HELPPPP!!! Sulcata hatchling is gasping!!

Joined
Oct 16, 2018
Messages
102
Location (City and/or State)
Lewisville, Texas
Hey everyone, my hatchling sulcata tortoise, Franklin, whom I ordered from “tortoise town” and arrived Thursday, October 4th, is gasping for air and acting lethargic. His substrate is eco earth coconut fiber substrate, mixed with cedar wood chips I believe. He is in a black storage tub that I got from tractor supply co, Kamp Kenyan showed how he used them in one of his sulcata care videos. I have a red 100 watt nightlight on one side,and a 100 watt daytime lamp on the other side. In the middle of his tub I have a zoomed uvb rectangular light. He has a half log on his hotter side, and a little cave rock that the red light shines on, with moist spaghnum moss inside to keep the humidity inside his cave up. The temperature in his tub ranges from 80 degrees to 104 on his basking spot. He has a shallow water dish, and is fed springmix, st Augustine grass, yellow squash, cucumber, purslane flowers, dandelion flowers and greens, and as an occasional treat, a strawberry. Now that I have covered his setup and diet, ill go over his case.
He is a couple months old, and as previously stated arrived the 4th of October. Recently he has been acting lethargic. He is sleeping most of the day, and gasping on his basking spot. He occasionally pulls his arms and legs inwards, then lets out a squeak, what must either be a sneeze or cough. I cant find any other case of a sulcata hatchling squeaking. I have a vet appointment planned, but I am very worried. Other people seem to consider replacing their tortoise if it gets sick/dies, but I am willing to do everything to keep this hatchling going strong. Any advice is appreciated.
 

Miscally

Active Member
Tortoise Club
Platinum Tortoise Club
Joined
Jun 23, 2017
Messages
248
I'm not an expert but temperature and humidity are vital. Read the stickies at the top of the threads. Closed clamber 85° minimum and very humid 90% and over @Tom is one of the experts here and he'll be doing with more info.
 

Maro2Bear

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
May 29, 2014
Messages
14,712
Location (City and/or State)
Glenn Dale, Maryland, USA
Greetings...

And welcome to the Forum.

First off, take a read of our care sheet here - https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/how-to-raise-a-healthy-sulcata-or-leopard-version-2-0.79895/

I see a few red flags in a few things.

  • Cedar substrate is possibly not a good substrate (very aromatic and maybe more issues with that)
  • Red emitting bulbs not recommended - makes everything look like food. Check out CHE or radiant heat panels for overhead night heat.
  • Sphagnum moss - not recommended, often ingested by youngsters. (Orchid bark mix is best)
  • Log is ok - but check Care Sheet for a proper humid hide.
  • Your temps look good, but double check all temps. What gauges are you using?
  • Food - strawberries shouldnt be fed - too much sugar, not processed by Sullys.
  • Soaking? Are you soaking daily?
  • An occasional squeak can be normal, but not all the time.
  • Covered? Is your enclosure covered to maintsin both heat and humidity?
Try to upload some pix of your tort and lighting and enclosure.

Good luck x I’m sure others will have suggestions too.
 

TechnoCheese

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Platinum Tortoise Club
Joined
Feb 20, 2016
Messages
4,505
Location (City and/or State)
Lewisville, Texas
Welcome to the forum!

Tortoise town is infamous for selling sick tortoises. Here are some reviews-
Tortoise Town
https://tortoiseforum.org/index.php?threads/Tortoise-Town.145811/

There is a lot that needs to be changed with your care.

-if the storage tub is open topped, you need to enclose it as well as you can to turn it into a closed chamber. It is almost impossible to hold the 80-100% humidity you need in an open topped enclosure.

-do you mean cypress mulch? Cedar is toxic to tortoises, and if you are using cedar in the substrate, you need to remove it immediately.

- Red lights are no good. Not only can they see both the color and the light so it keeps them up at night, but it also can cause them to eat their substrate. You should be using a flood bulb(not spot bulb) for basking, with a ceramic heat emitter to keep night temps and cool side/ambient above 80.

Is there any mucus coming out of your tortoise’s nose?

Could we see pictures of your tortoise and enclosure?

Please keep in mind that Kamp Kenan does not give very good advice. Most of it is outdated, or just flat out incorrect.

