# Keeping a giant tortoise in Canada/Northern US



## Redari (Apr 23, 2013)

I am looking at buying a decent sized farm out near Halifax, and may soon be able to realize my dream and get a giant tortoise.

The weather is nicer than many parts of Canada, but would still be below zero about 5 months a year. However I would have tons of space to build a large winter building (probably an Earthship) just for a tortoise, which would eventually be attached to our house that we will build. 

What are the minimum space requirements for a cold climate? The tortoise would be inside for a good six months a year. Also, Sulcata or Aldabra? Any other suggestions? Anyone have experience keeping large tortoises through a Canadian winter?

I won't be purchasing anything until we have the farm and the funds/space set up to build the winter enclosure.

Thanks!


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## wellington (Apr 23, 2013)

I have a leopard. Live in Illinois. Not as many cold months as you or as cold. However, in my opinion, if you can afford to build a good size enclosure and afford to heat it, then go for what you want. There are lots of people in the Northern states that have Sulcatas, not sure about the Aldabras.


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## Tom (Apr 23, 2013)

Anything is possible with enough time, money and effort. I think a sulcata would handle the extremes better than an Aldabra, but the Aldabra won't dig or be as destructive.

50x50' would be an absolute minimum space in my opinion, but I'd rather see it bigger if the animal will spend THAT much time indoors.


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## Redari (Apr 24, 2013)

Thanks for your feedback. 50 x 50 is pretty big, I am pretty sure we won't be able to go that big. Might think more about a Leopard then, as they are a bit smaller and less destructive, so we could use the space for other purposes as well. Maybe have them in a floor of our house or something.

I love the personalities of the Sulcata's, but Tom didn't you say somewhere there is a species of Leopard that is almost as friendly? I just found out there are people here in Calgary with a Sulcata, I am going to see them this weekend as they are bringing it to the Pet Expo. I think it's 7 or 8 years old and living in a tortoise table. I hope he's not in too bad a shape, from what I've learned here that sounds like bad living conditions.

Thanks


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## wellington (Apr 24, 2013)

A member of the forum has a herd of Aldabras. Eleven adults and are housed on one acre. Not sure if you split that up among the number of torts and their size if you could figure out a good size for one adult Aldabra or sulcata even. Keeping in mind, it's one acre for all of them, not split up into smaller enclosures.


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## AZtortMom (Apr 24, 2013)

An 8 year old sully in a tortoise table?? That must be a huge table!


Life is good


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## wellington (Apr 24, 2013)

If a 7-8 year old sully is living in a table, it's not having a good life. That is sad actually 
For you question about leopards, their are two kinds. The babcocki, which is the smaller of the two, less expensive of the two and more available and more shy. The other, the parradelis (spelling might be wrong) is the larger, less shy one and more expensive one. Now, that said, Tom raises the larger ones and if there was any way you could buy one in the states, he is your guy.


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## AZtortMom (Apr 24, 2013)

I was being hopeful 


Life is good


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## Redari (Apr 24, 2013)

Thank you Wellington. I really love the Leopards shells, but we wanted a bigger tort with lots of personality. The paradelis might be a good option. I love my star to bits, but I don't expect he will ever come asking for pets or scratches.

We were thinking a 15 x 15 up to 20 x 20 inside enclosure, but I would try to double the space by building some waist-height second levels.

I know, the Sulcata in the table is really sad. I haven't seen him yet, I just heard about him from the owners at a local reptile event. I'm going to the Expo just to get a look at him because I fear he is in bad shape. I will let them know about the TFO and that he should have more space. At least that way if they aren't prepared to house it properly maybe they can find someone on here to re-home it too. I really am looking forward to meeting a Sulcata because they sound like such wonderful animals.


