Manouria emys emys Hatchling Worries

[OkoraAphra10]

Hi All,

My name is Jeremy and I have been raising a Manouria emys emys since late September. He/She hatched in July. He/She lives in a closed plastic bin (39" x 20") with pine bark nuggets and coco coir with several water dishes and a few hides. The bin is next to a window and is heated by a heat bulb with a humidifier pumping fog into the tub. The temperature in the bin is a gradient of 78-85 and I turn off the heat at nightto reach temps near 73. I also soak daily with vitamins and baby food, occasionally two times a day. He/She has a food dish with turnip greens, collards, and cucumber, occasionally carrots and bok choy, sprinkled with calcium weekly. I have been worried as of late, as I have only seen it eat once since he/she arrived. Its weight has also fluctuated around 40 grams since arriving and I have not observed any growth. Lately, it has not moved from the spots I set it in the bin after soaking. He/She used to move around the bin and settle in a hide, but lately they have been falling asleep right where i place them. His/Her eyes are not sunken in and responds slowly to back-leg touches. He/She occasionally scratches its face. I had heard that this species grows fast and eats a lot. I am just fact checking. Are these signs of any concern? Is there anything that I need to fix? I am seeking information. Please help.

 

[Cheryl Hills]

I think you need a basking area around 95 to 100, so they can digest food. If they are too cold, they can not digest and therefore, will not eat. I don’t raise this species but that seems to be true for all tortoises.

 

[Yvonne G]

Manouria are one species that can tolerate cooler temperatures, but I don't allow my baby enclosures to get that cool. For the Manouria babies I keep the whole container 80-85F degrees, all the time, day and night. I also feed them like box turtles, that is, animal protein about three or four times a week, fruit three or four times a week. They are kept in a closed chamber in swamp-like conditions. I mean WET, not moist. I'm not sure that pine bark is the best substrate for them. I like to use fir bark (orchid bark), and when that's not available, I buy cypress mulch.

 

[OkoraAphra10]

Manouria are one species that can tolerate cooler temperatures, but I don't allow my baby enclosures to get that cool. For the Manouria babies I keep the whole container 80-85F degrees, all the time, day and night. I also feed them like box turtles, that is, animal protein about three or four times a week, fruit three or four times a week. They are kept in a closed chamber in swamp-like conditions. I mean WET, not moist. I'm not sure that pine bark is the best substrate for them. I like to use fir bark (orchid bark), and when that's not available, I buy cypress mulch.

I had the tort in a hotter environment previously. It avoided the heat like the plague. Is this normal behavior?

 

[OkoraAphra10]

I think you need a basking area around 95 to 100, so they can digest food. If they are too cold, they can not digest and therefore, will not eat. I don’t raise this species but that seems to be true for all tortoises.

I had it in a hotter environment previously, it avoided the heat like the plague.

 

[Yvonne G]

Like I said, my Manouria babies live in a closed chamber and the overall temperature in the enclosure is 80-85F degrees - no hot side, no basking area, no cool side. Think about it: Your body temperature is 98.6F degrees. That's damn close to 100F degrees! 80-85F is not all that hot.

 

[OkoraAphra10]

Like I said, my Manouria babies live in a closed chamber and the overall temperature in the enclosure is 80-85F degrees - no hot side, no basking area, no cool side. Think about it: Your body temperature is 98.6F degrees. That's damn close to 100F degrees! 80-85F is not all that hot.

I see! I’ll make some alterations to make the enclosure hotter and alter the substrate. The substrate is very wet. I actually, did this after seeing a previous post of yours. Thank you! Is there anything else that I could be doing incorrectly?

 

[Yvonne G]

It MIGHT be that the oils from the pine bark are affecting the tortoise, I don't know. Let's see if he doesn't perk up once you've made the changes. I have four right now, two in each enclosure. The two larger ones climb all over each other trying to reach me when I'm putting in the food. The two smaller ones in the other enclosure peek out of the hiding place, but aren't that brave yet to come attack the food goddess. There's def. something wrong with yours to be acting like it does. @Will ?????

 

[OkoraAphra10]

It MIGHT be that the oils from the pine bark are affecting the tortoise, I don't know. Let's see if he doesn't perk up once you've made the changes. I have four right now, two in each enclosure. The two larger ones climb all over each other trying to reach me when I'm putting in the food. The two smaller ones in the other enclosure peek out of the hiding place, but aren't that brave yet to come attack the food goddess. There's def. something wrong with yours to be acting like it does. @Will ?????

I see. I’ll make the switch tonight. Fir bark for the pine. Make it warmer!

Yeah. I haven’t seen any behavior like that from the beginning.

