My Russian crawled up into a Ground Squirrel tunnel - How long can he brumate up there?

DeanneW

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My adult male crawled into a ground squirrel tunnel in May. I know they can go 9 months underground in their native Kazakhstan. A California breeder said this climate is perfect for them...and he could stay up there all Winter. I know they are biologically programmed to survive underground for long periods of time. I would like some feedback? (I'm heartbroken.) I joined this forum for help with things like this. Thank you.
 

Lyn W

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My adult male crawled into a ground squirrel tunnel in May. I know they can go 9 months underground in their native Kazakhstan. A California breeder said this climate is perfect for them...and he could stay up there all Winter. I know they are biologically programmed to survive underground for long periods of time. I would like some feedback? (I'm heartbroken.) I joined this forum for help with things like this. Thank you.

Hi and welcome,
Torts normally hibernate overwinter or dig down if they get too hot.
May seems a lot too early for hibernation, but hopefully someone more familiar with your climate will be able to help.
Has he been there all this time and are you sure he's still there?
I would be worried he's stuck, any chance you can carefully dig him out?
 

DeanneW

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This is a really big tunnel that was on my property for years - but I did not know that it came out under a retaining wall. I bought an endoscope from Amazon - and I saw the tunnel - it is not blocked. This what I am worried about - I can't get to him. There is no where else he could have gone in a short amount of time, and is completely concealed & not moving around. He has been missing since May. It is a fenced in yard and so is my neighbors yard. This is similar to when he crawled under the shed. I took my eyes off him for 3 minutes..and he went right for the cool dark area. The breeder I emailed was very helpful for a while - but I think they went out of business. I can't think of any reason he might have died up there. I might have to accept that...but I did not know much about this species until I bought him.
 

Lyn W

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I'm sorry to say that after that amount of time, I think the chances are that he's either gone the whole length of the tunnel and come out on the other side under the wall and took off, got stuck or been predated by rodents. He would have needed food and uvb and especially water so unless he's come out somewhere and been able to find them, I can't see how he could have survived that long in the tunnel.
I hope I'm wrong - Russians love to dig and climb so maybe he dug under your garden fence, has been found and is living happily with another family.
So sorry I can't be more positive.
 

Lyn W

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I'm sure you've already done this but keep searching in every nook and cranny of your garden and under the shed and look out for him under shrubs etc in case he's been living wild and dug himself in for the winter last fall. If your temps have warmed up he would be coming out of hibernation soon.
 

DeanneW

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The tunnel is blocked at the top..so he can't crawl out. He had been behind the shed a few days earlier...so he knew how to get back there. He disappeared in a short amount of time , was not moving around and I went through this once when he went under the shed. He stopped moving around, was not looking for food, and was under there for a week. I have been working from home so I have been out patrolling & in the neighbors yard daily, weekly, monthly. That's the only place he could have gone. But, I agree, I am trying resign myself to the fact that he will not crawl out. I watched a video on Amazon - by a breeder - about Russians..and it is in their genetics to crawl out after brumation....but there is still no sign of him. I am very sad- I have had him for 6 1/2 years. He was like a member of the family. Thank you
 

Tom

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A few things:

Our climate is NOT perfect for them. Most breeders, I've found, have little idea what they are talking about and simply repeat the same wrong info that was repeated to them. This used to be me, and that's one way I know.

A ground squirrel burrow is just a little too small for a Russian to fit in. Russians usually just dig into the soil somewhere. This is the most likely scenario. If this is the case, he'll reappear when the days get longer and the weather warms, if something hasn't killed him over the winter.

If he did go down the burrow, and there are ground squirrels down there, he's likely been eaten or killed.

If you find your tortoise, or if you don't and decide to get another one, THIS is the reason we all tell people not to turn them loose in the yard. It doesn't matter how closely you intend to supervise, you will lose them eventually. You've now lost yours twice. Make a proper enclosure. Inspect it daily to make sure there are no new problems like burrowing animals, trash that might blow in on the wind, fallen tree branches, etc...

Read this for all the correct and current care info, including how to safely house them outside year round.
 

DeanneW

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A few things:

Our climate is NOT perfect for them. Most breeders, I've found, have little idea what they are talking about and simply repeat the same wrong info that was repeated to them. This used to be me, and that's one way I know.

A ground squirrel burrow is just a little too small for a Russian to fit in. Russians usually just dig into the soil somewhere. This is the most likely scenario. If this is the case, he'll reappear when the days get longer and the weather warms, if something hasn't killed him over the winter.

If he did go down the burrow, and there are ground squirrels down there, he's likely been eaten or killed.

If you find your tortoise, or if you don't and decide to get another one, THIS is the reason we all tell people not to turn them loose in the yard. It doesn't matter how closely you intend to supervise, you will lose them eventually. You've now lost yours twice. Make a proper enclosure. Inspect it daily to make sure there are no new problems like burrowing animals, trash that might blow in on the wind, fallen tree branches, etc...

Read this for all the correct and current care info, including how to safely house them outside year round.
 

DeanneW

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I appreciate the feedback. I did not turn him loose. I went to the other side of the house briefly, and he took off. This squirrel tunnel has been abandoned for years - and ascends up an embankment. The entrance to the tunnel is about 2 feet wide - before I plugged it up. I have thought of the worse. I guess he could have crawled under a big bush in my yard - but I don't think that environment could keep him dormant through the long California summers. (I checked every bush.) I know they like to burrow. This little guy is a wild caught - adult and I wondered how many times he would have had the same experience - crawling into tunnels for long months - in it's native land before he landed in Petsmart. I am doing my best to let go of him. I guess I need closure. Thank you
 

Duckster RT

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I would get a long fiberglass electrical snake. Place it in as far as it can go. Carefully dig in the area it stopped. Carefully excavate and repeat the process. It will be very hard. You will have to work slow and smart. This is the only thing that I can think of to help you with your problem. Good luck
 

DeanneW

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Thank you for all the replies. It has been almost a year and I feel that I have lost my little pet.
 

wellington

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Thank you for all the replies. It has been almost a year and I feel that I have lost my little pet.
You could hire a sewer and drain guy to come out and camera the tunnel to see if you can find him down there.
Like Tom said, if you find him give him a proper outside enclosure. Twice you took your eyes off him and he disappeared. That's why an enclosure suited for the tort is very important.
Good luck.
 

AgataP

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? I had a RT. Little bastard (sorry, sorry no other way to describe him), was an escape artist.
I knew his digging/sleeping spot for years till one day it decided to take off.
I was lucky the vegetation was perfect, temps were ideal, etc. we got him back after 3 months about 10 meters from the regular sleep spot.
If your tort has not been seen for a year - he took off.
Chances are that he has been eaten by other creatures since he decided to jump on someone else’s hard work. Or simply the tunnel was too amazing to stay in.

Rts slow down In late September. They start to be picky about their food. At this point if they are outdoor they start digging deep.
You observe the sun and you can predict where they are. Poland is way closer to the RTs climate so my assumption is they behaved “naturally”.
California climate is not really close to what they actually live in.
I would actually say WA (where I am located) might be closer.


I remember me RTs digging deep into the ground as soon as temps hit 21+ (Celsius) so let’s say 70-73 they were deep deep underground.


One thing that I have learned from all of that - I got a tortoise make sure the enclosure has solid walls and sold bottom.
Put enough substrate that allows them to dig and yet make sure they can’t dig beyond certain point.


I truly hope your tortoise comes back but otherwise remember these stinkers are escape artists.
 
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