# Indoor enclosure, all input welcome



## Odin's Gma (Dec 21, 2014)

Being Minnesotans, an indoor enclosure is obviously a must for several months of the year. Right now Odin is just a little fellow (roughly palm sized) and this is his first permanent indoor winter home so it would be great to get tips from more seasoned owners who have built indoor enclosures.
It is 4'x2' with a hanging UVA/UVB & nighttime heat emitter over the loft area. 3 of the substrate inserts are filled with a mix of slightly damp coconut coir/ desert sand mix/a bit of calci sand, and the 4th is two interchangeable gardens. One almost solely grass and the second a little garden of eden with grass, aloe, spider plants, carrot (for the greens) and seeded with marigold, clover and a few others that are escaping me at the moment. (We also have many houseplants, such as hibiscus, geraniums. christmas cactus etc that he adores decimating.)
The ramp is @9" wide x 2' long leading up the the basking area with is only about 6 inches above the substrate so its a nice low grade (with speeds bumps!) With a concrete igloo that we mist to maintain some humidity up there. 
Any questions or input would be appreciated. I want this funny little guy to be happy and healthy for a very long time!


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## Jodie (Dec 21, 2014)

I like the setup. The removable plant areas are great. I can't see him really good. He is a Sulcata right? What is your humidity? You may need to figure out a way to cover this. Building a frame and covering with plastic is easy, affordable and very effective. The sand is also an issue. It will not hold moisture for humidity and can cause impactation. The ramp and loft area is a great idea. I love the extra floor space for exploring. You might need to put up a railing though to prevent accidents. I think you have a really nice start for him.


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## Odin's Gma (Dec 21, 2014)

Thanks, I hope so!
I should have specified, the "sand" is actually a ground walnut shell mix for reptiles and it is only about 30-40% of the substrate mix and the calci sand is maybe 5-10% so it is predominantly coconut coir.
As far as humidity, it varies in different parts of the enclosure. Underneath the basking area (which is is favorite hiding spot) it runs about 70-80%, the rest stays lower, closer to 40-50%. I have been thinking about ways to cover it that don't change the light dispersion but haven't come up with anything yet, and we have also discussed a railing, but he is such a funny little guy, he is very cautious around edges and is very careful so we are watching and waiting to see if it will be necessary. I know this will likely only be a good enclosure for a couple of years tops because of the size.


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## Jodie (Dec 21, 2014)

Yes he will grow ridiculously quick. I would not use sand at all, but hopefully it will be okay. I am not at all sure about the walnut. I have a table that we built and later had to cover. This is how we raised our humidity. I easily maintain 80% humidity and over 80 F at all times. My Leopards are growing smooth and healthy. Sulcatas need the same conditions.


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## kdub (Dec 21, 2014)

I like his rock that says The Great Odin - very cute! And the grassy area looks like fun for exploring! Very lovely setup!


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## Maro2Bear (Dec 21, 2014)

Nice set up. I really like the idea of insertable/removable grass pads. Good way to have a few sprouting while one or two are in the container. You might want to consider a roof to maintain both heat and humidity levels.

Two observations:

1. you might want to make the hide more inviting by adding in some nice sphagnum moss, or spanish moss, etc. looks a bit barren now.
2. You might want to have a barrier of some sort on level number two so that he doesnt tumble off.


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## Odin's Gma (Dec 21, 2014)

Since taking the pics my son did put some hay in the cave, but I like the idea of moss better, thanks! And the fence has been a topic of discussion since we built the enclosure last weekend. (his prior enclosure was much smaller, plastic, and only intended as a nursery/night box as we brought him outside as much as possible when the weather permitted). My son and I are still arguing the construction and aesthetics of it.


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## leigti (Dec 21, 2014)

Until you can figure out a way to cover it, mist the entire enclosure often including the plants. Also add moist moss in the igloo and around the enclosure. is there a cuttlebone in there? If not I would put one in, he may not touch it for a long time and then One day eat it all up. I like the exchangeable trays idea. I also would not use any sand, you can add more coir to the mixture.


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## Odin's Gma (Dec 21, 2014)

The big greenish thing that looks like a bar of soap is a cuttlebone/calcium block and there is another, smaller one up on the 2nd level, and yes, we mist it several times a day and water each of the trays daily also. 
Thank you all for all the input so far! This is incredibly helpful!

edit to add*
We also soak him daily (he loves it!) and there is a clay water dish sunk in the substrate where he can soak himself (or just poop )


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## Yvonne G (Dec 21, 2014)

If you want your plants to grow, you'll have to get some light down at that end too. Plants require a very bright light to grow well indoors. Do you have a UVB light for the tortoise? And is your temperature warm enough down at the bottom end?


