Best Breeder Burmese Star

[Kapidolo Farms]

Going a bit further off topic about "extinct in the wild". The dawn of what became know as the "Asian Turtle Crisis" with Bill McCord's video was a report by well regarded turtle people that 'all the spengleri' had been harvested from Tam Dao national park in Vietnam.

In 2001 a decade later I was there and though they did not peer up at me from the foot bridges that connected one area to another in that fading French resort town. they were indeed super abundant there. I took photos of many dozen, pre digital camera for me - so no I won't post images. it's a pain the a$$ to fool with all that.

All I hear when some team explores known range and declare they can't find any, is people confessing they are mediocre field biologists. And yes I know who I'm saying that about.

There is a similar phenomena with rubber boas here in CA. Some folks can find them by the bucket load based on skill, some find a few based on luck. Different things make it easy for even well trained turtle biologist to do well in one setting and do poorly in another. Search image and expectation seem to be key to it all. Seasonal timing and how you walk in the area make a difference too.

 

[Tom]

Going a bit further off topic about "extinct in the wild". The dawn of what became know as the "Asian Turtle Crisis" with Bill McCord's video was a report by well regarded turtle people that 'all the spengleri' had been harvested from Tam Dao national park in Vietnam.

In 2001 a decade later I was there and though they did not peer up at me from the foot bridges that connected one area to another in that fading French resort town. they were indeed super abundant there. I took photos of many dozen, pre digital camera for me - so no I won't post images. it's a pain the a$$ to fool with all that.

All I hear when some team explores known range and declare they can't find any, is people confessing they are mediocre field biologists. And yes I know who I'm saying that about.

There is a similar phenomena with rubber boas here in CA. Some folks can find them by the bucket load based on skill, some find a few based on luck. Different things make it easy for even well trained turtle biologist to do well in one setting and do poorly in another. Search image and expectation seem to be key to it all. Seasonal timing and how you walk in the area make a difference too.

So from this I gather you are saying platynota are not extinct in the wild? That would be great if you are correct.

 

[Kapidolo Farms]

So from this I gather you are saying platynota are not extinct in the wild? That would be great if you are correct.

It's easy to say there are no three legged Canadian Geese in the wild, yet to say that and purport it as a scientific fact is foolish, until you have looked at all the geese (big N). Or at looked as an good sampling (little n) and say with 97% certainty there are no three-legged geese in the wild. That's what is gather-able from what I am saying Tom.

 

[Ernie Johnson]

Ernie

I do not have a broad range of personal experience across a lot of species, but have certainly done my share of research and personal visits/conversations whenever possible. My observation and conclusion (at this time) is that it really seems the further the native range from the equator, the more season - photoperiod and UV intensity plus light color - controls, or certainly influences, egg-laying triggers. The G platynota come from where this time of year the sunrise/sunset period is now 11 hours. So it would follow that once we pass under 11 hours, which happens about October for most of the keepers here, the tortoises would start to "think" about laying. I would be interested to hear from keepers like @KenS who maintain indoor groups what he does or if he maintains photoperiod/light adjustments and if that effects his groups' timing.

Its fascinating the instinctual behavior of tortoises.

I had my male Russian's start the pre-hibernation process 10 years ago when we lived in Minneapolis in August in the middle of a 90-95 degree 2 week run purely do to a neighbors tree covering 80% of their outdoor pen at the at time. They're so wired to the light, just like Burms for laying eggs.

The eleven hour threshold hits here in Dallas around Halloween, so no real difference from your location.

 

[Ernie Johnson]

Do you remember that argumentative jacka$$ that was on here arguing that captive breeding was only for the greed and satisfaction of the breeder and pet keepers and was of absolutely no value to the species in general or the wild population in particular?

I don't know everything, but 4000 babies a year, in the native range, for a species that is extinct in the wild, plus assurance colonies all over this country and the world, sounds pretty beneficial to me… Sometimes I just have to shake my head at the willful ignorance of some people.

Yeah, there are di**heads born every day.

 

[oramarco]

Skottip, I sent you a text (to **4-7054) about those holdbacks from last year. Did you receive my message? Let me know in case you still have some.

 

[Tom]

Scott answered me in a PM before thanksgiving, but I didn;t want to post it until I got the "ok" from him. I asked him to share his incubation technique, and this was his reply:

Hey guys. My incubation techniques are as follows: Immediately after digging up the eggs I diapause at 64 degrees for 28 days. Constant temperature, no fluctuations. I then incubate at 88 or 89 degrees for females. I found that 89 degrees produces more splitters so its a slippery slope if you want females with no scute irregularities. Average incubation 90 days in heat.
I have a homemade incubator with a fan. (old wine cooler)I think still air incubators have way too much temperature fluctuations so depending on where you have your probe, there could be varying temperatures inside the incubator. Come mid egg laying season, my incubator is full. I have a 30 inch height difference in my incubator so I think no matter how good your incubator and fan is, there will be restricted airflow which will make the temps fluctuate.
I have sold most of my animals I produced and the few people I spoke to did indeed get females from the ones I did incubate high.(except for Tom but I don't think he can sex tortoises) lol A few years ago I incubated low for males to give buyers options to buy pairs and as expected, no one wanted males. I can tell you with 100% certainty, the all turned out to be males. lol (anyone need males?)
I held back a few from last year that I am considering having scoped, just because..
Ill keep you posted.
Happy Bird day.

 

[Ernie Johnson]

Tom,

Interesting comments from Scott. I've haven't ask Chris Leone how temps are playing out for him to see if there's any consistent "parameters" that seem to get TSM and TSF results with higher probabilities.

All I can say is Berlandier's (from many years ago when I was more lucky than smart), Russians, and Redfoot's are/were alarmingly consistent for TSM and TSF.

 

[Ranman]

Well, I am honored to be on this list! By far my favorite tortoise. I have some eggs cooking now but I also have some holdbacks from last year that are pushing 100 grams or so. Some just over, some just under. Super smooth with rock hard shells. I also have some larger ones available. Feel free to text me if you want at 954 604 7054. I have babies available from 6 different females. Tom, you grew those babies fast! OMG, Now I wish I held a few back that year. lol What year did I sell those to you? Shaif, I have never had a problem with shipping (knock on wood)...

Skott, I have been reading these forums and would really love to add burmese to my collection. They are beautiful and appear to be a wonderful tortoises to raise. I have sulcatas and leopards now. There are lots of adds out there but would really like to buy 2 from a reputable breeder as discussed in these forums. It appears you are in Florida and i am in Louisiana. I was wondering if you might have any of your hold overs or any others for sale. I can't find any in Louisiana and unfortuantly would have to ship but it appears it might be the shortest distance if you had any. Thanks

 

[Ranman]

is there anyone here who might have some beautiful Burmese Stars for sale?

 

[Tom]

is there anyone here who might have some beautiful Burmese Stars for sale?

I have 8 clutches incubating right now, but no babies due for a couple of months.

 

[Ranman]

I have 8 clutches incubating right now, but no babies due for a couple of months.

Thats fantastic. I will be on the look out in a few months.

 

[Justin808]

Hi guys,

I'd also like to be kept in the loop with any available Burmese stars. These are the only tortoises I plan to keep and am looking up plans to build or buy the best available enclosure for them. Thanks!