Pics for previous thread i posted -eye infection?

[Madkins007]

Could you please post pictures of your enclosure so we can see what you have in there and the lighting too? That would help. What is your substrate that you are using? What are your temps? A 20 gallon tank is not very big, is there a cool side and if so what are the temps there? Please tell us what you are feeding also.

My enclosure is perfectly i already posted my husbandary on few blogs and even vet, they its all good

It is sometimes difficult to figure out what you are trying to say- the better we understand you, the more we can help.

It does not help us here when people are asking for help and give answers like 'that is OK, someone else said everything we are doing is fine'. We've all had a lot of experiences where so-and-so said things were good, and the animals died anyway.

If you are really looking for help for the poor torts, at least meet us halfway. Otherwise it looks like you are just playing games with people who are trying to help.

 

[Maggie Cummings]

It seems to me if you can pay $170 for a golden Greek you can spend $85 to take him to the Vet. We don't have blogs here that I know of, so you haven't told US how you keep your tortoises. You are asking us for help but you are not giving us the information we need to help you. Didn't I read somewhere that you had lost 2 tortoises already? When a baby is sick most times it's due to the husbandry of the keeper. So if you want us to help you, you need to show us how you are keeping the tortoise.

 

[Yvonne G]

My enclosure is perfectly i already posted my husbandary on few blogs and even vet, they its all good

I'm interpreting this to mean you are telling us that you have posted about your husbandry on a different blog from here on the forum. And yet you come here on our forum asking for our help. So just because you've told the blog what your habitat is like doesn't mean you don't have to tell us too. If you want us to help you, then you need to answer our questions. And just because the people on the blog and the vet told you its all good, doesn't mean it really is all good. For instance, that light is not good at all.

 

[Maggie Cummings]

I really think that light is most of the problem...and possibly your substrate is more of the problem....so please post pictures for us so we can help you...and turn off that light!

 

[ascott]

Hi ....I am sad to hear you are having such terrible trouble with your tortoise

I know that you are a student, even if you are not 700+ dollars is a bit steep to just come up with, you know?

I would be most concerned that the tortoise looks very thin in its legs and pockets of skin on either side of his neck....also appears dehydrated....seriously.

I would suggest that you call, or go to, your vets office(or better yet, go to a different reptile vet) , explain to them that you are a student, that you do not have alot of money, that your tortoise is ill (seriously) and if they can not, or will not, allow you to have your tortoise examined and treated and make some payment arrangement with them.....ask them if they will recommend a local tortoise rescue group....get that information and contact that rescue group, ask them if they would PLEASE look at your tortoise and beg them to help you help your tortoise....

Please do not say that you can not do this....because you can. Please DO approach A vet and beg them to help you to help your tortoise. I do not know what will happen, I do not know if they will help you, but you must do something.

Pay the examination fee to have your tortoise examined...HOWEVER, I would NOT just let someone put your tortoise to sleep/death...do not do that....

In the meantime, I would soak your tortoise at least twice a day, each time with 50% water + 50% baby food (carrot is good) for 30 minutes in warm water (keep the water warm)

Keep your enclosure warm....we went over temps with you before and those are still the same temps you should be at with this tortoise....My concern is that you are keeping this tortoise in the same enclosure as the other two tortoise.

Your enclosure may be "set up" correctly HOWEVER two other tortoise have passed and they both used that same 20 gallon tank, you need to go to the store and buy;

a Rubbermaid plastic tub with lid (50 gallon size is the goal).


Put 70% clean dirt and 30% coco coir as the substrate....

Put your heat emitter at one end (put your hot end at 95-105 ish
Cool end NO LOWER THAN 80

Do not use any UVB light right now---put that bulb aside for now

Use warm water and pour it slowly into the substrate on only HALF of the enclosure to make the soil MOIST not WET.

Put your hide about half way in the middle of the hot and the cold side with the opening NOT POINTING at the heat emitter.

Put a water dish in the enclosure

BEFORE YOU PUT YOUR TORTOISE IN THE NEW ENCLOSURE;
Soak your tortoise for 30 minutes in warm water...after you are done doing that....gently hold your tortoise in the palm of your hand over the sink and with a spray bottle with warm water in it...gently mist your tortoise until he drips with water....then throw out that soaking dish and purchase or provide an entirely new dish for soaking...

place your tortoise in his new enclosure under the heat emitter and keep an eye on him to make sure that he does not fade out while he is warming up....make sure you let him know where his hide and water are at....

Then each day do the carrot/warm water soak and offer him food, even if you need to hold the food to him and encourage him to eat...he may or he may not....but offer and have hope he will eat....

