# Help!!! My leopard tortoise's shell is softening!



## Kota62 (Sep 19, 2016)

My tortoise titan's shell is starting to get soft. He is up moving around and eating with no problems, but I can feel the shell thinning. His basking spot is around 100 degrees, replaced his uv just in case. What else should I do? Any advise would be greatly appreciated.


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## cmacusa3 (Sep 19, 2016)

Kota62 said:


> My tortoise titan's shell is starting to get soft. He is up moving around and eating with no problems, but I can feel the shell thinning. His basking spot is around 100 degrees, replaced his uv just in case. What else should I do? Any advise would be greatly appreciated.




What's his diet and do you give calcium supplements? Tell us about the enclosure too.


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## Kota62 (Sep 19, 2016)

Abramsmytankturtle said:


> What's his diet and do you give calcium supplements? Tell us about the enclosure too.


I feed him dark leafy greens and provide calcium dust on his food every other day. Also have a cuttlebone that he won't eat that I scrape onto his food. The enclosure I have him in now is a 24" by 12" and am currently building him a bigger one, but he about 6 months old and still fits in my palm so I figured this would be okay until the bigger one is assembled. He has a shallow water dish that he bathes in and drinks from.


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## cmacusa3 (Sep 19, 2016)

Kota62 said:


> I feed him dark leafy greens and provide calcium dust on his food every other day. Also have a cuttlebone that he won't eat that I scrape onto his food. The enclosure I have him in now is a 24" by 12" and am currently building him a bigger one, but he about 6 months old and still fits in my palm so I figured this would be okay until the bigger one is assembled. He has a shallow water dish that he bathes in and drinks from.


That all sounds good, how was he started? Dry method or hot and humid? Is your enclosure closed chamber? How about lighting, UVB?


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## Kota62 (Sep 19, 2016)

Hot and humid I think... but I'm not 100% and idk what closed chamber means.


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## cmacusa3 (Sep 19, 2016)

Kota62 said:


> Hot and humid I think... but I'm not 100% and idk what closed chamber means.


 Post a picture of the enclosure, does it have a top on it or is it open.


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## Kota62 (Sep 19, 2016)

It has a large slotted metal screen.


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## cmacusa3 (Sep 19, 2016)

http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/how-to-raise-a-healthy-sulcata-or-leopard-version-2-0.78361/

Read this and I will link some others soon


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## cmacusa3 (Sep 19, 2016)

http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/closed-chambers.32333/


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## Kota62 (Sep 19, 2016)

Abramsmytankturtle said:


> http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/closed-chambers.32333/


So from what I'm reading everything is what it should be except I should most likely get and enclosure that's bigger with a fine screen top to help hold in the humidity and heat.


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## cmacusa3 (Sep 19, 2016)

Yes, you want to make sure you have all the right lighting and proper heat and humidity. Follow that care sheet and that will get you going in the right direction. Look up enclosures on the site and get some other ideas. If you use a screen top you will still be losing some heat and humidity. @Tom I'm sure will be here shortly and can give you some other ideas


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## dmmj (Sep 19, 2016)

is the UVB Source on top of the screen?


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## Kota62 (Sep 19, 2016)

Okay cool.... I just don't get how to provide heat and lighting without a screen top of some kind...


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## Kota62 (Sep 19, 2016)

dmmj said:


> is the UVB Source on top of the screen?


Yes, but it's a wide hole metal mesh. Like 3/4" holes.


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## Kota62 (Sep 19, 2016)

So he is up moving around and eating fine still... what would cause his shell to get soft but him not be lethargic?


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## dmmj (Sep 19, 2016)

well he may get lethargic still. They had any of this for as long as possible because in the wild sick animals get eaten first.


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## Kota62 (Sep 19, 2016)

Okay well I'll keep everyone updated if anything changes, but he is still acting normal just the softening shell issue.


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## cmacusa3 (Sep 19, 2016)

What type of lighting are you using?


