Sulcata x redfoot hybrid

Dannypharmd86

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This just happened to me, my male leopard and female red foot have been together with me since they were hatchlings at least 10 years now. All of the sudden my red foot has laid 10 eggs in two crutches over the past 2 months, I am incubating them and 3 of the 5 from the first clutch look viable so far and the others were laid 4 days ago so I haven't disturbed them yet to candle. I never thought this could happen!
 

MayorMatt

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I think the head color may be from an overhead light, if you look at the tort in the background of the second picture it appears to have a reddish light shining down on it
 

naturalman91

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I think the head color may be from an overhead light, if you look at the tort in the background of the second picture it appears to have a reddish light shining down on it

Nope its definitely a red foot Sulcata mix

The one in the background is under a red heating light
 

motero

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This just happened to me, my male leopard and female red foot have been together with me since they were hatchlings at least 10 years now. All of the sudden my red foot has laid 10 eggs in two crutches over the past 2 months, I am incubating them and 3 of the 5 from the first clutch look viable so far and the others were laid 4 days ago so I haven't disturbed them yet to candle. I never thought this could happen!


That is cool, Please keep us posted on the outcome, I would like to see pictures of them as well.
 

skottip

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Danny
This just happened to me, my male leopard and female red foot have been together with me since they were hatchlings at least 10 years now. All of the sudden my red foot has laid 10 eggs in two crutches over the past 2 months, I am incubating them and 3 of the 5 from the first clutch look viable so far and the others were laid 4 days ago so I haven't disturbed them yet to candle. I never thought
This just happened to me, my male leopard and female red foot have been together with me since they were hatchlings at least 10 years now. All of the sudden my red foot has laid 10 eggs in two crutches over the past 2 months, I am incubating them and 3 of the 5 from the first clutch look viable so far and the others were laid 4 days ago so I haven't disturbed them yet to candle. I never thought this could happen!

Danny, I have 3 adult males "reppards" I think that name is cooler by the way. lol If you are incubating them for female I would be interested in a few. Please keep me posted.
 

Tom

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I find it disgusting and appalling. Those adults of different species, different care requirements and different diets should not be living to gather in the first place. Which species is is getting the wrong care or diet?

Its dumb luck that they don't get sick and die from each others diseases and parasites, which is most often the case when people engage in the practice of mixing species. Because a few vocal people have done it and gotten away with it so far, doe not mean the practice should be encouraged or lauded in any way. Everyone gets away with it until they day they don't.

Encouraging this practice with comments of how interesting and cute the babies are is encouraging bad tortoise keeping practices that will harm and kill captive tortoises. We should be working to preserve our precious imported resources, not seeing what sort of weird Frankenstein mixes we can come up with.
 

leigti

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If the hybrid is from two totally different species with different care needs, diet environment etc., then how do you raise the baby? And what about when they are an adult? It just seems like mixing such two different species you would end up with problems in their care and their needs later. It's not like mixing different breeds of dogs cats are horses etc. Just my opinion.
 

Markw84

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I have to agree that this is indeed a very undesirable practice. For me, when it comes to chelonians, we are the shepherds of the species. We keep them as pets, or as assurance colonies, to enjoy and better understand the species that are sadly disappearing in the wild. By mixing species, whether intentional or not, we are contributing to the disappearance of that species. Just as with Leopard tortoises now, it becomes harder and harder to find, or even differentiate what exactly we have with many individuals. A "true" South African may soon become almost impossible to find. Where are the true Ethiopian giants, except as diluted intergrades?

We look at most of the pictures, artwork and statues we see of tortoises these days, and many if not most will represent pyramided animals as if that is the only "normal" that is known, since that has become so "normal" in captivity and what most people see as a tortoise. Is that a portent of what is to come as redfoots blend to leopards, or leopards to sulcatas, etc, etc.

