# Would like some opinions...



## Ander (Apr 30, 2014)

I know that this is probably pretty debatable and some people probably have very strong opinions on it. Before starting I would just like to point out that this is just something that I have thought about for only about a day and am not at all set on it. I also do not want everyone assuming that I am a bad person, I obviously care if I am coming on here to get opinions and the cons about it. 

I have one sulcata who I have had for a few years now who I love so much. I have always really, really wanted an aldabra. I live in florida, which I believe is a good place to raise them and I would an acre for it/them. I have done a lot of research on them and have slowly but surely been reading aldabraman's thread (Im in the 100's!) and i swear my heart starts racing every time i start looking at them!  I am so jealous of aldabraman and it would be a dream to be able to wake up to them every day. I have visited people with aldabras and I love their personality. My dream life would be to be able to have many many aldabras.
It really got me to thinking... I keep my sulcata (There is no way I could ever get rid of him!!) and I one day get a hatchling aldabra that I would always keep and raise. However once I really understand what it is like raising my own aldabra (I have done tons of research but I know theres nothing like the real thing and there will be lots of "tweaking"), one day many many years from now I buy about 5 more hatchling aldabras. I would have a large enclosure for them. I see that there are many people that do keep aldabras together with success, however I would be completely prepared to have separate enclosures if I ever need/if you guys thought it'd be better. I would raise them like my own, giving them the best care and I would love each and every one of them! Then after a few years when they are bigger, sell them (this is only if I haven't fallen in love with them) but keep my one aldabra and sully. And then maybe buy 5 more hatchlings and start over. 
I "think" this is what some people call a broker? And I know there are some TERRIBLE brokers and I cannot stand the stories I read about them! However I would not really be doing this for the money at all. I would have my regular job and be a "normal" (but tort obsessed) person, but I would have the hobby of raising young aldabras and later selling them. I would just be doing what I love, raising torts. They would get the best care and I would never never just sell to anyone (huge pet peeve of mine). And its not like I would really be relying on the money at all that I'd get from them. It'd mostly be for fun.
I know there is one thread titled something like "convince me not to get an aldabra" and a few people actually recommend that he gets a few aldabra hatchlings and sells them when they get too big for him to give them a good winter (he lived up north), so I know everybody is not against it. But just want to get some more opinions. 

Please again keep in mind that this is just something I have thought about lately and I am really coming on here for opinions. It would just be a hobby, I'm not trying to make a lot of money from this (after all there's tons of other much faster ways to get money). Please let me know what you guys think. Thank you


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## Yvonne G (Apr 30, 2014)

I've always thought I would like to do this with puppies and kittens. Who doesn't love the baby of the species!

As long as you provide the best care possible, I see nothing wrong with it. Naturally, I'd love to see a tortoise go to a forever home. Tortoises are territorial, and it might be hard for a tortoise to live most of its life in one home then be sold and have to get used to a new home, but its been done before.


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## Neal (Apr 30, 2014)

I don't have any issues with what you have described, provided that you are capable of raising healthy tortoises, make honest representations about the tortoises when trying to sell them, and if you generally use good business practices. This is the reality of how our hobby grows, and the more tortoises in (responsible) homes the better in my opinion.

Yes there are bad brokers out there, but there are also good brokers. I have a few acquaintances locally who breed tortoises and for one reason or another, don't want any sort of exposure at all in trying to sell them, yet they take very good care of their tortoises and produce great specimens. So I play the middle man. I generally don't sell them directly for my own reasons, but I will send them off to those who do...people I trust and have good reputations. This is a win win win for everyone. 

Even with my own hatchlings, I usually sell them off wholesale to those I trust will get them in responsible homes because I simply don't have time to deal with the shipping and communication side of selling them individually.

Again, if done responsibly, it perpetuates our hobby so I say go for it!


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## lisa127 (Apr 30, 2014)

I don't have a problem with doing it with tortoises. Seeing as they are delicate animals when babies, isn't it better that way for those who would love a tortoise but don't want the risk of raising a delicate baby?

I would have a huge problem with doing it with say, cats and dogs.


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## Ander (Apr 30, 2014)

Thanks guys, I was actually expecting to get shot down! Of course I will raise them the best I can, I couldn't live with myself if I didn't raise healthy torts. I have read aldabramans stories (I think their names were Hopie and Tuff?) and I truly was kind of inspired by them; I loved that he didn't give up on them and wasn't afraid to spend the time/money to get them what they deserved. Of course I would hope for getting healthy hatchlings, but I think I would really like it if I got a hatchling that seemed healthy the first few months/year of its life, and then later I see that there is something wrong, with it like Aldabraman's stories, and be able to nurse it back to health and, depending on if it is stable enough, give it to someone who understands the condition and be able to take care of it. I mean of course I wished every tortoise was healthy, but I would like to know that I was able to catch something wrong and take care of it, then have someone who wouldn't catch it or who would give up. Anyways, the main priority would to raise healthy babies and enjoy them all.