At least a couple of times a day I would mist his enclosure and be certain he gets some of the misting on him

I really really really hope this little one makes it. I think that you have had terrible goings with the little ones lately....but I have hope you will be able to pull this little one through, I really do....

 

[Redstrike]

I'm also a student with 2 tortoise hatchlings and I can relate to your financial situation concerning medical care for you tort. I took my two hatchlings in for fecals and wellness checkups a month or two ago and was expecting a bill of ~$170 ($45x2 + $40x2), which I could not afford. I told the vet I was a grad student, clarifying my financial situation, and they waved half of the costs! I only paid ~ $70 for two fecals and a checkup on both torts.

I think this should be encouraging news for you, I can't guarantee it, but I hope your vet cuts you some slack on the visit costs. Mine weren't even sick and they were willing to half my bill. See what you can do and post up some pictures of your enclosure for us. All the posts previous to mine are coming from some very experienced keepers, they are all here to help you! If you give us some enclosure images, I'm sure they can provide you invaluable insight(s) that might make your tortoise a bit healthier and your experience more enjoyable. I'm sorry you've had poor luck previously, I know you're frustrated, but give us (and your vet) a shot.

 

[cyyoung749]

Hi ....I am sad to hear you are having such terrible trouble with your tortoise

I know that you are a student, even if you are not 700+ dollars is a bit steep to just come up with, you know?

I would be most concerned that the tortoise looks very thin in its legs and pockets of skin on either side of his neck....also appears dehydrated....seriously.

I would suggest that you call, or go to, your vets office(or better yet, go to a different reptile vet) , explain to them that you are a student, that you do not have alot of money, that your tortoise is ill (seriously) and if they can not, or will not, allow you to have your tortoise examined and treated and make some payment arrangement with them.....ask them if they will recommend a local tortoise rescue group....get that information and contact that rescue group, ask them if they would PLEASE look at your tortoise and beg them to help you help your tortoise....

Please do not say that you can not do this....because you can. Please DO approach A vet and beg them to help you to help your tortoise. I do not know what will happen, I do not know if they will help you, but you must do something.

Pay the examination fee to have your tortoise examined...HOWEVER, I would NOT just let someone put your tortoise to sleep/death...do not do that....

In the meantime, I would soak your tortoise at least twice a day, each time with 50% water + 50% baby food (carrot is good) for 30 minutes in warm water (keep the water warm)

Keep your enclosure warm....we went over temps with you before and those are still the same temps you should be at with this tortoise....My concern is that you are keeping this tortoise in the same enclosure as the other two tortoise.

Your enclosure may be "set up" correctly HOWEVER two other tortoise have passed and they both used that same 20 gallon tank, you need to go to the store and buy;

a Rubbermaid plastic tub with lid (50 gallon size is the goal).


Put 70% clean dirt and 30% coco coir as the substrate....

Put your heat emitter at one end (put your hot end at 95-105 ish
Cool end NO LOWER THAN 80

Do not use any UVB light right now---put that bulb aside for now

Use warm water and pour it slowly into the substrate on only HALF of the enclosure to make the soil MOIST not WET.

Put your hide about half way in the middle of the hot and the cold side with the opening NOT POINTING at the heat emitter.

Put a water dish in the enclosure

BEFORE YOU PUT YOUR TORTOISE IN THE NEW ENCLOSURE;
Soak your tortoise for 30 minutes in warm water...after you are done doing that....gently hold your tortoise in the palm of your hand over the sink and with a spray bottle with warm water in it...gently mist your tortoise until he drips with water....then throw out that soaking dish and purchase or provide an entirely new dish for soaking...

place your tortoise in his new enclosure under the heat emitter and keep an eye on him to make sure that he does not fade out while he is warming up....make sure you let him know where his hide and water are at....

Then each day do the carrot/warm water soak and offer him food, even if you need to hold the food to him and encourage him to eat...he may or he may not....but offer and have hope he will eat....

At least a couple of times a day I would mist his enclosure and be certain he gets some of the misting on him

I really really really hope this little one makes it. I think that you have had terrible goings with the little ones lately....but I have hope you will be able to pull this little one through, I really do....

Thank you for the help.I contacted some turtle orgainzation near my place and they are happy to provide full medical care if i surrender to them.

---

My enclosure is perfectly i already posted my husbandary on few blogs and even vet, they its all good

I'm interpreting this to mean you are telling us that you have posted about your husbandry on a different blog from here on the forum. And yet you come here on our forum asking for our help. So just because you've told the blog what your habitat is like doesn't mean you don't have to tell us too. If you want us to help you, then you need to answer our questions. And just because the people on the blog and the vet told you its all good, doesn't mean it really is all good. For instance, that light is not good at all.

