New Sulcata and need help/advice

[jaybee]

A few months ago, a coworker offered me a tortoise his parents were trying to rehome, as they had both just retired and wanted to travel. They said as long as they owned her they were unable to do so. I happened to have lived on a farm my whole life(animals of all sorts I currently own a goat, 4 guinea hens, 6 ducks, 12 chickens, 2 dogs, 4 house cats, and a rabbit) and my curiosity was peaked by the offer of her knowing that I have the space available for her outside without a doubt and an unfinished basement to aid me in the harsh New England temps and weather when needed. The tortoise was not brought up again till about 5 days ago when my co worker asked me if i was willing to take her. I had done some brief research on tortoises when the offer first came up and had only seen one picture of her with my coworkers children, she appeared to be somewhere around 20-25lbs and when I had asked my coworker if that was as big as she got he replied with a simple yes...


FAST FORWARD to today: my coworkers parents drove approx 4 hours to drop Mackzine off to me, upon their arrival I was shocked to say the least when a 50lb tortoise was removed from her plastic travel pool from the bed of their pick up truck and placed in my lawn. As her owners handed me a UVB lamp, some food to get me started(kale, butternut squash and some cherry tomatoes) informed me she was an African desert tortoise and that she is 10 years old and full grown at 50lbs(which i later learned was beyond a false statement), according to them she LOVES kale and should never be allowed near water besides a dish(pie dish they also gave me), as well as she was attacked by a bear a few years back at their house in Maine and thats the reason her shell is deformed on the top back part of her and because of that she ONLY has lived in their basment since. They then hurried off on their way without even giving me a chance to breathe, Im not even sure if I was able to tell them my name in the whole exchange, they more threw information at me and ran off.

Shes very sweet but upon actually getting a chance to sit down and research I am well aware I currently may be in over my head, but am very ambitious and want to give this little lady the best life she deserves. with that said I have a number of concerns and questions.

She has severe pyramiding happening, I attribute this to the apparent high consumption of kale perhaps? and what I can also only assume would be a lack of calcium supplement in her diet.

with that being said I was able to find a few suggestions in my internet searching for calcium supplements, these included: cuttlebones, calcium blocks, limestone powder that you can buy in feed stores, human calcium pills and oyster shells. I read you need to caution yourself in what you choose as some and most of these have some sort of metals also with them which can be harmful. I also read that the calcium blocks are only about 40% useable calcium for them as it contains plaster of paris which depleates the amount that benefits the tortoise. I was just wondering what others use and what seems to work well for them if they had tried multiple things?

because they had been using the UVB lamp thats why I am under the impression it was lack of calcium. however it could have been the lack of the good ole natural sunlight? and if not at least a combo of both?

now on to my soaking question, how and what do I even do? what do others use for theirs? I saw someone had used a snow sled saucer style and had made it flush with the ground so the tortoise could enter it, my only concern was that perhaps that would be too deep?

my next giant hurdle is trying to figure out a living situation for her, she is currently in my basement bathroom with her uvb lamp, water pie dish and I went and got her some turnip greens to at least get me through till tomorrow. her previous owners told me she knocked down a fence they constructed of 2X4 pannels and chicken wire around their garden, so I am a bit fearful of placing her in my extra duck enclosure that has a canopy to keep the menacing hawks out for fear she will knock it down while Im off doing other things and I will never find her again, she will get eaten, or wander off to the road and get killed by one of the many cars constantly going by.

Ill be sure to get a photo of her tomorrow so I am able to show you all what she currently looks like.

Any and all input and advice is beyond appreciated so im able to give this sweet lady the best life possible.

 

[Maro2Bear]

Wow Jaybee, what an "introduction" to the Tortoise Forum! Welcome. I'm sure many of the more experienced folks here will be able to assist you. Nice of you to roll up your sleeves and jump in. I get the feeling this tort is already in much better hands and will soak in the care it receives from you. One of the recommended sources of calcium is of course cuttlebone. Best of luck and I'm sure we all will want to see pix of your new guy. Good luck.

 

[Jabuticaba]

Welcome and what a story!! Please post pictures.


May, Aussies, & Hermannis
IG: @AUSSOMEAUSSIES

 

[Jodie]

Glad to hear you're ready to jump in with both feet for this tortoise. Sulcatas are amazing and a hand full. There are some care sheets in the sulcata section of this forum. The pyramiding is caused by a lack of humidity. Good luck.

 

[Tom]

You've gotten all sorts of misinformation... I hope we can help.