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## Tom (Apr 30, 2014)

Raising and selling 5 tortoises over the course of years does not make you a "broker". It makes you an interested hobbyist. You should feel free to buy, sell and raise whatever species you want. Nobody should have an issue with it as long as you are caring for them well and doing it all responsibly, which seems like you are from your post.

Have fun and enjoy your hobby!


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## Ander (Apr 30, 2014)

okay i feel much better about it now. i thought that i would be considered a "broker" and that people would assume what i was doing would be a bad thing. another question i have is do you think that the breeders would be okay with me doing this with their hatchlings? Of course I want the best still, so do you think a valuable breeder such as aldabraman would give me 5 babies at once? I understand why a breeder would rather them go to a forever home.


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## Yvonne G (Apr 30, 2014)

If you pay your money, the babies then belong to you. No one is going to make you sign a contract saying you can't sell them when they get bigger.

I operate a turtle and tortoise rescue. It bugs the heck out of me when I adopt out a tortoise, thinking I'm sending it to its new forever home, only to learn later that the tortoise has been sold (or given away). In my opinion, if you ADOPT a tortoise for free from a rescue, if you can no longer keep it you should offer it back to the rescue. But if you actually BUY a tortoise, it's yours to do with as you see fit.


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## T33's Torts (Apr 30, 2014)

I did this with snakes with a friend of mine. It wasn't fun to let them go, but I prefer working with the young ones rather than the adults.


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## Tom (Apr 30, 2014)

Ander said:


> ... so do you think a valuable breeder such as aldabraman would give me 5 babies at once?




Only one man can answer that question.


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## Jacqui (Apr 30, 2014)

Give you? no, sell you five? I doubt he would have a problem with it. But why wonder about it? It's so easy to just shoot him a message and get the asking over with.


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## Ander (Apr 30, 2014)

Yvonne that would really make me be upset too. I used to have sugar gliders when I was younger and as I got older I felt they deserved someone with more time. I found someone that I thought would really love on them and gave them to her for free WITH all their stuff, so that she could spend the money on their care. A week later I find an add on craigslist for something like $300, I was heartbroken. 
Jacqui, of course I meant sell  

@ALDABRAMAN could you give some input as to how breeders feel? Would/Have you sold 5 at a time, or to someone that may sell them in a few years? I completely understand both sides and really I'm still not even set on it and it'd be years from now, so its not going to hurt my feelings  Just wondering how other reputable breeders would feel about it.


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## Tom (Apr 30, 2014)

I'm not sure if I count as a reputable breeder, but I would be fine with it. I would gladly sell you a bunch of my babies as long as I knew you were going to care for them well for the time you had them. I'd probably even offer to buy them back from you later on.


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## ALDABRAMAN (Apr 30, 2014)

Ander said:


> Yvonne that would really make me be upset too. I used to have sugar gliders when I was younger and as I got older I felt they deserved someone with more time. I found someone that I thought would really love on them and gave them to her for free WITH all their stuff, so that she could spend the money on their care. A week later I find an add on craigslist for something like $300, I was heartbroken.
> Jacqui, of course I meant sell
> 
> @ALDABRAMAN could you give some input as to how breeders feel? Would/Have you sold 5 at a time, or to someone that may sell them in a few years? I completely understand both sides and really I'm still not even set on it and it'd be years from now, so its not going to hurt my feelings  Just wondering how other reputable breeders would feel about it.



* This is an interesting poll. My thoughts of a broker are those who buy/import in volumes to sell strictly for financial gain! We sell many to one customer, actually we sell the majority of our hatchlings in bulk. I have many customers that do exactly what you want to do, buy a few and raise them up for a future profit. I will say that the strongest and most consistent markets are young hatchlings and large adults.


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## wellington (Apr 30, 2014)

An animal broker is someone that sells for people that breed. Brokers do not do the breeding themselves. In the dog world, a broker is not a good thing at all. Most puppy mills uses brokers and most pet shops buy from brokers.

You would be a breeder, raising tortoises to sell at a later date. Good luck and let us know if or when you actually start and of course share pics


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## ALDABRAMAN (Apr 30, 2014)

wellington said:


> An animal broker is someone that sells for people that breed. Brokers do not do the breeding themselves. In the dog world, a broker is not a good thing at all. Most puppy mills uses brokers and most pet shops buy from brokers.
> 
> You would be a breeder, raising tortoises to sell at a later date. Good luck and let us know if or when you actually start and of course share pics



* Yes, I agree!


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## Ander (May 1, 2014)

@Tom , i don't know if its because i have a sulcata and because i read all of your sulcata threads or what, but i for some reason only assumed that you only have sulcatas. now i remember that you do have several species, do you have any aldabras too? 

@ALDABRAMAN thank you so much for your input, i appreciate it!

@wellington thank you for clearing that up for me!

I will let you all know if I start someday, I can't wait!


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## Tom (May 1, 2014)

No Aldabras for me. My climate is all wrong for them. Much too dry. I've got a few other species though.


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