I have the long reptisun 10.0 not the short one.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Reptile-Lig...485?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c17425d2d

 

[ascott]

Hi...I am glad that you have contacted the organizations.....my point was to not have you surrender your tortoise (although if you find you can not provide the help then that is a viable option) but rather to ask them for help in offering you suggestions by first seeing the tortoise and then offering you their visual opinions.....this is if you can not work out something with a good reptile vet on the cost to simply have them examine your tortoise and offer you direction and help....

I wish that I was a bit closer to you to offer you hands on help.....I know that we have many members that live in New York....I wonder if any of them would be willing/able to help your tortoise out?????

---

Is there anyway possible for you to let me take a peek at your enclosure, please? I am a person that does much better with seeing what is going on than trying to understand the written word.....I know that you said you don't have access to a camera all of the time but if you are able to that would be very helpful in helping your tortoise....?

---

I have read here on this thread and on a few others where it is stated that when ever there is a health problem with a tortoise it is usually the husbandry (human error) while I know that this is the case some of the time....there are also times that it is not the case, in a way.

what I mean is;

the person that cared for this baby before selling it to you likely did not provide the best care, then they ship the little one, it goes through all of the stress of shipping, then it gets to the person who buys it and it is already failing and you the buyer are now having to deal with trying to save it....

I know that folks ship all of the time and folks don't seem to think that is a real issue and all.....I personally would not have a tortoise shipped....too much stress and variables that are not controlled once it is sent on its way....

What I am saying is, do not feel as though it is you....understand?
The time in which your prior torts failed was too short for it to have been your direct fault....this little one is also failing too fast for it to be your fault (in my observation of all that you say and really re-reading all of your prior posts)....Do not give up

 

[cyyoung749]

Hi...I am glad that you have contacted the organizations.....my point was to not have you surrender your tortoise (although if you find you can not provide the help then that is a viable option) but rather to ask them for help in offering you suggestions by first seeing the tortoise and then offering you their visual opinions.....this is if you can not work out something with a good reptile vet on the cost to simply have them examine your tortoise and offer you direction and help....

I wish that I was a bit closer to you to offer you hands on help.....I know that we have many members that live in New York....I wonder if any of them would be willing/able to help your tortoise out?????

---

Is there anyway possible for you to let me take a peek at your enclosure, please? I am a person that does much better with seeing what is going on than trying to understand the written word.....I know that you said you don't have access to a camera all of the time but if you are able to that would be very helpful in helping your tortoise....?

---

I have read here on this thread and on a few others where it is stated that when ever there is a health problem with a tortoise it is usually the husbandry (human error) while I know that this is the case some of the time....there are also times that it is not the case, in a way.

what I mean is;

the person that cared for this baby before selling it to you likely did not provide the best care, then they ship the little one, it goes through all of the stress of shipping, then it gets to the person who buys it and it is already failing and you the buyer are now having to deal with trying to save it....

I know that folks ship all of the time and folks don't seem to think that is a real issue and all.....I personally would not have a tortoise shipped....too much stress and variables that are not controlled once it is sent on its way....

What I am saying is, do not feel as though it is you....understand?
The time in which your prior torts failed was too short for it to have been your direct fault....this little one is also failing too fast for it to be your fault (in my observation of all that you say and really re-reading all of your prior posts)....Do not give up

---

---

Thanks ascott. heres a pics of my enclosure. sorry guys for posting late ....

 

[ascott]

THANK YOU

Okay so here I will simply outline what I see as things that "I" would change or improve on, okay? I am not saying what you have here is wrong but rather can be adjusted a bit....

I know you are using a Ceramic Heat Emitter and you are using a tube UVB....all good there

Tank; it is a little on the small side, I say this because if the tortoise does not have a reason to stroll around he won't. He would likely do better in a Rubbermaid Tub (they only cost around 20.00 to 22.00 dollars) at as close to 50 Gallons as possible and right now during the holidays this will be able to be found at like Home Depot or Lowes--just walked past some for 21.00 dollars at Lowes. They come with a matching lid which is very helpful in using as a topper to help retain heat and humidity....please get one of these. I know you are on a budget (as am I and most regular folks) so these are actually more affordable than a glass tank.

Black Screen cover; your UVB is being completely (well near 90%) blocked out by this type of material being between your tortoise and your light...this has to be changed so that the UVB can actually reach your tortoise...this should be changed right away while you go to the store and purchase a Rubbermaid Tub...so that your tortoise will "feel" like moving and eating as well....

