Ceratonia siliqua (carob tree) - edible?

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Hello!

We have a lot of carob trees growing around (Ceratonia siliqua). Can I feed leaves to my tortoise?

So far, I was able to find only carob pods composition (rather common legumes profile with high sugars and protein but good Ca to P ratio and non-toxic), but no meaningful info about the leaves.

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

It says just to stick with the flowers on TTT, but as we know sometimes they’re over cautious so hard to say

Browse and Search the Tortoise Table Plant Database

Browse and Search the Tortoise Table Plant Database

www.thetortoisetable.org.uk

 

[Fluffy]

I've seen your searching skills and I'm guessing if you can't find any info it doesn't exist on the internet.

 

[jaizei]

Carob (Ceratonia siliqua) | Feedipedia

www.feedipedia.org

Carob leaves are relished by browsing livestock

However if you look through the reference list, there's several about the effects of tannins

ex: https://www.researchgate.net/public...-Containing_Leaves_Ceratonia_siliqua_by_Sheep
The nutritional value of carob leaves (CL) and the effectiveness of increasing amounts (12.5,25,32, and 50 g/day) of polyethylene glycol 4000 (PEG) supplemented once daily in overcoming the negative effect of tannins in carob leaves, were examined in four Merino ewes. Ewes fed solely CL were not able to sustain their body weights, and excreted in feces more protein than was consumed

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

It says just to stick with the flowers on TTT, but as we know sometimes they’re over cautious so hard to say

Browse and Search the Tortoise Table Plant Database

Browse and Search the Tortoise Table Plant Database

www.thetortoisetable.org.uk

TTT for some reason shows Jacaranda under "Carob Tree" name. It's not the same carob tree that grows near me.

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Carob (Ceratonia siliqua) | Feedipedia

www.feedipedia.org

Carob leaves are relished by browsing livestock

However if you look through the reference list, there's several about the effects of tannins

ex: https://www.researchgate.net/public...-Containing_Leaves_Ceratonia_siliqua_by_Sheep
The nutritional value of carob leaves (CL) and the effectiveness of increasing amounts (12.5,25,32, and 50 g/day) of polyethylene glycol 4000 (PEG) supplemented once daily in overcoming the negative effect of tannins in carob leaves, were examined in four Merino ewes. Ewes fed solely CL were not able to sustain their body weights, and excreted in feces more protein than was consumed

Thank you!
Interesting, that tannins content in leaves is comparable to mulberry. And carob has higher Ca to P ratio. Carob pods are worse in that aspects but fed to livestock extensively.

Otherwise it looks safe to feed in moderation (I hope I didn't misinterpret the tables and paper).

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

TTT for some reason shows Jacaranda under "Carob Tree" name. It's not the same carob tree that grows near me.

Oh interesting! No worries

 

[The_Four_Toed_Edward]

TTT for some reason shows Jacaranda under "Carob Tree" name. It's not the same carob tree that grows near me.

Yep, always have to check the latin names when using TTT

 

[The_Four_Toed_Edward]

Hello!

We have a lot of carob trees growing around (Ceratonia siliqua). Can I feed leaves to my tortoise?

So far, I was able to find only carob pods composition (rather common legumes profile with high sugars and protein but good Ca to P ratio and non-toxic), but no meaningful info about the leaves.

Maybe @RosemaryDW knows something? Not sure though

 

[RosemaryDW]

The Tortoise Table never convinces me. Legumes aren't bad in moderation. Zre tannins? I don't know but seems unlikely in moderation.

The realitives I found on the Tortoise Table are largely a "No because we aren't sure" or a "No but don't freak out if they take a bite." Again, not convincing. Your tortoises have a varied diet so I wouldn't worry much about it in moderation. Seems weird to me they will eat it but they are redfoots after all!

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

The Tortoise Table never convinces me. Legumes aren't bad in moderation. Zre tannins? I don't know but seems unlikely in moderation.

The realitives I found on the Tortoise Table are largely a "No because we aren't sure" or a "No but don't freak out if they take a bite." Again, not convincing. Your tortoises have a varied diet so I wouldn't worry much about it in moderation. Seems weird to me they will eat it but they are redfoots after all!

Thanks!

I have no high hopes about her eating leaves, but will try anyway. With the pods I expect to have more success

There is a lot of stuff growing around that I can't find on TTT or anywhere else. Like caper's bush which looks fine to feed and perhaps accessible to Testudos in the wild. Or wild spinach (chenopodium album).

 

[RosemaryDW]

There is a lot of stuff growing around that I can't find on TTT or anywhere else. Like caper's bush which looks fine to feed and perhaps accessible to Testudos in the wild. Or wild spinach (chenopodium album).

Even if you are a fan of it—which I am not—the Tortoise Table is largely based on foods found in the U.K., largely England and perhaps Ireland and Scotland. You won't find many matches to your area.

Chenopodium album is known as lambs quarters here. It's a member of the amaranth family and fine in a varied diet. The Tortoise Table has this as a no feed, largely based on the oxalic acid levels in it. Worrying about oxalic is outdated advice. Plenty of our members feed this on occasion. Just keep the diet varied, as you already do, and make sure your tortoise has easy access to water.

My tortoise won't eat it but I try this and regular amaranth a couple of times a year anyway; hope springs eternal!

Caper bush also looks fine to me; it's grouped under the brassicas.

You can always search the forum for a plant; you often find another member who had the same question. I looked and there is indeed a brief mention of carob but as a small part of a Galapagos tortoise. I wouldn't use limited data for a wildly different tortoise for mine though; too different.

I see two posts from me for some reason! This is the one you want.

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

My tort went for it without hesitation, so I think, she knows better As of oxalates, yes I know, it's not a big concern. I try to balance foods high in oxalates with calcium powder, hibiscus or mulberry leaves (hopefully, it works ).

I'm not a fan of TTT, but it's a good general reference anyway.

 

[The_Four_Toed_Edward]

I am more of a fan of some of their other resources than the plant data base, but I occasionally refrence it just because it covers so many plants in one place. I think overly cautious is better than nothing.