Please give these a read and come back with questions-
How To Raise A Healthy Sulcata Or Leopard, Version 2.0 https://tortoiseforum.org/index.php...ealthy-Sulcata-Or-Leopard,-Version-2.0.79895/

For Those Who Have a Young Sulcata... https://tortoiseforum.org/index.php?threads/For-Those-Who-Have-a-Young-Sulcata....76744/

Beginner Mistakes https://tortoiseforum.org/index.php?threads/Beginner-Mistakes.45180/
 
Joined
Oct 16, 2018
Messages
102
Location (City and/or State)
Lewisville, Texas
Hey everyone, my hatchling sulcata tortoise, Franklin, whom I ordered from “tortoise town” and arrived Thursday, October 4th, is gasping for air and acting lethargic. His substrate is eco earth coconut fiber substrate, mixed with cedar wood chips I believe. He is in a black storage tub that I got from tractor supply co, Kamp Kenyan showed how he used them in one of his sulcata care videos. I have a red 100 watt nightlight on one side,and a 100 watt daytime lamp on the other side. In the middle of his tub I have a zoomed uvb rectangular light. He has a half log on his hotter side, and a little cave rock that the red light shines on, with moist spaghnum moss inside to keep the humidity inside his cave up. The temperature in his tub ranges from 80 degrees to 104 on his basking spot. He has a shallow water dish, and is fed springmix, st Augustine grass, yellow squash, cucumber, purslane flowers, dandelion flowers and greens, and as an occasional treat, a strawberry. Now that I have covered his setup and diet, ill go over his case.
He is a couple months old, and as previously stated arrived the 4th of October. Recently he has been acting lethargic. He is sleeping most of the day, and gasping on his basking spot. He occasionally pulls his arms and legs inwards, then lets out a squeak, what must either be a sneeze or cough. I cant find any other case of a sulcata hatchling squeaking. I have a vet appointment planned, but I am very worried. Other people seem to consider replacing their tortoise if it gets sick/dies, but I am willing to do everything to keep this hatchling going strong. Any advice is appreciated.
I'm not an expert but temperature and humidity are vital. Read the stickies at the top of the threads. Closed clamber 85° minimum and very humid 90% and over @Tom is one of the experts here and he'll be doing with more info.
I use a spray bottle to mist his tub twice a day because being in north Texas it’s dry, and his humidity stays between 55-90 percent, which seems to be within the recommended range so I’m not sure what I’m not doing right, or if maybe franklin was already sick when he was shipped and they just didn’t catch it, or if i’m at fault.
 
Joined
Oct 16, 2018
Messages
102
Location (City and/or State)
Lewisville, Texas
Greetings...

And welcome to the Forum.

First off, take a read of our care sheet here - https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/how-to-raise-a-healthy-sulcata-or-leopard-version-2-0.79895/

I see a few red flags in a few things.

  • Cedar substrate is possibly not a good substrate (very aromatic and maybe more issues with that)
  • Red emitting bulbs not recommended - makes everything look like food. Check out CHE or radiant heat panels for overhead night heat.
  • Sphagnum moss - not recommended, often ingested by youngsters. (Orchid bark mix is best)
  • Log is ok - but check Care Sheet for a proper humid hide.
  • Your temps look good, but double check all temps. What gauges are you using?
  • Food - strawberries shouldnt be fed - too much sugar, not processed by Sullys.
  • Soaking? Are you soaking daily?
  • An occasional squeak can be normal, but not all the time.
  • Covered? Is your enclosure covered to maintsin both heat and humidity?
Try to upload some pix of your tort and lighting and enclosure.

Good luck x I’m sure others will have suggestions too.
The substrate might be cypress or something other, i bought a large bag of it from petco and mixed it in with the coconut fibers, ill look into that. Thank you for the info on sphagnum moss, i noticed franklin try to eat it once but didn’t think anything of it. I soak franklin in a warm bath up to his chin twice a day. With his strawberry, I’ve only given him a single slice yesterday, he only had a bite or two. Do you think that would cause him to gasp? I’m at school right now and will try to post a photo later.
 
Joined
Oct 16, 2018
Messages
102
Location (City and/or State)
Lewisville, Texas
Welcome to the forum!

Tortoise town is infamous for selling sick tortoises. Here are some reviews-
Tortoise Town
https://tortoiseforum.org/index.php?threads/Tortoise-Town.145811/

There is a lot that needs to be changed with your care.

-if the storage tub is open topped, you need to enclose it as well as you can to turn it into a closed chamber. It is almost impossible to hold the 80-100% humidity you need in an open topped enclosure.

-do you mean cypress mulch? Cedar is toxic to tortoises, and if you are using cedar in the substrate, you need to remove it immediately.

- Red lights are no good. Not only can they see both the color and the light so it keeps them up at night, but it also can cause them to eat their substrate. You should be using a flood bulb(not spot bulb) for basking, with a ceramic heat emitter to keep night temps and cool side/ambient above 80.

Is there any mucus coming out of your tortoise’s nose?

Could we see pictures of your tortoise and enclosure?

Please keep in mind that Kamp Kenan does not give very good advice. Most of it is outdated, or just flat out incorrect.

