# Long worm



## karalisa78 (Feb 19, 2013)

Bought a Greek tortoise as a companion for my Russian 4 days ago from Petsmart. She is very alert, friendly and seems healthy, but wouldn't eat. I tried all sorts of things, and today, ended up giving her a good soak. She has had some healthy poops, a couple of orange ones, but since they had just gotten her from a breeder, I thought it was just her diet...anyways, after the soak, I was watching to see if she would go eat when she let out a little squeak and all of a sudden there was a worm. No poop, but this live, long, skinny worm. Looked like a small, long earthworm. I instantly separated the two and took the worm out, after a picture, called the Petstore and took her back.

When they saw the picture, they said it looked like something she had eaten and not a parasite, and that it was probably causing a blockage which is why she wouldn't eat. They are taking her to the vet, but I'm skeptical. The worm was whole, and I've had her for 4 days! Would it be possible? I'm really worried about my other tort and even my kids who have been loving on her. Any thought?


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## Jacqui (Feb 19, 2013)

I too am very much a skeptic on what your being told. First off, I have yet to see any of my tortoises swallow a worm whole. They tend to bite it and rip at it. This worm was pretty good size in relationship to the tortoise also correct? Not saying that could not have happened, but I have my concerns. Next this worm stayed alive and unharmed inside the tortoise for four days? It wasn't getting digested at all as it passed through the tortoise's system? Hmmm.

Now the part about the worm causing the tortoise not to eat, is most likely true. The tortoise will be needing atleast two treatments and during that time you might want to keep it on something like newspaper or paper towels which are easy to toss and clean. The enclosure you had them in will need to be cleaned, substrate tossed, and the rest disinfected. Now the bad news, if wormy tortoise was in with your other tortoise, guess what he should be wormed too. Also keep in mind, a negative fecal test does not mean there are no worms, just that no worms or eggs showed up in the sample that was tested.


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## theelectraco (Feb 19, 2013)

karalisa78 said:


> Bought a Greek tortoise as a companion for my Russian 4 days ago from Petsmart. She is very alert, friendly and seems healthy, but wouldn't eat. I tried all sorts of things, and today, ended up giving her a good soak. She has had some healthy poops, a couple of orange ones, but since they had just gotten her from a breeder, I thought it was just her diet...anyways, after the soak, I was watching to see if she would go eat when she let out a little squeak and all of a sudden there was a worm. No poop, but this live, long, skinny worm. Looked like a small, long earthworm. I instantly separated the two and took the worm out, after a picture, called the Petstore and took her back.
> 
> When they saw the picture, they said it looked like something she had eaten and not a parasite, and that it was probably causing a blockage which is why she wouldn't eat. They are taking her to the vet, but I'm skeptical. The worm was whole, and I've had her for 4 days! Would it be possible? I'm really worried about my other tort and even my kids who have been loving on her. Any thought?



If the worm was live, obviously it was a parasite and needs dewormed. Sometimes long stem fibers can look like worms but if its wiggling you cant mistake it lol. They can have worms for a while and not show signs of them that are visible. Are you waiting to repurchase it or what? It will take a while so I wouldn't wait around, plus your Russian is fine without a friend. It's probably not eating from, the stress of shipment and environmental changes if they had just received it and then you purchased it soon after.




Jacqui said:


> I too am very much a skeptic on what your being told. First off, I have yet to see any of my tortoises swallow a worm whole. They tend to bite it and rip at it. This worm was pretty good size in relationship to the tortoise also correct? Not saying that could not have happened, but I have my concerns. Next this worm stayed alive and unharmed inside the tortoise for four days? It wasn't getting digested at all as it passed through the tortoise's system? Hmmm.
> 
> Now the part about the worm causing the tortoise not to eat, is most likely true. The tortoise will be needing atleast two treatments and during that time you might want to keep it on something like newspaper or paper towels which are easy to toss and clean. The enclosure you had them in will need to be cleaned, substrate tossed, and the rest disinfected. Now the bad news, if wormy tortoise was in with your other tortoise, guess what he should be wormed too. Also keep in mind, a negative fecal test does not mean there are no worms, just that no worms or eggs showed up in the sample that was tested.



