# Rescued leopard tortoise - need help.



## wildheart (Jan 13, 2010)

I am sorry I posted this in the intro as well. After thinking I realized that it most probable was not the best place to post to get an urgent answer.


I am Afrikaans, from South Africa and have a house next to the Kruger National Park and another house 5 hours away in Johannesburg. We have an abundance of wild tortoises etc. on our property at Kruger and I am only familiar with the wild kind.

My problem is that a leopard tortoise was dropped off at my home in Johannesburg yesterday. Johannesburg is no place for a tortoise because there is a huge difference in the climate and we've been having a lot of rain. Apparently he was found walking in the street, thank God he wasnt eaten by the Africans or driven over! The people that found him placed him in their yard and left him permanently outside since the 28th of November 09. He only ate grass and old lettuce during this time. We've been having a cold summer in Johannesburg with temperatures only reaching 27C and 15C at night (80 - 59). It also has been raining heavily every day for about an hour and this poor tortoise were outside with no shelter etc.!

They brought him to me, not in a box, but by holding him in the air and he was pooping and weeing everywhere. I almost had a heart attack - how on earth can you carry a tortoise or any kind of animal like that! He must have been so afraid thinking that a Martial eagle got hold of him, my heart broke!

I've placed him on top of a blanked in a huge low cut box - (he can see over the edge) under a basking light. He did peak out a couple of times but did not move much and he slept like that last night. It is rainy today so he cant go outside. I fed him the same food as my iguana except that I added grass and no veggies or fruit because he does not get that in his natural environment. After heating up he started walking all over the house and pooped once again and weed twice. Is that normal? He is definitely extremely stressed so I did not give him an over all inspection yet.

I will take photos of him tonight and try and weigh him. I want to know his approximate age and what sex he is.

If he is not too old and too used to captivity then I would like to release him at my other house. If I do that then it would be exactly the same as being back in the wild, there are no gardens etc. just bushveld. There is also all the natural predators ect. and the correct climate and food.

Will it be the right thing to do to release him? If he is big enough then his only thread would be elephants and buffalo on land and there are just a few types of eagles that prey on big tortoises. Ag, I dont know what to do!

He cant free-roam in my garden because in the front we have dogs, at the back we have a swimming pool and on the side is my iguana jungle. Will he fall into the pool or are they clever enough to stay away from lots of water?

Is it normal that he breathes heavily? He is not wet around the nose but it seems like he is battling to breath. I am afraid that he might have got sick from sleeping outside and being in the rain. How do they breath normally?

The only vet that can help me will be back in Feb, he is on holiday. Sad

I will try and record his breathing as well so you can tell me if it is urgent or just my nerves.

Any suggestions of what I can do to make him more comfortable? Should I give him a low water bath because he is very dirty? Can I release him if he is healthy?


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## Greg T (Jan 13, 2010)

It sounds good that someone brought him to you who knows about torts. We need to know a good size and weight for him and a picture if possible. Since he has pooped and peed, that means he appears to be getting sufficient food and water, which is good. You can continue to feed him like you are now. I imagine he has been through a lot and is pretty stressed, so it may take a little while to relax and come out in your house. The heavy breathing you hear could be from fear instead of sickness. Maybe someone else with more experience in illnesses can help with that. You can put him in a bowl or bathtub with a low level of luke-warm water and let him soak and drink for 10-15 minutes or so. But be ready because that will also make him poop/pee again. You can also clean his shell while he's in there.

As for letting it go, many will say not to unless you know it was wild caught already. My opinion is for you to either keep it if possible, find a suitable owner who knows torts, or release it if you have no better option. If it is large, it will probably be okay. 

You have probably already saved its life from what it sounds like. Thank you for that.  Keep us up to date on how it is going.


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## egyptiandan (Jan 13, 2010)

Welcome to the forum 

If the tortoise is healthy, than yes you can release him near the park.  I would though set-up a temporary pen to get him used to the area. Feed him with the local plants and grasses and in a month or so you can let him go, if all goes well.

Danny


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## Jacqui (Jan 13, 2010)

Wow Wildheart!!!! So nice to see you here. I see Danny already answered your question.


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## Stephanie Logan (Jan 13, 2010)

What a sad story but with your care and generosity, maybe it will have a happy ending! 

I would love to see photos of this possibly-wild-caught leopard tortoise. How lucky he is to have been brought to you! 

Also post some pictures of what South Africa looks like in your neighborhoods. Sounds lovely and exotic to me!