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## Odin's Gma (Dec 21, 2014)

Right now we are switching the planting boxes out every few days, either leaving them on the side by the light, or setting them in front of our south facing deck door. The "cold side" maintains about 75 degrees, and yes, the light is UVA/UVB.


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## Yellow Turtle01 (Dec 21, 2014)

Odin's Gma said:


> Right now we are switching the planting boxes out every few days, either leaving them on the side by the light, or setting them in front of our south facing deck door. The "cold side" maintains about 75 degrees, and yes, the light is UVA/UVB.


Even for a cooler side, 75 is bit chilly. How hot is the basking spot?
Nice enclosure! I like the grassy spot. I do agree about the walnut, though


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## Odin's Gma (Dec 25, 2014)

Busted! The little fella already figured out how to scale his cave!


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## leigti (Dec 25, 2014)

That's very cute. But I guess I'm a little paranoid but I would be worried about how he gets down from there. i'm afraid he might roll down and then off the cliff. you also don't want him climbing over the wall. You can pile up substrate on both sides to make that mountain more into a hill. That will be safer. they are pretty tough but you don't want to risk injury from falling on hard objects or from a high distance.


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## leopard777 (Dec 25, 2014)

hmmm , can he really climb that high


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## leigti (Dec 25, 2014)

leopard777 said:


> hmmm , can he really climb that high


He probably could if he braced himself against the wall and then pushed up with his legs. of course my Russian tortoise would just levitate up there.


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## Odin's Gma (Jan 17, 2015)

My computer crapped out on me but I am finally back online! YAY!
Yes, he uses the wall to get up there. We have tried substrate to to soften any falls but he yanks it out and drags it all over the enclosure, we have also tried various configurations of rocks to block off access, it only slows him down. He is such a stubborn little bugger!
It's still a work in progress. :/


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## Odin's Gma (Jan 20, 2015)

Enclosure update. We have added a plexi cover over 2/3rds of his home (you can see the edge just on the inside of the 2nd planting insert) and it is definitely keeping the humidity up and cutting down on the watering frequency of the removable planting and wandering areas. Being the grass destroyer that he is we have started more planting beds. We started with 2, one grass, one grass and plants. Now we have 2 grass and greens, one grass and plants, one without plants and I have ordered a new mix of clover and chicory along with some dandelion seeds and picked up some additional vegetable seeds locally for more variety (spinach, radish, carrot) to start another one (or two, or 10???)
I am also working on rooting cuttings of my big indoor hibiscus (currently nearly 5 feet tall, but with this guy around that won't last long!) and am starting new spider plants and aloe nearly weekly off of my my big (and very fertile) parent plants. We have tucked wads of sphagnum moss under the raised area and ramp and inside and around the igloo (which he promptly drags wherever he pleases, he is quite the little redecorator!) and soak or spray it daily along with watering the beds.
He may not quite be ready to take over the world, but he is certainly poised to take over the house! 
This is his happy face.


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## Odin's Gma (Jan 20, 2015)

After this mornings photos I cleaned up his house and put all new, moist sphagnum moss inside of his igloo all around the inner perimeter. As soon as he went in he promptly started redecorating and pushed all the moss in front of the opening and took a nap. He is such a funny little dude.


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## pfara (Jan 20, 2015)

Woohoo! Glad to see another person going nuts with indoor growing. I, too, am guilty of having backups of backup plants stockpiled all over the house 

Just remember: it's not an unhealthy obsession.. it's the brimful of love for one's tortoise.


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## bouaboua (Jan 20, 2015)

Look all that snow outside. I think you build a very nice indoor enclosure and indoor garden. Very nice!!


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## leigti (Jan 20, 2015)

I put spagnum Moss in my Russian tortoise enclosure , in the hides, and she hates it. She will not use any hide that has the moss in it. unless of course she has dug it all out first. so I guess I won't bother putting any more in.


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## Jodie (Jan 21, 2015)

Very cute and sounds like great activity levels. Your enclosure looks nice.


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## Odin's Gma (Jan 24, 2015)

I am considering the addition of heat mats (the kind for seedlings) underneath the planting boxes to increase the heat and humidity. I have seen here that some have experience with them and seem pleased. Any suggestions on brand, size etc.?


