All my guys are staying small....

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Saleama

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I have 5 baby Sulcatas. They are being raised in a closed, hot and humid enclosure. They get a wide variety of grasses, hay, weeds and other foods recommended in Tom's diet section with the exception of Mazuri. I do not feed them that.. They get plenty of outdoor time as well as a UVB light on 12 hours a day. They get soaks at least once a day sometimes more. When I got them, they were all around the same age, about a month old. The smallest was 26 grams and the largest was 46 grams. Today, 2 months and 2 weeks later at 3.5 months old, their weight has changed very little. The smallest is now 37 grams and the biggest is 62 grams with all the others gaining similar amounts of weight. They eat like piglets and get plenty of exercise from running around in their play pen to swimming in the tub during soaks (there is a deep end and a shallow end and they will go from shallow to deep and back, it's real cute). So, is this weight gain normal or really low? I see on here all the time people with 3 and 4 month old babies that weigh 140 - 160 grams. Should I feed them separately? Right now they get fed as a group. I watch them eat and nobody is getting pushed aside and not getting fed a lot. Please advise.
 

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How were they started before you got them? Where did you get them? How much time do they spend outdoors on a typical day?
 

sibi

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Now that they are getting older, I think hou should feed them separately. If you have read Tom's threads, you'd know that sullies shouldn't be paired up, but because of the chance that one or more may be bullies or stressed w/o your knowledge, I would go ahead and set them up in their own pens now.

I have a couple of concerns. If they are outside alot, you don't need to have the uvb on at all. So long as they are exposed to sun for a few hours a day, you don't need the uvb bulb. Also, if you have 5 babies, will you have enough outdoor/indoor room for them? They get big pretty fast.
 

Saleama

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Tom said:
How were they started before you got them? Where did you get them? How much time do they spend outdoors on a typical day?

Four of them I do not know how they were started. The fifth one came from Tortadise. Pretty sure he took very good care of his babies. I bought them all at reptile shows. They get about an hour every other day and on weekends they spend all day outside. I get home close to dark so I can't get them outside everyday.
 

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If they were all from the reptile show, I'd say they were likely started too dry. I can't recall exactly how Kelly starts them, but I remember thinking it was fine.

Do they have contact with your other species, or their enclosures indoors or out?

Outside all day on the weekends will certainly slow them down. See the link above for more explanation.

Have you had a fecal exam done, you know, just to be sure parasites are not part of the problem?
 

Saleama

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Tom said:
If they were all from the reptile show, I'd say they were likely started too dry. I can't recall exactly how Kelly starts them, but I remember thinking it was fine.

Do they have contact with your other species, or their enclosures indoors or out?

Outside all day on the weekends will certainly slow them down. See the link above for more explanation.

Have you had a fecal exam done, you know, just to be sure parasites are not part of the problem?

They do not have contact with the others. No fecal has been done other than a visual inspection.

So, I'm guessing you think they should be bigger than they are? I will start on separate enclosures as soon as possible, I have some room for that, and I can feed them separately although I have not witnessed any bully activity and I watch them eat and nobody seems to be getting pushed aside at the dinner rock.
Also, they all seem to be growing at the same slow but steady rate.
 

sibi

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I think if you separate them, you will see a difference in their weight gain. Try to get some fresh cut green grass cuttings (make sure no pesticides or fertilizers were used) mixed in their food. Grass should be about 70-80% of their diet. Try feeding more often as well. These lil guys are eating machines. The more you feed them, the more they eat and gain, usually, unless their is a problem. Did you read the experiment Tom did on the two groups of sullies?
 

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Saleama said:
So, I'm guessing you think they should be bigger than they are? I will start on separate enclosures as soon as possible, I have some room for that, and I can feed them separately although I have not witnessed any bully activity and I watch them eat and nobody seems to be getting pushed aside at the dinner rock.
Also, they all seem to be growing at the same slow but steady rate.

They are on the slow side for growth, but any growth is a good sign.

I'm just trying to eliminate possibilities with all my questions...

Personally, I would not separate them all, as long as the enclosure is good size. I regularly raise groups of young sulcatas and never have behavior issues that way. Pairs are often a problem, groups are usually not. My Sudan sulcatas have been in a group of five for nearly a year now, for example.

Have you posted enclosure pics before? Lets look at that.

Cutting their outside time down to no more than an hour or two a day, might help too. At least until they put on some more size.

