# cooked veggies



## sir prince (Oct 25, 2017)

Ok let me have it good and bad. Recently I was making home made pot pies I gave sir Prince some of the cooked veggies cooled down of course he seemed to love them. Give me your opinions


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## JoesMum (Oct 25, 2017)

Probably does no harm as long as no salt of sugar is added in the cooking. However, cooking does remove some of the nutrients so they are better served raw.

Also,tearing at crisp raw foods he!ps with keeping the beak in shape. Mushy cooked foods are too easy to eat.


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## sir prince (Oct 25, 2017)

Very good points. Maybe that's why he seemed to like them so much cause easy to...thanks good advice


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## wellington (Oct 25, 2017)

Not if you add anything to the cooking of them. Give raw or steamed but not on a daily basis


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## Tom (Oct 25, 2017)

sir prince said:


> Ok let me have it good and bad. Recently I was making home made pot pies I gave sir Prince some of the cooked veggies cooled down of course he seemed to love them. Give me your opinions


Depends on which veggies.

Carrots are too high in sugar, but a small amount once in a while is okay.

Peas are high in protein, but again, small amount once in a while can be good for them. Just make sure the tortoise is well hydrated with a higher protein intake.

What other veggies did you offer?


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## sir prince (Oct 25, 2017)

Tom said:


> Depends on which veggies.
> 
> Carrots are too high in sugar, but a small amount once in a while is okay.
> 
> ...


It was mostly green beans cause I hand fed. I steamed a small amount of cauliflower & broccoli today. He didn't touch ate the raw leafy veggie blend always available to him. Guess they know best. Silly torts ❤


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## no one (Oct 26, 2017)

Broccoli is not good for Tortoises.


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## JoesMum (Oct 26, 2017)

Beans are high in protein and shouldn’t be fed. The leaves of the plant are OK
http://www.thetortoisetable.org.uk/plant-database/viewplants/?plant=494&c=8#.WfGTBzPTWEc

Broccoli and Cauliflower shouldn’t be fed. 

http://www.thetortoisetable.org.uk/plant-database/viewplants/?plant=623&c=8#.WfGTMTPTWEc

Keep those for the humans. 

Check foods for suitability by searching in the Tortoise Table Plant Database 
http://www.thetortoisetable.org.uk/


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## Tom (Oct 26, 2017)

JoesMum said:


> Beans are high in protein and shouldn’t be fed. The leaves of the plant are OK
> http://www.thetortoisetable.org.uk/plant-database/viewplants/?plant=494&c=8#.WfGTBzPTWEc
> 
> Broccoli and Cauliflower shouldn’t be fed.
> ...



Just for the sake of conversation…

In years past, we all were told that protein was the cause of pyramiding. Protein became vilified to the point where some tortoises were becoming protein deficient. Richard Fife tells a great story of a time when he was doing a feeding trial for a company with a prepared food. All was going well for months, then one day all the tortoises on the prepared food started crashing and he couldn't see why. He called the company to ask. Apparently, they had brought in a "focus group" of tortoise keepers, and all of them said they would never feed that prepared food because it had a protein level of 11-12% and all these tortoise owners felt that was much too high. So the food company reformulated to bring protein level down to 4% and the customer tortoise owners all thought it was much better that way. Unfortunately, by following customer emotions instead of scientific fact, the new low protein formulation of tortoise food was unable to sustain tortoise life. Necropsy revealed protein deficiency in the test subjects. Richard was able to save most of them by switched to Mazuri which has a "high" protein level of 15%. Protein is not the enemy. Our tortoises need protein to survive and thrive. Its all a question of how much and how often, and how well hydrated they are. They need good hydration with a higher protein intake. The old routine of soaking once a week, or never, and living in a dry ultra low humidity enclosure would not be good for a tortoise eating 15% protein food items. In the new routine of daily soaks for babies and frequent soaks for adults, coupled with damp substrate and moderate to high humidity, some plant protein in the diet serves them very well. I don't think we should be feeding a hill of beans every day, but some occasional peas, beans, or alfalfa is actually very good for them.

Similarly, I think broccoli, cauliflower, spinach, chard, bok choy, carrot, yam, bell pepper, mushrooms, squash and other similar items are fine to feed once in a while. Just not large amounts on a daily basis.

So Sir Prince, some of that stuff once in a while is okay, but make sure your tortoise is well hydrated with frequent soaks, and make sure that the majority of the diet is comprised of the right stuff like broadleaf weeds, leaves and other good stuff.


