# Problem with rescued dt



## armandoarturo (Sep 22, 2014)

Hello everyone... A firend of mine rescued a DT that was kept under really bad conditions. I didnt get much information. The thing is that as soon as I got it, i knew there was something wrong with her back legs. I dont really think it could be mbd. Since I believe they got it from the Wild as an adult. (Just my guessing). Also ive seen mbd and tortoises kind of pull themselves with the front legs. 
I got it about 3 weeks ago. To be honest, there is NO herp, or specialist vet that could really help in town, althought I will be taking her for a check up, just in case they can do something, I really think she should get an x ray to see if its something wrong inside. Dont judge me for taking so long to go to the vet. Its expensive and Ive been earning the money to do it.

Here is a video of her. She is not actually walking but You can somehow realize what it looks like when she is trying to move. (Sorry for the noise, gardner was mowning the grass)






She eats well, and i have feeled the soft área inside the back legs and cant feel anything. (Like when You feel eggs) 

Any help, or suggestions are truly appreciated . i Will let you guys know as soon as I get an opinion from the vet.


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## russian/sulcata/tortoise (Sep 22, 2014)

wow i have never seen this. idk maybe one of her legs are broken.


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## armandoarturo (Sep 22, 2014)

Yes, ive been thinking it could be a broken bone, or maybe a stone, bladder stone or something like that. This is the first time i get to see this :/


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## russian/sulcata/tortoise (Sep 22, 2014)

hopefully a more experienced tort owner joins this thread and has an answer for you


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## ascott (Sep 22, 2014)

Almost looks like the tort is not mentally in tune with the motion??? Does that make sense....what is that surface that it is on? Does the tort get to walk on the actual ground? if yes, does the same motion happen?


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## ascott (Sep 22, 2014)

The tort has been doing this for some time...you can see the wear of shell pattern on its sides as well as on the front power leg...it appears rubbed clear of color as well....


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## tortdad (Sep 22, 2014)

How odd 


0.0.1 Redfoot (Spike)
0.0.1 Cherryhead Redfoot (Bruce Wayne)
1.0 Sulcata (Hal Jordan)


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## tglazie (Sep 22, 2014)

This could be very bad. My sulcata Jerry exhibited similar symptoms four years ago. It started with him moving less, then he started dragging his back legs. Keep in mind that before this, he was a dominant, seventy five pound, ten year old male with serious attitude. All of a sudden, he was reduced to weakness. I took him into the vet, thinking that he had broken his legs or hurt his head, something to explain the sudden debilitation. Dr. McGeehee, my vet here in San Antonio, took some x-rays, did some tests, then told me that he had seen this before, in another sulcata, one that was kept in a mixed collection like mine. He said that the other tortoise wasn't exposed to the other torts through living in the same enclosure, but he suspected that this had something to do with it, that they suffered cross contamination from an owner moving from one enclosure to another. I don't know how he could be certain of this; that's just what he told me. 

What is most unfortunate concerning this story is that Jerry died one year later, despite my vet's best efforts. The debilitation of Jerry's legs quickly turned into a degeneration of his spine, and soon enough, he was struggling to breathe. You should get your tortoise checked out. I haven't been so unlucky as to have this happen to any of my tortoises again, but my vet said he had seen it occur in several Russians, a sulcata, and even one redfoot. I don't know of the status of this degenerative illness, if research has since yielded a cure or, at the very least, more effective treatment. But this problem must be treated as serious. If you're lucky, the tortoise is simply injured. Injuries can heal. But the illness that took Jerry, that was a death sentence. 

T.G.


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## armandoarturo (Sep 22, 2014)

Tglazie that really is a sad story. 
I will be visiting the vet tomorrow. 
I dont know about the past of this tortoise, im trying to get the last Owner to get as much info as I can get.

Ascot, most of my backyard has soil and grass, and a concrete sidewalk.
The tort walks the same way in all the surfaces. 

It kind of lifts herself with one leg, but it lifts a lot from that same side. And keeps going on that way.

I will post what the vet says tomorrow.
Thanks for the help!!!