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## Odin's Gma (Jan 25, 2015)

With the addition of the plexiglass cover Odin's enclosure is now maintaining between 75 and 80% humidity and between 75-80 degrees in the plant side, similar conditions underneath the basking area, slightly cooler and drier in his favorite digging area (underneath the ramp) between 70-75, and inside his hide with moist moss, the humidity is nearly 90% with temps in the low to mid 90's with the basking light on. I haven't temped it during the night with the heat coil on, but it must be pretty comfy for him because that is where he sleeps all night. I think we are getting somewhere here!
Today he is sprawled out on top on the sphagnum moss wall that he likes to push into the doorway, half in and half out of his hide, just showing off his cute little booty.
I also included a pic of his roommate, Wolverine the gecko, just chillin' upside down.


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## Yvonne G (Jan 25, 2015)

I would worry about him sitting too much under those lights. He's awfully close to them. They could burn the new growth.


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## Odin's Gma (Jan 25, 2015)

The photo angle is a little deceiving, The bottom of the light cans are slightly over a foot above the basking area.


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## Evy (Jan 25, 2015)

Hi, look great. I'll put a flat rock under the heating lamp. Torts live to warm up they bellies that way.


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## Odin's Gma (Jan 25, 2015)

Evy said:


> Hi, look great. I'll put a flat rock under the heating lamp. Torts live to warm up they bellies that way.


We had one up there for quite a while but he avoided it so we put it underneath the raised platform. He still doesn't care for it. 

And another rare sunny winter day, so another walk in "the park". Inspecting and sampling his budding garden beds.


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## leigti (Jan 25, 2015)

My Russian tortoise never liked the slate or flat rock put under his basking lamp. So I moved it also.


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## Odin's Gma (Feb 1, 2015)

The rotating gardens are doing very well! As soon as he tramples / eats one, we switch it out and have so far more than kept up with his bottomless appetite, but hibiscus is still his favorite. The geranium is finally rebounding after being brought indoors for the winter and my hibiscus cutting are finally developing callus, which means next steps, roots! AND our big hibiscus is starting to develop buds again, so soon he will get his favorite treat, a flower bigger than he is!
Currently on the sprouting menu, grass, carrot, marigold, dandelion, clover, chicory, radish, spinach, trefoil and, as always, loads of aloe and spiderplant babies. Just look at that sweet, happy face!


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## Gennifer11 (Feb 2, 2015)

I'm from minnesota too! Yay! Currently stationed in VA though, I can't imagine bringing my tort back home always trying to keep the humidity up and trying to make sure he gets sun. Good job!


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## Odin's Gma (Feb 3, 2015)

Even though he is indoors right now we make sure he gets real sun at least a couple times a week thanks to our south facing deck doors (it gets hot back there!) That is where we keep his growing gardens and he spends several hours a week roaming them in the sun whenever it makes an appearance. As he gets bigger it will be more of a challenge, but right now it's a piece of cake!


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## Odin's Gma (Feb 7, 2015)

Finally got an infrared thermometer to get more accurate temp readings. Cold side 86-89 depending on location, 75-80 depending on location underneath the raised basking area and ramp, basking area 107, hide 103. Also added a couple of "permanent" plants. 
The first stalk of aloe was torn off the plant in under 10 minutes.


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## Odin's Gma (Feb 14, 2015)

New additions to the garden seed mix, arugula, cress, endive, radicchio, and a few lettuces, Salad bowl, oakleaf and red salad bowl, also a pack of microgreens, that include beets, pak choi, Kohlrabi, broccoli di ciccio and more radish. We also purchased some mustard greens, which he loved! (first produce I have purchased for him, and it was for fun not necessity) and we also bought an acorn squash and gave him a small slice to try. Completely ignored it and continued decimating his baby greens.
This is the face of the most spoiled tortoise in all of the land.


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## taza (Feb 15, 2015)

He sure is a cutie!


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## Kenzi W (Feb 16, 2015)

Where did you get your seeds and those tubs? I love it!


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## Odin's Gma (Feb 16, 2015)

I got the seed trays and some of the seeds on Amazon (the dandelions and the clover / trefoil mix). The rest of the seeds I have picked up locally.


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## Kenzi W (Feb 16, 2015)

Ok thanks! I was wondering because I went to Lowes and I haven't seen anything like what you got!


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## Odin's Gma (Feb 19, 2015)

A tortoise story

Hey Odin! Do you want to check out how your new gardens are coming along?
*grumble*


Hmm. This looks promising....


Ooh! Adventure!


So....close.....


Um, no. that is a little scary.


Wait, one more try! I think I can, I think I can!!!!!


Ugh! Gma is so mean! she never lets me have any fun!


Fine, If I can't slide out of the garden, YOU can't take pictures!


Whatev. I wanted to go to bed anyway. HMPH!


Quit taking pictures!


UGH! I hate this family!


GO AWAY GMA!!!!!