1. Pyramiding is caused growth in conditions that are too dry. Diet, calcium and UV have little to do with it, contrary to what all the old books and websites say. Diet, calcium and UV are all important factors for maintaining the HEALTH of your tortoise, but they play a minor role in the pyramiding. They are NOT desert animals. They have a hot humid rainy season over there for 3-4 months of every year, and they are underground in burrows for the rest of the dry portion of the year. They NEED water, warmth and humidity.
2. Diet. You've gotten all the wrong info and you are thinking WAYYYYYY too small scale. Sulcatas eat like a horse. Literally. Grazing all day long. My 30 pound sulcatas make bigger poops than my 140 pound great dane. Here is how and what to feed them:
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/for-those-who-have-a-young-sulcata.76744/
3. They need a large area to roam all year long. A basement bathroom for half the year will not do. The entire basement would be a compromise at best. Its a compromise I wouldn't make. Any species can be kept anywhere in the world with enough time, money and effort. How much time, money and effort are you willing to give? Here is my enclosure:
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/enclosure-expansion.38788/
4. I soak my 50 pounders in large stock tanks or large cement mixing tubs. Yours also needs a much better water bowl. For that I use pizza dough trays. They can be a challenge to find, but they work great. I sink them into the ground so the rim is level with the surface.
5. You don't need a lot of calcium supplementation for a large, non egg laying tortoise if they are fed a good diet. A little bit once a week will do. I like RepCal or ZooMed stuff. They sell it in bulk. Ask you pet store to order it for you. A large container will cost a lot more than the smaller ones, but it will last a long time.
6. Chicken wire won't hold them and might injure them. You need visual barriers and something sturdy. The block I use should work, but you might need to put 2x4 posts in the ground and ply wood in between. 16" high should work, but go 24" if you are worried about it.

Here is one more thread to check out:
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/beginner-mistakes.45180/

Good luck and feel free to ask lots of questions.

 

[Yvonne G]

Hi JB, and welcome to the Forum!!

You can build a fence that will hold the tortoise. Really any wood fence will do. If you put 4x4's down into the ground 2' then attach wood to them, he won't be able to get out. You can either use redwood pickets, plywood, corral lumber - anything will do. But nail up the wood to the INSIDE of the 4x4's so when the tortoise pushes on the fence the boards don't pop off. You can also build the fence with concrete blocks, but you have to realize that your tortoise IS going to try to escape. A tortoise that starts out in a pen as a baby, will not try to test the fence or try to escape as badly as a 50lb tortoise that is plunked down into t new territory and wants to go home. He's going to be climbing and pushing on the fence, and I'm afraid that stacking concrete blocks just will not be strong enough.

I have a 110lb sulcata that has lived in the same yard for about 15 years. He doesn't test the fence - ever, however, he walks exactly next to it, bumping it with each step, and when he comes to the corner, he turns INTO the fence, not away from it, so there is a lot of pressure put on the fence. Because my wood corral lumber is nailed on the OUTSIDE of the 4x4's, he would pop one off every so often, so I nailed up a 1x12 on the inside of the fence.

Your tortoise is going to be unhappy and try to escape for a couple of weeks, but he will eventually settle down and realize this is his new territory.
I'd love to see pictures. When you do take pictures, turn the tortoise over and let us see the bottom shell too, including the tail area.

 

[Yvonne G]

I forgot to include a picture of my sulcata's fence:

 

[jaybee]

I was able to get these pictures of her today while she was out roaming my yard and munching on grass

 

[jaybee]

thank you everyone for you're help so far! its been quite the busy day here trying to situate more for her.

 

[Tom]

I need to see a pic of the tail, but I think he is a she. How long is the tail? Can you get a pic of the tail?

This tortoise has Metabolic Bone Disease from a poor diet and lack of UV. A good diet, calcium supplementation, sunshine or indoor UV, and time will get it back on track.

"Good diet" info is listed in the thread above, and grass is a big part of it, so you are already off to a good start.

 

[jaybee]

its tail seems to be bent to the right side of the body under the rear of her shell if youre looking at it from behind. from what I could tell its just a little shorter then my index finger, perhaps 3-4 inches if I had to estimate. However as soon as it stops downpouring ill take her out again to try to get a photo of it

 

[Tom]

If that is the case, you have a male. Female tail are tiny little nubs. Barely measurable. Quarter to half inch on a huge female. Doesn't really matter for anything, just though you might want to know.


And your co-worker should have a serious talk with his/her parents. Shameful ignorance and neglect of an animal....

 

[tortdad]

Welcome. Here's a picture of my 150lb 11 year old male. Notice the flat spot on the back of his shell??? That's from his original owner keeping him inside durning the cold without the proper lights.