 

[Cheryl Hills]

It MIGHT be that the oils from the pine bark are affecting the tortoise, I don't know. Let's see if he doesn't perk up once you've made the changes. I have four right now, two in each enclosure. The two larger ones climb all over each other trying to reach me when I'm putting in the food. The two smaller ones in the other enclosure peek out of the hiding place, but aren't that brave yet to come attack the food goddess. There's def. something wrong with yours to be acting like it does. @Will ?????

Thank you for answering him. I was not sure

 

[Kapidolo Farms]

Lots of detail in you first post, but you don't say what you are feeding. What are you feeding?

I raised several M.e.p. and have no hot spot, I think temps over 90 can be stressful. When temps do go to high they will throat pump air like crazy.

I have had them in a 2 x 3 foot cement tray covered for high humidity, and on a tilt, the bottom half is soaking wet with standing water, their preferred hang out area, hide are at both ends and they will pile up in the swamp side hides instead of spacing out and using the dryer (relatively) side hides.

I gave them chopped greens such as what I have listed here https://kapidolofarms.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/With-notes-KapidoloFarmsTTPG.pdf

I lost a few from a large hatch. As so many, the majority, did well, I think those that did not survive the first few weeks were not likely to have survived at all.

I moved them into several of the same size tub as they grew and some were sold. Now at just over two years they are all well over ten inches and a few pounds and three held back are in a 3 x 6 foot vision cage. In the spring they will go outside.

 

[OkoraAphra10]

Lots of detail in you first post, but you don't say what you are feeding. What are you feeding?

I raised several M.e.p. and have no hot spot, I think temps over 90 can be stressful. When temps do go to high they will throat pump air like crazy.

I have had them in a 2 x 3 foot cement tray covered for high humidity, and on a tilt, the bottom half is soaking wet with standing water, their preferred hang out area, hide are at both ends and they will pile up in the swamp side hides instead of spacing out and using the dryer (relatively) side hides.

I gave them chopped greens such as what I have listed here https://kapidolofarms.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/With-notes-KapidoloFarmsTTPG.pdf

I lost a few from a large hatch. As so many, the majority, did well, I think those that did not survive the first few weeks were not likely to have survived at all.

I moved them into several of the same size tub as they grew and some were sold. Now at just over two years they are all well over ten inches and a few pounds and three held back are in a 3 x 6 foot vision cage. In the spring they will go outside.

Sorry. I feed turnip greens, collards, cucumber, mustard greens, carrot. Occasionally Bok Choi! Substrate is very wet!

 

[Yvonne G]

They eat a bit of colocasia/alocasia ( elephant ear), leaves from the banana tree, endive, escarole. . . and they seem to thrive on plants from the 'do not feed' list. Add some fruit and animal protein to your schedule, along with hard boiled or scrambled egg.

 

[OkoraAphra10]

They eat a bit of colocasia/alocasia ( elephant ear), leaves from the banana tree, endive, escarole. . . and they seem to thrive on plants from the 'do not feed' list. Add some fruit and animal protein to your schedule, along with hard boiled or scrambled egg.

Will do!

 

[drew54]

I love the info int this post! It's almost like this species is better adapted with its diet than most. Like Yvonne mentioned, they remind me of box turtles.

Do you have a photo of your tort? I'm not sure I've seen one of these.

 

[OkoraAphra10]

Just to update,

I changed the substrate and placed another heat source. I also changed the food to endives and mixed greens with some boiled egg. It seems to be bobbing its head quite a bit and not really moving. The heat has increased quite a bit. Is this normal or should I alter something further? Also saw a big yawn.

 

[Yvonne G]

Do you have a laser temperature gun? It might be a good idea to point and shoot all over the whole enclosure to check the temperature. By head bobbing, do you mean throat pumping? In Will's post he said if he allows the enclosure to get too hot they throat pump like crazy. This might be the tortoise telling you he's too hot.

Can you post a picture of the enclosure for us? Manouria don't need real bright light. They do quite well set up under the tube type fluorescent bulbs, with either a CHE or a Radiant heat panel for heat. If you're using a bright light, then you'll need to add quite a few plants to make it shady in the enclosure. These tortoises come from the rain forest, and need dappled sun, not full sun. I have seen my adults seek out a spot of sun occasionally to sit there and bask, but normally they hide from the bright light

 

[OkoraAphra10]

I have a temp gun. It was about 95 on one side and 85 on the other. I lifted the lamp on the side that was hotter to decrease the temp a bit. The bobbing has leveled off. It seems to just be sleeping now wherever it is.

 

[Yvonne G]

What kind of bulbs are in those fixtures? And can you add some plants around in there to give him a more closed in and safe feel.

 

[OkoraAphra10]

The bulbs are the ceramic heating bulbs. I can. What plants would tolerate the dim light and humidity?