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## sir prince (Oct 27, 2017)

Tom said:


> Just for the sake of conversation…
> 
> In years past, we all were told that protein was the cause of pyramiding. Protein became vilified to the point where some tortoises were becoming protein deficient. Richard Fife tells a great story of a time when he was doing a feeding trial for a company with a prepared food. All was going well for months, then one day all the tortoises on the prepared food started crashing and he couldn't see why. He called the company to ask. Apparently, they had brought in a "focus group" of tortoise keepers, and all of them said they would never feed that prepared food because it had a protein level of 11-12% and all these tortoise owners felt that was much too high. So the food company reformulated to bring protein level down to 4% and the customer tortoise owners all thought it was much better that way. Unfortunately, by following customer emotions instead of scientific fact, the new low protein formulation of tortoise food was unable to sustain tortoise life. Necropsy revealed protein deficiency in the test subjects. Richard was able to save most of them by switched to Mazuri which has a "high" protein level of 15%. Protein is not the enemy. Our tortoises need protein to survive and thrive. Its all a question of how much and how often, and how well hydrated they are. They need good hydration with a higher protein intake. The old routine of soaking once a week, or never, and living in a dry ultra low humidity enclosure would not be good for a tortoise eating 15% protein food items. In the new routine of daily soaks for babies and frequent soaks for adults, coupled with damp substrate and moderate to high humidity, some plant protein in the diet serves them very well. I don't think we should be feeding a hill of beans every day, but some occasional peas, beans, or alfalfa is actually very good for them.
> 
> ...


Prince has veggie leafs everywhere I grow my own where he has access I cut up raw veggies daily he eats if he wants. I think he only ate the cooked veggies because I was hand feeding it one time. As for soaking I do that daily and he has a pond if he chooses to use. Thankyou all for the advice..


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## Tom (Oct 27, 2017)

sir prince said:


> Prince has veggie leafs everywhere I grow my own where he has access I cut up raw veggies daily he eats if he wants. I think he only ate the cooked veggies because I was hand feeding it one time. As for soaking I do that daily and he has a pond if he chooses to use. Thankyou all for the advice..



Just to be clear and make sure we are talking about the same thing, I define "veggies" as store bought leafy greens and other human foods. This should make up very little of any tortoises diet. Their diet should be mostly broadleaf weeds, leaves, flowers, grasses for the grass eating species (Not Russians.), and some protein and mushrooms for "forest" species.

So when you say "veggies", what are you referring to?

Here is a list of food suggestions:
Mulberry leaves
Grape vine leaves
Hibiscus leaves
African hibiscus leaves
Blue hibiscus leaves
Rose of Sharon leaves
Rose leaves
Geraniums
Gazanias
Lavatera
Pansies
Petunias
Hostas
Honeysuckle
Cape honeysuckle
Leaves and blooms from any squash plant, like pumpkin, cucumber, summer squash, etc...
Young spineless opuntia cactus pads

Weeds: 
There are soooooooo many...
Dandelion
Mallow
Filaree
Smooth Sow thistle
Prickly Sow thistle
Milk thistle
Goat head weed
Cats ear
Nettles
Trefoil
Wild onion
Wild mustard
Wild Garlic
Clovers
Broadleaf plantain
Narrow leaf plantain
Chick weed
Hawksbit
Hensbit
Hawksbeard

Other good stuff:
"Testudo Seed Mix" from http://www.tortoisesupply.com/SeedMixes
Pasture mixes or other seeds from http://www.groworganic.com/seeds.html
Homegrown alfalfa
Mazuri Tortoise Chow
ZooMed Grassland Tortoise Food


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## sir prince (Oct 28, 2017)

Prince is a Russian tortoise. Cut veggies yes I mean store bought cauliflower, broccoli and occasionally cucumber he does not like carrots. I grow wild flowers like some mentioned, and vegetables just for leafs. He likes kale, romain and spinach to mention a few. He looks good, is active, eats and has regular stool/urine. So I'm guessing I'm doing something right.


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## Tom (Oct 28, 2017)

sir prince said:


> Prince is a Russian tortoise. Cut veggies yes I mean store bought cauliflower, broccoli and occasionally cucumber he does not like carrots. I grow wild flowers like some mentioned, and vegetables just for leafs. He likes kale, romain and spinach to mention a few.



I don't wish to argue or upset you, but the foods you are feeding are not a great diet for your tortoise. Sure they can survive on that sort of thing for a while, but they need things that the foods you are offering lack.

Broccoli and cauliflower aren't toxic, but they aren't great tortoise foods either. Too much and too often can cause problems. Same with spinach. The issue with cucumber is that it lacks fiber, lacks calcium and has the wrong calcium to phosphorous ratio. Same with most grocery store greens. If you must feed those foods, it would be best to amend them with some herbal hay, blended grass hay, soaked Mazuri tortoise chow or some soaked ZooMed Grassland pellets.

I'll bet if you look around your area, you'll be able to find some of the suggestions on the list above that are better food for your tortoise and usually free.


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## sir prince (Oct 29, 2017)

Oh no problem not upset that's what a forum is. I do have the pellets but I have not been able to get him to eat them. I have no problem looking for the hays.


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## sir prince (Oct 29, 2017)

sir prince said:


> Oh no problem not upset that's what a forum is. I do have the pellets but I have not been able to get him to eat them. I have no problem looking for the hays.


Also no mention of his pics? I tell him how handsome he is all the time. Lol


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