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## Isa (Jan 13, 2010)

Welcome to the forum  I am glad someone brought you the tortoise


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## Yvonne G (Jan 13, 2010)

to the forum!!

I'd love to see pictures of this tortoise...PLEASE, pretty please???


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## spikethebest (Jan 13, 2010)

Welcome! Cant wait to see the pictures and maybe the video of the breathing.


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## purpod (Jan 13, 2010)

Welcome & Thanx for taking in your newly given shelled friend! Thank God he is out of that cold rain! I think Danny's idea of getting him used to the more arid outdoors by introducing him to the native foods, etc., was a super idea.

I doubt if he would be smart enuf to understand the dangers of your swimming pool in your back yard & would suggest that if you plan on keeping him back there, you set up a small wall with cinder blocks or some other such brick.

Keep us updated & blessings ~
Purpod


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## Shelly (Jan 13, 2010)

Leopard Tortoises float and swim a bit apparently, so the risk might not be that great.


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## purpod (Jan 13, 2010)

Hiya Shelly ~

Well, even if such is the case, unless this is a full grown tort, I don't see how he could get out of a swimming pool & would surely exhaust himself with the swimming & attempts to get out of the pool... just a thought to be considered ~

Have a fine day!
Purpod


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## Yvonne G (Jan 13, 2010)

Purpod: That's usually why dogs drown in swimming pools...being unable to get out and get exhausted. So I imagine it would be the same for the tortoise.


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## Tom (Jan 13, 2010)

wildheart said:


> I am sorry I posted this in the intro as well. After thinking I realized that it most probable was not the best place to post to get an urgent answer.
> 
> 
> I am Afrikaans, from South Africa and have a house next to the Kruger National Park and another house 5 hours away in Johannesburg. We have an abundance of wild tortoises etc. on our property at Kruger and I am only familiar with the wild kind.
> ...


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## Laura (Jan 13, 2010)

I saw wild Leopard torts on my trip to SA as well. I dont recall where.. It was either Phinda or Kwazulu Natal Area..
Sorry. No pics..
So they are native.. I would call a Wildlife Rescue place near you and see what they recommend. Do they get sick if kept in captivty like Our Dessert Torts do? If released and not well, will infect the wild ones? 
A rescue might have others it can go with or they can direct you where to release and how to do it. I hope you cant get in trouble for having it...


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## wildheart (Jan 13, 2010)

Firstly thank you for all your warm welcomes and halo Jacqui! 

My daughter told me when I got home that he walked all over the house but did not eat anything. The sun was out when I got home so I placed him outside for a little while. He did not move a lot, I think he was tired of walking all over the house. Last night was the second time now that he squeezed himself in between furniture and the wall and fell asleep. He's got free-roam of the house again today because it is once again rainy. 

How many times do they do their business in a day? Do they always leave water marks here and there when they move? Is it healthy and wont he become dehydrated because of this?

Here is the promised pictures and he weighs 9kg = 19.84131 pounds.

































Both the front legs move when he breaths? 

The area by the swimming pool is a problem, I dont know how I can close the pool without driving my husband insane. (He made my iguana room - tunnel - outdoor jungle, dragon outdoor cages, snake cages. He wants to build a bar and a braai but I/we keep him too busy.) I dropped that the tortoise needs a water bath and my husband immediately looked extremely frustrated. 

The region where I am from (Kruger) is hot and dry. The temperature is day time 32 - 48+C (89.6 - 118.4) and night 18-23C (64.4 -73.4). 

I must say it is a bid frustrating that I will only get answers tomorrow.


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## samstar (Jan 14, 2010)

Hope this also helps:

http://www.tortoisetrust.org/care/cpardalis.html


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## egyptiandan (Jan 14, 2010)

Yes it is a male and _Stigmochelys pardalis pardalis_, (I like the new name ) so definately a native Leopard tortoise.

Perfectly normal for his front legs to move when he breathes. 

Danny


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## wildheart (Jan 14, 2010)

egyptiandan said:


> Perfectly normal for his front legs to move when he breathes.
> 
> Danny



Oh wow what a relieve! Is there anyway to tell his age or what other info can I supply to help?

So he is a boy, my daughter called him speedy because he is very fast! How do you tell the difs between boy and girl? 

I am going to try the soaking tonight and will take some photos of his first bath.


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## samstar (Jan 14, 2010)

Looks like a male to me from it's tail, again I'm no expert


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## wildheart (Jan 14, 2010)

Just spoke to my daughter that is looking after Speedy and she says that he did not touch his food. It is now the second day that he did not eat, when must I start worrying? How often do they eat and how much?


