# Overheating and death



## FLINTUS

Very sadly, after redoing the enclosures yesterday and adding my two new erosas to the rest of the group, my thermostat malfunctioned. 3 of the 8 are now probably dead. This came as a result of receiving back my main very expensive thermostat system(Microclimate Prime), which had been sent off for repair, to find it was not working. However, rather than using the heater with the built in thermostat, since it's getting colder, I thought i'd use the more powerful tubular heater with a plug in thermostat. I checked this morning, and everything has gone wrong. All the plants dead(temperatures I would guess 35-40 degrees Celsius), 5 tortoises severely dehydrated, and 3 almost certainly dead. Having worked to get my collection to this stage, I now have to rebuild it and start again. Therefore, I would warn people against buying plug-in thermostats that are not specifically labelled for reptiles, even if it is for the tubular heater, without getting good feedback first.
If anyone has suggestion on what to do with the possibly dead tortoises it would be much appreciated. They are currently bathing just above room temperature(about 23 or so degrees), with cooked mushrooms in the water.
@Jacqui @juli11 @Anyfoot @tortadise @Benjamin


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## dmmj

words fail me what else can one say? I'm sorry sounds hollow but I am sorry this happened


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## FLINTUS

dmmj said:


> words fail me what else can one say? I'm sorry sounds hollow but I am sorry this happened


Thank you for your condolences.


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## Anyfoot

FLINTUS said:


> Very sadly, after redoing the enclosures yesterday and adding my two new erosas to the rest of the group, my thermostat malfunctioned. 3 of the 8 are now probably dead. This came as a result of receiving back my main very expensive thermostat system(Microclimate Prime), which had been sent off for repair, to find it was not working. However, rather than using the heater with the built in thermostat, since it's getting colder, I thought i'd use the more powerful tubular heater with a plug in thermostat. I checked this morning, and everything has gone wrong. All the plants dead(temperatures I would guess 35-40 degrees Celsius), 5 tortoises severely dehydrated, and 3 almost certainly dead. Having worked to get my collection to this stage, I now have to rebuild it and start again. Therefore, I would warn people against buying plug-in thermostats that are not specifically labelled for reptiles, even if it is for the tubular heater, without getting good feedback first.
> If anyone has suggestion on what to do with the possibly dead tortoises it would be much appreciated. They are currently bathing just above room temperature(about 23 or so degrees), with cooked mushrooms in the water.
> @Jacqui @juli11 @Anyfoot @tortadise @Benjamin


OMG Ben. That is a sad state to be in. All you can do for now is bathe them all. Nearly dead or alive. Just bathe the lot. 
As for avoiding this situation again and for others, I'm a believer of using more than one heat source. If you need lets say 300watt of heat, use 3 x 100watt or 2 x 150watt. This way no one supply can over heat the enclosure, also if one supply goes down for any reason, the other(s) will stop it getting too cold. (Except power cuts obviously). 
My heart goes out to you my friend.


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## Jacqui

OMGosh was shocking and heart breaking this is to read. You must be feeling shock, devastation and guilt, but don't feel guilty. You can not change was has happened. Other then soaking and not doing a drasticly fast cool down, I just have no ideas. *hugs*


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## Maro2Bear

So sorry to hear this very tragic news. @ Anyfoot brings up some good points for us all. Always good to triple check equipment. Best of luck and hope for the best.


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## juli11

I had a similar problem 2 days ago.. 
My females of S. carinatus were under their pot which is normally their covert. They ram the pot so that the pot fall down and they can't go out. I don't know how long they stayed under it but one of them is dead and the other one sit in s bole she isn't still ok.. But that's turtles.. 

If I understand it right your temperatures get to high so that the tortoises hydrated? 
If yes my tip is to put them in a small terrarium with a humidity of 100% and much water.. Maybe a temperature of 23-25C. How do they look do you have a picture?


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## Yvonne G

Aw, darn it Ben. This is an awful thing to have happen. I've lost a tortoise or two to overheating, so I understand how helpless you feel. I'm so sorry this happened. 

It's so hard to tell if turtles are actually dead. I go through all the tricks and if I still can't tell, I wait until the body goes into rigor. I hope they're not dead, Ben, and that soaking them helps them revive.


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## FLINTUS

Next one has twisted looking limbs, pretty certain he's gone


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## FLINTUS

Thank you everyone.
They've been soaking all day but no luck.
Yes @juli11 the enclosure became way too hot, and they probably dehydrated.


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## SarahChelonoidis

I am so sorry. What a horrible loss.


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## wellington

I am so very sorry. This just shocked me. i can't imagine. So sorry


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## waretrop

I am so sorry. It's such sad news.


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## juli11

FLINTUS said:


> Thank you everyone.
> They've been soaking all day but no luck.
> Yes @juli11 the enclosure became way too hot, and they probably dehydrated.



