# Bobby died last night



## kellya31 (Jun 8, 2018)

thanks for everyone’s help during the time we had Bobby.
I have no idea what happened.
He had a uvb light, a heater emmiter, bought gauges for humidity and heat, monitored them, bought him all kinds of different foods that I got advice from here and scouring the internet.
Soaked him everyday put him outside (we don’t use pesticides) I just had ordered him mazuri to try anything to stimulate his appetite.
I really don’t think he ever ate that well when he arrived. The first week he would nibble and eat, maybe the first 5 days I would say, he ate the way he should have but after that he didn’t show much interest in food. Just nibbles. I looked at videos of tortoise eating and he never ate like that from the beginning. I spent everyday at least 45 minutes with him, to care for him..
I would not recommend anyone getting a hatchling when they have very little experience. If someone wants a tortoise they would be better off spending extra money for an established baby at least.
I’m really very sad about it, he lived 29 days.
He was 2 months old when I got him.


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## kellya31 (Jun 8, 2018)

I wanted to add, the first 2 weeks, he would yawn a couple of times every time I soaked him. He did this from the beginning.


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## Bee62 (Jun 8, 2018)

Hello, I am very sorry for your loss.
What tort specie was Bobby and where do you get him from ?
When babies are not well started ( means humid and warm ) they can get kidney problems very quick. Kidneys are not able to recover themselves. When you buy such a baby there is nothing you, a VET or meds can do.
Most of these babies die early. A few make it a little bit longer but do not thrive.
When you followed the advices here on the forum how to keep a baby it may be not your fault that your Bobby died.


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## katieandiggy (Jun 8, 2018)

I’m so sorry for your loss. You followed all of the Recommendations from here.
I just think some tortoises are not meant to make it. It’s terribly sad. [emoji170]


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## Maro2Bear (Jun 8, 2018)

Sorry to hear about Bobby.. Bee62 provided some great information.


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## kellya31 (Jun 8, 2018)

katieandiggy said:


> I’m so sorry for your loss. You followed all of the Recommendations from here.
> I just think some tortoises are not meant to make it. It’s terribly sad. [emoji170]



Thank you.


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## kellya31 (Jun 8, 2018)

Bee62 said:


> Hello, I am very sorry for your loss.
> What tort specie was Bobby and where do you get him from ?
> When babies are not well started ( means humid and warm ) they can get kidney problems very quick. Kidneys are not able to recover themselves. When you buy such a baby there is nothing you, a VET or meds can do.
> Most of these babies die early. A few make it a little bit longer but do not thrive.
> When you followed the advices here on the forum how to keep a baby it may be not your fault that your Bobby died.



He was a baby red foot. I got him from Redfoot Ranch.
I tried very hard to take proper care of him. I’m a novice so I know there is such a variable of things that I could have done wrong. It wasn’t from lack of trying though. We really wanted him.


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## ZEROPILOT (Jun 8, 2018)

Tiny babies are indeed much more difficult to keep alive than a robust sub adult.
However, some just don't survive because of any number of things and it may have been nothing in particular that you did wrong.


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## Bee62 (Jun 8, 2018)

kellya31 said:


> He was a baby red foot. I got him from Redfoot Ranch.
> I tried very hard to take proper care of him. I’m a novice so I know there is such a variable of things that I could have done wrong. It wasn’t from lack of trying though. We really wanted him.


I don`t know how good the reputation of Redfoot Farm is. Maybe some others soon come in and share their opinions, but when they start on this farm a lot of babies and sell a lot of babies it is very possible that they don`t take good care for the babies. It is more making money....
Please don`t punish yourself that you lost Bobby. It often happens to people when the baby they got is already sick.
Search for a breeder and ask him how he starts his babies. When he keeps them in closed chambers with high humidity and warmth you can buy a baby there. When he says his babies live on rabbit pellets avoid to buy there.
Maybe you can get a little Redfoot from someone of the forum. I know that there are some that breed redfoots tortoises.


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## kellya31 (Jun 8, 2018)

I also wanted to add, I felt the under carriage of his shell felt soft. I don’t know if that means anything.


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## kellya31 (Jun 8, 2018)

I’m so upset about it, I won’t be getting another for awhile if I do at all.
If I do, I will buy a juvenile from a breeder on here. 
Everyone on here seems very passionate and very concerned about the care of the tortoises.
If I knew then what I know now, I would have did that in the beginning.
I am sure the breeder didn’t mean to send me a sick tortoise if he did. It could have been that or an error of my care.


