# Moving overseas!



## devsharkey (Aug 4, 2013)

Hello! So my girlfriend and I live in Arizona, and in February, we'll be moving to Manchester, England.

I have two Greeks, will I be able to take them with me? How would I go about doing that, if I could?

Thanks everyone~!


----------



## Terry Allan Hall (Aug 5, 2013)

Likely some sort of quarantine period...no idea what the exact requirement would be, though. And a clean bill of health from your veternarian, in writing, may be required.

Hopefully someone'll join this thread with more exact information.


----------



## FLINTUS (Aug 5, 2013)

Welcome to England-soon. Yes, you will be able to take them with you by animal transport planes, but we are probably talking mid-top end of 3 figure sums. You will have to apply for A10's from DEFRA to take them into the EU, as these prove they are CB-all appendix 1 species, like graeca, radiated, hermanni etc. need them in the EU as we are trying to fully stop WC specimens of these species and while you can legally keep them without A10's you cannot sell or bring from one country to another. If you're going between countries in the EU you need the A10's as well, but you can travel freely through Europe with them. The UK has quite strict rules regarding quarantine, I would suspect 6 months and a clean bill of health. The weather is much colder than Arizona here, but as long as you have a small inside enclosure for those few days it gets frosty after they've woke from hibernation, you should be able to keep them out 24/7 with no heat. Get a cold frame though. Contact an animal transport company and see what you can arrange and talk to them about applying for A10's, but as long as you have the $$$ then you should be fine.


----------



## Millerlite (Aug 5, 2013)

It's just cost dollars like above say, it's possible just they make you jump through hoops. 

Idk if you military or how long you plan to stay, may be cheaper to let it stay with family. Or maybe someone can foster the tortoise for you while your away.


----------



## ulkal (Aug 5, 2013)

Hi,

I had the same problem as you have with my leopards.
You have to apply for an export permit. It can take up to 90 days 
so apply early. From what I got, Greeks are on Appendix II.

Information/Download export permit
http://www.fws.gov/international/permits/how-to-apply.html

If you have further questions, maybe call the Wildlife office on the airport
you depart from. The general number is a circle of computer voices.

Call your airline for transportation regulations and be warned:
with United I was told reptiles are the only animals not allowed in the cabin. For my tiny leopards of 3 and 3 1/2 inches and overall weight of one lbs, I would have had to pay 500$ for transport.

At the same time you have to apply for an import permit. I think the regulations in the UK are a bit different from the rest of the EU, but not sure. As far as I know, Greeks require photo documentation, because they were taken from the wild quite heavily. You might also have to register them there. Again, here maybe some member actually from the UK knows better.
Maybe you can find more information with some British equivalent of wildlife or agricultural or other department.

Whatever you do, allow a time frame of at least 3 months. And if anything is unclear, just call,call,call, so no bad surprises.
Look at my threads, I had the topic some time ago, unfortunately, its did not work out due to an uncooperative breeder.

Good luck!

here is the link to my thread: http://www.tortoiseforum.org/thread-69832.html

other than that, I agree with Millerlite. If its a forever-move, try (but be not surprised if it does not work and you have to rehome them), if not maybe check all the alternatives.


----------



## FLINTUS (Aug 5, 2013)

as said you have to have an a10 to get them in, can you give proof-contact with the breeder-that they are CB?


----------



## devsharkey (Aug 5, 2013)

So, file an A10, figure out which airlines allow me to travel with my reptiles, sit patiently through the quarantine period, and pay a fee? That doesn't sound too bad. 

I don't have contact with the breeders anymore, but I also can't prove that they're captive bred, will that be a problem?


----------



## EricIvins (Aug 5, 2013)

Long story short, the answer would be no. You have no documentation on the animals, and I'm sure the person you acquired them from does not have the paperwork to properly apply for a Permit. 98% of "Breeders" do not. You would need to prove back to the original wild founders with proper declaration paperwork. 90 days? I'm on a year and 3 months for a CBB Export Permit. This is all reality, from someone who has experience in the Import/Export field....

Now if it were a Boa or Ball Python, things would be a whole lot easier.....


----------



## FLINTUS (Aug 5, 2013)

So would he need a CBB export permit as well as an A10? A10's are not that hard to get, but with no contact with the breeder it will be hard to get an A10. That said, DEFRA do sometimes give permits to WC/no CB proof animals after a lot of haggling. You would need to do this very soon.


----------



## ulkal (Aug 6, 2013)

He needs an export permit. Definitely.
And as EricIvins said, you also need proper documentation from the 
breeder. I forgot what exactly that was, but given that you have no 
contact or whatsoever,things look bad.

I did not get any documentation from the breeder, and tried for the option
where can describe the circumstances under which you acquired you tortoises.
Despite "proof" for the transaction with the breeder (emails, their ads, credit card bill ) , it was still a "no". 
Im sorry.


----------



## devsharkey (Aug 6, 2013)

Ugh ): okay. Thanks everyone for your help! I'll see what I can do and if anything pans out positively, I'll let you guys know!


----------



## EricIvins (Aug 7, 2013)

FLINTUS said:


> So would he need a CBB export permit as well as an A10? A10's are not that hard to get, but with no contact with the breeder it will be hard to get an A10. That said, DEFRA do sometimes give permits to WC/no CB proof animals after a lot of haggling. You would need to do this very soon.



You need an Export Permit to get the animals out of the US. There is no sense in even worrying about what the EU wants if the USFW are not going to let the animals out of the country to begin with.....


----------