Hmm okay. But that's my only tip
what you can do. But I think that they don't have a chance if they look like that especially as the last one..


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## Pearly

I am so sorry to hear this horrible news! Equipment malfunction has been my worry since I got the babies into a closed chamber. I know how you must feel. Long time ago my (then LITTLE, maybe 5yrs old) got 2 gold fish at the carnival. She was so happy I decided to keep them, stopped by the store to pick up a fish bowl (wrong! I know that now) and food, dechlorinator atc. Washed the bowl and put the fish in it. The next morning both fish were dead. I can't tell you how sick I felt inside knowing that I had somehow caused their demise. Those were living breathing creatures. I still remember that vividly, but also know that I never meant to hurt an animal and that experience has made me a better pet keeper. I now try to anticipate any possible issue and counteract potential problems. I know it will be hard for you to not beat yourself up for what has happened, but I hope you find a way to turn this into a positive experience in some other ways. Again, I am so very sorry for your loss


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## Pearly

One more thing, as I'm still relatively new to tortoise keeping, I haven't heard of putting mushrooms into the bath water. That's very interesting. Could someone please tell me more about it or point to website where I could educate myself more?


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## jeffjeff

so sorry for your loss. I hope the others pull through ok.


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## FLINTUS

Pearly said:


> One more thing, as I'm still relatively new to tortoise keeping, I haven't heard of putting mushrooms into the bath water. That's very interesting. Could someone please tell me more about it or point to website where I could educate myself more?


That's just due to this species. Being forest dwellers, they like their funghi, and when cooked they have a strong smell hat I was hoping might entice them out.
Sorry to hear about your fish too.


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## mike taylor

Man Ben hopefully you can pull them through . Sorry it really sucks when crap like this happens .


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## Jodie

One of my worst nightmares. I am so sorry!


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## Lyn W

So sorry to read this sad post, but thank you for sharing this with us so we can all learn from it and be reminded to check our equipment. I just always assume mine is OK but will make a point of testing it now.
All good wishes for the recovery of the others, as well as these three if they can be revived.


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## Elohi

Oh man, so sorry to hear this. Thank you for sharing so we can be aware of things like this. Again, so very sorry.


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## mike taylor

So how's the turtles Ben any news ? Hopefully good news.


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## kathyth

I'm very sorry for your tragic loss.


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## Pearly

FLINTUS said:


> That's just due to this species. Being forest dwellers, they like their funghi, and when cooked they have a strong smell hat I was hoping might entice them out.
> Sorry to hear about your fish too.


Thank you, that was a while ago and I had never planned on taking on fish, but once in my possession I felt responsible. I think the deadly error was me washing the bowl with use of mild dish soap. I later learned to never do that. I washed the heck out if it but it apparently wasn't enough. I was having nightmares about this for a long time


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## stojanovski92113

I'm really upset to read this and I don't even know you or your torts...I'm truly sorry to hear about this entire situation I'm hoping your other torts are doing ok??!!


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## Pearly

Hi, I'm opening your thread hoping for some good news...?


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## ZEROPILOT

I had hoped for an update with good news.


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## AnimalLady

I'm so very sorry.. <3 <3 <3 a heart for each tort lost.


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## Jacqui

Almost afraid to ask, but how are things?


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## FLINTUS

I'm afraid they've gone.


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## TerrapinStation

terribly sorry to hear. What a tragedy.


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## Jacqui

FLINTUS said:


> I'm afraid they've gone.



Just these, not the rest too correct?


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## FLINTUS

Yes, the other 5 seem OK-ish, but we'll see.


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## Anyfoot

FLINTUS said:


> Yes, the other 5 seem OK-ish, but we'll see.


Hi Ben. Are the remaining 5 looking ok.


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## Tidgy's Dad

So very sorry for your losses, a terrible tragedy, heartbreaking.
Really, really wishing the other five all the best.


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## Randi

Pearly said:


> Thank you, that was a while ago and I had never planned on taking on fish, but once in my possession I felt responsible. I think the deadly error was me washing the bowl with use of mild dish soap. I later learned to never do that. I washed the heck out if it but it apparently wasn't enough. I was having nightmares about this for a long time


The reason your fish died was the fish bowl. Goldfish are very messy, and do best in a tank that's three times their size. In a fish bowl, the water fouls up incredibly quick. The ammonia that they excrete (they also excrete more when stressed, as well as losing their slime coating when stressed which acts as their protection) will inhibit respiration. Not to mention, goldfish need surface agitation so they can breathe. They need moving water to live. There are some fish (Japanese fighting fish, Arowannas, etc) that are able to live in an environment without surface agitation but they evolved to be able to do so. The other issue with a fish bowl is that it does not allow for proper growth of the fish - eventually the organs will outgrow their body and they die. I love fish - breeding them and keeping them. They are easy but there are a lot of things that can cause them to die prematurely. And pet stores aren't always great when it comes to making sure the customer knows how to take care of the animal they are purchasing. Sorry about your fish. Hopefully you have better experiences with fish in the future. Best of luck to you and yours 

I'm really sorry to read that your torts became overheated. Hopefully they will make it. I want to say thank you for posting this as it acts as a reminder that we need to be vigilant in ensuring everything is functioning properly. So sorry you had to go through this. Hoping for the best outcome. Best of luck to you and yours.