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## AZtortMom (Apr 24, 2013)

I absolutely love my sulllies  even at their young age their personalities are starting to come out. I can't wait until they are older. My boyfriend is going to have his hands full with house repairs and yard work 


Life is good


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## Kapidolo Farms (Apr 24, 2013)

Hi,

We had a mixed herd of Galops and Aldabras at the Philly Zoo. They were completely inside for a few month each year, not 5 or 6, but the key issue was not so much the space, and they should get alot, but rather ease to clean.

50 x 50 would be a good amount of space, but expensive to build, but 25 x 100 might be much less expensive to build, and give as much floor space as well as a chance to shift animals from one end to the other daily to assist in cleaning. I shallow walkin pool, sky light with glass that allows UV transmission, and a low ceiling all help reduce cost and increase utility. See if some of the more northern Zoos will let you see their winter 'holding areas' those places built for utility, not so much pretty.

The public display at Philly was a good compromise for pretty and utility, the Galops there bred and laid eggs in the indoor enclosure.

If your animals will be inside that much, you should consider some area for egg laying too.

Will


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## DeanS (Apr 24, 2013)

Why not build an oversized greenhouse?!? I don't like the idea of any large tortoises in Canada...of course, I'm not a fan of tortoises anywhere that sub-zero temps are the norm for any perios of time...but, that's just me! I know most homes in Canada have basements...why not convert the basement into your charge's habitat?


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## Jacqui (Apr 24, 2013)

Chainsawkitten said:


> An 8 year old sully in a tortoise table?? That must be a huge table!



Or a very small tortoise due most likely improper care.


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## Redari (Apr 24, 2013)

The farm actually has 8 greenhouses, but they are not four season greenhouses, so not heated through the winter. We would probably build an Earthship (we are going to build an Earthship house eventually) which is kind of like a greenhouse. Lots of windows, and almost self-heating through the winter (they cost about $500/year to run, compared to $500/month for a regular house). They don't have basements though.

Here is the basics: http://earthship.com/simple-survival. My friend that we would be buying the property with builds them for a living.

Still don't know if we are getting the farm yet so this is all kind of hypothetical, I was just SO excited at the possibility of being able to get a giant tortoise. I would almost pick up and move to the States just for that


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## AZtortMom (Apr 24, 2013)

Jacqui said:


> Chainsawkitten said:
> 
> 
> > An 8 year old sully in a tortoise table?? That must be a huge table!
> ...



Very sad either way 


Life is good


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## Tortoise (Apr 24, 2013)

Have you considered red foot tortoises or yellow foots too.They are personable as well and get quite large(yellow foots are larger) but not impossible to house.(need humidity though throughout their room/enclosure)
Leopards would be much better here than sulcatas and they don't do the extensive burrowing etc.
I am intrigued by the earth ship idea will read about that.
I think a large tortoise here is possible for sure but very few people take the time to research enough and provide anywhere close to the space needed for their happiness.
Great you are working this all through before deciding on species.
Good luck-will look forward to photos of the building in future.


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## Kapidolo Farms (Apr 25, 2013)

On the basement - if you do get a giant species, you probably don't want to have to haul it up and down stairs, even only once up and once down each year, think about that, no basement = no problem.

If you can arrange a away for the tortoises to walk from the indoor area to an outdoor area, that is best. Over time you will see they can be herded to go inside.

Will


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## Steve_McQueen (Apr 25, 2013)

Have you looked at the Manouria emys ssp? The black variety get to be large, and they're fairly cold tolerant.


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## Turtulas-Len (Apr 25, 2013)

I have a heated house that my sulcata has access to in the winter and the yard is bigger than 50x50,we get cold,maybe not as cold as as you might, and not for as long as you, but temps do get below 32 F quite often which I believe is your zero during winter, there are not many days that go by that he doesn't venture out and roam around to eat and drink if I remember to replace the ice with fresh water. I am amazed at how long he retains body heat when the temps are in the 20s and the sun is shining, with no direct sun rays he cools down quicker and heads back to his house with less time wandering around. So I believe it is possible to have a large tortoise in cold climate areas, just takes a little more effort ( and good insulation) to keep them happy all year. My sulcata is 17 years old and I have had him since a hatchling, so we know each other pretty well.


