Intro and suggestions

[Charles_Veitch]

Hi I have had my two Russian Tortoises for about 6 years and they live in a glass aquarium with coconut substrate. I wanna switch the substrate to a mulch and want to know the best kind. i also want to change up their diet from the usual Kale and Carrots but am not 100% sure what to switch to. i also don't know exactly how old they are and what gender they are so any tips on that would be helpful too. Thanks

 

[TechnoCheese]

Welcome to the forum! It sounds like a lot of things need to be changed with your care.

-tortoises, especially Russians, should never be kept in pairs. They are solitary, territorial animals that don’t have a concept of friendship, and only see other tortoises as mates, combatants, or both. Your two need to be separated and each given properly sized enclosures.

-unless you have a custom behemoth of a tank, it is likely much too small. Each of your Russians requires a minimum enclosure size of 8x4 feet, which can be achieved by building a tortoise table.

-you are right about wanting to change the diet. Your tortoises cannot process sugar, and should not be eating sweet vegetables (like carrots) or fruit of any kind often, if at all. Your tortoises should be eating very few grocery foods, especially kale which is high in oxalates that bind calcium and can form kidney stones, and instead should be eating mainly weeds from your yard.

-for substrate, fine grade orchid bark is best, but you can also use fine grade cypress mulch.

Please give these a read and come back with questions-
Russian Tortoise Care Sheet https://tortoiseforum.org/index.php?threads/Russian-Tortoise-Care-Sheet.80698/

Beginner Mistakes https://tortoiseforum.org/index.php?threads/Beginner-Mistakes.45180/

Can we see pictures of your tortoises and enclosure?

 

[Charles_Veitch]

I got these when i was 11 so i didn't exactly know what i was doing. They don't fight and both seem in good health. I live in New England so i cant pick weeds. I want to do everything I can for these guys because they have always been there for me. Could I build a box from say plywood and then put a screen top on it?

 

[Charles_Veitch]

Welcome to the forum! It sounds like a lot of things need to be changed with your care.

-tortoises, especially Russians, should never be kept in pairs. They are solitary, territorial animals that don’t have a concept of friendship, and only see other tortoises as mates, combatants, or both. Your two need to be separated and each given properly sized enclosures.

-unless you have a custom behemoth of a tank, it is likely much too small. Each of your Russians requires a minimum enclosure size of 8x4 feet, which can be achieved by building a tortoise table.

-you are right about wanting to change the diet. Your tortoises cannot process sugar, and should not be eating sweet vegetables (like carrots) or fruit of any kind often, if at all. Your tortoises should be eating very few grocery foods, especially kale which is high in oxalates that bind calcium and can form kidney stones, and instead should be eating mainly weeds from your yard.

-for substrate, fine grade orchid bark is best, but you can also use fine grade cypress mulch.

Please give these a read and come back with questions-
Russian Tortoise Care Sheet https://tortoiseforum.org/index.php?threads/Russian-Tortoise-Care-Sheet.80698/

Beginner Mistakes https://tortoiseforum.org/index.php?threads/Beginner-Mistakes.45180/

Can we see pictures of your tortoises and enclosure?

So I have been reading some of the threads and it looks like I will have to build a big tortoise table and figure out a new diet and substrate. I look forward to your suggestions.

 

[TechnoCheese]

I got these when i was 11 so i didn't exactly know what i was doing. They don't fight and both seem in good health. I live in New England so i cant pick weeds. I want to do everything I can for these guys because they have always been there for me. Could I build a box from say plywood and then put a screen top on it? View attachment 258081 View attachment 258082 View attachment 258083

Tortoises don’t always fight. They usually stress each other out mentally, in ways that look cute to us. For example, cuddling, following, sitting on food, basking together, sitting nose to nose, mounting, climbing on each other, always sharing a hide of others are available, or just always being together in general are all one tortoise trying to push, shove, and stress the other out of it’s territory. Regardless, they need to be separated.

You don’t necessarily need a screen top. You can just hang lights from above. Here’s a guide on making a tortoise table-
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3XVjjTUbDNPUlhnVlN2bG0tUnc/view

Note that the dividers are completely optional, and you can just do it with two sheets of plywood. Instead of cutting the sides 15 inches tall, cut them 16 inches tall. Then just rout the sides and bottom as shown in the guide, press them together and glue/screw them in place, and you have a finished table. Then all you need to do is silicone around the edges, seal the inside(or half way up)with flex seal, dry lock, or some type of boat paint. After you do that, line the inside with a tarp where you want the substrate, I would recommend doing it at least 6-8 inches up.

