Baby sulcata bottom beak fell off😳

mastershake

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in looking very closely at your pics I do notice some alarming things and I feel bad to bring these up. the ones who get these bumps show edema on their body which u can see in his front almost like they don't fit in their shell like way to puffy. also the right front foot is that a lesion there? I saw this exact same thing before nail/s fell off. I also think I see some other yellow spots besides the one on the neck. these are all related to this thing they have IF it is. even if u fully cure them they end up not growing or BARELY at all. one we had was 10+ months and never made it past 79 grams and ate like there was no tomm. just can't gain. those spots are HIGHLY contagious and one case we saw a healthy one contracted them almost 3 weeks AFTER they appeared cleared up fully so they remained contagious. as far as the jaw yes there is some exposed bone there. and the baytril by now will have worn off as far as it still working so more antibiotics may be needed. I HOPE for u they do make it but i only know of 2 that are still alive after those bumps and those two do not grow at all. im wondering are the additional yellow spots food possibly? on the inner right front leg and under the neck etc?
 
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zovick

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Yes it looks white..I assume bone? And the baytril was 1 single injection on sept 17th
For Baytril to be effective, it needs to be given daily for 7-21 days. The instructions say to give it daily till 2 days after the symptoms are gone. Were you given any oral antibiotics to use at home? Maybe that would explain the reason for just a single injection.

That being said, you would be much better off giving the tortoise ceftazidime (Fortaz) instead because that only needs to be given every 2 to 3 days. In this case, I think dosing every other day would be in order because your tortoise looks fairly ill. The dosage is 20 mg. per kilo of weight given in the pectoral muscle area (armpit of front leg). Hopefully you can get your vet to give you about 5-7 tuberculin syringes with the correct amount of medication already in them. Just keep them in your refrigerator and use one every other day till they are gone and see how the tortoise is doing by then.
 

zovick

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And which pics are best position/angle? I can try to take that angle after work with hubby's camera, his is much clearer
I will try to figure that out and let you know in a little while.

This one below is pretty good.
 

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shawnateerow

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in looking very closely at your pics I do notice some alarming things and I feel bad to bring these up. the ones who get these bumps show edema on their body which u can see in his front almost like they don't fit in their shell like way to puffy. also the right front foot is that a lesion there? I saw this exact same thing before nail/s fell off. I also think I see some other yellow spots besides the one on the neck. these are all related to this thing they have IF it is. even if u fully cure them they end up not growing or BARELY at all. one we had was 10+ months and never made it past 79 grams and ate like there was no tomm. just can't gain. those spots are HIGHLY contagious and one case we saw a healthy one contracted them almost 3 weeks AFTER they appeared cleared up fully so they remained contagious. as far as the jaw yes there is some exposed bone there. and the baytril by now will have worn off as far as it still working so more antibiotics may be needed. I HOPE for u they do make it but i only know of 2 that are still alive after those bumps and those two do not grow at all. im wondering are the additional yellow spots food possibly? on the inner right front leg and under the neck etc?

Yes they are from the carrot soak. The only one I have seen on her is the one behind her neck then the lesion on her front foot where the nail fell off and 1 other similar looking spot. I have t seen any other yellow bumps on her so far
 

shawnateerow

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For Baytril to be effective, it needs to be given daily for 7-21 days. The instructions say to give it daily till 2 days after the symptoms are gone. Were you given any oral antibiotics to use at home? Maybe that would explain the reason for just a single injection.

That being said, you would be much better off giving the tortoise ceftazidime (Fortaz) instead because that only needs to be given every 2 to 3 days. In this case, I think dosing every other day would be in order because your tortoise looks fairly ill. The dosage is 20 mg. per kilo of weight given in the pectoral muscle area (armpit of front leg). Hopefully you can get your vet to give you about 5-7 tuberculin syringes with the correct amount of medication already in them. Just keep them in your refrigerator and use one every other day till they are gone and see how the tortoise is doing by then.

