# Dumb Q About Cinder Blocks



## dwright27 (Apr 4, 2016)

Good afternoon everyone!

I have been so busy with school the last few months that I haven't been on the forum. 

I am looking to make an outdoor pen for my redfoot, and I'm wondering about using cinder blocks. Do I need do use mortar, or is it safe to just stack them? I'm paranoid that the blocks will fall or something, even though they wouldn't be that high--I guess 3 blocks high would be enough? 

Also, I live where there are birds of prey, raccoons, and coyotes. So I'm open to simple suggestions for how to cover it. I am NOT handy in any way, can't even hammer a nail straight. So the less carpentry the better, lol!

Thank you!


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## dmmj (Apr 4, 2016)

I use cinder blocks in my enclosures for the walls. they do  fine stacked 2 high. I put pieces of rebar in the holes and then put dirt around it to make it sturdier.


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## dwright27 (Apr 4, 2016)

Thanks! That sounds simple enough. Do you have it covered?


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## dmmj (Apr 4, 2016)

dwright27 said:


> Thanks! That sounds simple enough. Do you have it covered?


do I have what covered?


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## dwright27 (Apr 4, 2016)

Your outdoor enclosures. Do you have a screen of some kind to keep animals out?


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## dmmj (Apr 4, 2016)

dwright27 said:


> Your outdoor enclosures. Do you have a screen of some kind to keep animals out?


I see now, no I do not. We have no bird of prey in my area and raccoons are only a problem at night and they have secure lock boxes for that.


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## dwright27 (Apr 4, 2016)

Alright, I'll keep looking around. Thank you!


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## Yvonne G (Apr 4, 2016)

If you alternate them instead of stacking them directly one on the other, it makes the fence more stable.


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## ZEROPILOT (Apr 4, 2016)

The cool thing about blocks is that you can first find something suitable to use for a top...like a fence gate. And then make the enclosure the size that fits the top.
I wish you luck.
My Redfoot live outdoors, but in simple wooden pens. You'd need to be able to use hand tools...


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## Tom (Apr 4, 2016)

I use half blocks and stagger the rows.

Start your first row with a regular block. Start your second row with a half block, and then start your third row even with the first.

3 blocks high will contain adult sulcatas in most cases, so it will for sure hold in a redfoot.


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## Tony the tank (Apr 4, 2016)

I would caution against going three high unless you have a way of locking the blocks together...either with Mortar or as stated above fill with dirt and rebar ... ..(all the way through to the ground).....a little shift can make the wall very unstable..


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## Texas Scott (Apr 4, 2016)

Here is mine 


You can get mortor in a caulking gun tube...very easy to apply.


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## Tom (Apr 4, 2016)

Tony the tank said:


> I would caution against going three high unless you have a way of locking the blocks together...either with Mortar or as stated above fill with dirt and rebar ... ..(all the way through to the ground).....a little shift can make the wall very unstable..



In 20 years of using blocks stacked 3 high, nothing has ever made them unstable and they've never fallen over. I have several hundred feet of 3 block high enclosure walls that have been sitting where there are, in a very stable fashion, for many years, with no mortar or rebar. They run up and down hills, around corners, and in long stretches on uneven ground. They usually don't fall over even when someone bumps them with a car bumper.


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## Tony the tank (Apr 4, 2016)

Tom said:


> In 20 years of using blocks stacked 3 high, nothing has ever made them unstable and they've never fallen over. I have several hundred feet of 3 block high enclosure walls that have been sitting where there are, in a very stable fashion, for many years, with no mortar or rebar. They run up and down hills, around corners, and in long stretches on uneven ground. They usually don't fall over even when someone bumps them with a car bumper.




Tom....This isn't about you..I'm offering advise.. I wouldn't nor would I advise anyone to just stack cinder blocks 3 high without a way of locking the blocks together.... Blocks do shift and a cinder block can do a lot of damage.... Your way is not always the correct way Tom.... Most will agree a cemented or rebar block wall has a lot less chance of collapsing than just staggered stacking..surely even you can see that...

Why take a chance and avoid a disaster ..


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## dwright27 (Apr 4, 2016)

Ah guys please don't get upset, I'm taking info from everywhere I can. I asked the initial question because stability is of the utmost concern. I would be devastated to lose my tortoise to a cinder block. And since I've never done this before, I just want to make it as secure as possible. 
Where I live, some sinking into the ground is bound to happen.. Perhaps I'll just dig a deep enough trench to hold a whole block? I don't know.. Actually I was hoping to not have to dig much, if at all.