As Jacqui said also, it's going to be awhile if you do want to eventually repurchase the tortoise. we are currently deworming a Redfoot. Took about 3 weeks to recover, was dewormed twice, lost a lot of weight and was off food. So now were waiting for it to put on some weight and pass its 3rd fecal exam before it is ready to be sold.


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## karalisa78 (Feb 19, 2013)

It was defiantly a worm, and yes, very large. The lady at the store owns multiple tortoises and says she's seen lots of worms, nothing like this...that's why she thought that. I totally cleaned/disinfected everything, and they said they would pay for my other torts treatment of worms if it came back. Uggghhh


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## theelectraco (Feb 19, 2013)

I doubt that it is actually a worm that was fed because it isn't policy to feed them worms plus I'm pretty sure it would be digested and not whole upon exit. Orange poo also doesn't sound very normal but idk what they were feeding. My stores torts get to have whatever my tort at home has so they're lucky >.<




karalisa78 said:


> It was defiantly a worm, and yes, very large. The lady at the store owns multiple tortoises and says she's seen lots of worms, nothing like this...that's why she thought that. I totally cleaned/disinfected everything, and they said they would pay for my other torts treatment of worms if it came back. Uggghhh



Care to post the picture lol?


Also, are Greeks and Russians supposed to be housed together? Everything I have read here says not to mix species.


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## karalisa78 (Feb 19, 2013)

They told me they were all screened before being sold, so I'm pretty upset that this happened. I really don't want my little guy getting sick. 


I don't know if I could stomach it again, but maybe it would be helpful? The tortoise lady said they'd be fine together. Wonder if that's not correct too.


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## sibi (Feb 19, 2013)

You did the right thing. Returning the tort so that they can get it to the vet is their responsibility. Now, you have two problems. 1. you need to get your russian tort de-wormed, regardless of what the fecal test reveal. 2. you need to decide if you are going to keep your greek after this. Unfortunately, oral meds for de-worming can be difficult to administer, and your tort may miss some of the medicine. So, make sure your vet gives you extra medicine. Also, after a good period of time, have your russian tested once more. You want to make sure he is clean of worms because worms can kill your tort. As far as your greek is concerned, if they have taken care of the worms, that shouldn't stop you from taking him back home. But, like your russian, you would need to have him checked once again to make sure he is worm-free. Finally, I would never put different species of torts together. Your russian don't need a buddy; likewise, your greek don't need a buddy either. They should have different enclosures and never put together. I have read that Russian torts can be very aggressive and pick on your greek tort. I wouldn't risk it if I were you.


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## theelectraco (Feb 19, 2013)

Worms aren't always visible, especially if the tort isn't being soaked cus the poop usually breaks down in the water and you can see the contents. And if you purchased it shortly after they received it then there probably weren't too many opportunities to be alerted that they may have worms. It took a few weeks before I noticed one of our Redfoots had worms because there were never any visible in the poop and the tort was acting fine.




sibi said:


> You did the right thing. Returning the tort so that they can get it to the vet is their responsibility. Now, you have two problems. 1. you need to get your russian tort de-wormed, regardless of what the fecal test reveal. 2. you need to decide if you are going to keep your greek after this. Unfortunately, oral meds for de-worming can be difficult to administer, and your tort may miss some of the medicine. So, make sure your vet gives you extra medicine. Also, after a good period of time, have your russian tested once more. You want to make sure he is clean of worms because worms can kill your tort. As far as your greek is concerned, if they have taken care of the worms, that shouldn't stop you from taking him back home. But, like your russian, you would need to have him checked once again to make sure he is worm-free. Finally, I would never put different species of torts together. Your russian don't need a buddy; likewise, your greek don't need a buddy either. They should have different enclosures and never put together.



The Greek was the Petsmarts tortoise which she returned I don't think she has plans of getting rid of her original Russian




karalisa78 said:


> They told me they were all screened before being sold, so I'm pretty upset that this happened. I really don't want my little guy getting sick.
> 
> 
> I don't know if I could stomach it again, but maybe it would be helpful? The tortoise lady said they'd be fine together. Wonder if that's not correct too.