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## Stephanie Logan (Jan 14, 2010)

Wow, his front legs look very strong and I love his coloring! His shell looks very heathly and unpyramided to my inexperienced eyes. If you do bathe him I'd love to see what his shell looks like then, and if Danny's able to calculate an age we'd know how much of his life was "wild" before he was caught. I am guessing that scute was damaged somehow or maybe injured in a fight with another tortoise?

Keep us updated!


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## egyptiandan (Jan 14, 2010)

He's about 10 to 12 years old.

Here's what a female looks like






Here's a great caresheet done by Misty Coton who lives in Africa. http://www.chelonia.org/Articles/Mistypardaliscare.htm
Here's a great website for South African tortoises
http://www.dewsburycrafts.co.za/index.htm

Danny


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## Yvonne G (Jan 14, 2010)

I'm thinking that the tortoise isn't eating because he isn't warm enough. Two reasons, really...he's a wild animal and not used to human intervention (stressed because of being in the house with people), and he's not warm enough.


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## samstar (Jan 14, 2010)

Also you might want to take him to the vet if you plan on keeping it.


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## wildheart (Jan 14, 2010)

I honestly do not think that he is wild because the closest area where he could have survived is more than 100km away from Johannesburg. The only way that he could have ended up here is if somebody stole him from a National Park. You can not buy tortoises at any petshop in Gauteng nor are there any breeders.


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## Tom (Jan 14, 2010)

Here in California that happens all the time. People go to, or just drive through the desert, see a tortoise walking around, pick it up, load it in the car and bring it back to their home in the city with the intention of letting it live in their backyard as a pet. Sad, but true. Also very illegal!

BTW, he looks exactly like all the other ones I saw in S.A. I didn't even recognize it as a leopard when I was there, because they all live outside and are smooth and a bit weathered and dirty. I was used to seeing the other subspecies, all clean and pyramided from being captive raised here in the States. I've learned a lot since then.


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## wildheart (Jan 15, 2010)

wildheart said:


> I honestly do not think that he is wild


 Correction, I meant to say "I honestly think that he *is* wild"



Roachman26 said:


> I was used to seeing the other subspecies, all clean and pyramided from being captive raised here in the States. I've learned a lot since then.



I had to google pyramided and it is terrible! I suppose then that my guy is healthy to the eye and must have been picked up recently, do you agree? I cant think that somebody could have taken proper care of him for 10-12 years and then loose him. The previous people who had him from Nov 09 even placed an add in our local paper to try and find the owners, but no luck. 

There is no way that he could have lived in Gauteng in the winter because we have severe frost and it drops to -1C+ at night and only 10C day time. 

I do not need permission to release him on my other property, it is mine after all. But, what worries me - will he cope? They are territorial and their range covers 1-3km. What will happen if I release him on another torts territory? Will it be fair to either? It will also not be fair to keep him captive while I have his natural environment on my doorstep.

What do you think?

Here is my boy's first bath. He was hissing, sighing and complaining, he definitely hated it!  He pooped so I drained the water and as soon as the fresh water was in he pooped again. He also pooped after the bath. He did not drink, will he not get dehydrated with all this pooping? Is it normal?









Nice and clean.








How often should he get a bath if I do not have a soaking area available?


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## Tom (Jan 15, 2010)

This is all normal for a soaking tortoise and all the pooping is a good thing. Supposedly they can absorb water through their cloaca without drinking, but to what degree is a matter of debate. I do this once every two weeks or so in the winter and once a week in the summer, but everybody has their own way of doing it.

Temps get much cooler than that down in the Cape(at least they did when I was there) and I saw literally dozens of this exact subspecies living outside there with no supplemental heat or shelter of any kind. You could always set-up some sort of a "dog house" with a pig blanket for him. I don't know whats available in SA, but do a google search for "Kane Heat Mat" to see what i'm talking about. The temps here drop to -7C in the winter and my sulcatas(which can't take cold as well as your subspecies of Leopard) have been doing just fine for years with that set-up.

If you just turn him loose on your property, you will almost certainly lose him. You'll need to build some sort of pen for him and put his warming shelter in it. The bigger the pen the better. You've got a dilemma there about what to do with him. Not knowing his history, I wouldn't release him into the "wild". You could be introducing captive diseases into the local wild population. Sometimes they can carry disease and parasites, but be asymptomatic.

He's a great looking fellow. Good luck, whatever you decide.


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