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## Pearly

Randi said:


> The reason your fish died was the fish bowl. Goldfish are very messy, and do best in a tank that's three times their size. In a fish bowl, the water fouls up incredibly quick. The ammonia that they excrete (they also excrete more when stressed, as well as losing their slime coating when stressed which acts as their protection) will inhibit respiration. Not to mention, goldfish need surface agitation so they can breathe. They need moving water to live. There are some fish (Japanese fighting fish, Arowannas, etc) that are able to live in an environment without surface agitation but they evolved to be able to do so. The other issue with a fish bowl is that it does not allow for proper growth of the fish - eventually the organs will outgrow their body and they die. I love fish - breeding them and keeping them. They are easy but there are a lot of things that can cause them to die prematurely. And pet stores aren't always great when it comes to making sure the customer knows how to take care of the animal they are purchasing. Sorry about your fish. Hopefully you have better experiences with fish in the future. Best of luck to you and yours
> 
> I'm really sorry to read that your torts became overheated. Hopefully they will make it. I want to say thank you for posting this as it acts as a reminder that we need to be vigilant in ensuring everything is functioning properly. So sorry you had to go through this. Hoping for the best outcome. Best of luck to you and yours.


Thanks for taking your time to address it. I seriously think both fish died because there was something in that bowl. They literally died the first night after I released them from their little carnival containers into that bowl. Being completely unprepared and ignorant about fish, I washed that bowl with dish soap and hot water. Sure, I thought I rinsed it well, but perhaps not well enough. Couple of years later one of my kids got another fish. This time I had got on aquatic forum, fresh water testing kit, proper filters, live plants and stuff. That experience had taught me that specialty forums are best resources out there.


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## Randi

Pearly said:


> Thanks for taking your time to address it. I seriously think both fish died because there was something in that bowl. They literally died the first night after I released them from their little carnival containers into that bowl. Being completely unprepared and ignorant about fish, I washed that bowl with dish soap and hot water. Sure, I thought I rinsed it well, but perhaps not well enough. Couple of years later one of my kids got another fish. This time I had got on aquatic forum, fresh water testing kit, proper filters, live plants and stuff. That experience had taught me that specialty forums are best resources out there.


In my opinion, it is normal that they passed away once released in the fish bowl. Some live hours, some live a day and the exceptions will live days to weeks, sometimes even longer. They would of been stressed enough during transportation - they would already be releasing ammonia - and then to be put in such a small space - the ammonia probably killed them. And if the water from the container or bag that they were in was added into the bowl, death is inevitable. I've found that stores say it's OK to add that bag of water to the tank - all we are doing is adding ammonia and whatever else has come with them in the bag - if the tank they were taken from was sick and this water was added, the fish in the tank would more then likely become sick. Another thing that they do not tell you.. stressed fish are likely to get sick and die. They lose their slime coating - this barrier protects them from parasites and illness.. and if you pair this with cold water, a parasite named Ich is likely to attach to them and kill them. Ich thrives in cold water - it's in every tank but is dormant until the water cools.. The other thing is Goldfish prefer large, fully planted tanks. Putting them in a space where there's no cover is likely to stress them and kill them. There are so many things that people aren't aware of when it comes to fish. I see that you've already connected that water and dish soap does not mix. The soap strips away any good bacteria that was in an environment. It also is very hard to wash off. I found out that even washing filter media in water will strip away good bacteria! Without the good bacteria to balance everything out, ammonia and nitrites overwhelm the tank and kill the fish. Fish have it so hard. It's sad  sorry for how long this post is. I also want to make it clear that it wasn't your fault. You didn't kill them. You weren't informed about how to keep them. As you can see, there are a lot of things that can contribute to their demise. I always felt bad when my fish died - most people wouldn't feel bad that a fish passed away. Most people don't care about something so small passing away, especially when it can be replaced so quickly. I've seen people buy the most aggressive fish you can get, just so they can put them in a tank and watch them demolish each other.. it's disgusting. I'd like to put these people in a tank together and watch them fight it out, hahaha. Anyways, happy fishing!!


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## Pearly

Yes, it is very difficult to accept that little critter whose life totally depended on us didn't make it. I do hope that the other torts came out ok from this overheating freak accident.


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## Randi

I certainly hope they are alive and well. Any updates? How are they? Wishing for the best


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