# 130-gal Closed-Top Tank Progression Thread



## StudentoftheReptile (May 15, 2012)

I recently adopted another redfoot (Thanks, jrcrist!), so since I made the decision that my juvenile sulcata can remain outside more or less permanently now, I am going to work towards re-doing my 130-gallon tank as larger accommodations for both of my juvenile redfoots.

This was the previous set-up for Kobe the sulcata. Mainly just soil and mulch directly on the tank's bottom with lights above an open-top.






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Some of you may have remembered previous threads of mine where I talked about constructing a new closed top for this tank, and I still definitely plan on doing that. I was working on a really cool 3-D model mock-up of what I was envisioning, but I am lazy and I can draw a lot faster than I can create 3-D models in Maya. Here is a rough idea of what I plan to do. I need to return the porcelain light socket I purchased and exchange it for something for outdoor lighting because someone suggested it would last longer and hold up to high humidity better.





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Right now though, I plan on working from the ground up for now, because I want to get the little guys moved over to more spacious living conditions as soon as possible because the tub is now a little crowded. Although my tank isn't quite as large, I am going for what Chris has illustrated out so well in this thread, with the heat rope underneath the substrate.

So this is what I got so far. An empty tank with tarp material on the bottom. 





I believe my grandpa has some hardware cloth in his carport somewhere, so I'll be rummaging around there to look for it sometime this week. Waiting for some extra money to pop up so I can order the heat rope from Big Apple and then I'll be able to get things rollin'.


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## ascott (May 15, 2012)

Nice....and look forward to pics once it is all together...


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## terryo (May 15, 2012)

That's going to be fantastic when you're finished. What kind of tank is that? Is it a breeder tank. I never saw a 130 gal square like that. I love it.


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## StudentoftheReptile (May 15, 2012)

terryo said:


> What kind of tank is that? Is it a breeder tank. I never saw a 130 gal square like that. I love it.



It's certainly not a standard size. It was probably a custom tank built specifically as a fish aquarium; hence the overflow box on the side (see my third photo...its covered up with stickers!). At the bottom of that box are two drilled holes that would connect piping to a sump below the aquarium.

Anyway, a friend of mine gave me this tank 4-5 years ago for free. Aside from that pesky overflow box, it is a GREAT size for medium-sized reptiles. Although I've more or less grown past using glass tanks for herps, I'm never getting rid of it, as I'm sure I'll always find a use for it!

Dimensions are 42" long x 36" wide x 20" high (I think...not sure on the height, but its not as important to me as the other two).


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## Jacob (May 15, 2012)

Very Nice, I like you layout Plans.
Did you draw it by hand on the computer?


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## StudentoftheReptile (May 15, 2012)

Jacob said:


> Very Nice, I like you layout Plans.
> Did you draw it by hand on the computer?



I doodled it hastily by hand a couple nights ago, and then just added some color in Photoshop.


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## StudentoftheReptile (May 19, 2012)

Step #2:

I got a roll of this stuff from my grandpa. For the life of me, I cannot recall the term for it, but people use it wrap around plants and gardens as a barrier for pest animals. Made out of plastic. It isn't hardware cloth, but I think it'll work just fine for my purposes.

Cut out an appropriately-sized piece and placed in it the bottom, and went ahead and put the base rocks in the corners to support the tarp lining.






Next week, I'll be ordering the heat rope!


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## ascott (May 19, 2012)

I am curious ...is there a reason you are lining a glass tank with the liner????


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## StudentoftheReptile (May 19, 2012)

It has cracks on the bottom. Plus, in the event of replacing the substrate, it will be easier to just remove the plastic wire with the heat cable, then take out the liner...as opposed to scooping it all out of the tank directly.


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## GeoTerraTestudo (May 20, 2012)

Looks great. Nice diagram, too. Although, for my enclosures, I hang my CHEs from ZooMed armatures, which have an adjustable height. I think this is an important feature, because it allows me to raise or lower the CHE to achieve the right basking spot temperature. It also allows me to keep the enclosure open so air can circulate freely.


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## Tom (May 20, 2012)

Why not cut the silicone with a razor and remove the overflow? You could then patch the holes with some silicone and either glass or rigid plastic sheeting. While you are at it, you could patch the cracks on the bottom and keep them from breaking further.

I love the idea of hinges on the top and mounted fixtures.

GTT, air circulation is the enemy in a case like this. He's trying to create a warm humid stable environment and air circulation will circulate the warmed humidified air right out into the room and replace it with cooler dry air from the room. And given the Student's level of expertise with reptiles, I'm sure he'll be controlling temps, by either adjusting the wattage of his bulbs, using a thermostat, or using a rheostat.


