Okay To Breed Different Russian Tortoise Subspecies?

MichaelL

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Nov 18, 2018
Messages
983
Location (City and/or State)
Ocala, Fl
Hello all. I've heard some conflicting info on this subject. So I have had a hunch that my younger Russian is a rustmovi (spelling lol?) I bought her so that she would be a breeder female, but started realizing later that she had the rustmovi qualities (notice how the widest part of her shell is in the middle, while the other subspecies have the flare at the end) while my others had the kazakistani qualities. Here is a pic of her.

IMG_1400.JPG

So, does it matter if I interbreed the subspecies? Should I sell her and try to find a female of the same subspecies? I hope not, it's a hassle finding a nice female, and this one has a great appetite and a nice shell.
 

MichaelL

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Nov 18, 2018
Messages
983
Location (City and/or State)
Ocala, Fl
This is my other female. Not the best pic, but you can see the widest part is at the flare. Don't mind her walking in her mountain of greens lol.
IMG_2234.JPG
 

Yvonne G

Old Timer
TFO Admin
10 Year Member!
Platinum Tortoise Club
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Messages
93,405
Location (City and/or State)
Clovis, CA
I really doubt anyone is paying attention to that, which is a shame. Years ago I had our member, EgyptianDan, I.D. my Russian sub species and I adopted out all of them except for the kazachstanica ones. I think russians are more interbred than any other tortoise.
 
Last edited:

jsheffield

Well-Known Member
Moderator
5 Year Member
Joined
Sep 29, 2018
Messages
3,114
Location (City and/or State)
Westmoreland, NH
Interesting discussion... do you have a reference link for ID-ing my Russians?

I'd love to know what sub-species Chili and Persephone represent, or even what blended characteristics they exhibit.

Thanks,

Jamie
 

Yvonne G

Old Timer
TFO Admin
10 Year Member!
Platinum Tortoise Club
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Messages
93,405
Location (City and/or State)
Clovis, CA
Interesting discussion... do you have a reference link for ID-ing my Russians?

I'd love to know what sub-species Chili and Persephone represent, or even what blended characteristics they exhibit.

Thanks,

Jamie
 

Crush da Baum

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 1, 2020
Messages
544
Location (City and/or State)
Brooksville
Interesting discussion... do you have a reference link for ID-ing my Russians?

I'd love to know what sub-species Chili and Persephone represent, or even what blended characteristics they exhibit.

Thanks,

Jamie
Same. I never knew there were subspecies for Russians.
 

Yvonne G

Old Timer
TFO Admin
10 Year Member!
Platinum Tortoise Club
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Messages
93,405
Location (City and/or State)
Clovis, CA
The differences are so subtle that even with egyptiandan's excellent pictures, I can't see the differences.
 

jsheffield

Well-Known Member
Moderator
5 Year Member
Joined
Sep 29, 2018
Messages
3,114
Location (City and/or State)
Westmoreland, NH

Thanks so much, Yvonne!

Even if I can't tell for my two, I'll still have fun guessing.

Jamie
 

jsheffield

Well-Known Member
Moderator
5 Year Member
Joined
Sep 29, 2018
Messages
3,114
Location (City and/or State)
Westmoreland, NH
Based on the pics and the descriptions on the page you linked me to I'd guess that:

Chili is T.h.rustamovi (domed, but long and narrow)
IMG_20200406_125153.jpg



and that Persephone is T.h.kazachstanica (flat and almost as wide as long)
IMG_20200406_104308.jpg

Jamie
 

MichaelL

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Nov 18, 2018
Messages
983
Location (City and/or State)
Ocala, Fl

MichaelL

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Nov 18, 2018
Messages
983
Location (City and/or State)
Ocala, Fl
Just guessing... also, the top-down photos don't really give you the feel of their domed/undomed natures.

Chili is built like a VW-bug, to Persephone's triple-stuff oreo.

J
Nice. Has persephone given you eggs yet?
 

jsheffield

Well-Known Member
Moderator
5 Year Member
Joined
Sep 29, 2018
Messages
3,114
Location (City and/or State)
Westmoreland, NH
? Even the tortoise is in quarantine. Do you think Chili wants to mate with her?

As soon as Persephone came into our house, Chili started acting differently. A couple of times, I've found the two of them facing each other and as close as their separate enclosures will allow, despite not being able to see each other... I'm certain they can smell another member of their species, even with three other species of tortoises also sharing my office.

J
 

MichaelL

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Nov 18, 2018
Messages
983
Location (City and/or State)
Ocala, Fl
As soon as Persephone came into our house, Chili started acting differently. A couple of times, I've found the two of them facing each other and as close as their separate enclosures will allow, despite not being able to see each other... I'm certain they can smell another member of their species, even with three other species of tortoises also sharing my office.

J
Wow that is fascinating.. I bet they have such good sense of smell and recognition of another of their species because in the wild, it is much harder to find another. Also, I would be so anxious to have them meet lol.
 
Top