# HELP tortoise foaming in the mouth



## psookdet (Nov 23, 2012)

I live in southern California. Nighttime temps are 40-55 degrees right now. daytime is in the lower 70s. I found a tortoise wandering in my back yard. He's been there for 2 months. I brought him inside when it got cold. I think he's a Greek tortoise? Adult? And male? about 6 inches long. Anyway, his new home is 4 ft by 3 ft with dirt as a substrate. His sleeping place is dirt covered with Timothy hay. He only slept there the first night. All other nightshe sleeps outside or under the lamp. I figured he was cold so I bought a 150w ceramic bulb placed about 24 inches above. The night heat lamp is about 12 inches above. I also have a basking day time bulb and a reptiglo 5.0 bulb. 

Yesterday was 75 degrees outside so I took him out for some sun. He immediately started foaming in the mouth. So I moved him to a shady area and gave him a cool bath. When he looked better, I brought him back inside. But he immediately went back underneath the UV bulb. He didn't eat. At night he stayed under the black light heating bulb.

This morning he foamed again. Under the bulb is about 80 degrees. I gave him another cool bath. What's wrong with him? Am I killing him? Also there are some light colored markings on his shell. Is that normal?

The other end of the enclosure is cooler maybe 70 but he chooses to stay under the lamp. Help please.


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## Yvonne G (Nov 23, 2012)

Hi psookdet, and welcome to the Forum!

I don't know how to tell the greeks and hermann's apart, but your tortoise sort of looks like a hermann's to me. Maybe this type of tortoise comes from a warmer climate and shouldn't be allowed to get cold?????

Foaming sometimes means overheating, sometimes mean poisoning. In my opinion, the tortoise should be set up in a large indoor habitat with stable temperatures. 

Give him a warm forced soak, leaving him in the water for about 15 minutes.

Hopefully some members who know more about the greeks/hermann's will come on and give you some more helpful advice.


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## Tom (Nov 23, 2012)

I agree with Yvonne. Usually foaming at the mouth is from over heating or from ingesting something poisonous.

Another issue might be your UV bulb. Is it the coil type? Those can burn their eyes and blind them. I suppose it is possible that enough eye pain could make him foam at the mouth.

You might have two separate causes going on...


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## furandscales (Nov 23, 2012)

I would say just soak it for like 30 minutes and maybe change its diet?


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## psookdet (Nov 23, 2012)

I'll keep up the twice daily soaking then. The UV bulb is compact (coiled). I will replace it with a mercury one. As for poisoning, well he hadn't eaten anything for 2 days. I feed him spring mix. The temp is around 75-80 so overheating sounds suspicious. Also, if he's too warm why would he continue to stay under the lamp? Maybe it'll be ok after I replace the bulb. Thanks for the replies.

Oh one more thing. Should I continue to try to take him outside? The temp is finally reaching the lower 80s. I can keep him in the shade. Don't want him to foam again..... 

Sorry about the typos. I'm using my phone and it won't let me edit the last line

Just another thought. It's not shell rot is it? I noticed some odd coloring but it just maybe be an old scar. I don't know how old he is, Burr he definitely didn't look like a baby our even juvenile....


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## Tom (Nov 23, 2012)

Indoors, he might have one issue and outdoors another.

Inside, knowing the over all temp is great, but what is the temp directly under the basking lamp? Regardless, this should not have caused him to overheat if he can move away from the heat source and cool off.

Outdoors, many new keepers read that sun is good for tortoises so they go outside and put them in direct sun with no way to get out of it. Or sometimes they say their tortoises kept moving to the shade and they wanted them to get sunshine so they kept putting them back in the sun, or worse put them in a container in the sun. If your outdoor pen has lots of shade available in addition to sunny spots where he can warm up, I would continue using it. Can you post us a pic of each enclosure? Sometimes we can see things in pics that are difficult to explain with words. Just go to tinypic.com, upload anysize photo, and copy/paste the IMG code into your forum post. No memberships, accounts or hassles. Just a free, east to use site.

I'm not seeing an obvious reason why your tortoise would foam at the mouth, so I'd really like to help you figure this out.


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## kimber_lee_314 (Nov 23, 2012)

I have also seen foaming with pneumonia. I would recommend a trip to the vet. I'm not saying he has pneumonia, but if he does, it can get worse quickly. Good luck and keep us updated.


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## psookdet (Nov 23, 2012)

Will definitely look for a vet. Meanwhile all I have with me now are really bad photos but you can see the general layout. 
http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2rms76b&s=6
http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=24xph8x&s=6

No enclosure outdoors. We found where he likes to sleep and built some bricks around it. It's covered with a plastic pond longer at the moment to keep out the rain. Whenever I put him outside, he heads straight for that place. I didn't measure the temp but it's pottery hot and humid inside.

As for indoors, I have cardboard boxes lined with a plastic shower curtain then filled with 10 seed trays, which are filled with first from my back yard. Temp under the lamp is at 80. I turned off the ceramic heater. Temp outside the indoor enclosure is 70.


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