Is there food leftover after feedings, or do they gobble it all up right away and then have nothing else for the rest of the day?
 

Saleama

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Tom said:
Saleama said:
So, I'm guessing you think they should be bigger than they are? I will start on separate enclosures as soon as possible, I have some room for that, and I can feed them separately although I have not witnessed any bully activity and I watch them eat and nobody seems to be getting pushed aside at the dinner rock.
Also, they all seem to be growing at the same slow but steady rate.

They are on the slow side for growth, but any growth is a good sign.

I'm just trying to eliminate possibilities with all my questions...

Personally, I would not separate them all, as long as the enclosure is good size. I regularly raise groups of young sulcatas and never have behavior issues that way. Pairs are often a problem, groups are usually not. My Sudan sulcatas have been in a group of five for nearly a year now, for example.

Have you posted enclosure pics before? Lets look at that.

Cutting their outside time down to no more than an hour or two a day, might help too. At least until they put on some more size.

Is there food leftover after feedings, or do they gobble it all up right away and then have nothing else for the rest of the day?

I have posted pics before. I'm the guy who uses magnets to hold down the cover. My enclosures are 5 x 4, sphagnum dirt with cool end hovering around 80 day time, warm end is close to 100 with basking spot a bit higher. I can't measure humidity but there are drops of water on the plastic cover so it is high. I feed them once a day. I will start feeding more often. I have an abandoned hay field across from my work and I have started taking hay leaves from there and chopping them up. I will post pics and more tonight when I get home.
 

tortadise

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The one you got from me Steven was soaked 2-3 times a day. Kept on coco coir. MVB for UV low 80s on cool side. Low 100s on hot side. I also use a fogger once a day to elevate the humidity. I use it middle of the day when its at the warmest temp so it causes no cool effect. Very odd how they are staying same size. Which did you get them from(besides mine) I may be able to tell you who sold them to you. What kind of UV are you using. I know the best results I notice warmer the better. Luckily all my babies hatch out early summer and I rear them doing mid summer. Warmth and hydration is key along with good UV. I do have to say. Every year I will keep back 10 to grow up. Some will stay rather small but still grow. Some will grow like weeds. Their is no real average. Sometimes slow steady good growth is great.
 

Saleama

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tortadise said:
The one you got from me Steven was soaked 2-3 times a day. Kept on coco coir. MVB for UV low 80s on cool side. Low 100s on hot side. I also use a fogger once a day to elevate the humidity. I use it middle of the day when its at the warmest temp so it causes no cool effect. Very odd how they are staying same size. Which did you get them from(besides mine) I may be able to tell you who sold them to you. What kind of UV are you using. I know the best results I notice warmer the better. Luckily all my babies hatch out early summer and I rear them doing mid summer. Warmth and hydration is key along with good UV. I do have to say. Every year I will keep back 10 to grow up. Some will stay rather small but still grow. Some will grow like weeds. Their is no real average. Sometimes slow steady good growth is great.

I got the first two at Repticon in Pasadena Texas on July 6th and was told they were between two and three weeks old. I got two more at the show in Arlington on July 13th (Cold Blooded Exotics out of Florida[I think] was the seller) and was told they were about a month old, so same as the others. These two were half the size of the first two. I got the one from you 10th of August and as you said above, seems to have been born around the same time frame as the others. The thing is, they are all growing at the same rate. Slow and steady, and they are growing nicely, especially the one I got from you. You can tell he was raised better than the other four. There is nothing I see that has me concerned for their health. They are active most of the day. More so than a lot of people on here say theirs are. They even come when "called" so I can soak them and feed them. I am just worried they are so small. Rollo is only 36 grams and he eats from the time I set out the food until it is all gone. They have all gained about 50% of their starting weight since I got them.

UV is the 32" tube light for Dessert reptiles and is positioned over the hide entrance and extends over both the basking spot and the "feeding" spot. I do hide food dishes in different locations around the pen to encourage grazing. I also provide two ways to get outside. I have a 5 x 4 outside garden they live in on weekends and a playpen I put them in when I get home in time during the week. I think maybe it is my feeding schedule. I usually feed them in the evening about three hours before bed. I have started (this morning) to feed them in the morning and again at night. I am also going to feed them seperately to make sure the two little guys are getting enough, although I watch them eat and I can't see where any one is getting more or less than the others.


On a side note, I have created a spread sheet and got my scale back so I will be charting their progress more often starting tonight. I have only been weighing them monthly.
 
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