Leopard issues?

[SarahChelonoidis]

Ah yes, I see your old thread. Your temperature issues are the same as before, but your setup is challenging to change. You'll need a lower wattage bulb since raising it won't be possible.

It seems like you've added quite a few tortoises since your last post. You had a sick sulcata and leopard then so I have to ask why you would introduce more babies when you suspected a pathogen before? If it is truly not environmental, your temperatures still need to be corrected because tortoise immune systems don't work efficiently if they can't get warm enough. Small 'hospital tanks' may be in order to separate your sick tortoises into so you can monitor them individually and make sure the conditions are right (much easier in a small space).

There isn't a most common infectious agent to recommend treating for that I am aware of. I don't suspect anyone will advise you to medicate without knowing what you are attempting to treat.

 

[Yvonne G]

What is that.....six of you replied and absolutely no treatment guidance whatsoever? Are you flipping kidding me? This is the only tortoise forum I'm aware of and NO ONE knows how to treat infections??? That simply can't be true.

I've gone over and over with you guys the stats and all that bs. I do everything perfectly to the t as much as is humanly possible. Although in the low side of my enclosure it's pretty impossible to keep the temp higher than 75-80. I have radiant heat panels and they simply won't maintain anything more than 5-10 degrees higher than the room. And yes, I've been over it with the manufacturer and his claim, up and down, is that they're functioning properly.

I suggest you cover that enclosure. It's the only way to get the heat to stay in and to keep the room air out. Also, if the RHP aren't doing the job, get rid of them and add a CHE over the cooler end.

Under the big light is hot....probably 110-120. I've also asked in the past how the hell any of you supposedly have a basking temp of only 100 and then maintain a decent temp in the rest of the enclosure but no one answered that either.

Your habitat has to be big enough in order to get a gradient. I have a 4' long plastic tub for my desert tortoise babies. I positioned the MVB in the center with a 60 watt black light at either end. Then the whole thing is draped with a sheet of plastic. It's about 103F directly under the MVB and it's appx. 80F all over the rest of the habitat. I raised or lowered the MVB until I got the desired temperature at ground level.

There's multiple hides although none of them use them consistently....they all seem to rather stuff themselves in the back corner where it's about 90.

I have four hides, two at each end, that take up the whole space at the end. The ends seem to be where they want to rest, so I've used that whole space with half logs.

I of course don't use the coil bulbs.....they're soaked every day.....etc, etc, just like everyone says.

I refuse to believe that you can't house them together and if that's the only culprit am fine with some survival of the fittest. After past experience I didn't expect to end up with this many that are seemingly healthy anyway.

Also the sully's are OBVIOUSLY unaffected, so why separate them? The two leo's either have the same thing or are just acting the same way if nothing is wrong.

You've tried everything else, why won't you even consider separating the species. At the very least, the one you're concerned about should be in his own space. I like to keep my desert tortoise hatchlings together because it seems to make them eat better (competition for the food), however, when they get to be about 8 months to a year old they get separated. Bullying is a mental thing. It's not always something the human can see. The dominant tortoise lets the more submissive tortoise know that he's not wanted in this territory. Since they are all locked into the same habitat, the less dominant animal has no place to go, so he stops eating and stay hidden, or at least he tries to keep out of the dominant tortoise's way.

We're really trying to help you here. Maybe we just don't have the know how to solve your problem, but we're trying. We've all learned from experience, and it's our experiences that we're sharing. If you don't want to take our advice, that up to you, but don't get mad at the messenger. We really are trying to help you get your tortoise better.

 

[kywilli2063]

I actually did call a vet today but that's simply not reasonable. Here (I'm on TDOA in dc area) they charge 75 dollars to see them, they'll run a fecal sample without seeing them but then won't tell you if the result is positive without seeing them. Plus the lady couldn't actually verify that the vets (exotic office though mind you) have previous experience with torts. No thank you, not wasting that much money.

 

[kywilli2063]

Metro treats a wide range of things, and panacur is the same on the worm side. I'm not sure how the hell to give it to them though. He might not want to open his eyes much without provocation, but he's still very feisty and getting his mouth open is super hard.

My enclosure is huge.

I'm not sure how in the world I'm supposed to keep the rest of it warm though if I lower the wattage again on the basking light. I've already lowered it once.

The temp being low is really not an issue, there is ONE small area that is in the 70s, and like I've said, they do not spend time there. I added a long tube uvB to that side of the enclosure and they still don't really go over there despite it being mostly in the mid 80s.

 

[Yvonne G]

OK, I'll say it again - The two young tortoises that won't or can't open their eyes need to be set up in a smaller hospital tank/tub/container. For one baby I use a 10 gallon aquarium, but for two youngster that I don't know the size of maybe you need something SLIGHTLY bigger than a 10 gallon aquarium. It's so much easier to maintain heat and humidity in a smaller, even though it's crowded, enclosure. Make the temperature 80F degrees inside this hospital tank (I'm going to use 'tank' because it rolls off the fingers easier). Moisten the substrate and cover the whole shebang to keep the warm, moist air inside.

Every morning, take these two babies out of the hospital tank and place them into a small bowl (something with a small footprint, but tall sides) of warm water mixed half and half with Gerber strained carrots. The mixture should come up to the middle of the babies' sides, where the top shell meets the bottom shell. Position a light over one end of the soaking container so it doesn't get cold, but pay attention so you don't cook them. Leave them in this soaking mixture for AT LEAST a half hour, and longer is even better. They may not drink the mixture, but they do absorb some of the nutrients through the thin skin on the throat and around the cloaca. You should see improvement in three days. It has never failed to work for me. The eyes are open after three days soaking in carrot water for a half hour or more daily.

Bear in mind you are only addressing the closed eye issue. During this three day period, you need to be a detective and really work hard at trying to figure out why this happened to the babies in the first place. The soak is fixing the eye problem, but if you put them right back into their old habitat and care, it's just going to happen again. It may help if you take another look at the care sheet and read it with an open mind, tossing out any old outdated info you may have stored in there.

Good luck to you. I really and truly hope these babies get better.