# New Lamp Setup, Temperature ok?



## NicJ (Jan 28, 2019)

What do the experts think about my new lamp setup with regards to temperature? In the past I've been using a "National Geographic" Flood bulb. I am now going to try a 400W Metal Halide bulb that can be dimmed to 150W. I'm going to try to attach photos... but I'm new here will be my excuse.

You can't see it in the photo but there is a fluorescent tube under that edge at the front of the enclosure. That's why the temperature is a bit elevated under there.

Oh a bit about Tommy who lives in the enclosure. He is a Russian Tortoise who is fully grown... about 10 years old. I'm gearing up to put live plants in there and I'm not sure his lighting was the best. That's why I'm changing the light around

Nic

*edit* Ha Ha I just looked at the photos. That's not Tommy in the pictures. My kids like to put that "friend" in there he's plastic.


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## NicJ (Jan 28, 2019)

Here is a picture that shows both the old setup and the new. I added the big batwing light and took away that flood. You can see Tommy in this picture too.


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## Gillian M (Jan 29, 2019)

Welcome to the forum, @NicJ . Any pics of your tort?

Let's ask the experts, here

@Yvonne G 
@TechnoCheese 

your help would be appreciated. Thanks v much.


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## Yvonne G (Jan 29, 2019)

The light might be hanging down to close to the tortoise's back. Hard to tell.

I like the idea of the sight barriers that he has to walk around. Have you measured the temperature all over the whole enclosure?


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## Gillian M (Jan 29, 2019)

Yvonne G said:


> The light might be hanging down to close to the tortoise's back. Hard to tell.
> 
> I like the idea of the sight barriers that he has to walk around. Have you measured the temperature all over the whole enclosure?


Thanks Yvonne.


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## NicJ (Jan 29, 2019)

Yvonne G said:


> The light might be hanging down to close to the tortoise's back. Hard to tell.
> 
> I like the idea of the sight barriers that he has to walk around. Have you measured the temperature all over the whole enclosure?




Well, I'll let you know he doesn't walk around anything. LoL He always tries climbing or forcing his way first. The first picture is the temperature all around the enclosure. Its in Celsius but the range would be 70 to 90 in Fahrenheit I think. The lamp is at 20" now. If I raise it much more I'm afraid I will lose the cooler end of the enclosure. I have yet to build a proper fixture for the light so I could make half of the table cooler by shading the bulb and raising it up more. I would prefer the 20" height though.


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## Tom (Jan 29, 2019)

Here is my take on things:

The enclosure is way too small.
The enclosure sides are too low.
The substrate is much too dry. Looks like it would be dusty in that state.
That water bowl is suitable for lizards and snakes, but not tortoises.
The tortoise should not have access to those electrical cords. If he bites into it, he's toast and you're whole house could ignite. What is that cord attached to in the enclosure?
If the temperatures are working, then your new bulb might be okay, but I prefer to use much lower wattage bulbs. 65 watt floods at 8-10 inches from the tortoise do the job well and save a lot of electricity. If you need ambient heat, I'd use a CHE or RHP set on a thermostat.
If the florescent bulb is for UV, it can't work from that height. What type is it?
For more info on what to do, check these out:
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/beginner-mistakes.45180/
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/russian-tortoise-care-sheet.80698/


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## NicJ (Jan 29, 2019)

Tom said:


> Here is my take on things:
> 
> The enclosure is way too small.
> The enclosure sides are too low.
> ...




Thanks for all the tips. I have the package for the fluorescent tube but I'm sure it's the Reptisun 10. That's what the cord you see in the picture is from.

What is the requirement for higher sides? He has never escaped from here. They were higher but last time I changed the substrate I wanted it deep enough that he could bury himself so that's why.

I am planning on some live plants (they have just sprouted)... that's what precipitated all this. I was hoping they would increase the moisture in the area. Do you think that will be enough? The substrate is dusty. I water it once in a while, but it's not a habit.

Do you think the water bowl is too small? He goes in there, and can fit his whole body in.

From the reading I've been doing the last few days I think the range in temperature maybe ok... I did the initial research a few years ago and then just kept everything the same till now. 

What do you think the minimum sq footage is. This enclosure is 8 sq feet. I've read people using as little at 4. I don't want the minimum for my guy. The original plan was to make a "tray" type area underneath where he could crawl down into...but I worry he will go down there and we won't see him much. If I'm right a 100 gal tank has a sq footage of about 9.3 feet. I just used whatever dimensions I could find online.

I've read both of those links thank you. They are a great resource.


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## NicJ (Jan 29, 2019)

I went back and see you recommend 32 sq feet for an adult.

