# Daisy Lou + Vet = Pancur



## Torty Mom (Dec 14, 2010)

Holy crap we have worms! UGH!!!! Pinworms to be exact!!! UGH!!!

We did not get another xray because she was going to charge me $160.00! NOT!! Dr. McGraw is trying to talk me out of the xray, she says it's not needed, but I am really dying to see inside her and see if all the crud has cleared out. She said her puffy eyes are looking great and reminded me that it will take a few months, but she sees improvement! Yea! So we go back again in 30 days! 

The other vet 5 minutes from my house will only charge me $38 for an xray, so I will make an appt there tomorrow. 

PLEASE, PLEASE everyone get your torties poo checked! It's so important! 

 Mary Anne, Daisy Lou and Lisa!!!


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## TKCARDANDCOIN (Dec 14, 2010)

I am having the same problem with the worms and my herd of russian torts!What a mess.....Good luck, i hope everything clears up.


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## Torty Mom (Dec 14, 2010)

Thanks! It is a nightmare. I am so glad everyone is seperate! She told me it is only passed on by ingesting infected poo, is that what you were told? 

Poor Daisy Lou, everytime she turns around something else happens to her!! 

I hope yours clears up fast also! I am gonna google and see what these little boogers look like!

I wonder if they are part of or a contributing factor to the vit A def, she has, that they are taking her nutrition.......


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## TKCARDANDCOIN (Dec 14, 2010)

I ended up putting a new tort in with my existing bunch and thats how they got the worms i'm guessing.I purchased her from a friend and he assured me that she was parasite free,soooo...Anyways I only quarantined her for a short period of time and she looked good so I put her with the rest and now everyone has them.I knew better but I just was in a hurry.Oh well the panacur will clear them up and a good diet and healthy immune system should hold them off at least i'm hoping.

After you treat her with the panacur soak her in some warm water in a clear container and when she cleans herself out you should see them(the worms) resting on the bottom.My new girl was filled with them, I almost could not believe how many were in her.She went from energetic to really lethargic in no time.

She is alot better now and her appetite is back to normal.I have one more week and then I will start the second round of treatments.


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## Torty Mom (Dec 14, 2010)

I bet it's hard with more than one, as you have to treat them all, I am so sorry you are going thru that! How many have it? 

Should we do it before or after she eats? Does it matter? I don't need to see the worms, but I am sure Lisa will! 

I was pretty sure Daisy Lou did NOT have any worms. I almost bet Lisa money. I was totally shocked. I am still shocked actually! 

I never cuss, I must have said sh*t 20 times quietly to Lisa while we were waiting for the meds. UGH!!!


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## Laura (Dec 14, 2010)

they are common... and hard to see... kids (people type) get them all the times as well.. ewwwww....
Some parasite you cant see without a microscope..


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## Angi (Dec 14, 2010)

Oh...That is awful. If I have two torts that live together should I have both checked?


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## TKCARDANDCOIN (Dec 14, 2010)

I am treating 8 at the moment.I was able to see worms in just about every one so they all are being treated.My vet gave me the powdered form of panacur and i sprinkle it on the food.I just have to make sure they all get some.I have another group of russians that were not affected(Thank God).They were in a seperate enclosure.

Angi, If you think that one of your torts may have parasites than they both most likely have them,assuming they are living together in the same enclosure.


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## Tom (Dec 14, 2010)

Pinworm eggs are very tiny and very light weight. They blow around on the wind. Since they are out in the world blowing around, they can pick them up anytime.


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## uilani104 (Dec 14, 2010)

Dumb question but how do they check the poo?


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## Tom (Dec 14, 2010)

Microscope.


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## Yvonne G (Dec 14, 2010)

The vet or tech takes a fresh stool sample and puts it in a vial of water, stirring it up well. Then you put that on a slide and look in the microscope. They don't actually see "worms" but the see the worm eggs.


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## uilani104 (Dec 14, 2010)

OOohh Ok, interesting... I'll make sure to have them check Rye and Ryne


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## TKCARDANDCOIN (Dec 15, 2010)

You can actually see the worms but with the microscope they will be able to see the" worms "and the "eggs".


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## Angi (Dec 15, 2010)

I haven't seen worms. Should I still have them checked?