0.0.1 Redfoot (Spike)
0.0.1 Cherryhead Redfoot (Bruce Wayne)
1.0 Sulcata (Hal Jordan)

 

[Robertchrisroph]

hello. Tom, how can you tell there is MBD? just trying to learn as much as I can. thanks

 

[Tom]

hello. Tom, how can you tell there is MBD? just trying to learn as much as I can. thanks

The tortoise's back is concave. See how it dips about 3/4 of the way back?

 

[Prairie Mom]

I forgot to include a picture of my sulcata's fence:

View attachment 94318 View attachment 94320 View attachment 94321 View attachment 94322

WOW Yvonne!!! What an amazing space for your tortoises! Is the water they are drinking from upside down trash lids? clever.

 

[Tom]

Welcome. Here's a picture of my 150lb 11 year old male. Notice the flat spot on the back of his shell??? That's from his original owner keeping him inside durning the cold without the proper lights.

No it isn't. That is normal for the descendants of most of the imported sulcatas. Especially typical of the Mali tortoises which is where most of them were imported from. You'll see that same slant in many of the tortoises that have lived their whole lives outside eating weeds and walking in the sun in warmer climates, like mine. Not the same thing as MBD where the back of the carapace becomes concave, sunken in and the scutes turn in on each other.

 

[Prairie Mom]

A few months ago, a coworker offered me a tortoise his parents were trying to rehome, as they had both just retired and wanted to travel. They said as long as they owned her they were unable to do so. I happened to have lived on a farm my whole life(animals of all sorts I currently own a goat, 4 guinea hens, 6 ducks, 12 chickens, 2 dogs, 4 house cats, and a rabbit) and my curiosity was peaked by the offer of her knowing that I have the space available for her outside without a doubt and an unfinished basement to aid me in the harsh New England temps and weather when needed. The tortoise was not brought up again till about 5 days ago when my co worker asked me if i was willing to take her. I had done some brief research on tortoises when the offer first came up and had only seen one picture of her with my coworkers children, she appeared to be somewhere around 20-25lbs and when I had asked my coworker if that was as big as she got he replied with a simple yes...


FAST FORWARD to today: my coworkers parents drove approx 4 hours to drop Mackzine off to me, upon their arrival I was shocked to say the least when a 50lb tortoise was removed from her plastic travel pool from the bed of their pick up truck and placed in my lawn. As her owners handed me a UVB lamp, some food to get me started(kale, butternut squash and some cherry tomatoes) informed me she was an African desert tortoise and that she is 10 years old and full grown at 50lbs(which i later learned was beyond a false statement), according to them she LOVES kale and should never be allowed near water besides a dish(pie dish they also gave me), as well as she was attacked by a bear a few years back at their house in Maine and thats the reason her shell is deformed on the top back part of her and because of that she ONLY has lived in their basment since. They then hurried off on their way without even giving me a chance to breathe, Im not even sure if I was able to tell them my name in the whole exchange, they more threw information at me and ran off.

Shes very sweet but upon actually getting a chance to sit down and research I am well aware I currently may be in over my head, but am very ambitious and want to give this little lady the best life she deserves. with that said I have a number of concerns and questions.

She has severe pyramiding happening, I attribute this to the apparent high consumption of kale perhaps? and what I can also only assume would be a lack of calcium supplement in her diet.

with that being said I was able to find a few suggestions in my internet searching for calcium supplements, these included: cuttlebones, calcium blocks, limestone powder that you can buy in feed stores, human calcium pills and oyster shells. I read you need to caution yourself in what you choose as some and most of these have some sort of metals also with them which can be harmful. I also read that the calcium blocks are only about 40% useable calcium for them as it contains plaster of paris which depleates the amount that benefits the tortoise. I was just wondering what others use and what seems to work well for them if they had tried multiple things?

because they had been using the UVB lamp thats why I am under the impression it was lack of calcium. however it could have been the lack of the good ole natural sunlight? and if not at least a combo of both?

now on to my soaking question, how and what do I even do? what do others use for theirs? I saw someone had used a snow sled saucer style and had made it flush with the ground so the tortoise could enter it, my only concern was that perhaps that would be too deep?

my next giant hurdle is trying to figure out a living situation for her, she is currently in my basement bathroom with her uvb lamp, water pie dish and I went and got her some turnip greens to at least get me through till tomorrow. her previous owners told me she knocked down a fence they constructed of 2X4 pannels and chicken wire around their garden, so I am a bit fearful of placing her in my extra duck enclosure that has a canopy to keep the menacing hawks out for fear she will knock it down while Im off doing other things and I will never find her again, she will get eaten, or wander off to the road and get killed by one of the many cars constantly going by.

Ill be sure to get a photo of her tomorrow so I am able to show you all what she currently looks like.

Any and all input and advice is beyond appreciated so im able to give this sweet lady the best life possible.

I'm glad this tort will have a forever home now. It sounds like you'll do a great job!