A Petition to stop selling wild caught Russians !!! PLEASE SIGN

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terryo

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I am mostly against anything wild caught, I won't even buy a WC box turtle, but the alternative is sometimes devastating. Here 300 wild RF and YF are being roasted alive by Kayapo' Indians.

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Tom

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I think every one of those rfs would have been happier with you or Mark or JD or Terry K, or Jacqui, or Yvonne, or Allegra, or Jeff, etc.....

I can understand everyone's opposition to too much collection from the wild, but I can't understand anyone's opposition to ANY collection from the wild. None of us would be here without it. None of us would know anything about rfs, sulcatas, or any other species not native to our area.
 

ALDABRAMAN

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Done, actually i have several others that i contacted and they signed as well!

terryo said:
I am mostly against anything wild caught, I won't even buy a WC box turtle, but the alternative is sometimes devastating. Here 300 wild RF and YF are being roasted alive by Kayapo' Indians.

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:(
 

cemmons12

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terryo said:
I am mostly against anything wild caught, I won't even buy a WC box turtle, but the alternative is sometimes devastating. Here 300 wild RF and YF are being roasted alive by Kayapo' Indians.

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Oh god, that sight made me sick to my stomach.... our poor shelled friends. :(
 

chase thorn

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On the fence with this one... I agree with Tom on this one. I have fallen into getting a WC from a petstore... I hate that petstore but it was not a Petco or Petsmart...


I have very very very nice petcos and petsmarts. I have never and will never see a bad petco here in the springs. My petco has an amazing staff and amazing animals. They can't control what comes in but they do know how to care for the sick and feed the malnourished. This petco was also on of only a couple petcos to start the saltwater and frag tank setup. for those who do not know, a frag tank is simply a tank with live corals. That being said, Patty, the employee among others have been some of the best care takers of these fish, corals, herps, birds, and even rodent pets! The only sick animal I saw was a green anole, which was a fussy eater and they tried to force feed but he simply did not make it. Awesome people and care for even the simplest of animals. They do not advise on the Petco care sheets as these even have bad info and they will tell you what to get without trying to scam for a better profit! The tortoises are even feed a fresh (not frozen) diet of great well varied foods. Not crickets and pellets like some other stores strictly feed their russians...

Sorry kinda ranty...
 

StudentoftheReptile

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terryo said:
I am mostly against anything wild caught, I won't even buy a WC box turtle, but the alternative is sometimes devastating. Here 300 wild RF and YF are being roasted alive by Kayapo' Indians.

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Now, to me, this has nothing to do with the topic. Yes it is sad that tortoises are treated this way...but here's a couple things to think about:

1.) Fishing - Fish have nerves and feel pain like most other vertebrates. Look at how we treat them: we hook them in the mouth with no aneasthetic, skin them and fillet them practically alive. Its not much different than what folks do at these rattlesnake roundups that people are outraged about right now. Now, Im not trying to attacking the fishing industry; I fish on occasion, and I eat fish regularly. Just offering a different perspective.

2.) These tortoises are part of these peoples' natural diet and part of the native ecosystem. True, there should be some regulation but fundamentally, how is this any different than one of us going out to hunt for feral pigs, deer, game fowl, etc.? It's easy to point and judge and feel sad for the tortoises, but again, this has nothing to do with the pet trade. Try hopping on a plane, flying down there to that country and set those Indians straight. Give them alternatives so they don't have to eat RF tortoises. Again, I'm not necessarily trying to make anyone feel guilty, but look at the big picture here.


Yeah, I would rather a WC tortoise end up here in the states in a glass box to live a so-so life as someone's pet than be roasted alive by a tribe in South America, but at the same time, I can't fault a fellow human being in a impoverished country for feeding themselves, ya know?
 

ra94131

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StudentoftheReptile said:
Yeah, I would rather a WC tortoise end up here in the states in a glass box to live a so-so life as someone's pet than be roasted alive by a tribe in South America, but at the same time, I can't fault a fellow human being in a impoverished country for feeding themselves, ya know?

I actually disagree. I think it is far more "natural" and acceptable for the tortoises to be eaten by an indigenous group than than to be whisked around the world and bred/sold for our amusement.

That said, I love my little reptile captives, but I feel a real debt to them that requires me to provide the most ideal conditions possible in their "unnatural" habitats.
(More so than I would feel towards a truly domesticated animal like a dog/house cat/etc. that owes its existence to humanity.)

Just my thoughts. Always an interesting discussion.
 

StudentoftheReptile

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ra94131 said:
I actually disagree. I think it is far more "natural" and acceptable for the tortoises to be eaten by an indigenous group than than to be whisked around the world and bred/sold for our amusement.

I understand. Its a tough line as an animal lover and as a human being. Now most certainly, I would rather them be eaten by indigenous peoples than being shipped off to Asian food markets!
 

ra94131

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StudentoftheReptile said:
I would rather them be eaten by indigenous peoples than being shipped off to Asian food markets!

We can both agree on that.

However, even that doesn't bother me too much when sustainable harvest guidelines are strictly observed so as to not threaten a species natural existence. It may be hard to stomach sometimes as a person that keeps these animals as pets, but I always try to also appreciate the animal's inherent place in the food chain.

(Note: I know the big problem is that many (most?) of those foreign markets DO NOT observe any responsibility for sustainability, which is the reason I included the caveat above.)
 

Neal

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StudentoftheReptile said:
1.) Fishing - Fish have nerves and feel pain like most other vertebrates. Look at how we treat them: we hook them in the mouth with no aneasthetic, skin them and fillet them practically alive. Its not much different than what folks do at these rattlesnake roundups that people are outraged about right now. Now, Im not trying to attacking the fishing industry; I fish on occasion, and I eat fish regularly. Just offering a different perspective.

Not to be off topic, but fish actually don't have nerves in their mouths. While they may still feel pain when we hook them, it is probably not enough to do any sort of major damage by itself. They fight because they are being pulled in a direction they don't want to go. If you've ever caught and released a fish, they quickly go back to behaving normally.
 
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