Anyone else here tired of being deleted or fluffed?

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ascott

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Likely this thread will be deleted or fluffed before many will see....but going to give it a try anyways...well, to see if there is still any real forum here where folks can share....

I have noticed, more so recently, that many threads are having the posts fluffed for nice nice instead of allowing the thread to develop a life of its own---amongst the general population?

Now, don't misunderstand.... I don't find it beneficial for folks to get into cussing matches or outright vicious attacks on one another..however, if there is a certain level of banter that takes place without harsh name calling or the like...then I believe the moderators should take their place in the shadows to enter a block post reminding folks to not be vicious---BUT I do not believe that moderators should be under the impression that the run this forum---that I believe is Josh. I also believe that this forum has been going on strong due to its members, right.....not solely moderators.

I also believe that moderators should be voted in and not simply clicked in....I mean are we not a forum full of members? Why do members not get to decide who the moderators will be? I believe that at present there are some less than adult acting moderators at work here and it truly is making this forum a playground more than a resource....

So, I have not blasted anyone person here....I have not cussed anyone out here....I have not slandered anyone here...but lets just see what comes of this thread. I would like to hear what some of the other members "feel" on this thread....

Thank you.
 

Yvonne G

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Well, I'll give you my reasoning as to why I 'fluff' some threads.

We have many youngsters who read the threads. We want to set a good example to those youngsters. We want them to understand how to be grown up about stating their opinions and disagreements.

So when I see a thread disintegrating into a hot tempered mis-match, I will usually delete (move the offending post to the moderator section) a post.

Everyone is supposed to be allowed to have an opinion on the Forum. If someone else doesn't agree with that opinion, that's fine too. But you MUST be civil about your disagreement. How can we expect our youngsters to act like grown ups when we sometimes don't.

Way back when, before the first "other" forum was started, we had arguments, hash slinging, verbal abuse, etc. and this wasn't a very nice place to be. After we, the mods, cleaned it all up, I made the promise that I wouldn't stand for any of that behaviour any more, and I was just going to arbitrarily delete offensive posts/comments.

I've tried to go by our guidelines, and allow differing opinions to be posted, but sometimes its pretty hard when some members can't watch how they voice their differences.
 

ChaseNTx

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I'm a newbie to the forum so I have posted very few items, but as a new follower I am already growing very tired of the back biting, unnecessary sarcasm and just plain rudeness of some posts. I come to this forum to learn and seek experienced tortoise people's opinions, not read a bunch of attacks on others opinions or knowledge. I appreciate each and every piece of feedback am I given and generally enjoy reading the posts and learning from the experiences of other and and just wish others could play nice or take their toys else where to play.
 

ascott

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Yvonne, I should have said that this does not apply to you...and here is why I say that....you have in the past come on and advised/warned folks on a particular thread that things are going in a negative direction and that you will put a stop to it if the participating parties don't get back in line---this, in my opinion, is completely expected of a moderator...you even weigh in from time to time with your opinion on a subject (without apparent bias---and I bet this can be difficult at times) that may be a bit sideways....but you do not offend, you do not belittle, you do not tell someone that your way is the right way no ifs ands or butts....

You Yvonne, are a perfect example of what I refer to as a fair and impartial moderator....You have pm'd me from time to time with a courteous advise on why you did an adjustment or the like and I respect that about you....I am not saying there should not be moderator review--there absolutely should be.

But that moderator review should always be done by someone who is mature enough in nature to not allow personal feelings into the mix....and yes, there are young folks on here--but that does that mean they are so ultra fragile that they can not observe the way a variety of opinions and passions can ignite through a thread..?

Like I said, I do not believe that folks should be cussing and directly viciously attacking one another due to a difference of opinion, not at all...
 

Kapidolo Farms

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ascott, I agree Yvonne has rare/good sensibilities.

I have had a few posts nicked, and in retrospect I would have to agree with the nicking, no matter how objective the observation behind the post, the wording was subjective and negative. Some people . . .

My single most popular thread by orders of magnitude was an angst over what I referred to as 'silly' posts infused into informative threads.

What to do.

I nominate you for moderator, if that is within your interest to direct things for the better.

