Seeking advice - my sulcata was attacked by coyotes

AAH · Oct 21, 2018

Nine days ago, my four-year-old sulcata was attacked, probably by coyotes according to the vet. We keep him in an outdoor enclosure with a screened roof, but the coyotes got through the roof and got ahold of him, causing several puncture wounds in his shell (thankfully no damage to his legs or head). He spent four days at the vet getting his wounds cleaned out as well as shots containing antibiotics and pain medicine. Then they sent him home with antibiotic and pain pills (which he isn’t taking because I can’t get him to eat) and with instructions to soak him daily for 10 minutes, flush out his wounds with an antiseptic called clora-something-or-other (which the vet provided in a squeeze bottle) and to drizzle raw unfiltered honey in the puncture wounds to help with healing. I’ve been doing the daily baths, flushings and honey but haven’t been able to figure out how to get him to eat anything meaningful (which means he isn’t getting his medicine either). I’ve tried giving him Mazuri tortoise pellets soaked in water or juice, which he used to absolutely love, but they don’t interest him at all now. I’ve also tried feeding him his favorite foods, including bok choy, grapes, bell peppers, and strawberries diced into small manageable pieces, but again, no interest!

He does move around his indoor enclosure from time to time but seems most happy to sit and sleep under the heat lamp. He did go #2 yesterday, which I took to be a good sign that his digestive system is working. I want to believe he’s on the mend, and the vet told me that sulcatas can go 2 to 3 weeks without eating and be ok and the vet also said that he might take a while to start eating again due to the stress and trauma, but I am worried about him. Does anyone have any suggestions or thoughts about how to get him to eat or anything else that might help him recover?

wellington · Oct 21, 2018

Try banana to get the meds in. Also could try some pumpkin either fresh but boiled to make it soft or even from a can without any of the spices.
He can go quite awhile without food. Keep him hydrated though, which the soaks will help with.
So sorry this happened. He sure to fix the enclosure, they will be back.

Arzu78 · Oct 21, 2018

AAH said:
Nine days ago, my four-year-old sulcata was attacked, probably by coyotes according to the vet. We keep him in an outdoor enclosure with a screened roof, but the coyotes got through the roof and got ahold of him, causing several puncture wounds in his shell (thankfully no damage to his legs or head). He spent four days at the vet getting his wounds cleaned out as well as shots containing antibiotics and pain medicine. Then they sent him home with antibiotic and pain pills (which he isn’t taking because I can’t get him to eat) and with instructions to soak him daily for 10 minutes, flush out his wounds with an antiseptic called clora-something-or-other (which the vet provided in a squeeze bottle) and to drizzle raw unfiltered honey in the puncture wounds to help with healing. I’ve been doing the daily baths, flushings and honey but haven’t been able to figure out how to get him to eat anything meaningful (which means he isn’t getting his medicine either). I’ve tried giving him Mazuri tortoise pellets soaked in water or juice, which he used to absolutely love, but they don’t interest him at all now. I’ve also tried feeding him his favorite foods, including bok choy, grapes, bell peppers, and strawberries diced into small manageable pieces, but again, no interest! He does move around his indoor enclosure from time to time but seems most happy to sit and sleep under the heat lamp. He did go #2 yesterday, which I took to be a good sign that his digestive system is working. I want to believe he’s on the mend, and the vet told me that sulcatas can go 2 to 3 weeks without eating and be ok and the vet also said that he might take a while to start eating again due to the stress and trauma, but I am worried about him. Does anyone have any suggestions or thoughts about how to get him to eat or anything else that might help him recover?

Hi, so sorry you guys are going thru this. You could add some carrot baby food to the soak. It’s done to babies that won’t eat in order to get their nutrients. The only thing different in your case are the wounds. Are they on top of his shell??? You don’t want food in them. Usually the torts will drink from the soak and “eat” the baby food. Good luck!!!

jsheffield · Oct 21, 2018

So sorry about the attack on your tortoise ... fingers crossed for a speedy recovery.

