Lethargic baby Hermann's tortoise

[Moonrabbit]

I bought a baby Hermann's tortoise in February. Initially, he was very active, and I frequently observed him eating. However, over the past couple of weeks, he seems to spend nearly all of his time in one place, either basking or hiding in shade, and I have not observed him eating in some time. To be clear, he is moving about the cage when not being observed, and I have seen him drinking recently.

I am attaching a few pictures for reference. I have him in a 20 gallon tank with UVB light, a 75w basking light on one side, and a 75w thermal coil on the other. Temp runs 80-90 F on side with basking light and 70-80 F on side with thermal coil depending on room temp. I have a continuously running humidifier to keep humidity 50-70% depending on temp. At night, I turn off the UVB and basking lights and shift the thermal coil to the other side of cage, where a heat pad also runs over night. Night time temp is 80 F on heated side, ~70 F on unheated side.

Turtle is fed a mix of greens (kale, spinach, dandelion, etc.) and small amount of peas (which he has seemed to like). Fresh food is provided twice per day. I have been supplementing calcium every day but read that this may be too much. Provide spring water for drinking and bathing. Soak tortoise in spring water for 30+ minutes at least once per week.

I see no obvious signs of distress. No evidence of shell rot (white patches on shell) or respiratory illness (eye/nose secretions). My son commented that the tortoise's plastron is very pliant, but I understand this is normal in babies.

Perhaps I am being overly concerned, but any suggestions others have for improving care would be greatly appreciated.

 

[wellington]

Please read the caresheet asap and make adjustments, your temps are too cold for a hatchling. Also get rid of the coil bulb it can harm their eyes.

 

[Pearly]

Hello @Moonrabbit and very warm welcome from Texas! Before you do anythhing else SOAK this baby for ½ an hour in nice warm water temp 95-105F. Ditch this dial temp gague and get yourself couple of digital ones. Walmart has those “humidity gagues” that also read temps. They are like 9 bucks, easy. Your tank is small so temps are not going to vary that much. With these little babies keeping them WARM and HUMID and CORRECT DIET are paramount. No more spinach/kale, those are high in oxalates which mess up calcium absorbtion. Instead of supplementic calcium you can put cuttlefish bone in there for him to nibble when he wants plus offer more appropriate food. I also don’t believe peas are good food for grazing tortoise. It seems to me that their high protein and sugar content would be too much for the baby tort. Do you have any pelleted tortoise diet? Did breeder send you a little sampling if Mazuri? If yes, pour water over those pellets and let them soak till soft and then offer to your baby tort, after his ½ hr warm bath, when his inner core temp is up. Do you see this baby pee/poop? What does it look like? “Pliant” belly maybe ok, how is the carapace? I understand that much pliability maybe indicating metabolic bone disease which is very painful to tortoises and ends up irreversibly deforming their shells. I love it that you have the humidifier in there! Awesome job!!!! Put more hides, sight barriers (plants) in there, those babies don’t like to feel like they are in a fish bowl. Maybe few plants around the glass walls, the back and sides? And some lower ones by the front?.... I agree about the coil lamp- no good for their eyes. We have had peoples torts get bad eye burns and one that i know of even went blind. Definitely SOAK in AT LEAST 95F water (again 95-105f is best range to keep them warm), for at least ½ an hr, DAILY! Or twice a day. Definitely CHANGE THE DIET! Once the baby starts eating proper diet then you can consider calcium supplementation. Many babies won’t come near food if calcium powder is on it. I hope @Hermanni Chris gets on the forum soon. He will give you the best advise. Good luck! Glad you have found us here

 

[Moonrabbit]

Thanks, both!

So, a couple of questions.

First, the thermal coil, which does not emit light (only heat), is bad for tortoise's eyes? If so, then what should I use to heat the other side of cage? Care sheet advocates against heat pads or rocks, but I understand the tortoise should be provided an area to "get out of the sun" so to speak. The ambient temp in our house is 70, so without additional heating, temp on that side of cage will be fairly cool.

Second, regarding cuttlebone, can I use the bones they sell for birds (parakeets)? If so, do I just lay this on substrate for tortoise to chomp on at leisure?

Will look into purchasing Mazuri food today and increase soaks to 3-4 x per week. Will also look into new temp/humidity gauges today.

The tortoise's shell is not soft. His plastron is flexible, like a plastic Tupperware lid. From what I have read, this is not atypical. Unfortunately, I did not palpate the tortoise's plastron when we bought him, so I have no reference standard against which to judge it.

I have seen the tortoise defecate, albeit not in a while. It was brownish-black and a small quantity. Tarry would be apt description.

 

[Moonrabbit]

Submitting an update.

I replaced my 75w basking light and 60w thermal emitter with two 100w thermal emitters on dimmers. Using my analog thermometers, temp is maintained at 80 F (80% power) on one side and 90-95 F (max power) on other side during day and 80 F (80% power) on both sides during night. I have ramped up humidifier to accommodate increase in temps. I have also started feeding the Mazuri small bites food, which the tortoise went for right away. I suspect that this may have been what the breeder was feeding him beforehand. I am soaking the tortoise twice per day before feeding. The tortoise defecates frequently while soaking. During the day, the tortoise still spends a lot of time basking.

I put a parakeet cuttlebone in the tank, but there is no evidence that the tortoise is touching this. I ordered a calcium block designed for tortoises and will see if he goes for this. I powdered the Mazuri with calcium this morning, and the tortoise ate it, so this may be the most practical solution for calcium intake. I also ordered two digital thermometers/hygrometers to replace my analog devices, which should arrive today.

A few questions. Is it okay to feed the tortoise the Mazuri food exclusively if he eats it? Do I need to provide any vegetables or other supplements (other than calcium)? Also, how frequently per week should I provide the calcium supplement?

 

[TechnoCheese]

Tortoises will often go a while without eating the cuttlebone, and then start eating them like potato chips.
Mazuri should only be used as a supplement, so no, you can’t feed it exclusively.
I wouldn’t provide a calcium supplement as long as the cuttle bone is in there, but I would wait for a second opinion on that

 

[Koen]

also change your soil please, those wood chips doesn't keep humidity and it is very difficult to walk on for such a small tort.

i would recommend to change to coco coir or just plain garden soil.