Lighting/Heating HELP!!!

abyrhianl

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We recently got our first ever tortoise, a baby leopard. I’m a little worried that the heating and lighting we currently have aren’t good enough for him (he isn’t very active, he’s in an indoor enclosure but it’s an old house so gets rather cold at night and during the day). What is the best lighting/heating to get for him?
 

TechnoCheese

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Be sure that you read these-
How To Raise A Healthy Sulcata Or Leopard, Version 2.0 https://tortoiseforum.org/index.php...ealthy-Sulcata-Or-Leopard,-Version-2.0.79895/
For Those Who Have a Young Sulcata... https://tortoiseforum.org/index.php?threads/For-Those-Who-Have-a-Young-Sulcata....76744/
Beginner Mistakes https://tortoiseforum.org/index.php?threads/Beginner-Mistakes.45180/
You need a fluorescent tube UVB, a ceramic heat emitter, and a daylight/flood light basking bulb.(not a spot light.)
Could we see a picture of your lighting and enclosure?
 

Luke52

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You may want to get a higher watt bulb at night your tort may be inactive because it was cold
 

wellington

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Things need to be changed asap. Get rid of the hay. Get a deeper substrate and bury the water dish so the lip is level with the substrate. Get it closed on top and your wattage is too low. The temp needs to be 80 day and night with a basking spot of 95-100 and humidity at 80%. Your baby is too cold and that's really bad for a hatchling.
 

Markw84

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We recently got our first ever tortoise, a baby leopard. I’m a little worried that the heating and lighting we currently have aren’t good enough for him (he isn’t very active, he’s in an indoor enclosure but it’s an old house so gets rather cold at night and during the day). What is the best lighting/heating to get for him?

I do not want to seem harsh, but since you asked for advice - I need to be honest and tell you what I think will allow your tortoise to live and thrive.

In your current setup, I believe your tortoise will eventually die. I cannot see a young leopard living in that type of setup and not getting sick. They need consistent heat - never below 27°C in the coldest corner of the enclosure. Get an IR heat gun and check your temperatures. Point it at every corner and inside wall of the enclosure and check what you have. There is no way to keep an open enclosure above 27° EVERYWHERE unless your whole room is above 27°. A leopard tortoise needs humidity. They do best when humidity never drops below 80%. Especially in colder climates, even on days when the weather station says the humidity is 90% and foggy - that cold air, when heated in your house, has relatively little moisture and the indoor humidity is really i the 30% - 40% range. Under a light in the enclosure it will be even less! The substrate is a problem. The hay is an issue...

The "climate" we create for our tortoise is the most important beginning point of proper care. So the title of your post is totally appropriate. The threads linked above are a great source of proper care. Instead of listing things wrong, I would like to suggest you read this. I actually first wrote this for leopards. Leopards and stars are identical in care, especially their first few years.

https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/how-to-raise-a-healthy-star-tortoise.159167/

Then come back and ask all the questions you have if somethings don't make sense to you as to why you would need to do that.
 

Yvonne G

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About that substrate: Those little white bits encourage your tortoise to eat his substrate, and may cause impaction.

I like to use the fluorescent UVB tubes with a Ceramic Heat Emitter (CHE) for heat. The CHE can stay on all the time, while the fluorescent bulb is on a timer for being on 7a to 7p.

If you cover the enclosure, the CHE will keep it nice and toasty inside.

fluorescent UVB bulbs.jpg

I bought the fixture to mount the bulbs in through LightYourReptiles.com

ceramic heat emitter.jpg

CHE can be purchased online or at most pet stores. For a small tank I use a 65 watt, but a 100 watt may be needed for your tort table.
 

Yvonne G

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If you want to get creative, you can have the UVB (fluorescent bulb) on only for a couple hours during the middle of the day, and use a regular incandescent bulb or a spot bulb the rest of the time (for heat and light).
 

abyrhianl

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The water bowl is built into the substrate (we had to cut a step into it so he could get in and out easier as he’s only little, the substrate is what was recommended to us where we bought him from. And the hay was recommended on a care sheet from the tortoise protection group. I will definitely give that a read and get one of the T5 tube lights. We were told to use a table as it had better air flow, what would you recommend we make a lid out of?
 

abyrhianl

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The water bowl is built into the substrate (we had to cut a step into it so he could get in and out easier as he’s only little, the substrate is what was recommended to us where we bought him from. And the hay was recommended on a care sheet from the tortoise protection group. I will definitely give that a read and get one of the T5 tube lights. We were told to use a table as it had better air flow, what would you recommend we make a lid out of?

The hay is actually ReadiGrass which is exactly what was recommended, there’s a lot of contrasting information out there.
 