Although this is still rare, it is beginning. It seems innocent and an "interesting abnormality". But I feel we must act now to educate and ensure this practice does not gain any foothold and soon overwhelm our precious tortoise legacy.
 

counting

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I hope I wasn't encouraging the practice by commenting it was cute and being curious of what it looks like :(

I also agree that torts are not domestic animals and hybridization is rather unethical. It's not what's best for the species as a whole or the individual animals. And I certainly would not support the practice with my money, which is usually what talks in these situations(look at "designer dogs, though the situation is different).

That said, a lack of knoweldge or censorship on topics in my opinion has never, ever kept those things from happening. Education is what prevents things like this from happening, and knowledge. Seeing the result of such partnerships ( look at the subject of this thread to begin with, and obviously unhealthy -imo- looking specimen. ) speaks more to the ethical ramifications to the individual animals than a simple "no" ever could.

Though, it's my honest hope this animal has a suitable life and does not suffer horribly as a result of human error(and the parent animals are separated to prevent this from happening again). It's alive and here. And I don't think pretending it is not does much to prevent the practice or does much to help the welfare of this now existent creature. It's alive, and it certainly isn't the fault of the animal that they alive nor do they need to suffer.

Education on conservation, on proper living conditions of various torts and knowledge about the adverse outcomes and suffering an animal might endure as a result is probably more preventive than pretending it never happens.

I also think that negative attacks do nothing to help the welfare of the animals in this situation. It is more likely to discourage someone from seeking out help to give this animal appropriate care.

But I tend to look from the perspective of individual life, not just what's in the best interests of the species as a whole. Which in the end is greatly more urgent:)

Not that I'm criticizing anyone who has posted before me. Just sharing my thoughts.
 

leigti

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Nobody is denying that it is cute. I think it is all so cute, and interesting. And I would be interested to see how it does over the next few years and held a person decides to care for it. And it is definitely true that it deserves a good life no matter what. I don't think anybody is denying that.
 

counting

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Nobody is denying that it is cute. I think it is all so cute, and interesting. And I would be interested to see how it does over the next few years and held a person decides to care for it. And it is definitely true that it deserves a good life no matter what. I don't think anybody is denying that.

Neither do I

I posted what I posted above with the utmost respect the previous posters. I just don't think that curiosity = encouragement, necessarily.
 

eric joranson

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It happens in nature....fin whales will mate with about any cetacean they encounter; producing some very odd looking; yet beautiful off spring There are populations of different species whose territories overlap; soon interbreeding occurs. As in Orioles (the bird) western and eastern populations are now just one species after decades of breeding together. Lack of habitat or low food , pushing populations in to limited areas are major factors that result in inter species copulation. In the big picture; since humans have brought those conditions about; we might be considered responsible for the hybrid species. There are unplanned cross breeding in zoos; (again limited space). So I am not worried that a few backyard Frankensteins are going to pollute the entire gene pool; who knows maybe one of them will make something superior one day. But I wouldn't count on it; mother nature has had alot more experience at it. Rather have them fiddling with captive raised reptiles than say virulent viruses, Heck; if early man hadn't cross bred with Neanderthals; we wouldn't have any politicians. :p
 

leigti

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It happens in nature....fin whales will mate with about any cetacean they encounter; producing some very odd looking; yet beautiful off spring There are populations of different species whose territories overlap; soon interbreeding occurs. As in Orioles (the bird) western and eastern populations are now just one species after decades of breeding together. Lack of habitat or low food , pushing populations in to limited areas are major factors that result in inter species copulation. In the big picture; since humans have brought those conditions about; we might be considered responsible for the hybrid species. There are unplanned cross breeding in zoos; (again limited space). So I am not worried that a few backyard Frankensteins are going to pollute the entire gene pool; who knows maybe one of them will make something superior one day. But I wouldn't count on it; mother nature has had alot more experience at it. Rather have them fiddling with captive raised reptiles than say virulent viruses, Heck; if early man hadn't cross bred with Neanderthals; we wouldn't have any politicians. :p
Crossbreeding in nature happens between two species that I obviously can live in similar situations. Read Fouts and leopards wouldn't meet in nature as far as I know. I don't think they could survive or thrive in each others environment. And if crossbreeding is happening in zoos, I think the zoo people need to get some bit of a clue on how to keep animal separate from each other.
 
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