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## TKCARDANDCOIN (Dec 15, 2010)

I would only have them checked if you are concerned.The only reason I did was because of how many I saw, It was a heavy load and she was not eating so it was obvious they were affecting her.As for the others they got treated also because they stay in the same enclosure.If you let it go it can get out of hand especially this time of year.Chances are if your torts are acting normal and eating and look healthy I would not worry.


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## Laura (Dec 15, 2010)

you can also over medicate.. or medicate for things that arent even there.. so best to check..
Some bugs are good.. and you dont want to kill off all the good stuff too...


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## Torty Mom (Dec 15, 2010)

Daisy Lou eats like Miss Piggy and I have NOT seen anything in her poopies. If she has had them this long, wouldn't you think we would be able to see them? 

Is this contagious to my family? 

Does anyone think these little critters might effect her nutrition? Maybe that's why her eyes are so puffy? 

I am going to soak her right now, I hope to see some in the tub I am using.


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## exoticsdr (Dec 15, 2010)

Just want to clear up a couple things for you.

When checking for intestinal parasites, a fecal sample is mixed with a high percentage sugar solution. If mixed with tap water, the eggs are more dense than the water and sink (this comes in handy in some cases, especially torts). So, most of the time we mix the poo with our fecalsol and wait 20 minutes or so for the eggs to float at which time they can be easily collected on a slide or cover slip and looked at under the microscope.

Now, since some species make pellets or very fibrous feces (like torts), first we break the poop up in tap water and centrifuge that down at about 3000rpm for 10 minutes. this makes a small pellet of fecal material and parasite eggs (if present) at the bottom of the test tube. We then pour off the water and grassy fibrous materials, add our sugar solution and mix it back up and let it sit for 20-30 minutes and read it under a microscope. I will sometimes centrifuge it one more time in the sugar solution because most of the fecal mater is more dense than the sugar solution and the eggs are not so they will float after centrifuging. Fecals can sometimes be quite time consuming.

I think it's always a good idea to have fecal samples done and have them done often (if you pet is likely to be exposed...i.e living outdoors). Should you treat everytime your vet finds a parasite? I would say definitely NO! However, every household has to be looked at separately: are the torts handled by children, interact with other pet, cagemates, etc.) Parasites, such as pinworms, are very common and if in low numbers the tort can live with them with no problems. We are in big trouble with large animal intestinal parasitism these days because of treating when we shouldn't, so many parasites are becoming partially or completely resistant to our anti-parasitic drugs.....so much so, the drugs used at the turn of the century are becoming the drugs of choice because they are the only thing effective and unfortunately much more dangerous. We don't need that.

this is a good thread


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## Torty Mom (Dec 15, 2010)

Todd, awesome explanation! Thanks so much! 

I really need to know if these pinworms are contagious to me or my family? 

I also work at a school with 5 year olds, I do wash my hands ALOT. I am worried about that too!


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## exoticsdr (Dec 15, 2010)

I believe pinworms are species-specific and pose little threat, but as canine roundworms and hookworms can cause very serious disease, especially in children.... I would say Yes, if for no other reason than to err on the side of caution. Good hand washing should protect you, your family and the little urchins at school. You would have a hard time talking an angry parent out of blaming you if they found out your tortoise had pinworms and then their child came down with them, even if you could show them tons of proof as to the species specificity of the parasite.


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## Torty Mom (Dec 15, 2010)

Thanks Todd, I must admit I am a bit freaked out about it. 14 five year olds with worms would be a nightmare for sure, UGH!!! I think I would be looking for a new job in another city!  I will keep my son from handling her until we get a clean fecal. 

Do you think those pinworms effect nutrition, like her vitamin A dif?


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## exoticsdr (Dec 15, 2010)

In large numbers, any parasite could become a problem....I never saw the fecal, so really can't comment on the severity of the infestation..the threat of inpaction or nutritional problem would have to be determined by the egg count etc....am I rambling? haha Guess I could be a politician.....wish I could say more on the subject.

As for pinworms as a kid.....oh the memories of my mother "digging" for pinworms....it was not fun! hahaha Too much info?


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## Torty Mom (Dec 15, 2010)

I think those stories are cute, as a Mom of 2 boys, we have had some interesting situations!! 

Thanks Todd for all your advice! I appreciate it!!!


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