Yvonne G

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Baby tortoises really don't start eating actual hay until they're three or four years old. Maybe if you cut it up into bite-sized pieces and mix it in with the food he will eat it, but not whole, long strands. It helps to sit the cut up pieces in water for a few minutes too, to soften it.
 

abyrhianl

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Thank you, I’ll make those changes, should I put anything in his hide? We were also given moss to keep it a little damp? Or is that no good either? What should I make a lid out of?
 

TechnoCheese

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Thank you, I’ll make those changes, should I put anything in his hide? We were also given moss to keep it a little damp? Or is that no good either? What should I make a lid out of?

Nothing should be in the hide besides substrate.
The entire enclosure needs to be damp, and the moss will likely be eaten, so don’t put it in.
You’ll have to build a frame out of any material(wood, plastic, pvc pipes, etc.), and cover it with a shower curtain. You can also start over with a new enclosure.IMG_0524.jpgheres an example of the top of mine. You can also use these for inspiration https://www.homedepot.com/p/NuVue-2...BEgKrX_D_BwE&dclid=CL3l-tytxNoCFcJGXgod0RYIIQ
Be sure that you forget everything the pet store told you. Just follow those links, and your tort should be ok.
 

katieandiggy

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Sorry to butt in on this thread but just noticing some of your wires @TechnoCheese
Where do you put your probes for measuring temps under the basking lamp? Can I just lay my wire on the substrate I’m worried it will get chewed..? Or shall I bury the wire under the substrate abs just have the end of the probe poking out?
 

TechnoCheese

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Sorry to butt in on this thread but just noticing some of your wires @TechnoCheese
Where do you put your probes for measuring temps under the basking lamp? Can I just lay my wire on the substrate I’m worried it will get chewed..? Or shall I bury the wire under the substrate abs just have the end of the probe poking out?

Not sure I can help you with the probes. I use a digital hydrometer and a temp gun.
 

Kirsty3407

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If your house is cold most of the time i would say you need to do what i have for my baby leopard and build an enclosed vivarium with ventilation vents and defo up ur heat bulb wattage. Mine is 80w dual bulb uv/heat on 12 hours and i have 60w ceramic for cold nights which is on a thermastat. Ever since his enclosure at 1 end heats up to between 85-95f he is soo much more active n comes out to bask eat and have a nosey round.
 
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Tom

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...there’s a lot of contrasting information out there.

This is very true. The reason for this is because we've been doing it wrong for decades. With a lot of help from a lot of sources, several of us here on this forum have figured out what was wrong with the typical old advice and why it didn't work. Through years of trial and error, and much experimentation based on what we were learning, we've now discovered what works and why. Most of the rest of the tortoise world has not caught on yet and is still clinging to the old incorrect ways. Pet shops, vets and breeders are some of the worst "expert" offenders.

And the proof is in the pudding! How is your baby doing? I currently have 9 leopards hatchlings that are growing, active, eating like little shelled piggies and absolutely thriving in the environment that I've created for them. See it here:
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/new-stack-of-animal-plastics-closed-chambers.165626/#post-1600958

We share this new and better info with as many people as we can, but not everyone can accept our word over the word of their local pet shop. We are trying. Everyone who tries it is amazed at the difference. Spend some time reading old posts here. You'll see what I mean.
 

abyrhianl

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IMG_2140.jpg

Just a little update: we have added a roof to help keep it humid and warmer and I’ve removed the hay and changed the substrate. We have ordered a T5 14% tube light to give him some more UV and are awaiting a higher wattage heat emitter. Will hopefully have one happy little tortoise once he’s back inside after a day in the sun [emoji217]
 

abyrhianl

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This is very true. The reason for this is because we've been doing it wrong for decades. With a lot of help from a lot of sources, several of us here on this forum have figured out what was wrong with the typical old advice and why it didn't work. Through years of trial and error, and much experimentation based on what we were learning, we've now discovered what works and why. Most of the rest of the tortoise world has not caught on yet and is still clinging to the old incorrect ways. Pet shops, vets and breeders are some of the worst "expert" offenders.

And the proof is in the pudding! How is your baby doing? I currently have 9 leopards hatchlings that are growing, active, eating like little shelled piggies and absolutely thriving in the environment that I've created for them. See it here:
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/new-stack-of-animal-plastics-closed-chambers.165626/#post-1600958

We share this new and better info with as many people as we can, but not everyone can accept our word over the word of their local pet shop. We are trying. Everyone who tries it is amazed at the difference. Spend some time reading old posts here. You'll see what I mean.

Thank you! Your set up looks amazing! And he’s doing okay he’s spent a day in the sun (supervised) we’ve made the changes to his enclosure so hopefully he will be much happier! This is our first tortoise and we only want him to have the best, just felt so bad knowing we had got it wrong when it was based off information by supposed ‘experts’. Onwards and upwards, just want him to be happy and healthy that’s all that matters[emoji4]
 
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