No, they gave me nothing for home. They only scheduled a followup which I will have to reschedule. The vet appointment alone is 35 plus 55 for "exotics" and the baytril was 35 for the one injection. Does that sound like the average?
 

zovick

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Other good ones are the files ending in 145240 and 145222 which probably the best one for showing the lower jawbone.
 

zovick

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No, they gave me nothing for home. They only scheduled a followup which I will have to reschedule. The vet appointment alone is 35 plus 55 for "exotics" and the baytril was 35 for the one injection. Does that sound like the average?
All vets are different and charge what they feel is right in their area. It sound a bit steep to me, but I cannot say what the fees should be where you live (which is where?). I am not familiar with a town/city called Maurice.

This is a common problem, though. Treating a sick tortoise properly often costs more than buying three or four healthy ones (or more).
 

shawnateerow

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All vets are different and charge what they feel is right in their area. It sound a bit steep to me, but I cannot say what the fees should be where you live (which is where?). I am not familiar with a town/city called Maurice.

This is a common problem, though. Treating a sick tortoise properly often costs more than buying three or four healthy ones (or more).

Near lafayette, la. Only one "exotic" vet in town. I messaged my regular vet who works on pets and farm animals to see if he would be willing to get her fortaz
 

zovick

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Near lafayette, la. Only one "exotic" vet in town. I messaged my regular vet who works on pets and farm animals to see if he would be willing to get her fortaz
Good idea. Hopefully he will cooperate and give you the meds you need without requiring an office visit. Just FYI, be ready for another possible sticker shock. The ceftazidime may be as or more costly than the Baytril. I haven't had to buy any for a while but when it first came out, it was quite expensive. However, it it much better to use due to the lack of pain to the animal, no tissue necrosis, and the fact it only needs to be given half as often, etc.

If you do get it, alternate the side on which you give the dose each time. IE, first dose on left side, second dose on right side, and so on. Here is another tip: it is a good idea to keep a list of the dates and which side it was given so you don't have to rely too heavily on memory.
 

mastershake

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@mastershake whats the status on the babies getting tested? Any update yet? 🙄
sadly the 2 people who were supposed to be sending in their animals either messed up by freezing them or they backed out. the other person did place the animals in the fridge properly but it was tossed out in the heat during the day by her husband. so i still need one to send in. the 2 we have do not have the bumps we need a sample WITH the bumps
 

shawnateerow

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sadly the 2 people who were supposed to be sending in their animals either messed up by freezing them or they backed out. the other person did place the animals in the fridge properly but it was tossed out in the heat during the day by her husband. so i still need one to send in. the 2 we have do not have the bumps we need a sample WITH the bumps

Dang ok I gotcha
 

shawnateerow

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mastershake

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just keep in mind IF the bumps are the same thing we have been seeing we have no idea to know how long they remain contagious for so far we know at least a month after they are gone but it can be possibly longer so they should never be around other reptiles of any kind until we can pinpoint what exactly this is (if the underlying condition could be what we think, then possibly forever and would not be able to be near any other reptiles at all)
 

zovick

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just keep in mind IF the bumps are the same thing we have been seeing we have no idea to know how long they remain contagious for so far we know at least a month after they are gone but it can be possibly longer so they should never be around other reptiles of any kind until we can pinpoint what exactly this is (if the underlying condition could be what we think, then possibly forever and would not be able to be near any other reptiles at all)
What do you believe to be the condition which will require permanent quarantine? Not being antagonistic, just quite curious.
 

zovick

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It does appear that the lower jaw bone (mandible) is exposed. The bone appears to be in good condition and I am not seeing any necrotic bone tissue. Hopefully the horny covering will be regenerated over time (if the tortoise survives long enough as I said yesterday).
 

zovick

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possible crypto or yellow fungus
Has anyone at UFL suggested that this problem could be a newer manifestation of INC (Intranuclear coccidiosis) or is that possibility being ruled out?
 

mastershake

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it doesnt present as such but thats why we need specimens inc usually results in respiratory issues, cloaca lesions, skin erythematous (swollen red or inflamed skin), rapid weight loss, etc. it infects nearly all tissues. we need a couple samples to test though but in working with 3 different well known people who are VERY well respected in these things so far that was not something we have on the list as primary. we WILL test for it though to know for sure. either way that is another disease that is NOT good.

to add this does not mean we are not dealing with more then one thing here either from various people. we also have possible reason to suspect crypto but i can not post that info here yet till we know for sure.
 
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