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## Yvonne G (Jun 8, 2018)

What you call yawning may have been gasping . Tortoises don't breath through their mouth, so if his nose was plugged due to a respiratory infection, he would just not breathe until he absolutely needed air, then he would open his mouth and take in air. This would also explain the not eating. They don't eat if they can't smell.

I'm so sorry you lost Bobby.


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## Bee62 (Jun 8, 2018)

kellya31 said:


> I also wanted to add, I felt the under carriage of his shell felt soft. I don’t know if that means anything.


Babies have a little bit softer shell but:
When torts have damaged kidneys the kidneys are not able to get the metabolic waste out of the body. In order that the blood will not get overacidified the body takes calcium from shell and bones and add it to the blood. That is why the shell gets softer when a baby tort is suffering kidney problems. But in the end the tort dies. There is no way back when kidneys don`t work well any longer.
I think that happend to your Bobby.


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## vladimir (Jun 8, 2018)

@kellya31 I'm so sorry to hear about Bobby. It sounds like you did everything you could to provide for him. I hope when the time is right another tortoise can find its way into your life.


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## kellya31 (Jun 8, 2018)

So hard to tell. Thank you.
I had never heard of the kidney failure.
I bought him one of the cuddle bones but I never saw him touch it. 
I had posted a yawn video and put up a post too, and someone said watch for excessive yawning. He didn’t seem to do it a lot but he did do it routinely. He would bat at his eyes off and on. I couldn’t see drainage. He also would lay his head down low the last week in this soak and blow a few bubbles. I saw him do that twice. Slow to open eyes in the am, but once he did his eyes looked clear.
I saw a post from a poster that their baby tortoise had died and before he did, he was crawling more in his enclosure and bumping into things. Bobby did this yesterday.
I know dogs and tortoises are light years apart, but I used to raise a few yorkies. One baby got very sick started running into walls and circling. She was seen by a vet and she died of liver shunt and kidney failure.


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## Bee62 (Jun 8, 2018)

kellya31 said:


> So hard to tell. Thank you.
> I had never heard of the kidney failure.
> I bought him one of the cuddle bones but I never saw him touch it.
> I had posted a yawn video and put up a post too, and someone said watch for excessive yawning. He didn’t seem to do it a lot but he did do it routinely. He would bat at his eyes off and on. I couldn’t see drainage. He also would lay his head down low the last week in this soak and blow a few bubbles. I saw him do that twice. Slow to open eyes in the am, but once he did his eyes looked clear.
> ...


Dogs and torts may be light years apart but from what you describe the signs of kidney and liver sickness can be similar.

Edit: Running into walls and circeling is a sign that the body gets more and more poisend from the metabolic waste in the blood.


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## kellya31 (Jun 8, 2018)

Hindsight is 20/20. Of course I am not a vet.
Considering all Bobby’s symptoms from the start I really think he had a respiratory infection, stressed him and ultimately died of kidney failure. 
Based on everyone’s input this really makes sense.
I asked my son if he wanted another tortoise later and he said no I never do after that.
I wish you all happy, healthy tortoises.
Great forum, keep up the great information.


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## EdMurphy (Jun 8, 2018)

@kellya31 I'm sorry you lost Bobby.
There are a lot of torts out there that could use a good caring owner like you, I hope you meet another that steals your heart.


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## Toddrickfl1 (Jun 8, 2018)

Oh my god @kellya31 I am so sorry. That's terrible, you were doing everything you could right. Don't beat yourself up, this is not your fault. SO SORRY


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## TammyJ (Jun 8, 2018)

kellya31 said:


> Hindsight is 20/20. Of course I am not a vet.
> Considering all Bobby’s symptoms from the start I really think he had a respiratory infection, stressed him and ultimately died of kidney failure.
> Based on everyone’s input this really makes sense.
> I asked my son if he wanted another tortoise later and he said no I never do after that.
> ...


I am very sorry Bobby did not make it but I feel it is no fault of yours. How old is your son? It's normal for him to say "never" at this time as he tries to deal with it, but we adults know that we should never say "never"! All the best in the future whatever you decide and thanks for caring so much!


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## teresaf (Jun 8, 2018)

He may change his mind. You never know. A baby from a well-known member here would be healthy.


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## daniellenc (Jun 8, 2018)

I am devastated for you and your son. Don't let bad luck deter you. Bobby was probably sick from day 1 and not started well.


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## Jay Bagley (Jun 8, 2018)

Very sorry for your loss.