Just because she owns tortoises doesn't mean she knows all about them. I wouldn't trust her judgement 100%. You should let her know species shouldn't be mixed if you see her again and she probably can't Identify worms correctly


Post the picture!


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## karalisa78 (Feb 19, 2013)

Here it is for identification.


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## theelectraco (Feb 19, 2013)

karalisa78 said:


> Here it is for identification.



That does not look anything like the worms the tortoise I recently dewormed had. Hopefully someone with more worm experience will chime in but now I understand why the lady helping you said it doesn't look like any worm she's even seen.


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## CtTortoiseMom (Feb 19, 2013)

Cool, I am so glad you took a picture. It is a fluke worm. My sulcata had fluke worms and the vet gave him oral droncit. It's not a big deal and easily treatable.


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## theelectraco (Feb 19, 2013)

I'd like to note that all the visible worms in the tortoise poop that I have seen have been dead tho.




CtTortoiseMom said:


> Cool, I am so glad you took a picture. It is a fluke worm. My sulcata had fluke worms and the vet gave him oral droncit. It's not a big deal and easily treatable.



Do these specific worms usually come out alive more often then a more common parasitic worm? OP, now that you have an ID, you should let the pet store know so they can use that as a reference for the vet.


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## karalisa78 (Feb 19, 2013)

CtTortoiseMom said:


> Cool, I am so glad you took a picture. It is a fluke worm. My sulcata had fluke worms and the vet gave him oral droncit. It's not a big deal and easily treatable.






theelectraco said:


> I'd like to note that all the visible worms in the tortoise poop that I have seen have been dead tho.
> 
> 
> 
> Do these specific worms usually come out alive more often then a more common parasitic worm? OP, now that you have an ID, you should let the pet store know so they can use that as a reference for the vet.







CtTortoiseMom said:


> Cool, I am so glad you took a picture. It is a fluke worm. My sulcata had fluke worms and the vet gave him oral droncit. It's not a big deal and easily treatable.




Wow! I'm so glad you know what it is! Bleh! That thing was nasty! I will give them a call tomorrow, get my RT in to be treated, and will sadly not end up getting her again, as I wanted to house them together, and have done some research and you are all right, it is not a good idea.  Hoping to find an RT (female) that he will like. He is a hyper little guy, loves playing and being very social, which is why he seemed to like her so much. She will make a great pet for someone. Darn!


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## CtTortoiseMom (Feb 19, 2013)

The vet will be able to figure it out in two second's with a fecal test. You should have them do a fecal test, and they should pay for the treatment and you can administer the treatment at home. I bet it is infected by more than one type of worm. My sulcata was. I think that no matter how a tortoise is acquired it should always be taken by the new owner to get checked by a vet. It establishes a good baseline for the tortoises health and is a great resource if your tortoise actually gets sick in the future.


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## theelectraco (Feb 19, 2013)

Don't forget to isolate your new tortoise if you do decide on getting one so you can avoid this happening again! Keep them separated for a few months and if all is well then they can share an enclosure. Your Russian is perfectly happy by himself tho


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## karalisa78 (Feb 19, 2013)

CtTortoiseMom said:


> The vet will be able to figure it out in two second's with a fecal test. You should have them do a fecal test, and they should pay for the treatment and you can administer the treatment at home. I bet it is infected by more than one type of worm. My sulcata was. I think that no matter how a tortoise is acquired it should always be taken by the new owner to get checked by a vet. It establishes a good baseline for the tortoises health and is a great resource if your tortoise actually gets sick in the future.



Awesome! Thanks! I also have a Great Dane! My hubby calls me an animal hoarder. Lol!


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## CtTortoiseMom (Feb 19, 2013)

That's cool you have a Great Dane too. I want to change my guess too roundworm. It is not light like one but I am thinking it is just a little yucky. Either way, the vet will surely know what it is.


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## karalisa78 (Feb 20, 2013)

A better option? Is it fairly easy to do at home or should I have them do it there?




karalisa78 said:


> A better option? Is it fairly easy to do at home or should I have them do it there?