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## StudentoftheReptile (May 21, 2012)

Tom said:


> Why not cut the silicone with a razor and remove the overflow? You could then patch the holes with some silicone and either glass or rigid plastic sheeting. While you are at it, you could patch the cracks on the bottom and keep them from breaking further.



I actually have tried to slice out that overflow box. My efforts barely made a dent in the problem, and I just decided it wasn't worth the time and energy.

I could patch the cracks, but I already stated my reasons for having the tarp in there, so again, the time/energy put forth into patching the cracks and having the substrate directly on the glass bottom isn't worth the advantages of the tarp.



> GTT, air circulation is the enemy in a case like this. He's trying to create a warm humid stable environment and air circulation will circulate the warmed humidified air right out into the room and replace it with cooler dry air from the room. And given the Student's level of expertise with reptiles, I'm sure he'll be controlling temps, by either adjusting the wattage of his bulbs, using a thermostat, or using a rheostat.



Yeah pretty much.  And in response to GTT, constructing this door on my own, heck, I can always install my own little fan to add some circulation if I feel its needed. But Tom is right, the whole purpose is to keep all that warm, moist air IN the enclosure!


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## StudentoftheReptile (May 29, 2012)

UPDATES! Last week, my heat cable and rheostat came in so Saturday I was finally able to resume this little project.

I took the heat cable and just ran it through the hardware cloth stuff to keep it in place. I also placed the huts where I wanted them.









Next, I started adding the cypress mulch on top. [sorry for the sideways image. The original wasn't that way. I don't know why Photobucket uploaded it like that..grrr]





Then, I placed a generous layer of coconut coir on top of the cypress.





Now for the really fun part! Adding the decorations and stuff!













I originally was going to just leave the Mercury Vapor Bulb on there (see photos above), but I decided it was a little too bright, and I didn't have a way to add an extra lamp for the CHE at night, so I took off the MVB and just put in the tube florescent UVB and the CHE from their old enclosure. This way I can just leave the CHE on 24/7 to make sure they don't get too cold at night.













I still haven't started building the custom top, but I'm happy I've gotten it to a point where I could finally move them into it. I got a beach towel covering most of it (don't worry, it's not close to that heat lamp), and I'm pretty satisfied with the temps and humidity so far.

Basking temps (directly under CHE): 120'F
Ambient Daytime Temp: 80-82'F
Ambient Nighttime Temp: 79-80'F
Coolest area: 75-77'F

The heat cable keeps the substrate at about 77-80'F.


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## Tropical Torts (May 29, 2012)

Tht looks really good! Glad the little fellow has a great home.


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## Carlos83 (Jun 24, 2012)

wow good job..where di you get that heat cable if you dont mind ???


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## StudentoftheReptile (Jun 24, 2012)

Big Apple Herpetological Supply. I think I put the link to it somewhere...


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## pam (Jun 24, 2012)

Looks Awesome


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## KimandKarasi (Jun 24, 2012)

Very nicely done!! I was just curious, what size rope are you using? You convinced me to get my own! Lol, substrate temps were the one thing I was really having trouble with since I would always spray water to keep it humid (even if I used warm water it would always go cold within five minutes..) also, does it help keep the water bowl warm?


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## StudentoftheReptile (Jun 24, 2012)

KimandKarasi said:


> Very nicely done!! I was just curious, what size rope are you using? You convinced me to get my own! Lol, substrate temps were the one thing I was really having trouble with since I would always spray water to keep it humid (even if I used warm water it would always go cold within five minutes..) also, does it help keep the water bowl warm?



I used the 18 ft rope, They also sell it in a 12 ft. and 27 ft as well. - http://www.bigappleherp.com/Big-Apple-Flexible-Heat-Ropes


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## ALDABRAMAN (Jun 24, 2012)

Nice!


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## mightymizz (Aug 1, 2012)

Question regarding the heat ropes. I would assume that they dont get hot enough to start buring the mulch or whatever substrate you use? I have been using almost entirely Sphagnum Moss and get it somewhat damp and using a CHE to warm that part of the enclosure, which will also heat the moss helping raise the humidity. I use a timer on my CHE to help it turn on and off throughout the day which helps keep the warm part of the enclosure in the high 80degree range. Oh, i also have redfoots.

I also figured that if the torts want to cool down, they can burrow into the moss, or go to the cooler side of the enclosure.

Do you also use a thermostat on these ropes?

Thanks for sharing!


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## tortadise (Aug 1, 2012)

I would utilize the overflow area. If it doesnt have cracks or a hole in the bottom that cannot be patched. I would keep it full of water and put a aquarium heater in it to boost the humidity. Looks awesome.


