Pyramiding

[cotley]

This particularly applies to anyone who has kept Stars from hatchlings, or has bred them...


Just wondered about your experiences of 'pyramiding' in Stars.
It is one of the very few species where it is usually said that 'pyramiding' can be natural, and not necessarily a sign of poor husbandry (as in virtually all other species of tortoise).

However - several well-known figures have pointed out that in wild populations, pyramiding is usually very infrequent. An American breeder and writer, Jerry D. Fife suggests that if given the option of a humid microclimate in a setup, pyramiding in captive Stars is hugely reduced, as evidenced in his trials.

Anyone have any photos of a Star they have which is particularly smooth?

What are your experiences? Have you had wide variation in levels of 'pyramiding' in your Stars?

 

[Redfoot NERD]

These are 4".. WC -

Male

Female

7+" CH Female

A humid mocroclimate is vital to retain a smooth carapace.. as above and also evidenced in my 3 yr. old redfoots.. as another example.. and the list goes on. Thus proving [ once again and finally ] that protein is not the culprit.. low hide humidity is!

 

[Redfoot NERD]

These are 4".. WC -

Male

Female

7+" CH Female

A humid mocroclimate is vital to retain a smooth carapace.. as above and also evidenced in my 3 yr. old redfoots.. as another example.. and the list goes on. Thus proving [ once again and finally ] that protein is not the culprit.. low hide humidity is!

Still haven't figured out why the 30 minute time limit on editing.. Josh didn't answer that.. ANYWAY -

Meant to say above.. A humid microclimate.. etc.

 

[cotley]

Thanks, those are perfect, just what i was looking for.

I've found that my hatchling rarely if ever goes into the humid hide (which has damp sphagnum moss inside) and only sleeps or hides in the dry hide.

Do you give yours the option?

How do you keep it humid? Someone suggested glueing a sponge to inside roof of hide, but I found that dripped on tortoise which it obviously didnt like.

 

[Redfoot NERD]

Most don't realize that India has "Monsoon" seasons.

They get an option.. on hides. Spray moss with 'plant-mister'!

And mine live inside [ weather-based ] in the same building as the redfoots.. with temps in the mid - upper 80's.. ( sometimes higher ). AND high humidity.. which they are fine with as long as the temps are UP!

G. elegans are very sensitive to cool temps and high humidity!
G. elegans are very sensitive to high temps and NO/low humidity!

In other words.. just as many problems arise from too dry with high temps as too humid with low temps. Mid-range humidity [ and higher ] is what they will thrive well on AS LONG AS THE TEMPS ARE mid-80's OR HIGHER!

I have observed them outside in the summer 'basking' in low-90's when the humidity was above 70-80%. And have seen then sitting in their water dish before the water got too hot.. in the morning.

So "we" have to Q? this thing about G. elegans and high humidity. Don't let it get too cool for them.. and don't de-hydrate them!

FWIW

Have you seen the Jan. '08 Reptiles article? See the 'unedited' link in here.. http://www.turtletary.com/stars.html

Keep in mind I did not "start" the males.. they were started on too low humidity hides/environment! The female was a different situation and has maintained as you have seen.

 

[delicious]

Well, protein makes tortoises grow a lot faster than they would in the wild and this is no good.

A high fibre and high calcium diet will maintain a beautiful and smooth shell.

 

[Redfoot NERD]

Well, protein makes tortoises grow a lot faster than they would in the wild and this is no good.

A high fibre and high calcium diet will maintain a beautiful and smooth shell.

Have you raised hatchling G. elegans to become smooth carapace egg-producers? If not then you can't [ honestly ] make that statement that protein makes them grow too fast. Besides that Stars obtain protein from the "plant-matter" they eat.. which is entirely different than animal protein that redfoot tortoises eat!

Is there something wrong with the looks of this '05 CH redfoot.. which ate animal protein once a week from 6 months old? And was virtually 'dripping' with humidity from day one.

So is your claim on "no protein" for stars or redfoots or what?

nerd

 

[elegans]

Having raised both Indians and SriLankans from babies, I can tell you for sure that SriLankans will in general pyrimid much more than Indians raised side by side in the same conditions. I have a couple of picts of SriLankans in SriLanka that show virtually every one with some degree of pyrimiding some quite extreme. Enclosed is a picture of one of the largest and smoothest female SriLankans probably in existance. I have also enclosed a picture of one of my holdback 3 year old males. She usually gives me 2 to 3 clutches a year. She was imported as an adult in 1988 and is still doing great! I have seen lots of Indians though, that were all baby butt smooth. Douglas Beard

 

[elegans]

Here is the pict of my largest girl, as I said in the last post she is a wild caught circa 1988 animal. All of the others ar CB by me of various ages. Douglas Beard

 

[Redfoot NERD]

Here is the pict of my largest girl, as I said in the last post she is a wild caught circa 1988 animal. All of the others ar CB by me of various ages. Douglas Beard

I agree completely Douglas.

The Sri 'locale' tend to [ all ] be "pyramided' - a term I've always associated with unnatural husbandry generally associated with humidity - which for that species is normal(?).

The "smooth" Sri is the 'uncommon' one in this scenario.

And the herp community is finally accepting the vital importance of a "humid-hide" for all land-dwelling chelonians. Ahh the effects of man's ego and pride at the tortoises expense!

nerd