RI in leopard tortoise

dawnypooh

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Hello everyone I need some advice from experience tortoise owners. I’ve owned a male adult leopard tortoise for about four years I’ve never had any health issues in great condition no issues. About two months ago I purchased a leopard tortoise but they told me was four years old from a well-known reputable tortoise shop here in Arizona. The next day after purchasing her I noticed that her nose was wet I immediately scheduled a vet appointment . The vet believes she had a upper respiratory infection and started her on a course of antibiotics batyil. She was on two courses two weeks each of that particular anabiotic. After her not getting any better with her wet runny nose the vet suggested we run lab work which we did we did a series of bacterial study and for Mycoplasma. The results came back that she had the mycoplasma and some other bacteria. Which anabiotic’s to another one while we were waiting for the results to come back. She’s at the end of this course of anabiotic’s which was every three days I’m not sure the name but wanted to store in the freezer she’s been on it for almost 3 weeks and still has an issue with the runny nose. I’ve had her for a little over two months and she’s been on antibiotics the whole entire time except for a few days while we were trying to figure out what to do. She’s always been active she’s always eating and drinking and moving pooping all the normal things that a tortoise does except for the runny nose. I have her an open top tortoise table with the proper lighting and the temperatures are 90 under her heat lamp during the day and the room temp is about 70 to 75 at night. The vet said that those temperatures are perfect for her humidity level it’s only at 30-40 and Arizona is extremely dry and I cannot get it above 30-40 Even with missing her enclosure on a daily. Even with Misting the enclosure. I’m at a loss as to what to do at this point the vet that I’m going to is an exotic pet they only treat exotic animals so I’m seeing the correct Yvette I just wanna know if anyone out there has experienced the same issues and did they have any other treatment options. Sorry for the long post I was trying to make sure I include all the details so people don’t ask a lot of questions with background information hopefully I did a good job of that.
 

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Yvonne G

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Quite a few leopard tortoises are allergic to or have a very bad reaction to Baytril.

It has always been my take on a runny nose that if the tortoise is eating and the nose fluid is clear, just let it be. Tortoises go through relocation stress and often stress exhibits as a runny nose. I don't administer antibiotics unless or until the nasal discharge turns thick or colored.

Also, a new tortoise should be kept separately from an existing tortoise for a month or more before putting them together. . . and just to let you know, pairs very seldom work out. Three or more seems ok, but two is not.
 

Tom

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Hello everyone I need some advice from experience tortoise owners. I’ve owned a male adult leopard tortoise for about four years I’ve never had any health issues in great condition no issues. About two months ago I purchased a leopard tortoise but they told me was four years old from a well-known reputable tortoise shop here in Arizona. The next day after purchasing her I noticed that her nose was wet I immediately scheduled a vet appointment . The vet believes she had a upper respiratory infection and started her on a course of antibiotics batyil. She was on two courses two weeks each of that particular anabiotic. After her not getting any better with her wet runny nose the vet suggested we run lab work which we did we did a series of bacterial study and for Mycoplasma. The results came back that she had the mycoplasma and some other bacteria. Which anabiotic’s to another one while we were waiting for the results to come back. She’s at the end of this course of anabiotic’s which was every three days I’m not sure the name but wanted to store in the freezer she’s been on it for almost 3 weeks and still has an issue with the runny nose. I’ve had her for a little over two months and she’s been on antibiotics the whole entire time except for a few days while we were trying to figure out what to do. She’s always been active she’s always eating and drinking and moving pooping all the normal things that a tortoise does except for the runny nose. I have her an open top tortoise table with the proper lighting and the temperatures are 90 under her heat lamp during the day and the room temp is about 70 to 75 at night. The vet said that those temperatures are perfect for her humidity level it’s only at 30-40 and Arizona is extremely dry and I cannot get it above 30-40 Even with missing her enclosure on a daily. Even with Misting the enclosure. I’m at a loss as to what to do at this point the vet that I’m going to is an exotic pet they only treat exotic animals so I’m seeing the correct Yvette I just wanna know if anyone out there has experienced the same issues and did they have any other treatment options. Sorry for the long post I was trying to make sure I include all the details so people don’t ask a lot of questions with background information hopefully I did a good job of that.
FIrst: Hello and welcome!

Second: Vets know very little about tortoise care.