Jamie

Yvonne G · Oct 21, 2018

Hi, and welcome!

He's stressed right now, and pretty scared. Give him time to settle back into his old routine. Keeping him in his old set up will help. I'd take some moistened, mashed Mazuri, a bit of banana, and the medication all mixed up together, then spread it on a large leaf of romaine. Roll it up like a tightly rolled burrito. Try hand feeding him from the long end.

Tom · Oct 21, 2018

How and where is he housed? What are the temps and what is the overnight low? What heating and lighting equipment do you use to maintain those temps? I'm asking because lack of appetite is often caused by less than optimal temps. The added stress of injury is enough to stop the appetite when temps are too low, even though he was still eating before the attack.

Also, while I can't be sure, instinct and past experience tells me this is more likely the work of a dog or dogs. This is not typical of coyotes. I live in the high desert bordering the national forest. I see coyotes running all over the place every day. I've never had coyotes come onto the ranch and attempt anything like that. Its just not how they generally operate. I could be wrong, but I'd be looking more suspiciously and my own dogs, neighbors dogs, or any dogs in the area. I'd also put out some snares (if its safe to do so in your area), or some large baited Have-a-Heart traps to see if I could catch the culprit. Even in stupid CA we have depredation laws that allow me to eliminate wild animals or dogs that harass or kill my stock, and I'll bet TX is even more permissive in that area.

AAH · Oct 21, 2018

Thank you all for your input and good wishes! Since we brought him home from the vet, he is living inside our house in a 3x4 foot wood/plexiglass enclosure that my husband built for him a few years ago. It’s what we have used in the past for keeping him warm and dry during the winter, so it is familiar and comforting to him. I put an upside down cardboard box with a hole cut into it on one side so that he has a “hide.” I have a 150 watt red heat lamp on the other side of that enclosure (that’s the wattage the vet recommended...) that is in 24 hours a day, along with a separate UV lamp that I have timed to be turned on 12 hours a day. The lid of the enclosure and lights are about a foot above where he’s at. The first few days he was back from the vet, he just hid in his cardboard “hide” under some newspaper pages that I put in there. Now, he’s not using the hide at all. Instead, he just sits under the heat lamp several hours a day, mostly snoozing. The bulbs are about a foot above him. We keep our house around 72°. If had to guess on the temperature, I’d say it’s close to 80° inside his cage with the heat lamp.

AAH · Oct 21, 2018

BTW the vet said to house him inside for at least the next three months while his shell heals. She said it’s critical that he not get any dirt or other debris in his shell puncture wounds, so the plan is for him to live in our house in his enclosure for the next few months. I know the enclosure is smaller than ideal, so once he’s a little further along in his recovery, on good weather days I can let him have supervised time in our front yard so he can move around more and graze on our grass.

AAH · Oct 21, 2018

Here he is in his enclosure, parked right under the heat lamp...

Tom · Oct 21, 2018

Ahh... Now we're getting somewhere!

Red heat lamps are a no go. They need white light during the day and darkness at night. This can mess with their appetite, and also cause other problems.
Heat lamps are a no go for a tortoise that size. They will slow burn the top of the carapace and still not warm the tortoise enough.
Not measuring and knowing your temps is a huge mistake. You need to know what the temperature is on the top of the carapace, the floor, the cool side, the warm side, and the overnight low. These are tropical animals. They need warmth day and night. The right amount of warmth. Not too much and not too little. You need a couple of digital thermometers and a temp gun.
Even though he spent time in that little enclosure in years past, it is way too small for him now. Confining him to something that size is stressful. Stress kills appetite.

I hope these things help. Check out these threads for more care info that will help you get through this tough time:
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/beginner-mistakes.45180/
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/how-to-raise-a-healthy-sulcata-or-leopard-version-2-0.79895/

Please come back with any questions. Ask for more explanation if needed. We are here to help.