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## Lyn W (Jun 8, 2018)

So sorry for your loss. You did your best for the little guy. 
If you eventually decided to try again then there are plenty of older rescue torts and I'm sure they'd be lucky to have a good home with you.


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## Via Infinito (Jun 8, 2018)

kellya31 said:


> thanks for everyone’s help during the time we had Bobby.
> I have no idea what happened.
> He had a uvb light, a heater emmiter, bought gauges for humidity and heat, monitored them, bought him all kinds of different foods that I got advice from here and scouring the internet.
> Soaked him everyday put him outside (we don’t use pesticides) I just had ordered him mazuri to try anything to stimulate his appetite.
> ...



My first baby was a very stressful experience. It was hovering around 50-60g for 3 months without gaining a gram despite the optimum care I had for it.
Finally it got me so stressed that I had to resell it back to the petstore (they sold it to someone else now, but I heard it's still not gaining any weight!)
Then I decided to put a bit more money down and got Titan, he was around 400g. That alone eliminates the problem of hatchling failure syndrome and you know he has a normal healthy kidney.
Now he is 522g after 3 months.

Honestly, I don't think pet store should sell them babies at all. From my experience, I would never go for babies at 50-60g, it is too much of a risk taking them in because you just don't know if they are gonna make it. If they don't it's just devastating. I never go for spongy, soft carapace ones either.
They are generally safe at 100g plus because you know that it is surely growing.
If you try again, I recommended getting one at least more than 80g, tell the petstore to weight it, if it's below 80g, don't take it.


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## TriciaStringer (Jun 8, 2018)

I am so sorry. Such sadness with you lose a beloved pet.


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## Tortoisefanatic88 (Jun 9, 2018)

Sorry for your loss  Don't let this deter you from owning another tortoise. You followed all the proper care instructions and were very passionate about Bobby.


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## joshua10867 (Jun 10, 2018)

kellya31 said:


> thanks for everyone’s help during the time we had Bobby.
> I have no idea what happened.
> He had a uvb light, a heater emmiter, bought gauges for humidity and heat, monitored them, bought him all kinds of different foods that I got advice from here and scouring the internet.
> Soaked him everyday put him outside (we don’t use pesticides) I just had ordered him mazuri to try anything to stimulate his appetite.
> ...


Sorry for your loss


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## StacieJ (Jun 13, 2018)

Just my experience with Red Foot Ranch. We purchased a total of 10 redfoots from him because he lives close and is very knowledgeable however of those 10 only 2 have lived thankfully we kept them away from our big guys from @ZEROPILOT. 7 were 2 year olds all purchased at the same time from the same container and only one is still living and truthfully she is just hanging on. We spent thousands of dollars at vets on them and they still died and at the same time got an education at the vets office. We did find out after being at the “ranch”and seeing his incubator although impressive it was kind of empty however the next weekend he had about 50 babies and larger ones that weren’t there a few days earlier. He told us he travels to buy them from other people and he sells them without quarantine. We were inexperienced but learned a very fast and expensive lesson. If you can buy from the great people of tortoise forum and take their advice. I think the people here are the reason the one is still hanging on. We had and issue with eggs we incubated and hatched and I emailed a member and immediately he directed me to another member from another country and I emailed him and immediately he answered me and was able to give me the help and support I needed to get me through that.


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## MissK_ (Jun 13, 2018)

I definitely know what you’re going through. I just got my baby red footed tortoise on February 2nd and he was a hatchling as well. He just died last Thursday. He also wasn’t eating and i was contantly giving him different types of greens and fruits to see if that would change anything but it didn’t


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## vladimir (Jun 13, 2018)

@MissK_ @StacieJ so sorry for the loss [emoji45]


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## ZEROPILOT (Jun 13, 2018)

StacieJ said:


> Just my experience with Red Foot Ranch. We purchased a total of 10 redfoots from him because he lives close and is very knowledgeable however of those 10 only 2 have lived thankfully we kept them away from our big guys from @ZEROPILOT. 7 were 2 year olds all purchased at the same time from the same container and only one is still living and truthfully she is just hanging on. We spent thousands of dollars at vets on them and they still died and at the same time got an education at the vets office. We did find out after being at the “ranch”and seeing his incubator although impressive it was kind of empty however the next weekend he had about 50 babies and larger ones that weren’t there a few days earlier. He told us he travels to buy them from other people and he sells them without quarantine. We were inexperienced but learned a very fast and expensive lesson. If you can buy from the great people of tortoise forum and take their advice. I think the people here are the reason the one is still hanging on. We had and issue with eggs we incubated and hatched and I emailed a member and immediately he directed me to another member from another country and I emailed him and immediately he answered me and was able to give me the help and support I needed to get me through that.