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## armandoarturo (Sep 25, 2014)

So... I just came in from the vet.
She used an ultrasound to see if everything was right.
She says all the organs look good.
Its not gout.
Its not kidney/bladder stones.
No egg bound.
No broken bones.
And everything seems to be running very well.
She will send the ultrasound video to me, and I will post it in here as soon as I get it.
She also says that the tortoise is underweight, and it doesnt have strong muscle in the back legs.
She told me to boost up calcium, and lots of sunshine. (which I already knew that was needed) .
She says it could be some sort of mbd, but we are very confused by the way it walks.... Usually mbd tortoises lift well with front legs, and usually push/slide with the hind legs. But this one lifts itself up from the sides.
I got a better video, where you guys will be able to see how it actually moves, since the last video she didnt walk much.

Here she is trying to reach my hand with a slice of italian squash. (chill out, she is in the sidewalk of my house wich has concrete, dont worry, most of (if not all ) of my backyard is filled up with grass and weeds, I placed her in there to get a clear view ). (just saying )







And!!!! I almost forget....
I finally got to talk to the previous owner, he keeps his tortoises in a very LITTLE backyard, they dont get direct sunlight since theres a huge tree in there.
They took her from the wild, and she was fed 100% pure iceber lettuce all of the time.


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## russian/sulcata/tortoise (Sep 25, 2014)

i was thinking maybe she was on of those badly cared for torts that never moves, that just sit in a small area. maybe she never really learned now to walk properly.


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## chaseswife (Sep 25, 2014)

russian/sulcata/tortoise said:


> i was thinking maybe she was on of those badly cared for torts that never moves, that just sit in a small area. maybe she never really learned now to walk properly.



This is what I was thinking too. It almost seems like she just doesn't know how to move herself.


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## russian/sulcata/tortoise (Sep 25, 2014)

its so sad how can some one can take something so beautiful from the wild and give it such improper care. again WHAT IS WRONG WITH PEOPLE


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## chaseswife (Sep 25, 2014)

Thinking on it a little bit more, she reminds me a lot of my human babies when they haven't learned to crawl yet but really want to get somewhere. They swipe awkwardly with their arms and push upwards with their legs so they get the side to side wobble but no forward movement. So much energy used, but nothing to show for it. If babies didn't progress from this, Dr's would push for physical therapy. Is tortoise physical therapy even a thing? 

Sorry- i have tons of experience with human babies. Not so much tortoises.


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## russian/sulcata/tortoise (Sep 25, 2014)

lol. i know like nothhing about babies besides they are squishy lol.


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## chaseswife (Sep 25, 2014)

Yeah- 4 younger brothers, too many cousins to count, 16 neices and nephews, spent time working at a daycare, volunteered at the child crisis center during highschool, and now 5 kids of my own. I am more nervous about taking care of my 5 1/2 week old sulcata than I was when I brought home my first squishy baby.


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## russian/sulcata/tortoise (Sep 25, 2014)

my little sister was born when i was 6 so i kinda remember when she was a baby. but during the summer i work at a camp for 4-11 year olds.


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## russian/sulcata/tortoise (Sep 25, 2014)

on the Eiffel tower


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## Maro2Bear (Sep 25, 2014)

Very sad to see your DT struggling like that. Maybe you can make a mini skateboard and prop him up on it that will hold the majority of his weight. Then He'll be able to slightly push himself and maybe help slowly strengthen his legs. I'm sure plenty of food and TLC will help as well.


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## armandoarturo (Sep 25, 2014)

Well, like i said, previous owner says he kept her 7 years. And started to show this walking symptoms a couple of months ago, im thinking somewhen around april / may. So the tortoise does knows how to walk, besides she was taken from the wild, and was already an adult. I dont think she doesnt knows how to move.
It is very sad, im worried that she could take a wrong step and could flip over or something. 
I was also thinking about the board, Something like that would be Cool. 

I guess ill just have to be patient and give it time. Im starting to add calcium with d3 to the food, and im guessing i will be making her eat more. And she wont be hibernating this winter.