Also note that the lamps should be coming straight down from a built in stand or detached one, and not clamped from the side. Clamps are extremely dangerous, and huge fire hazards. Learned that the hard way.(Curtis was named Lucky at first for a reason.)

If you are able to find endive, escarole, arugula, radicchio, dandelions, or cactus pads (also called nopales), favor those as staples, and add other food around it. You can also add pellets like zoo med grassland tortoise food or NutraZoo (I believe that’s what Mazuri’s called outside of America) tortoise pellets to grocery store food.

 

[Charles_Veitch]

Tortoises don’t always fight. They usually stress each other out mentally, in ways that look cute to us. For example, cuddling, following, sitting on food, basking together, sitting nose to nose, mounting, climbing on each other, always sharing a hide of others are available, or just always being together in general are all one tortoise trying to push, shove, and stress the other out of it’s territory. Regardless, they need to be separated.

You don’t necessarily need a screen top. You can just hang lights from above. Here’s a guide on making a tortoise table-
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3XVjjTUbDNPUlhnVlN2bG0tUnc/view

Note that the dividers are completely optional, and you can just do it with two sheets of plywood. Instead of cutting the sides 15 inches tall, cut them 16 inches tall. Then just rout the sides and bottom as shown in the guide, press them together and glue/screw them in place, and you have a finished table. Then all you need to do is silicone around the edges, seal the inside(or half way up)with flex seal, dry lock, or some type of boat paint. After you do that, line the inside with a tarp where you want the substrate, I would recommend doing it at least 6-8 inches up.

Also note that the lamps should be coming straight down from a built in stand or detached one, and not clamped from the side. Clamps are extremely dangerous, and huge fire hazards. Learned that the hard way.(Curtis was named Lucky at first for a reason.)

If you are able to find endive, escarole, arugula, radicchio, dandelions, or cactus pads (also called nopales), favor those as staples, and add other food around it. You can also add pellets like zoo med grassland tortoise food or NutraZoo (I believe that’s what Mazuri’s called outside of America) tortoise pellets to grocery store food.

I have arugula in my house currently so I will use that for now. I will have to do some rearranging in my house but i think i can make that Tortoise table work, Would that be for one tortoise or 2? What should i do in the meantime while I am waiting to build the table in regards to the tortoises?

 

[TechnoCheese]

I have arugula in my house currently so I will use that for now. I will have to do some rearranging in my house but i think i can make that Tortoise table work, Would that be for one tortoise or 2? What should i do in the meantime while I am waiting to build the table in regards to the tortoises?

You need one for each tortoise. You could also attempt to make something like this- Two Story Insulated Tortoise Town-home

https://tortoiseforum.org/index.php...wo-Story-Insulated-Tortoise-Town-home.163540/

As long as you get the new enclosures done soon, I would just keep them in the same enclosure for now. They’ve gone this long with it, a little longer can’t hurt much.

 

[Charles_Veitch]

You need one for each tortoise. You could also attempt to make something like this- Two Story Insulated Tortoise Town-home

https://tortoiseforum.org/index.php...wo-Story-Insulated-Tortoise-Town-home.163540/

As long as you get the new enclosures done soon, I would just keep them in the same enclosure for now. They’ve gone this long with it, a little longer can’t hurt much.

There is not a lot of extra space in my house for multiple tables but i think I can fit a 4x8 table in, but I am unsure what to do for the second and really want to keep both.

 

[TechnoCheese]

There is not a lot of extra space in my house for multiple tables but i think I can fit a 4x8 table in, but I am unsure what to do for the second and really want to keep both.

Would you be able to fit two 6x3 tables, and add a 2x3 second story to each with a ramp leading up to it? It’s lower than the minimum, but it’s not terrible. You could also try doing a 4x4 double decker, like this- https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/double-decker-or-two-story-enclosure.86566/

 

[Charles_Veitch]

Would you be able to fit two 6x3 tables, and add a 2x3 second story to each with a ramp leading up to it? It’s lower than the minimum, but it’s not terrible. You could also try doing a 4x4 double decker, like this- https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/double-decker-or-two-story-enclosure.86566/

That is another good idea, I got a lot to think about tomorrow. Thanks for the help so far. Gn

 

[Yvonne G]

So I have been reading some of the threads and it looks like I will have to build a big tortoise table and figure out a new diet and substrate. I look forward to your suggestions.

If it were me, I would be thinking about building an outdoor enclosure for when the weather is nice enough for them to be outside, then in the winter they would brumate, so an indoor enclosure wouldn't be necessary.