Will
 

Jacqui

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I for one am more tired of seeing other moderators feeling like they should be doing fluffing, then actualy seeing it get done. I wished all members could allow each other to express their opinions without turning it into a war or resorting to name calling. Sadly that's not the case and why Mods step in. We don't like it, but it's better then allowing it to go on and having members getting turned off by it (especially the new members who are here to learn).

Thank goodness Mods are not chosen by a vote, as often those would be the folks who break and bend the rules the most.

Plus never forget this is Josh's forum. He is the one who makes these choices, so he is who you should be complaining to.
 

lisa127

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ChaseNTx said:
I'm a newbie to the forum so I have posted very few items, but as a new follower I am already growing very tired of the back biting, unnecessary sarcasm and just plain rudeness of some posts. I come to this forum to learn and seek experienced tortoise people's opinions, not read a bunch of attacks on others opinions or knowledge. I appreciate each and every piece of feedback am I given and generally enjoy reading the posts and learning from the experiences of other and and just wish others could play nice or take their toys else where to play.

This is the only forum (well, one of two but both are chelonian forums) I have ever, ever belonged to that did not have a bunch of fighting and name calling. I have never seen rudeness or meanness of any kind here and I'm wondering why you say this? I have enjoyed this forum due to the lack of arguing and name calling. As I said, never have I belonged to a forum where it didn't get nasty. And I'm sorry, I'm an adult and don't have the patience for forums that have a bunch of juvenile arguing. So I say thank you for the "fluffing".
 

DeanS

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On the other hand...reality is a bit too much for some people to grasp...hence my virtual nonexistence here anymore...

OOPS! I can hardly see my cave from here...gotta run (back to seclusion)!

Angela...I hope you have your answer ;) Miss your narrations of my animals' activities!


Jacqui said:
Plus never forget this is Josh's forum. He is the one who makes these choices, so he is who you should be complaining to.

...but he rarely takes heed...
 

Kapidolo Farms

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Have you ever walked into a bar that had "regulars", even a fern bar? Sometimes looks like guns are about to be drawn, knives flashed, and the women folk, well you know what I mean.

But those regulars are soooo often harmless, just having fun, and not so reserved about that fun.

Several people speak with passion. I have spent 10's of 1,000's of hours doing herpetoculture, professionally and as a hobbyist. I have a few firsts, and still a few only's in raising and breeding herps. I also have much experience with a rather large number of other groups of plants and animals. Some people seem to like to trifle with that. It's actually fun to some extent, but at times it is tiresome, and facts and data gots-to-be pressed into the dialogue. That kind of passion is why I like this TFO.

I too have been pressed with some gots-to-be said things. I've even slipped in a few unsavory words here and there, spelled such that if your kid is smart enough to sort it out, they are not that young and impressionable.

And then there is writing "this", and someone reading "that". Sticks and stones, you know.

Will
 

Yvonne G

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Well, I think its a pretty sad commentary when I get a PM and the writer asks me a private question about his tortoises because, "...And thank-you for answering. I like the forum, but where you use tact, some
others seem to get really up set ."

We all need to think, actually THINK about what we want to say and especially about HOW we say it. There's no reason for belittling anyone with our answers.
 

jaizei

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ascott said:
Now, don't misunderstand.... I don't find it beneficial for folks to get into cussing matches or outright vicious attacks on one another..however, if there is a certain level of banter that takes place without harsh name calling or the like...then I believe the moderators should take their place in the shadows to enter a block post reminding folks to not be vicious---BUT I do not believe that moderators should be under the impression that the run this forum---that I believe is Josh. I also believe that this forum has been going on strong due to its members, right.....not solely moderators.

I also believe that moderators should be voted in and not simply clicked in....I mean are we not a forum full of members? Why do members not get to decide who the moderators will be? I believe that at present there are some less than adult acting moderators at work here and it truly is making this forum a playground more than a resource....

I agree with your philosophy. I prefer to let threads develop as long as they remain mostly civil. But once someone crosses the line, the hammer comes down. Keep in mind that even if all you see on the public forum is posts disappearing and maybe an occasional warning on a thread, there is usually spirited discussions going on in the moderator section. I think we should strive to make the forum hospitable for everyone. Even those that don't agree with the most popular opinion. This is why I think making moderation a popularity contest is not a good idea.