Please give these a read and come back with questions-
How To Raise A Healthy Sulcata Or Leopard, Version 2.0 https://tortoiseforum.org/index.php?threads/How-To-Raise-A-Healthy-Sulcata-Or-Leopard,-Version-2.0.79895/

For Those Who Have a Young Sulcata... https://tortoiseforum.org/index.php?threads/For-Those-Who-Have-a-Young-Sulcata....76744/

Beginner Mistakes https://tortoiseforum.org/index.php?threads/Beginner-Mistakes.45180/
I cant believe i jumped the gun like this. Months of research for my tortoise to find out my sources were insufficient? Thank you so much for telling me this. I only saw positive reviews, ugh. Luckily there’s no mucus coming from his nostrils, that was the first thing i checked. I will try and find a way to enclose his tub, this is frustrating because I’m not sure how to enclose the tub while also allowing for uvb to get in, as well as his heat bulbs. Can you link me to an example of how to enclose a plastic tub? Ill also get one of those ceramic heat emitters. Thank you so much for your advice, I’m going to give tortoise town a good talking to.
 

Maro2Bear

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
May 29, 2014
Messages
14,712
Location (City and/or State)
Glenn Dale, Maryland, USA
The substrate might be cypress or something other, i bought a large bag of it from petco and mixed it in with the coconut fibers, ill look into that. Thank you for the info on sphagnum moss, i noticed franklin try to eat it once but didn’t think anything of it. I soak franklin in a warm bath up to his chin twice a day. With his strawberry, I’ve only given him a single slice yesterday, he only had a bite or two. Do you think that would cause him to gasp? I’m at school right now and will try to post a photo later.

A single slice of strawberry won’t cause harm, but it’s definitely not on the “feed” list. Check the Care Sheets of what to feed.
 

Tom

The Dog Trainer
10 Year Member!
Platinum Tortoise Club
Joined
Jan 9, 2010
Messages
63,264
Location (City and/or State)
Southern California
I cant believe i jumped the gun like this. Months of research for my tortoise to find out my sources were insufficient?

Ok... This is going to sound awful at first, but it gets better if you keep reading.

You've made nearly every mistake there is. Boom. There is it. Now that I've finished the bad part, let me butter you up. You've made these mistakes because you tried so hard to do a good job. You've clearly read a ton of stuff and followed lots of advice from various sources. Here is the problem: Almost all the sources out there are wrong and almost all of them are saying the same wrong stuff. You are learning this lesson the hard way.

The problems have already been pointed out, so I'll list the steps to fix it all:
  1. Get rid of the red bulb and replace it with a CHE or RHP set on a thermostat.
  2. Get rid of the moss.
  3. You need a large closed chamber to hold in the heat and humidity.
  4. Humidity needs to be 80%+ day and night, 24/7.
  5. I saw no mention of night heat. The symptoms you are seeing are the onset of a respiratory infection. This is almost always due to temps that are too cool, usually at night.
  6. Spraying the surface does very little. A thick layer of damp substrate is the best way to keep humidity up.
  7. For a sick one keep temps up over 85 24/7 in the entire enclosure for at least two weeks after symptoms disappear.
  8. There is nothing a vet will be able to do for this. Most of them don't know much about tortoises and the things they tend to do make things worse and speed up the tortoise's demise. Its a terrible thing, but if this baby was started too dry and the kidneys were damaged at the breeders or sellers place, no one and nothing can save it. All you can do is offer the best care possible and hope for the best. Some of them make it.
Good luck. Questions and conversation are welcome. :)
 

Maro2Bear

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
May 29, 2014
Messages
14,712
Location (City and/or State)
Glenn Dale, Maryland, USA
Joined
Oct 16, 2018
Messages
102
Location (City and/or State)
Lewisville, Texas
How do i enclose his plastic tub without blocking out his heat lamps and uvb lamp? And I’m so frustrated about tortoise town. They have a 4.7/5 review, I’m not sure how I never saw any negative reviews. I reached out to them yesterday evening about the condition of my tortoise and they haven’t even responded yet.
 

Miscally

Active Member
Tortoise Club
Platinum Tortoise Club
Joined
Jun 23, 2017
Messages
248
How do i enclose his plastic tub without blocking out his heat lamps and uvb lamp? And I’m so frustrated about tortoise town. They have a 4.7/5 review, I’m not sure how I never saw any negative reviews. I reached out to them yesterday evening about the condition of my tortoise and they haven’t even responded yet.
You are now in the best place for all the help and advice. Someone will be doing shortly to give you ideas on enclosing the tub, I believe shine irons use mini greenhouses or shower curtains.
 
Joined
Oct 16, 2018
Messages
102
Location (City and/or State)
Lewisville, Texas
You are now in the best place for all the help and advice. Someone will be doing shortly to give you ideas on enclosing the tub, I believe shine irons use mini greenhouses or shower curtains.
You guys, and this community are the best. I’m looking at ideas on how to close his tub off, but my situation is difficult in that the tub is an oval, so i cant build a square cover. Ill have to make something custom but I’m looking at photos and such. Any further advice would be greatly appreciated
 

New Posts

Top