Third: Those temps are too cold. Torts don't just get sick for no reason like people do. There is usually something wrong with the environment, and in most cases that is temperature. Normal temps for young leopards are no lower than 80 at any time day or night anywhere in the enclosure, and ambient in the high 80s to low 90s during the day, with a basking area directly under the bulb of about 95-100 at tortoise shell height. 70 is too cold and will make them sick. 90 for a basking area is not warm enough. To help a sick one recover, ambient temps of 85-90 24/7 with a 100 degree basking area will help.

Fourth: Humidity for a young growing leopard needs to be 80%+ all the time. This is impossible in an open topped enclosure like a tortoise table. You need a large closed chamber. This makes humidity maintenance easier too.

Fifth: Was the Baytril given orally or injectable? Injectable Baytril is highly caustic and painful. Its like injecting bleach into them. It causes a chemical burn at the injection site and terrible pain. If your vet injected that into your tortoise, its a sign that your vet has not kept up on, or simply never knew proper tortoise treatment.

Here is all the correct care info:
 

DoubleD1996!

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Hello everyone I need some advice from experience tortoise owners. I’ve owned a male adult leopard tortoise for about four years I’ve never had any health issues in great condition no issues. About two months ago I purchased a leopard tortoise but they told me was four years old from a well-known reputable tortoise shop here in Arizona. The next day after purchasing her I noticed that her nose was wet I immediately scheduled a vet appointment . The vet believes she had a upper respiratory infection and started her on a course of antibiotics batyil. She was on two courses two weeks each of that particular anabiotic. After her not getting any better with her wet runny nose the vet suggested we run lab work which we did we did a series of bacterial study and for Mycoplasma. The results came back that she had the mycoplasma and some other bacteria. Which anabiotic’s to another one while we were waiting for the results to come back. She’s at the end of this course of anabiotic’s which was every three days I’m not sure the name but wanted to store in the freezer she’s been on it for almost 3 weeks and still has an issue with the runny nose. I’ve had her for a little over two months and she’s been on antibiotics the whole entire time except for a few days while we were trying to figure out what to do. She’s always been active she’s always eating and drinking and moving pooping all the normal things that a tortoise does except for the runny nose. I have her an open top tortoise table with the proper lighting and the temperatures are 90 under her heat lamp during the day and the room temp is about 70 to 75 at night. The vet said that those temperatures are perfect for her humidity level it’s only at 30-40 and Arizona is extremely dry and I cannot get it above 30-40 Even with missing her enclosure on a daily. Even with Misting the enclosure. I’m at a loss as to what to do at this point the vet that I’m going to is an exotic pet they only treat exotic animals so I’m seeing the correct Yvette I just wanna know if anyone out there has experienced the same issues and did they have any other treatment options. Sorry for the long post I was trying to make sure I include all the details so people don’t ask a lot of questions with background information hopefully I did a good job of that.
I've had a few box turtles and a russian tort to get ri. I never gave them baytril before because I felt it was too strong. The most important thing to do is dry out the infection. When mine had one I kept a heatmat underneath their enclosure around 90 along with the proper lighting and gave them warm soaks everyday.
 

mark1

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an opinion .......

vets , at least any i been to , know more about reptiles than anyone i know , including me , if it wasn't so i wouldn't need them .........

the ph of undiluted baytril is closer to the ph of a tums (11) than it is to bleach ......

baytril is by far , not anything close , the most used , longest studied, antibiotic in reptiles ...... the side effects are insignificant when compared to the amount that has been administered .....

sounds to me like your vet know what they're looking at , baytril is one of the few time tested antibiotics effective against mycoplasma infections .......

the second drug your vet gave you is sounds most likely to be ceftazidime , ineffective against mycoplasma infections , and i believe slightlymore disruptive of intestinal bacteria , which seems to be a consensus problem with administering antibiotics ..... like 95-99% of intestinal bacteria are anaerobic , i'm pretty certain baytril is ineffective against anaerobic bacteria ?

i would take Tom's advice and raise the temps ..... you might want to ask your vet about the nasal washes ..... mycoplasma infections seldom go away , if you keep your tortoises enviromental conditions optimal , captive tortoises live with mycoplasma infections ...... best to keep this tortoise away from the other ...... JMO ....
 