While this may not be completely relevant to your situation, I think it reminds us that things are not always as they appear. When I was a regular member, I thought that there was favoritism with regards to certain members that broke the rules often and then had a moderator come behind them and clean up the mess. I eventually realized that it was just a side effect. The moderators were just working to protect the forum and any benefits to those members were coincidental. I like to think this is still true. Even when we make mistakes, we (hopefully) have the forum's best interest in mind.

lisa127 said:
This is the only forum (well, one of two but both are chelonian forums) I have ever, ever belonged to that did not have a bunch of fighting and name calling. I have never seen rudeness or meanness of any kind here and I'm wondering why you say this? I have enjoyed this forum due to the lack of arguing and name calling. As I said, never have I belonged to a forum where it didn't get nasty. And I'm sorry, I'm an adult and don't have the patience for forums that have a bunch of juvenile arguing. So I say thank you for the "fluffing".

I think it is testament to the system that is in place that your experience is shared by many. Blink and you will miss it. On the other hand, if you had read some of the deleted posts, you opinion of some members would probably change drastically.
 

DeanS

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jaizei said:
I think it is testament to the system that is in place that your experience is shared by many. Blink and you will miss it. On the other hand, if you had read some of the deleted posts, you opinion of some members would probably change drastically.

You would know...Josh's biggest mistake!:D
 

Baoh

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I would rather see things play out, but this is not something I have ownership of. Depending upon how the clipping is done, it can also dramatically alter the appearance of the exchange into something it may not be, thereby potentially creating a false impression. It may sometimes be difficult to avoid, but I find it sad when it does happen.


DeanS said:
jaizei said:
I think it is testament to the system that is in place that your experience is shared by many. Blink and you will miss it. On the other hand, if you had read some of the deleted posts, you opinion of some members would probably change drastically.

You would know...Josh's biggest mistake!:D

I disagree.
 

ascott

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Depending upon how the clipping is done, it can also dramatically alter the appearance of the exchange into something it may not be, thereby potentially creating a false impression

Absolutely. As pointed out, everyone has a different take on the same story ---every time.

Therefore, if a moderator is going in and going to remove the entire post that is one thing (but that moderator should also be required to pm the party involved)...a moderator should not be allowed to EDIT a post and remove some of it and leave some of it--as this totally is infringement on the writers point----so intrusive and creates a different meaning all together....this should just not be allowed...after all--a moderator does not hold special mind reading skills...so to think that they are doing a good thing is a mistake... delete and pm parties involved or leave it as is...but don't monkey with someones point and tweak it to something else....
 

cemmons12

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Well, I just want to say, "Wow"! I guess that's my .02. Now have a good day my forum friends! :)
 

CharlieM

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I am a moderator on a bird forum. When there is a problem the post is hidden and discussed behind the scenes and a PM is sent out alerting the member that their post was hidden for the various reason. The member is encouraged to edit their own post before its released back to public. This way the member is involved in the process. We never randomly edit of fluff anything and only delete if the member won't edit. Not saying that's right or wrong but it does help the member understand what's happening.
 

yagyujubei

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When a post is changed from the original without the knowledge of the original posted, it's censorship plain and simple. So I guess we have to address others on here as if they're a ten year old, just in case there's one listening. I said "holy crap" once in a post, and it was changed to "gee willikers" or "my goodness gracious" or something similar. I thought that that change portayed me as an idiot, since I don't talk like that. The forum has to decide what members they want here, knowledgable people that believe in what they're saying, or very nice and polite posters that know nothing and talk like eight year olds.
 

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yagyujubei said:
The forum has to decide what members they want here, knowledgable people that believe in what they're saying, or very nice and polite posters that know nothing and talk like eight year olds.

Totally agree, and a healthy debate should always be respected. Agree to disagree.
 

IBeenEasy

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love the forum, but i do agree there are some 'know it alls" here...an most of the time..the rude coments are being said to a newbie whos just excited and has alot of questions and might have been guided in the wrong direction...those people come here for friendly advice..not to be mocked or made in fun of...which alot of the "regulars" , older members and some mods doo..quite alot.... why cant we all just be a big happy turtle family!!! new turtle lovers, old tortoise owners, we can be the TURTLE GANG!!! LOL
 
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