Sorry, that posted weird...Petsmart is being really good about it. They are paying to treat my Russian as well, and offered to treat him in house. What do you think would be better for a new tortoise owner? Would it be easy to treat at home?


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## CtTortoiseMom (Feb 20, 2013)

I would let them do it, and take him home when they are done, and wait a a couple months and have the tortoise re-checked by a vet. You just have to bring a poop sample. Then if it is still positive than you can treat at home. You will be more comfortable with your tortoise by then and it wont seem overwhelming.

I am glad to hear positive things about a pet store.


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## theelectraco (Feb 20, 2013)

The vet is offering to treat in house or petsmart is? Personally I would have the vet do the actual medicating but keep him at home.with you for recovery. You dont REALLY know the habitat the vet will have set up and food they offer plus noone will taoe better care of your baby better than you.


I am a new tortoise owner, have had my redfoot for 3 months, and I was.able to medicate him fine cus he had a uri when i got him. I wouldnt let the vet nor petsmart have my tort in house for recovery, it can take a few weeks to recover. In your case you dont know your tort for sure has worms yet and of it does he was only recently exposed and hopefully has a.small parasite load so it may not take as long, but i would still want the tort with me so i know its eating and being.taken care of.properly


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## Jacqui (Feb 20, 2013)

I would set up two enclosures just using plastic totes (for ease of cleaning) and leave them pretty bare because you going to want to keep them well cleaned. The original enclosure also needs a complete cleaning due to their may be eggs there. I would want to keep the animals myself, just to keep an eye on them and give them good care. The Russian and the Greek really will need their own homes after all is said and done.


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## theelectraco (Feb 20, 2013)

She already returned the Greek and is not going to repurchase it.


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## Yvonne G (Feb 20, 2013)

karalisa78 said:


> Bought a Greek tortoise as a companion for my Russian 4 days ago from Petsmart.



In my opinion, different species of tortoise should not be placed in the same habitat. One reason is that they might make each other sick, but another reason is that they don't need company. Tortoises are solitary creatures, only coming together during breeding. They like to have their own hiding place and not have to compete with another tortoise for the food. You may end up with lots of fighting if you put them together.


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## Jacqui (Feb 20, 2013)

theelectraco said:


> She already returned the Greek and is not going to repurchase it.



Thanks I overlooked that. I guess now would be a good time to tell you that getting just one female Russian would not be helping matters much. More then likely the male would bother the female too much. Two females to one male works better.


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## theelectraco (Feb 20, 2013)

I agree with Jacqui, and you're better off just keeping your little dude by himself.


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## CtTortoiseMom (Feb 20, 2013)

theelectraco said:


> The vet is offering to treat in house or petsmart is? Personally I would have the vet do the actual medicating but keep him at home.with you for recovery. You dont REALLY know the habitat the vet will have set up and food they offer plus noone will taoe better care of your baby better than you.
> 
> 
> I am a new tortoise owner, have had my redfoot for 3 months, and I was.able to medicate him fine cus he had a uri when i got him. I wouldnt let the vet nor petsmart have my tort in house for recovery, it can take a few weeks to recover. In your case you dont know your tort for sure has worms yet and of it does he was only recently exposed and hopefully has a.small parasite load so it may not take as long, but i would still want the tort with me so i know its eating and being.taken care of.properly




Oh, good point, I thought we were talking about a vet that is in the pet store administering droncit or pannacur or whatever and then her taking the tort home. A pet store is not a vet.


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## theelectraco (Feb 20, 2013)

I'm going to assume that PetSmart is willing to pay for in house treatment at the vet, because it would definately be against policy for them to treat an animal that isn't their own in their store. Either way, I would definately let the vet deal with the medicating, even if it means going to the vet once a day to a few days to have them administer it, and then keep the tortoise at home for recovery. As long as your tortoise doesn't go off his food his recovery should be quick and complication free. If he goes off food it may be a little extra work.


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## karalisa78 (Feb 20, 2013)

Just got a call back. It is a roundworm. They have the medication for my RT, and said they will give him the first dose. He only needs 2 doses, so I will give him the 2nd and keep him home. I'm going to put him in a tote. What should I use for substrate? Also...I just thoroughly cleaned his environment yesterday, do I need to do it again? Really appreciate all the help!