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## yagyujubei (Apr 25, 2013)

If you made a dumbwaiter, carrying up and down the stairs wouldn't be a huge problem. South African leopards will get in the 40 to 60 pound range, big, but not overtly so. Much less problems for you than Sulcata's. A big heated bldg will cost a fortune to heat ---- and build.


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## Redari (Apr 25, 2013)

Thanks Steve, I didn't know about those guys. Luckily I have lots of time to do research 

I met a giant Galap once on a visit to Kenya, they had her in a reptile sanctuary. The most amazing creature I've ever come across. Her name was Maria and she was ancient. So a giant has been my dream since then, but I will do what is best for the animal and only get one I can properly take care of. 

Thanks everyone for your opinions and knowledge.


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## HamletsMom (Apr 25, 2013)

I live in southern Ontario and have a Sulcata-who obviously is an indoor tort for about half the year. I just make sure that Hamlet gets lots of exercise out of the enclosure daily....he's more of a house tort than anything. But I am also prepared to be fastening plywood sections to the lower portions of my walls when he's bigger(they WILL go through drywall) and to clean up huge messes  Soon he will be too big for any enclosure at all, and will be "free range". He will need a HUGE,long box filled with hay or straw, with a pig blanket under it to "burrow" in the winter. He will need several basking sites around the house with heat and UVB lighting to ensure his health. The house will need to be more tortoise proofed than it is now. Canadians all have basements, but many are unfinished-in which case we don't spend much time in them-and the torts seem to like to be with their people. Also-an unfinished Canadian basement is chilly-it may not be much more expensive to heat a well insulated outbuilding to 70 then add basking areas.....but then again you run into the no people around for most of time. As a "housepet" they will rearrange your furniture on a regular basis "just because its fun", they are very active and curious. As for summer, even an outdoor tort pen doesn't provide as much exercise as they need. I am teaching Hammie to stay on the sidewalk when we go for walks (who knows what the neighbors use on their lawns) and I tell you, he is smarter than a dog. Even with all the provisions I will make to keep him upstairs with us as he gets bigger(like bolting the dining room table to the floor teehee) I fear that he will end up in the basement once he's three feet long  but with two able bodied people he can still come up to play daily. So it CAN be done, you can have a happy, smooth large tort in colder climates...but it is a HUGE commitment and lifestyle change. Think hard about it.


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## Redari (Apr 25, 2013)

HamletsMom that sounds pretty amazing, you are such a dedicated pet owner. Sounds like tons of work but with a huge payoff. I would love to come visit your house, you should take a video or something


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## HamletsMom (Apr 27, 2013)

I grow too attached to my pets, and am devastated when I lose them. I have just lost my 12 yr old CollieX and my 19 yr old rescued iguana(who I rescued at 2 yrs [email protected] hatchling size if you can believe it) within three weeks of each other. You have such an intense relationship with a dog, and only have them for ten-twelve years. Or a cat for fifteen or twenty. So......I did my research and found ONE pet that I (and my grandkids) can live happily ever after with. I've always kept a lot of pets which takes a lot of work......but this way I have one that takes a lot of work. I can pour my heart and soul into one that will be with me for a looong time  So when I decided to have a baby I knew it was time to have a sully also . Than for using term "amazing"....most people use the term "nuts" lol.


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## shelloise (Apr 27, 2013)

you would also need a generator..........I know rabbit breeders that lost all their rabbits in their heated barns when the power was out. 



Redari said:


> I am looking at buying a decent sized farm out near Halifax, and may soon be able to realize my dream and get a giant tortoise.
> 
> The weather is nicer than many parts of Canada, but would still be below zero about 5 months a year. However I would have tons of space to build a large winter building (probably an Earthship) just for a tortoise, which would eventually be attached to our house that we will build.
> 
> ...


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