loose sleep thinking about it' radar. Kinda like the electromagnetic radiation post someone did...



Your right Chad as with anything out there you have to be careful. I do have an reverse osmosis system because I don't like chlorine and other toxins in my water. I don't find that they're expensive. I am not skeptical on alternative health. I go to a doctor now that deals in alternative health, but that doesn't mean that he's not a real doctor. He's been a doctor for 51 years and he's also was a coroner (talk about someone who know you inside and out)  He also sees my kids. They have a genenic thyroid problem (from their fathers side). Dr. Yuri gave them (just like my husband) a bio-indentical thyroid instead of the synthetic one that they used to have my husband on. Children's Hospital in LA told my husband the truth at least she said that she's not against it and she knows about them they just haven't studied them yet. Anyway when she got the blood work back she said my kids are doing fine on it. My husband is now also on it. I do love to hear people thoughts and I'm not against other ways it's just that I'm doing the research for myself.


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## stells (Sep 7, 2009)

Yep i am in England... There are a few that go the Homeopathic route here... i wouldn't say its what is mainly used though... my sister is big on it and uses it alot... i just use the doctor and the chemist lol


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## Candy (Sep 7, 2009)

stells said:


> Yep i am in England... There are a few that go the Homeopathic route here... i wouldn't say its what is mainly used though... my sister is big on it and uses it alot... i just use the doctor and the chemist lol



Interesting Kelly because most things that I read make me believe that it is a high percentage that is homopathic in England. I guess it's like me and my sister I am more homopathic and she is not (not that I don't try to get her to be) . I've never known anyone from England and since I've heard that bio-indentical hormones are big over there and that they have been for some 35 years or more do you know about them? Our FDA here does not approve them (actually now only one) I was just wondering since you live there.


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## chadk (Sep 7, 2009)

For some background on the fluoride debate...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opposition_to_water_fluoridation


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## Candy (Sep 7, 2009)

chadk said:


> For some background on the fluoride debate...
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opposition_to_water_fluoridation




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kLgKeHOgneQ&feature=player_embedded


After reading a couple of the references it's more confusing than ever. I just figure this way....why put something in your child's system (or yours) just because your government has decided it's good for you. That in itself is enough to keep me away from it. Chad, have you read what in your antiperspirant lately? 



Candy said:


> chadk said:
> 
> 
> > For some background on the fluoride debate...
> ...



I found these after and I tried to post them, but I'm not good at that. Anyway along with the one video that I posted at the top I'm posting this one too. Very interesting to watch if you have a few minutes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3y8uwtxrHo&feature=player_embedded


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## stells (Sep 7, 2009)

Candy said:


> stells said:
> 
> 
> > Yep i am in England... There are a few that go the Homeopathic route here... i wouldn't say its what is mainly used though... my sister is big on it and uses it alot... i just use the doctor and the chemist lol
> ...




OMG... that has just flown straight over my head lol 

I am now completely confuddled and think i need my bed....


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## dmmj (Sep 7, 2009)

Ask a dozen peope about flouride and you will prob get a dozen different answers, but I will admit I use filtered water becuse I do not like the taste of tap water, I know they say that tap water does not have a taste but I can tell the difference between tap and filtered, so go figure. The main problem I see about flouride is you have one side (the goverment) and then you have th eother side ( People hwo hate the goverment) telling you different things. So do your research on the subject and then decide on what is best for you and your family, and who cares what others say about you. I have no personal problem myself with flouride and it is in my toothpaste I use.


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## chadk (Sep 8, 2009)

The thing to remember about tap water is that not all our water is the same... I get my water from a big clear mt lake that our local water district set aside for drinking water use. Lots of the drinking water in my sate comes that way. Most of it is piped to a distribution center where it is tested and treated.

Other places have shared small community wells. Other places tap into massive deep underground aquafirs shared by many communities. And there are many here in the US on private wells.

Each community will have different tasting water. So 'tap water' may taste good in one area, but not so good in another. I can't stand going to my grand parents who's water always has a slight sulpher taste and smell to it. But it is still tap water that meets the EPA standards.



On an slightly related note, I get tired of the politically correct do-gooders in my area preaching their 'green' message to our kids using ignorant propoganda. Don't get me wrong, I am a conservationist and environmentalist to some extent - but not one of these radical political tools... So they come in to our schools and tell the kids that they should feel guilty about drinking our clean tap water and taking a nice long hot shower and watering out lawn etc etc etc. After all, in some areas, they don't have good clean drinking water. And water is a scarce resource and all that... BS! OK, yes, in some places that is true. But be honest! Here in Western WA we have MORE water than we can use each year. Our reservoirs are regularly maxed out (mainly spring and fall) and guess what, when they do start to get a LITTLE low by end of the summer, each year the heavy fall rains and deep snow packs (we've had record snow packs lately) fill them right back up again. So much so that we end up spilling so much out of the reservoir into the local rivers because we can't contain it all. 
Is it bad that they teach our kids here to conserve water? NO. But they should be honest about it! It does not come down to helping the poor and less fortunate. Our water usage has no impact on some 3rd world family who has to walk a mile just to fill a jug of water (that is what they want them to think...).

What's next? Air? They already want to tax us on our 'carbon footprint' and water usage... Air usuage is next. I mean, in some places in the world, clean air is not as abundant as it is here in the PNW. And in places like Denver CO, the air is thinner. We should try to conserve it. In fact, we should tax each person on their personal usuage just to be fair.... Do you run just for pleasure and\or exercise? Shame on you! That burns precious air. You should conserve it!

OK, dumb rant. Sorry...


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## Madortoise (Sep 8, 2009)

We stopped using toothpaste with fluoride in our household years ago b/c we read about some marketing genius (a nephew of Freud) thinking it was a good idea somehow to include industrial bi-product in toothpastes to get rid of them.
Our favoirte brand is Tom's and favorite flavor fennel. It works for us.


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## dmmj (Sep 8, 2009)

chadk how dare you and your family take water away from people who need it, you meanie. (J/K)


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## chadk (Sep 8, 2009)

LOL. If I could push some of the infamouse Seattle rain clouds toward them I sure would


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## terracolson (Sep 9, 2009)

I konw that my pediatric perscribes floride for my son, Rancho Cordova, where i live, doesnt have floride in the water.


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## Candy (Sep 9, 2009)

Madortoise said:


> We stopped using toothpaste with fluoride in our household years ago b/c we read about some marketing genius (a nephew of Freud) thinking it was a good idea somehow to include industrial bi-product in toothpastes to get rid of them.
> Our favoirte brand is Tom's and favorite flavor fennel. It works for us.



Madortoise, I had read that in the beginning when I first started reading things about fluoride. That's why I went further. Whether it's true or not I think I would rather not be their experiment to see if it does (which I highly doubt).


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