You're a great tort mom!


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## Hbewsher (Jun 13, 2018)

I am so sorry  I hope you take the time you need and fall in love with another tortoise someday. It would be lucky to have you.

We got a hatchling cherry head from Redfoot ranch about 3 months ago. Luckily, it seems to be thriving. We are already very attached to Todd, but I can only imagine how hard it must be to lose one, even if they haven't been with you long. They are endearing little creatures.

I hope there aren't hidden, underlying issues that could arise later on from coming from a less than ideal breeder. I wouldn't have gone to Redfoot Ranch if I had heard this 4 months ago.


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## Kadels (Jun 13, 2018)

kellya31 said:


> I would not recommend anyone getting a hatchling when they have very little experience. If someone wants a tortoise they would be better off spending extra money for an established baby at least.
> I’m really very sad about it, he lived 29 days.
> He was 2 months old when I got him.



I got 2 baby red-eared sliders several years ago. I bought them from a kiosk in a mall. I had a similar experience and it devastated me. Truth be told, it still bothers me. But I now have a very healthy 6-year-old Sulcata (albeit with only 3 legs), and a 22-month-old human. It may be rough for awhile, but don't be discouraged.


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## Toddrickfl1 (Jun 13, 2018)

Hbewsher said:


> I am so sorry  I hope you take the time you need and fall in love with another tortoise someday. It would be lucky to have you.
> 
> We got a hatchling cherry head from Redfoot ranch about 3 months ago. Luckily, it seems to be thriving. We are already very attached to Todd, but I can only imagine how hard it must be to lose one, even if they haven't been with you long. They are endearing little creatures.
> 
> I hope there aren't hidden, underlying issues that could arise later on from coming from a less than ideal breeder. I wouldn't have gone to Redfoot Ranch if I had heard this 4 months ago.


I must say Todd is an outstanding name!
But I am a little bias....


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## Pealow127 (Jun 14, 2018)

kellya31 said:


> thanks for everyone’s help during the time we had Bobby.
> I have no idea what happened.
> He had a uvb light, a heater emmiter, bought gauges for humidity and heat, monitored them, bought him all kinds of different foods that I got advice from here and scouring the internet.
> Soaked him everyday put him outside (we don’t use pesticides) I just had ordered him mazuri to try anything to stimulate his appetite.
> ...





So very sorry...I just got a hatchling today, hope I have better experience. That is just so sad. There is another baby waiting for you


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## bouaboua (Jun 14, 2018)

So very sorry.......


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## Dianne iin South Florida (Jun 15, 2018)

kellya31 said:


> thanks for everyone’s help during the time we had Bobby.
> I have no idea what happened.
> He had a uvb light, a heater emmiter, bought gauges for humidity and heat, monitored them, bought him all kinds of different foods that I got advice from here and scouring the internet.
> Soaked him everyday put him outside (we don’t use pesticides) I just had ordered him mazuri to try anything to stimulate his appetite.
> ...




I too am new but I think I have it in me to make this work perfectly for my baby. I can understand the neurological signs because the kidneys affect the brain, if the kidneys were sick this would be my tip-off. I am sorry you lost your baby. I'm learning so much more than I thought I knew already through the members of this Forum. More than one opinion makes for a great place for information. Again my condolences.


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## ShirleyTX (Jun 15, 2018)

I am so so sad for you and your family.... Hatchlings are so hard. I know that tortoises do not have emotions, that’s what everyone says. But tortoises are living beings and I truly believe that being in your loving care would be a gentle way for him to cross that rainbow bridge....


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## StacieJ (Jun 15, 2018)

ZEROPILOT said:


> You're a great tort mom!



@ZEROPILOT Thanks I try.. you are a great tort dad and forum member and friend


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## Pearly (Jun 16, 2018)

kellya31 said:


> thanks for everyone’s help during the time we had Bobby.
> I have no idea what happened.
> He had a uvb light, a heater emmiter, bought gauges for humidity and heat, monitored them, bought him all kinds of different foods that I got advice from here and scouring the internet.
> Soaked him everyday put him outside (we don’t use pesticides)  I just had ordered him mazuri to try anything to stimulate his appetite.
> ...



I am so very sorry for your loss. You have done your very best. Sending you electronic hugs[emoji173]️


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