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## Tony the tank (Apr 4, 2016)

dwright27 said:


> Ah guys please don't get upset, I'm taking info from everywhere I can. I asked the initial question because stability is of the utmost concern. I would be devastated to lose my tortoise to a cinder block. And since I've never done this before, I just want to make it as secure as possible.
> Where I live, some sinking into the ground is bound to happen.. Perhaps I'll just dig a deep enough trench to hold a whole block? I don't know.. Actually I was hoping to not have to dig much, if at all.




I think a wooden pen is the way to go... Just build it like you would a small board fence..... Use 1x8 boards 4 high....


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## Tom (Apr 4, 2016)

Yes, I think most would agree that cement and rebar would give it less chance of collapsing, but its not going to collapse with out cement and rebar, is my point. No need for all the extra work and expense. The time and money could be better spent on making the enclosure even larger and better instead of doing work that is totally unnecessary.

Spending the extra time, money and effort won't hurt anything, but it not needed in any way.


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## dwright27 (Apr 4, 2016)

Tony don't poke the bear! 
Tom, do you have to treat the wood with anything? Or buy pressure treated? I don't want it to rot on me.


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## Tom (Apr 4, 2016)

dwright27 said:


> Tom, do you have to treat the wood with anything? Or buy pressure treated? I don't want it to rot on me.



This will depend on your climate. Untreated wood will last for years here where I am, but in the south the same wood would rot away in less a than a year if left untreated.

I usually prime and paint my stuff, or use slumpstone block.


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## ZEROPILOT (Apr 5, 2016)

I like the stacked cement block.
If you stack them block, half block, block half block. Or a layer of block then a layer of half block,etc. as described.
If you decide on wood, for the cost, I always use and have had them last for ten years, wooden fence picket boards screwed to metal posts hammered into the ground about a foot deep.
I've enclosed a photo as an example.
Like I mentioned before. It's very cheap and easy as well as long lasting. But you will need some basic tools. You can cut down on tool time by going with six foot lengths. (The length of the boards)...Like a 12 by 18 foot pen. A 6 by 24 foot pen, etc.
I.M.O. this would be plenty strong for a Sulcata until it gets quite huge and powerful.
Fence picket lumber. Fence picket posts and a box of 1" exterior deck screws.


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## dwright27 (Apr 5, 2016)

Tom said:


> This will depend on your climate. Untreated wood will last for years here where I am, but in the south the same wood would rot away in less a than a year if left untreated.
> 
> I usually prime and paint my stuff, or use slumpstone block.



I live in Canada, so we have, y'know, weather. lol


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## dwright27 (Apr 5, 2016)

ZEROPILOT said:


> I like the stacked cement block.
> If you stack them block, half block, block half block. Or a layer of block then a layer of half block,etc. as described.
> If you decide on wood, for the cost, I always use and have had them last for ten years, wooden fence picket boards screwed to metal posts hammered into the ground about a foot deep.
> I've enclosed a photo as an example.
> ...



Thanks for the info! I see you live in Florida. I wonder how long it would hold up through a few Canadian winters..?


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## ZEROPILOT (Apr 5, 2016)

dwright27 said:


> Thanks for the info! I see you live in Florida. I wonder how long it would hold up through a few Canadian winters..?


Good point.
I honestly can't say.


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## Pearly (Apr 5, 2016)

Oh thank you for starting this thread!!!! I've been on a quest lately too, looking for best suited fencing for my outdoor pen. I am not handy and not very physically strong, so there's major limitation right there. Oh! And forgot the biggest ine! No money to pay for the job to someone who can do it... I've already made couple of trips to Home depot and Lowes, looking at different options. There are nice stone type of blocs (looking NICE) but some are HEAVY!!!! And expensive! For the size if enclosure I'm making there's just no way to spend that much. I'm leaning towards cinderblocks as well, but ... They are ugly!!!! And very rough surface! I have to get something that I myself can haul from hardware store, bring it up little hill to my backyard, and install it without digging (can't dig in this soil without excavation machinery, it's full of limestone). Cinders just seem most practical for me. I even thought of filling the holes with soil and planting some trailing plants in them to cover the ugly looking thing


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## dwright27 (Apr 5, 2016)

Pearly said:


> Oh thank you for starting this thread!!!! I've been on a quest lately too, looking for best suited fencing for my outdoor pen. I am not handy and not very physically strong, so there's major limitation right there. Oh! And forgot the biggest ine! No money to pay for the job to someone who can do it... I've already made couple of trips to Home depot and Lowes, looking at different options. There are nice stone type of blocs (looking NICE) but some are HEAVY!!!! And expensive! For the size if enclosure I'm making there's just no way to spend that much. I'm leaning towards cinderblocks as well, but ... They are ugly!!!! And very rough surface! I have to get something that I myself can haul from hardware store, bring it up little hill to my backyard, and install it without digging (can't dig in this soil without excavation machinery, it's full of limestone). Cinders just seem most practical for me. I even thought of filling the holes with soil and planting some trailing plants in them to cover the ugly looking thing



Now that's an idea! And I saw someone else was worried about shell damage from the concrete, but I suppose you could always put plywood or something up along the bottom?