Any other ideas of what could be causing this ???????? :/


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## russian/sulcata/tortoise (Sep 25, 2014)

i hope you tort get better


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## BeeBee*BeeLeaves (Sep 26, 2014)

Is there a possibility that it got heat stroke at some point and has a little bit of brain damage?
I know you said there was a large tree, shade and all, but it could have been tipped over in the sun and unable to right itself, or wedged where there is sun, and overheated one day. Just a thought. Although how would we ever now that for sure. 

I am so glad this little one will be getting much better care with you. Yay! 

About the former keepers. Education is everything. Sometimes people just do not know any better. 
They may have thought they were doing the right thing. Survive and thrive are two different things, right?

Which is why this forum is so awesome for little chelonians everywhere. Information/knowledge is power!
More TFO members = more info = more happy, healthy tortoises and turtles. : )


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## armandoarturo (Sep 27, 2014)

BeeBee, I also thought that it could be for something like that.
Does anyone know what are the symptoms of an overheated tortoise??
Could this be the reason of this?


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## Yvonne G (Sep 27, 2014)

My gut response when I saw the second video was to immobilize the legs in some way, give lots of calcium and sunshine and feed well. Immobilization would give the joints/muscles time to heal without moving. Then after a week or so, remove the restraints and put in a small enclosure with very good traction and allow minimal exercise. Water therapy might be a good idea too. Figure out a way to keep the tortoise floating and put it in enough water that the legs don't touch the bottom.


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## ascott (Sep 27, 2014)

> I finally got to talk to the previous owner, he keeps his _tortoises_ in a very LITTLE backyard, they dont get direct sunlight since theres a _huge tree_ in there.



So this person has others still, are they all the same species? You show "tortoises"....what type of tree is in the yard?
_*
*_


> _*They took her from the wild*_, and she was fed 100% pure iceber lettuce all of the time.



This tort is not a baby/hatchling....so how long has the tort been in the care of these people? I mean, if the tort was in the wild for most of the time it grew to this size and then was placed into the poor environment I don't believe the iceberg alone was the key problem here....was there any grass in the small space? Were there any other CDTs in the yard?


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## ascott (Sep 27, 2014)

That tort looks as though it ate something toxic and the results are what you see....however, there is no way for me to know that for certain...


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## armandoarturo (Sep 30, 2014)

Will follow your advice yvonne.

Ascott, they are all gopherus a. I already saw a picture. There must be 5 more in there. The place looks small... I guess 3x3 meters. No grass, the tree seems to be a big mezquite.
I also thought it couldnt be mbd, since it was taken from the wild a san adult, but it has been this way for about 7 years. Can you imagine this??

Im trying my best to go there and show this guy a lesson!


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## ascott (Sep 30, 2014)

I wonder if the tortoise was bitten by something venomous? What are the common snakes in the area? Man, this motion just looks like a direct result of an event....not as a result of care....


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## ascott (Sep 30, 2014)

So, the tort wants to move wants to eat and participate right....you may just need to nurse him right now--hand feeding, supervised soaks and such...perhaps the tort will work through this...if it is indeed an event based issue...gosh, this is really going to bug me....


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## Madortoise (Oct 7, 2014)

Any progress with rehabilitation?


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## armandoarturo (Oct 12, 2014)

Hello, thanks for asking Mado.
Nothing new. 
Im giving lots of calcium and healthy food...
Lots of sunshine.
I havent been able to inmobilize the back legs, because Ive been having much at work, and I wouldnt feel good leaving her tied up while im not here.
Im thinking about taking her inside, with an UV lamp and then immobilize the legs and keep up with the calcium with d3.
Its very frustrating... do you guys think she can recover??
The vet said she can, but to be honest, I dont really trust the her, I mean... she is the only one in town that knows about exotic pets, but still...
To be honest I trust more in what you guys say....


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## Yvonne G (Oct 13, 2014)

I have seen pictures of where a vet has moved the back leg up into the leg cavity, then taped it in place so it can't come back out.


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## sissyofone (Oct 13, 2014)

its so sad￼ how can some one can take something so beautiful from the wild and give it such improper care.￼ again WHAT IS WRONG WITH PEOPLE￼￼

I totally agree R/S/T.


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