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## theelectraco (Feb 20, 2013)

karalisa78 said:


> Just got a call back. It is a roundworm. They have the medication for my RT, and said they will give him the first dose. He only needs 2 doses, so I will give him the 2nd and keep him home. I'm going to put him in a tote. What should I use for substrate? Also...I just thoroughly cleaned his environment yesterday, do I need to do it again? Really appreciate all the help!



I would use newspaper for substrate and change daily until treatment is complete. Who do you mean by they? Will a PetSmart associate be administering the first series of meds or the Vet?


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## CtTortoiseMom (Feb 20, 2013)

theelectraco said:


> karalisa78 said:
> 
> 
> > Just got a call back. It is a roundworm. They have the medication for my RT, and said they will give him the first dose. He only needs 2 doses, so I will give him the 2nd and keep him home. I'm going to put him in a tote. What should I use for substrate? Also...I just thoroughly cleaned his environment yesterday, do I need to do it again? Really appreciate all the help!
> ...



Newspaper or paper towels is good for your "hospital" enclosure.I think the treatment is just a powder that you can sprinkle over food. It is really easy to give. The Droncit was a lot harder because it came in a syrynge and I had to squirt it in my big sully's mouth. I used strawberries for the powder treatment.


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## theelectraco (Feb 20, 2013)

CtTortoiseMom said:


> Newspaper or paper towels is good for your "hospital" enclosure.I think the treatment is just a powder that you can sprinkle over food. It is really easy to give. The Droncit was a lot harder because it came in a syrynge and I had to squirt it in my big sully's mouth. I used strawberries for the powder treatment.



Hopefully you get the powder. I had to use an oral treatment and it was a little tuff getting the tort to take it. If you can sneak it in his food and he will eat it all then that would be great, but if not syringe forcing it may be necessary and you will have to pry your torts mouth open :/ I had to use tweezers to get mine to open his mouth and take the meds.


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## CtTortoiseMom (Feb 20, 2013)

theelectraco said:


> CtTortoiseMom said:
> 
> 
> > Newspaper or paper towels is good for your "hospital" enclosure.I think the treatment is just a powder that you can sprinkle over food. It is really easy to give. The Droncit was a lot harder because it came in a syrynge and I had to squirt it in my big sully's mouth. I used strawberries for the powder treatment.
> ...



That is terrible, I am sorry you both had to go through that! I pretended to feed a cactus pad and when he opened his mouth to bite the cactus pad I squirted it in.


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## theelectraco (Feb 20, 2013)

CtTortoiseMom said:


> That is terrible, I am sorry you both had to go through that! I pretended to feed a cactus pad and when he opened his mouth to bite the cactus pad I squirted it in.



Yeah it wasn't fun, if he was still eating it would have been easier but he wasn't


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## Laura (Feb 20, 2013)

Fluke worm or round worm? some meds work better then others to get rid of different worms.. ID it first..


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## CtTortoiseMom (Feb 20, 2013)

She said they said it was round worm.


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## karalisa78 (Feb 21, 2013)

Ok, update...got the meds yesterday and we were not able to give them to him. He would not open his mouth! They said for me to take him home and try, but still couldn't. Ended up injecting into a banana, most of which he ate this am(it sat out all night) but I'm worried he didn't get it all. 

The vet has no idea how to treat tortoises so when I called this am, they were clueless. The prescribed pyrantel. Just making sure that's ok, because now my tort is super sleepy.


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## Eloise's mommy (Feb 21, 2013)

I don't think it's a fluke worm I think it's Ascarids. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ascaris

Sorry I got behind while researching and then finished up reading and you already know it's a roundworm.....glad they got your RT treated and how scarey this whole ordeal must be!!! for you and your little guy too bad you had to take the new baby back but in the end you RT will appreciate not having to compete.


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## karalisa78 (Feb 21, 2013)

This is so gross. Petsmart reassured me this type could not be transferred to humans, but now I'm wondering. Ugggh!


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