zovick

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Hello everyone I need some advice from experience tortoise owners. I’ve owned a male adult leopard tortoise for about four years I’ve never had any health issues in great condition no issues. About two months ago I purchased a leopard tortoise but they told me was four years old from a well-known reputable tortoise shop here in Arizona. The next day after purchasing her I noticed that her nose was wet I immediately scheduled a vet appointment . The vet believes she had a upper respiratory infection and started her on a course of antibiotics batyil. She was on two courses two weeks each of that particular anabiotic. After her not getting any better with her wet runny nose the vet suggested we run lab work which we did we did a series of bacterial study and for Mycoplasma. The results came back that she had the mycoplasma and some other bacteria. Which anabiotic’s to another one while we were waiting for the results to come back. She’s at the end of this course of anabiotic’s which was every three days I’m not sure the name but wanted to store in the freezer she’s been on it for almost 3 weeks and still has an issue with the runny nose. I’ve had her for a little over two months and she’s been on antibiotics the whole entire time except for a few days while we were trying to figure out what to do. She’s always been active she’s always eating and drinking and moving pooping all the normal things that a tortoise does except for the runny nose. I have her an open top tortoise table with the proper lighting and the temperatures are 90 under her heat lamp during the day and the room temp is about 70 to 75 at night. The vet said that those temperatures are perfect for her humidity level it’s only at 30-40 and Arizona is extremely dry and I cannot get it above 30-40 Even with missing her enclosure on a daily. Even with Misting the enclosure. I’m at a loss as to what to do at this point the vet that I’m going to is an exotic pet they only treat exotic animals so I’m seeing the correct Yvette I just wanna know if anyone out there has experienced the same issues and did they have any other treatment options. Sorry for the long post I was trying to make sure I include all the details so people don’t ask a lot of questions with background information hopefully I did a good job of that.
It is virtually impossible to cure Mycoplasma. The tortoise will be a carrier of the problem forever. It will get better for a while and then come back throughout the tortoise's lifetime. Some tortoises are more affected by it than others, so it might be severe in one animal and almost unnoticeable in another one.

As others have said, this new one can easily pass Mycoplasma on to your other one and it, too, will become a carrier. If you haven't exposed the new one to your other one, I would recommend seriously considering getting rid of it before it infects the other one.
 

dawnypooh

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Thank you for info I forgot to mention that the other tortoise has not been in contact with her. I’ve keep them separate. Should I switch to closed chamber habit? I wanted to keep her outdoors. I live in AZ and most of the year the weather is great.
 
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Tom

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Thank you for info I forgot to mention that the other tortoise has not been in contact with her. I’ve keep them separate. Should I switch to closed chamber habit? I wanted to keep her outdoors. I live in AZ and most of the year the weather is great.
Outdoor is fine for older larger ones, in fair weather, with a warm night box, after the tortoise is healthy and not showing signs of sickness. Indoors in a closed chamber would be best over the winter to get the tortoise as healthy as possible in light of the infection.

Infection of your other tortoise is highly likely if you keep this one.
 

dawnypooh

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an opinion .......

vets , at least any i been to , know more about reptiles than anyone i know , including me , if it wasn't so i wouldn't need them .........

the ph of undiluted baytril is closer to the ph of a tums (11) than it is to bleach ......

baytril is by far , not anything close , the most used , longest studied, antibiotic in reptiles ...... the side effects are insignificant when compared to the amount that has been administered .....

sounds to me like your vet know what they're looking at , baytril is one of the few time tested antibiotics effective against mycoplasma infections .......

the second drug your vet gave you is sounds most likely to be ceftazidime , ineffective against mycoplasma infections , and i believe slightlymore disruptive of intestinal bacteria , which seems to be a consensus problem with administering antibiotics ..... like 95-99% of intestinal bacteria are anaerobic , i'm pretty certain baytril is ineffective against anaerobic bacteria ?

i would take Tom's advice and raise the temps ..... you might want to ask your vet about the nasal washes ..... mycoplasma infections seldom go away , if you keep your tortoises enviromental conditions optimal , captive tortoises live with mycoplasma infections ...... best to keep this tortoise away from the other ...... JMO ....
She’s had the nasal wash twice. I think I’m going to switch to closed box type enclosure and ease her temps and see how she does.
 

dawnypooh

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It is virtually impossible to cure Mycoplasma. The tortoise will be a carrier of the problem forever. It will get better for a while and then come back throughout the tortoise's lifetime. Some tortoises are more affected by it than others, so it might be severe in one animal and almost unnoticeable in another one.