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## Kenzi W (Feb 19, 2015)

Haha that's adorable. I'm so jealous!


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## Odin's Gma (Feb 19, 2015)

Thank you! I just can't get enough of this little guy, he is so funny! And he really does love sliding out of the gardens, but he will only do it if he can get the angle just right and when we stop him and relocate him he really seems to pout.


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## Kenzi W (Feb 19, 2015)

Haha! He is a cutie.


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## TSchadel (Jul 18, 2015)

Jodie said:


> Yes he will grow ridiculously quick. I would not use sand at all, but hopefully it will be okay. I am not at all sure about the walnut. I have a table that we built and later had to cover. This is how we raised our humidity. I easily maintain 80% humidity and over 80 F at all times. My Leopards are growing smooth and healthy. Sulcatas need the same conditions.
> View attachment 110904


Jodie - this is something I'm looking to do for my table. Do you have lights in there? I can't quite see. I posted a picture of my table when I first started on the ABSOKUTELY WONDERFUL forum!. I'm thinking of plastic like you have in your picture. Can you post some close ups so I can get a better view? Thanks


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## Jodie (Jul 18, 2015)

TSchadel said:


> Jodie - this is something I'm looking to do for my table. Do you have lights in there? I can't quite see. I posted a picture of my table when I first started on the ABSOKUTELY WONDERFUL forum!. I'm thinking of plastic like you have in your picture. Can you post some close ups so I can get a better view? Thanks


Hope these help. The frame has cross beams that lights hang from. The one on the left was the 1st one. It is all wood. The one on the right we recently added. We had a broken yard tent canopy thing. We used the pieces from the frame to build it


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## TSchadel (Jul 19, 2015)

Jodie said:


> Hope these help. The frame has cross beams that lights hang from. The one on the left was the 1st one. It is all wood. The one on the right we recently added. We had a broken yard tent canopy thing. We used the pieces from the frame to build it


These are great and give me some ideas. Unfortunately my table does not have high enough sides for Irwin to have a double decker - so that will be a future project. Are those spider plants in there? I've been thinking of redecorating to include plants.
Here is his table currently - any thought, observations, do's/dont's?


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## Odin's Gma (Jul 19, 2015)

TSchadel said:


> These are great and give me some ideas. Unfortunately my table does not have high enough sides for Irwin to have a double decker - so that will be a future project. Are those spider plants in there? I've been thinking of redecorating to include plants.
> Here is his table currently - any thought, observations, do's/dont's?


Plants, definitely. Spider plant is a good one, safe to eat and good for cover. As much as they like their hides, plants give additional hiding spots and they also hold more humidity in the enclosure. Grass and clover seed are cheap, quick to sprout and will encourage natural grazing.


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## TSchadel (Jul 19, 2015)

Odin's Gma said:


> Plants, definitely. Spider plant is a good one, safe to eat and good for cover. As much as they like their hides, plants give additional hiding spots and they also hold more humidity in the enclosure. Grass and clover seed are cheap, quick to sprout and will encourage natural grazing.


Thanks Gma!!! I was just thinking about you! Irwin is not very happy with me cause I keep messin with his table and rearranging. I remembered what you said about Odin being grouchy. Irwin spent all sat night in the corner where his hut used to be - I moved it closer to the lights. He's gonna be really mad cause I'm going to try to fashion a larger hiding hut with Spanish moss.... And then make an enclosure for the whole darn table, he's gonna be in a tizzy for sure! But it's all out of love


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## Odin's Gma (Jul 19, 2015)

TSchadel said:


> Thanks Gma!!! I was just thinking about you! Irwin is not very happy with me cause I keep messin with his table and rearranging. I remembered what you said about Odin being grouchy. Irwin spent all sat night in the corner where his hut used to be - I moved it closer to the lights. He's gonna be really mad cause I'm going to try to fashion a larger hiding hut with Spanish moss.... And then make an enclosure for the whole darn table, he's gonna be in a tizzy for sure! But it's all out of love



Odin is going to be in a mood today too! His enclosure needs a good cleaning and that always sets him off. "Why are you taking out all of my tort turds? I was saving those!"


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## Jodie (Jul 19, 2015)

TSchadel said:


> These are great and give me some ideas. Unfortunately my table does not have high enough sides for Irwin to have a double decker - so that will be a future project. Are those spider plants in there? I've been thinking of redecorating to include plants.
> Here is his table currently - any thought, observations, do's/dont's?
> View attachment 139806
> View attachment 139807
> ...


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## TSchadel (Jul 19, 2015)

Primitive but effective - Irwin's humidity levels are climbing!!!


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