Wow. I don't know If I can get that.

Nic


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## Wolfpackin (Jan 29, 2019)

NicJ said:


> Thanks for all the tips. I have the package for the fluorescent tube but I'm sure it's the Reptisun 10. That's what the cord you see in the picture is from.



If it is a Reptisun 10.0 T8 then it needs to be very close to the tortoise, 4-6" range.
If it is a T5 10.0 then 16-22" ish will work.


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## TechnoCheese (Jan 29, 2019)

Wolfpackin said:


> If it is a Reptisun 10.0 T8 then it needs to be very close to the tortoise, 4-6" range.
> If it is a T5 10.0 then 16-22" ish will work.



Reptisun 10.0 in a T8 should be 10-12 inches away, if I’m not mistaken. 4-6 inches is much too close.


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## Tom (Jan 29, 2019)

NicJ said:


> Thanks for all the tips. I have the package for the fluorescent tube but I'm sure it's the Reptisun 10. That's what the cord you see in the picture is from.
> 
> What is the requirement for higher sides? He has never escaped from here. They were higher but last time I changed the substrate I wanted it deep enough that he could bury himself so that's why.
> 
> ...




A regular 10.0 rube needs to be about 10" away for the tortoise to get any UV benefit. If you want to leave it that high, just use a calcium supplement with D3 in it.

Live plants will be trampled or eaten unless they are in pots.

The substrate needs to be kept damp. All the time. Dry dusty substrate is bad for a number of reasons. Dump water in there as needed and add more daily, or as needed.

For wall height, measure the tortoises carapace, then add 4 inches. This is to calculate how far he can reach with his front feet whilst standing on the tippy toes of his back feet. Then add 6 more inches to calculate your wall height ABOVE the substrate and anything else he can stand on. So for a 6" tortoise, add 4", then add 6" more, then add 4" of substrate, and you'll need walls 20" tall. 6+4+6+4=20.

The water bowl isn't too small. Its too steep and too deep and not safe for a rigid shelled animal to use. A terra cotta saucer sunk into the substrate will work much better.

Temperature directly under the heat lamp should be around 95-100F or 36-37C. As long as the rest of the enclosure is in the 70s in the day time, it will be fine.

Locomotion is a necessary part of digestion in tortoises, just like a horse. They need room to roam in their enclosure. The more room the better. 2x4' is too small for an adult. 4x8' should be the minimum, but the tortoise won't drop dead if you can only do a 3x6' table.

You have good questions. Feel free to ask more.


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## Wolfpackin (Jan 29, 2019)

TechnoCheese said:


> Reptisun 10.0 in a T8 should be 10-12 inches away, if I’m not mistaken. 4-6 inches is much too close.



I'm not recommending that any animal should be 4" inches away from any type of UV, light or heat source but...

I get readings of UVI 1.0-1.5, using a Solarmeter 6.5, on a Reptisun 10.0 T8 at 10-12 inches. And that's directly below the center of the tube, as the meter moves away from the tube the UVI readings drop quickly.

For my tortoise, using the Sunbeam Method as described by F. Baines, I try to get UVI 2.5-3.0+ at two different basking spot areas in my enclosure. 
If you are covering the majority of the enclosure with UVI 1.0-1.5 that might be acceptable using the Shade Method in conjunction with the Ferguson Zone of your pet.

Unfortunately the only way to know for sure if you have the correct bulb and distance is to buy an expensive meter.

Here are some links that helped me do the guessing game before I broke down and purchased a Solarmeter 6.5.

http://www.uvguide.co.uk/index.htm

https://www.researchgate.net/public..._Research_41_42_-_63_httpwwwjzarorgjzararticl

http://www.reptilesmagazine.com/An-In-Depth-Look-At-UV-Light-And-Its-Proper-Use-With-Reptiles/

I hope that helps.


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## NicJ (Jan 30, 2019)

Tom said:


> A regular 10.0 rube needs to be about 10" away for the tortoise to get any UV benefit. If you want to leave it that high, just use a calcium supplement with D3 in it.
> 
> Live plants will be trampled or eaten unless they are in pots.
> 
> ...



His UV bulb is pretty close to him. I was aware that UV levels drop significantly with distance. The tube is mounted under the leading edge of the enclosure. So depending on where he is standing he could be within 4 inches of the bulb.

I am kinda planning on him trampling and eating the plants... hope it will be fun for him. 

I do sprinkle calcium on his food a couple times a week and vitamins about once a month.


I don't like the sounds of the expensive UV light meter... It's too bad pet stores don't offer a loan program like auto part stores do.

Nic


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