tag78
New Member
Please correct me if this is wrong but I have read a few different articles saying that sulcatas can tolerate temps slightly below 50 F.
Double Door Night Box
- Thread starter Tom
- Start date
I cannot correct you. I'm certain that you've read articles that said that. While they can tolerate and sometimes survive temperatures that cold, and even colder, it is NOT good for them, and certainly not optimal. Ground temps where they come from hover around 80-85 all year. This is what their quarters should be kept at year round. I'm not interested in providing conditions for my animals that are barely survivable. I'm interested in providing conditions that are optimal. 50 is likely to make them sick and it will certainly damage the gut flora and fauna, while drastically reducing appetite and activity. None of that is beneficial in any way for a sulcata. These are tropical animals. A cold winter day in their part of the world might only get up to 88, but most days are near 100.
In short, like most of what is written for care of this species, what you read was wrong.
tag78
New Member
That is why I go for more than one opinion - thanks.
A.Vazquez
Member
Excellent plans, thank you for the detailed information.
Nice Job Tom. I learned a few pointers from this Post .
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Hey @Tom i finally got my house for Koopa outside and I’m getting heat installed. Ordered a mini oil radiator heater. Have my shelf ready to install. Have the box to put the thermostat in as well. My question is which do you plug into the thermostat? The heater , fan and rhp? And then the kane pig blanket on a separate plug? Just worried about overloading the zilla 1000 thermostat.I make these little portals over my doors to keep rain ou on the rare occasion that we get rain here:
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Here is the inside front and side all framed up and with insulation in place. Next I run a silicone bead put the walls up and screw them to the framing all around:
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Here the sides, front and back are all sealed and buttoned up. I've added the little walled area that will keep the torts from touching the heater and you can see the removable divider in the middle. Next summer I plan to mix the males and females. When that finally happens I will probably remove the divider and let them all move back and forth between the pens as needed. This will give me the option of separating the male if he becomes too aggressive, and I can also close one door, remove the divider and make them all live on one side while I grow stuff to graze on one side or the other. Options. This box gives me lots of options.
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I hate power cords sitting out exposed. They get weathered, tripped on, and I don't want the torts to have access to them.
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Here is what I came up with for this situation. I ran the cord through this pipe into the ground and buried the remainder.
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Same thing on the side where it plugs in:
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Here it is all done and plugged in. No cord!:
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One more post and we will be done...
What you have there is an either/or type situation, not both. Either the radiant mini oil heater/fan combo, OR the Kane mat/RHP combo. If you want to run all of it anyway, you'll need a splitter of some sort since your thermostat won't have that many receptacles, and you should still be under the 1000 watt limit. Most mini heaters are 400-600 watts. The highest I've seen and used was 700 watts. The Kane mat should be 80 watts and the RHP 78 watts. The computer fan will use very little power.
If you do want to run all of it, I would do it on two separate thermostats for redundant safety. If one thermostat or heating element fails, the other will literally save your tortoise's life.
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Thanks @Tom so far the rhp and Kane are doing great on their own and the box stays 80 overnight even when the temps are 50 outside. I’ll cross the bridge of colder temps when I get there. Got the oil filled radiator yesterday and a second reptile thermostat from Amazon so I have what I need. I’m going to add humidity too as Denver is only in the 20s. I’ve kept her from pyramiding by providing the humidity as you taught in your raising a hatching article. You’ve been instrumental for the great health of my Koopa and I’m so grateful.
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Ergotaxon
Member
Hi, do you use radiant heat panels in addition to an oil filled heater for these night boxes?
I use a Kane mat/RHP combo in the 4x4 boxes, and I use the mini radiant oil heaters in the 4x8 foot boxes.
Ergotaxon
Member
Thanks!
Peggy's Peacock Palace
New Member
Before i got mine everything i read said to let them have a bunker in the ground so that is what i did with my first. With concrete walls to stabilize the sides and support the roof we put 2x6s across the top with foam board insulation then tarp then corrugated metal roofing and lots of dirt. With a heat lamp he's staying nicely warm. It's there a reason it would be better to have an above ground box for him? (Just trying to figure out the best housing options although atm i don't have the resources to change things up)
Alex and the Redfoot
Well-Known Member
Maybe an over-ground nightbox is just easier to build than a full fledged insulated concrete bunker. Especially, when you need more than one or two.
Night boxes should simulate a burrow for sulcatas - and "bunker" fits just fine if you can keep the right temperatures inside. A risk of flooding is another thing to consider.
Night boxes should simulate a burrow for sulcatas - and "bunker" fits just fine if you can keep the right temperatures inside. A risk of flooding is another thing to consider.
Underground you need to worry about flooding...
I keep large tortoises in there...I used to have a large 100+pounds Sulcata named Bob. He was a very different tortoise...he was intelligent, easy to train and he lived in the shed I posted earlier. I feel very lucky that the Sulcatas I have kept would get in a corner and dig and dig then after they adjust the 'blanket' in the bare corner they go to sleep. I have kept more than a few Sulcata and none ever dug in an outside pen...they dig at the plywood corner...their burrow...lol
I dabbled with underground shelters a bunch. Has some successes and some failures. My main one was 4x4x2 feet tall and that was buried in a 3 foot deep hole. There was an eight foot long sloped and covered entrance tunnel, and an access hatch with two insulated doors/covers. Here are some of the high points of what I learned:
1. I built them very carefully to prevent flooding. Entrances facing downhill and with covers to keep rain out. I had one that lasted seven years, but it eventually flooded and then rotted and caved in within the next year. It was great for those first seven years though. If I didi it again, I would build it with expanded PVC sheets for the walls.
2. I first built it with no floor so the sulcatas could be on natural earth down in their "burrow". Then my sulcatas did what sulcatas do and started digging to China. Filled the entire box and blocked the entrance with dirt from the subterranean tunnel. Digging that out and retro fitting in a plywood floor through the small access hatch was not a fun day
3. The earth is a great insulator when it is hot outside. The earth is also a terrible heat sink, and when the ground wants to be 50 degrees in winter, it was not cheap or easy to keep it 80 underground. It took bout 300 watts of CHEs, and RHPs running all the time to keep it 80ish. The ground just sucked the heat right out of it, even with 3/4 inch plywood sides, top, and bottom.
4. Its much easier and much less problematic to just make it above ground. If the box is sealed and insulated, it works just as well as burying it in the ground.
Mr. RussianTortoise
Well-Known Member
I have a question, would 1 inch insulation foam thickness work or would it be too thin?
Never tried it. I frame my boxes with flat 2x4s, so 1.5 inch rigid foam made the most sense. Using 1 inch insulation would leave an air gap.
1.5 rigid foam keeps my box temps around 80 when the nights are dropping into the low 30s in winter. Its also the caulking, weather stripping around the top where it meets the lid, and the correct heating devices.
I also like efficiency since electricity isn't cheap here. With enough heat inside, a cardboard house would stay warm enough. I try to make it so my heaters don't have to run all that much.
The only way to answer your question would be to build it and stick a thermometer in it.