Cathie G · Oct 21, 2018

AAH said:
Nine days ago, my four-year-old sulcata was attacked, probably by coyotes according to the vet. We keep him in an outdoor enclosure with a screened roof, but the coyotes got through the roof and got ahold of him, causing several puncture wounds in his shell (thankfully no damage to his legs or head). He spent four days at the vet getting his wounds cleaned out as well as shots containing antibiotics and pain medicine. Then they sent him home with antibiotic and pain pills (which he isn’t taking because I can’t get him to eat) and with instructions to soak him daily for 10 minutes, flush out his wounds with an antiseptic called clora-something-or-other (which the vet provided in a squeeze bottle) and to drizzle raw unfiltered honey in the puncture wounds to help with healing. I’ve been doing the daily baths, flushings and honey but haven’t been able to figure out how to get him to eat anything meaningful (which means he isn’t getting his medicine either). I’ve tried giving him Mazuri tortoise pellets soaked in water or juice, which he used to absolutely love, but they don’t interest him at all now. I’ve also tried feeding him his favorite foods, including bok choy, grapes, bell peppers, and strawberries diced into small manageable pieces, but again, no interest! He does move around his indoor enclosure from time to time but seems most happy to sit and sleep under the heat lamp. He did go #2 yesterday, which I took to be a good sign that his digestive system is working. I want to believe he’s on the mend, and the vet told me that sulcatas can go 2 to 3 weeks without eating and be ok and the vet also said that he might take a while to start eating again due to the stress and trauma, but I am worried about him. Does anyone have any suggestions or thoughts about how to get him to eat or anything else that might help him recover?

I'm so sorry your tortoise is going thru this. Maybe steamed, diced, fresh carrots would entice an appetite or anything else. Your vet did administer some meds and I'm sure you will continue your good care...a bite of just real food(even if steamed) might be the ticket. Also your vet is probably judging the size of the bite marks but I'm thinking fox...they kill for fun. That means whatever is still around your home. It does really sound like your tortoise is coping though and mending. Best hopes and prayers.

AAH · Oct 21, 2018

Tom, thanks for the very specific advice re temp and housing and links to your prior posts! What are the best options for keeping his enclosure the right temperature if not by heat lamp? Is the optimal temp around 80° with high humidity? I will get a temp gun and start measuring the temp.

Tom · Oct 22, 2018

AAH said:
Tom, thanks for the very specific advice re temp and housing and links to your prior posts! What are the best options for keeping his enclosure the right temperature if not by heat lamp? Is the optimal temp around 80° with high humidity? I will get a temp gun and start measuring the temp.

High humidity isn't as important for an older larger one, but warm temp are critical.

Ambient can be maintained with a mini oil heater, or a combination of RHPs or CHEs that are not pointed right at the carapace. Either of these options should be regulated by a thermostat. Offering a warmer basking area indoors for a tortoise this size is more of a challenge. RHP in combination with a light source can work, but any sort of incandescent bulb won't work well. A bank of two or three flood bulbs set at the right height, along with a warm ambient and floor temp, might work but you'll have to really watch carapace temps to make sure he isn't basking too much and getting cooked. A warmer ambient will discourage too much basking under hot desiccating lights.

Offering enough room to roam in another challenge. Cooping them up reduces gut motility and hampers digestion which slows down the appetite.

Its just not easy to house a large tortoise indoors.

AAH · Oct 22, 2018

Tom thanks again for the additional very helpful advice about indoor temp/housing options. Victory!!! Today he ate some mashed bananas and greens and he drank a bunch of water during his daily soak. He literally stuck his face into the water for about 10 seconds and guzzled down several swallows of water. I’m feeling very encouraged! Thanks to everyone for your great guidance and well wishes!

Seeking advice - my sulcata was attacked by coyotes

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