I'm also broke right now too. Life of a student! But my tax return is coming soon!!


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## keepergale (Apr 5, 2016)

ZEROPILOT said:


> I like the stacked cement block.
> If you stack them block, half block, block half block. Or a layer of block then a layer of half block,etc. as described.
> If you decide on wood, for the cost, I always use and have had them last for ten years, wooden fence picket boards screwed to metal posts hammered into the ground about a foot deep.
> I've enclosed a photo as an example.
> ...


I like that look. I currently have block walls on my pen but I am worried the tortoises my rub the sides of their shell on the block walls. I have been thinking of going with wooden walls.


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## Yvonne G (Apr 5, 2016)

When I first moved to this house about 20 years ago, I made all my pens with cinderblock. Eventually, over time, I changed them all out and made wooden fences. The cinderblocks were nice, but some of the pens were in tight spots and the width of the blocks just took up too much space. 

I never had a problem with the contained animals knocking over or moving the blocks. But my sister Maggie, up in Oregon with Bob the sulcata, surely did. She wrote many threads here about Bob and his escapes from his cinder block yard. She pounded stakes or rebar down through the holes, she filled the holes with heavy sand...nothing could contain Bob when he was on a mission.


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## JoesMum (Apr 5, 2016)

Yvonne G said:


> When I first moved to this house about 20 years ago, I made all my pens with cinderblock. Eventually, over time, I changed them all out and made wooden fences. The cinderblocks were nice, but some of the pens were in tight spots and the width of the blocks just took up too much space.
> 
> I never had a problem with the contained animals knocking over or moving the blocks. But my sister Maggie, up in Oregon with Bob the sulcata, surely did. She wrote many threads here about Bob and his escapes from his cinder block yard. She pounded stakes or rebar down through the holes, she filled the holes with heavy sand...nothing could contain Bob when he was on a mission.


Bob definitely was part bulldozer - you worried far more about the things he walked through than those things damaging Bob.


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## dwright27 (Apr 5, 2016)

I wonder... if I can't do chain link or something, would deer netting or bird netting be okay? Or is that too easily wrecked?


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## Yvonne G (Apr 5, 2016)

dwright27 said:


> I wonder... if I can't do chain link or something, would deer netting or bird netting be okay? Or is that too easily wrecked?



If a tortoise can see through the fence he'll spend most of his time trying to get through it.


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## Yvonne G (Apr 5, 2016)

Some posts in this thread have been removed and will continue to be removed due to being off topic.

If you wish to continue your off topic conversation, take it private.


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## dwright27 (Apr 5, 2016)

I would still have a base covering, but we have beasties outside


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## Pearly (Apr 5, 2016)

I'm facing similar dilemma, minus the predators. This year the babies will be just getting their outdoor time during a day when no uninvited critters come to my backyard. It's the night that there are no guarantees so before moving outside full time they'll have to have safe heated house where I can lock them up for the night. Keep us posted and include pictures. I'm hoping to get some ideas here


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## ascott (Apr 6, 2016)

dwright27 said:


> I wonder... if I can't do chain link or something, would deer netting or bird netting be okay? Or is that too easily wrecked?



Some folks will use a chain link dog kennel....then around the bottom on the inside they will cover the inside perimeter with wood boards the are from the ground up to a foot or so...they then cover the top with another kennel panel to assure coverage....you can also sink some barrier along the bottom of the kennel into the dirt to avoid any digging.....there is a nice one on a thread here on the forum but I don 't remember the name of the thread....


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## Tony the tank (Apr 6, 2016)

If you have a problem with critters... I would use a electric fence..I have a serious bear issue... I use an electric fence and never lock my animals in... On that note.I don't make it easy... I make the hide entrance for my lg sulcatas just big enough for them to squeeze in and out... And use driveway alert sensor and IR cameras in each pen to alert me at night if anything gets by the electric fence...


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