Substrate; I would use clean dirt or organic soil (not organic soil with plant fertilizer added but organic with no chemical fertilizer nor plant food added) and would make up 70% of the total substrate and then the other 30% coco coir (you can get a bag of this for like under 9.00 bucks (or buy the compressed block of the coco coir and follow its directions for fluffing it up for use)...the bark is not a great mucking around surface...it just is not earth like at all, especially for a young tortoise who have a need to dig in and hide. Also, you will need to supply your tortoise with deeper substrate, like near 5-6 inches according to the size your tortoise looks...plus will also help in maintaining humidity and likely will just feel really good for your tortoise to dig down into....

Your tortoise also needs UVA so make sure that your bulb offers that along with the UVB..okay UVA is a feel good ray ....so this is very very important....

I hope that you understand that I am simply trying to help you and your tortoise...please do not feel as though I am knocking what you are doing but as you previously explained---you are new at tortoise care...so understand that I am sharing what I know with you...if you do these things your tortoise world will improve....

Also, continue to do your soakings....well, your tortoise I mean...LOL

 

[cyyoung749]

THANK YOU

Okay so here I will simply outline what I see as things that "I" would change or improve on, okay? I am not saying what you have here is wrong but rather can be adjusted a bit....

I know you are using a Ceramic Heat Emitter and you are using a tube UVB....all good there

Tank; it is a little on the small side, I say this because if the tortoise does not have a reason to stroll around he won't. He would likely do better in a Rubbermaid Tub (they only cost around 20.00 to 22.00 dollars) at as close to 50 Gallons as possible and right now during the holidays this will be able to be found at like Home Depot or Lowes--just walked past some for 21.00 dollars at Lowes. They come with a matching lid which is very helpful in using as a topper to help retain heat and humidity....please get one of these. I know you are on a budget (as am I and most regular folks) so these are actually more affordable than a glass tank.

Black Screen cover; your UVB is being completely (well near 90%) blocked out by this type of material being between your tortoise and your light...this has to be changed so that the UVB can actually reach your tortoise...this should be changed right away while you go to the store and purchase a Rubbermaid Tub...so that your tortoise will "feel" like moving and eating as well....

Substrate; I would use clean dirt or organic soil (not organic soil with plant fertilizer added but organic with no chemical fertilizer nor plant food added) and would make up 70% of the total substrate and then the other 30% coco coir (you can get a bag of this for like under 9.00 bucks (or buy the compressed block of the coco coir and follow its directions for fluffing it up for use)...the bark is not a great mucking around surface...it just is not earth like at all, especially for a young tortoise who have a need to dig in and hide. Also, you will need to supply your tortoise with deeper substrate, like near 5-6 inches according to the size your tortoise looks...plus will also help in maintaining humidity and likely will just feel really good for your tortoise to dig down into....

Your tortoise also needs UVA so make sure that your bulb offers that along with the UVB..okay UVA is a feel good ray ....so this is very very important....

I hope that you understand that I am simply trying to help you and your tortoise...please do not feel as though I am knocking what you are doing but as you previously explained---you are new at tortoise care...so understand that I am sharing what I know with you...if you do these things your tortoise world will improve....

Also, continue to do your soakings....well, your tortoise I mean...LOL

umm ok thanks for your correction. so your saying that my mesh top blockes the uvb ray? umm right now i will do my best to cure my tortoise but if it doesnt get better i will send it to orgainzation near me so it will get better. Im also planning to get some lepoard tortoises because my girl friend will buy me for christmas. If i get one should i get a 50 gallon rubber maid instead of 20 gallon im using right now. Im also will get cocofir and dirt you told me. Thanks man really thankful for your help.

 

[ascott]

If you are going to have any young tortoise and plan on housing that tortoise indoors...then yes, I would set that tank aside and get the Rubbermaid Tub I described along with the change of the substrate. You should do this with the tortoise you have now as well....

Also, yes, the black screen that you have your UVB tube light on is blocking the rays and your tortoise is not receiving its benefits at all.

If you are going to possibly turn your tortoise over to the rescue, I would make that decision rather soon, as since your tortoise is young it will get worse quicker than an adult would...so time is of the essence....please decide what you are going to do soon to offer the best success for your tortoise

Leopard Tortoise ultimately get rather large, you know this about them right? I do not know what your property situation is and all but just keep that in mind.

Also, may I suggest that if you do get additional tortoise in the future that you get one that is near adult age---the reason is that the more critical stage will have past and you can become more confident with your care and then in turn will have more experience to offer a younger tortoise....I also would not purchase a tortoise that will need to be shipped....there are so many places that have tortoise that need to be adopted that you would enjoy and the tortoise would benefit as well....also, with proper research you can find a tortoise to purchase within driving distance and can eliminate the entire shipping thing...especially since your luck in this area has not been so great, you know?

I wish you and your tortoise the best wishes in what ever you decide and please do continue here to gain the information you will find useful....