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## Kota62 (Sep 19, 2016)

A 100 watt heat bulb and a zoo med uv coil light.


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## Tom (Sep 19, 2016)

All of the following is intended to help you improve the situation. I'll just spell it out, rather than beat around the bush and sugar coat it.

You've gotten some old outdated care advice. Here is what is see that needs to be fixed:
1. Your enclosure is too small. I start babies in a minimum of 40 gallons which is 36x18". Bigger is better.
2. The open top is letting all your heat and humidity out into the room. 100 watts is a lot of desiccating heat in such a small area. I use a 65 watt flood in my 4x8' closed chambers. Read the closed chamber thread that Craig linked for you in post number 9.
3. Instead of a screen, you need to hang the lamps from over head. Many ways to accomplish this. Do an internet search for ZooMed Lamp Stands.
4. Your tortoise needs a humid hide and daily soaks.
5. Those coil bulbs can sometimes damage tortoise eyes, and they usually are not an effective UV source. There are many types of long florescent tubes that are more effective and safer.

Questions:
1. Where are you and does your tortoise ever get outside for sunshine?
2. Where did you get this tortoise? How it was started as a baby might be the biggest clue of all to solve the mystery of your softening carapace.


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## Kota62 (Sep 19, 2016)

I am in Las Vegas NV... he gets outside time 1-2 times a week, but will be increasing now. Got him from my local exoctic pet shop not sure how he was brought up but when I bought him he was in a larger setup with a bunch of other little ones. They had big soaking areas and they seemed to be on a moist substrate


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## Tom (Sep 19, 2016)

Kota62 said:


> I am in Las Vegas NV... he gets outside time 1-2 times a week, but will be increasing now. Got him from my local exoctic pet shop not sure how he was brought up but when I bought him he was in a larger setup with a bunch of other little ones. They had big soaking areas and they seemed to be on a moist substrate



I'm going to post this because its a common thing with leopards and sulcatas. There is no way for me to know if this thread applies to your baby or not, so I'm just going to give you the info and let you decide where you want to go from here:
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/hatchling-failure-syndrome.23493/

See also #1 on this thread:
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/beginner-mistakes.45180/

And this is how your baby should have been started:
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/how-to-incubate-eggs-and-start-hatchlings.124266/


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## Kota62 (Sep 19, 2016)

Thank you for all of the information... I'm going to begin building him a closed cage tomorrow and look into getting other uv light sources. I am hoping that since he is still active it has something to do with the uv and is not the failed hatching syndrome like you mentioned. Thank you all for the quick and caring responses. I will keep you all updated on his progress.


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## Fredkas (Sep 19, 2016)

Remember to update it.
It is a mystery for me how can this happens to you.


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## Gillian M (Sep 20, 2016)

A very warm welcome to the forum!

Please post pictures of your tort as well as his enclosure.


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## sue white (Sep 30, 2016)

To hang lamps I used one of those wheel around clothes rack and small chain to hang the fixtures with That way I can easily change the height of the lights


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## surfergirl (Sep 30, 2016)

you can build a rack above the enclosure out of pvc pipe and hang you lights off that. then you can cover the top of the rack with plastic to keep the humidity in. I use a florescent long tube fixture for uvb attached to the longest side of the tub wall under the screens. As a dbl safety feature for the basking heat lamp and the heat emitter for cool nights, I put screens under those. you could secure the fixtures to the rack and completely remove screens though if using a uvb mecury bulb heat /basking lamp where uvb will be blocked from absorption by the tort. I am just over doing it with the screens.


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## sue white (Oct 2, 2016)

Nice idea! Looks more compact then the racks which would be great.


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## Average-Joe_15 (Oct 7, 2016)

I think everybody could provide more help if you gave us a few nice clear photos of your terrarium set up; a broad view of the whole home. From there we can better provide more precise advice and form constructive criticism~


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