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## StudentoftheReptile (Aug 1, 2012)

mightymizz said:


> Do you also use a thermostat on these ropes?



Yes I do. The ZooMed RheoStat: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0002AQD0Y/?tag=exoticpetnetw-20




tortadise said:


> I would utilize the overflow area. If it doesnt have cracks or a hole in the bottom that cannot be patched. I would keep it full of water and put a aquarium heater in it to boost the humidity. Looks awesome.



It does have two holes drilled on the bottom of that overflow box. It has a lot of calcium residue inside that is a PAIN to chip off, which is a major reason I haven't used it (laziness).

With the heat ropes underneath the substrate, everything works well enough, although I have thought about rigging up a humidifier to connect into it. I may not need it though, when I ever get around to building the top to the tank.


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## mightymizz (Aug 1, 2012)

So, with these heat ropes, do they not get hot enough to possibly catch fire to different substrates since they are submerged in them?

I know with my CHE if anything touches that it would most likely be able to burn, or at least smolder things.


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## StudentoftheReptile (Aug 1, 2012)

With that rheostat (or any thermostat, I imagine), they stay "warm" at best. I'm not trying to create a basking spot of 100+ degrees or anything; I'm just using them to keep the substrate from getting cold and damp.

Remember that in nature, the ground (and burrows especially) doesn't really fluctuate in temperate day in and day out. For similar discussions, see this thread: http://www.tortoiseforum.org/Thread-New-Research-on-Basking-Lamps-from-TT#axzz22J7O6onU


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## lynnedit (Aug 1, 2012)

Those Big Apple heat ropes are very safe when used with a thermometer. Their probe to measure the temp is embedded right with them. They are also completely waterproof, not just water resistant like some of the others.

Several other Redfoot owners have used them very successfully under substrate, zip tied to a hardware or plastic grid. It is a wonderful way to keep the humidity up.


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## mightymizz (Aug 2, 2012)

What do most people do with any extra length of rope, or just the part that is exposed plugging it into an outlet? Just have a hot cord coming out of the enclosure?

I am really starting to like this heat rope idea as a way to warm up the substrate.


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## EspenK (Sep 21, 2012)

Is the heat rope still used for reptiles in general, and especially for tortoises? The only heat source any animal will ever encounter, is the sun. Most species bury themselves down to cool off. If it is hot in the substrate too, they have no were to go. Also the plastron(in some species) will compensate for the unnatural heat, and build up trying to make sure the intestines do not get injured. For the understanding of the idea( and for those of you who understand german), chech out Wolfgang Wegehaupt "NatÃ¼rliche Haltung und Zucht der Griechischen LandschildkrÃ¶te"


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## StudentoftheReptile (Sep 21, 2012)

Good points, Espen.

Just FYI, the heat rope doesn't cover the entire bottom of my enclosure. The areas where the hide boxes are do not have any belly, and my babies often go in there to cool off.


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## EspenK (Sep 24, 2012)

StudentoftheReptile said:


> Good points, Espen.
> 
> Just FYI, the heat rope doesn't cover the entire bottom of my enclosure. The areas where the hide boxes are do not have any belly, and my babies often go in there to cool off.



Is the heat rope just to amp the temp, or the humidity too? I guess a spot would do much the same? Just scared of damaging the torts


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## StudentoftheReptile (Sep 25, 2012)

EspenK said:


> StudentoftheReptile said:
> 
> 
> > Good points, Espen.
> ...



Both. Most hatchling tortoise species spend the first several months of their life in and around the nesting site/burrow. Although the general environment does fluctuate more, this micro-habitat actually does not vary that much. Baby redfoot tortoises do not experience cold, drafty nights in the mid 60s (F), as I and many Americans keep their household at night. I don't want to subject my young tortoises to that, so providing some supplemental belly heat keeps that substrates from getting too cold and/or too damp, because we all know too cold + damp = respiratory issues. Yes, they do have a warm basking area provided by the ceramic heat emitter, but you see how large this enclosure is (36"x42"). The cool side can still get a little too cool for my liking (below 75'F). With these waterproof heat cables, I can periodically add water straight into the substrate. The cables heat the water, keeping the substrate humid in addition to being warm. So even on the coolest side of the enclosure, those little tortoise bellies don't get below 75'F.

That is why I use this method. I actually got the idea from another keeper. It has worked quite well for my animals and I.


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## Carlos83 (Sep 25, 2012)

StudentoftheReptile said:


> EspenK said:
> 
> 
> > StudentoftheReptile said:
> ...


Im actually do the same thing with my heat ropes works really good for my sulcata enclosure . .Great job on that one man


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