As others have said, this new one can easily pass Mycoplasma on to your other one and it, too, will become a carrier. If you haven't exposed the new one to your other one, I would recommend seriously considering getting rid of it before it infects the other one.
This is the second tortoise that I’ve gotten and it’s had this. I rehome the last one, new owner was aware of health issue. Waited a few months to find another one. And this one has it too. Both time got from supposably reputable reptile location.
 

biochemnerd808

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This is the second tortoise that I’ve gotten and it’s had this. I rehome the last one, new owner was aware of health issue. Waited a few months to find another one. And this one has it too. Both time got from supposably reputable reptile location.
I'm so sorry this happened to you. You've gotten good advice above.

I would not ever buy from that pet store or whatever it was again. There are better sources for reptiles, especially in AZ. Arizona tortoise compound, e.g. but I know there are others.

If you rehome the sick one, and want to get another, you can ask to have the animal tested for mycoplasma. It costs about $170 to run the test I think. Or, you can just decide that the one you had first will be an only tortoise, and spoil it rotten with an amazing indoor and outdoor habitat and a good life without food competition. Pairs just don't do well...

Best of luck whatever you end up doing!
 

mark1

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She’s had the nasal wash twice. I think I’m going to switch to closed box type enclosure and ease her temps and see how she does.
i'd definitely go with Tom's advice on the environmental care ....... the medical end , i'd go with the vet ....... just because your tortoise has mycoplasma doesn't mean it's the reason for it's runny nose , which is most likely why they tried another antibiotic .......... i would guess many folks , if not most , who cure chronic mild uri's with improved environmental care have tortoises with mycoplasma infections , i doubt mycoplasma is uncommon in captive tortoises .......
 

dawnypooh

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i'd definitely go with Tom's advice on the environmental care ....... the medical end , i'd go with the vet ....... just because your tortoise has mycoplasma doesn't mean it's the reason for it's runny nose , which is most likely why they tried another antibiotic .......... i would guess many folks , if not most , who cure chronic mild uri's with improved environmental care have tortoises with mycoplasma infections , i doubt mycoplasma is uncommon in captive tortoises .......
This is what I’m finding out from what I’ve been told by the vet that unfortunately the population in the US with certain breeds of tortoises particularly leopard tortoise is that this particular bacteria most of them have it and just lives dormant and two environmental changes or they’re stressed out that are crops up. The reason why I rehome the first one was I didn’t think I was capable of taking care of a sick tortoise. I did my research and realised after I had already given her a way that this particular bacteria is prevalent in tortoises. And usually with good husbandry the problem is fixed I just don’t know what I’m doing wrong I’m going by the vets recommendation when it comes to heat levels but I’m guessing it’s not hard enough. I’m sure in the summer months here in Arizona it is no problem because it’s extremely hot day and night. So I deafly will go with the suggestion of changing her environment housing to capture and closing heat and humidity and see if this resolves the issue.
 

Jan A

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This is what I’m finding out from what I’ve been told by the vet that unfortunately the population in the US with certain breeds of tortoises particularly leopard tortoise is that this particular bacteria most of them have it and just lives dormant and two environmental changes or they’re stressed out that are crops up. The reason why I rehome the first one was I didn’t think I was capable of taking care of a sick tortoise. I did my research and realised after I had already given her a way that this particular bacteria is prevalent in tortoises. And usually with good husbandry the problem is fixed I just don’t know what I’m doing wrong I’m going by the vets recommendation when it comes to heat levels but I’m guessing it’s not hard enough. I’m sure in the summer months here in Arizona it is no problem because it’s extremely hot day and night. So I deafly will go with the suggestion of changing her environment housing to capture and closing heat and humidity and see if this resolves the issue.
Wow. A lot to go thru & it is stressful. Welcome to the forum. Keep us in the loop. Hope your tort responds well to changes that you implement. We are here to help however we can.
 

dawnypooh

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Wittmann AZ
Hello everyone I need some advice from experience tortoise owners. I’ve owned a male adult leopard tortoise for about four years I’ve never had any health issues in great condition no issues. About two months ago I purchased a leopard tortoise but they told me was four years old from a well-known reputable tortoise shop here in Arizona. The next day after purchasing her I noticed that her nose was wet I immediately scheduled a vet appointment . The vet believes she had a upper respiratory infection and started her on a course of antibiotics batyil. She was on two courses two weeks each of that particular anabiotic. After her not getting any better with her wet runny nose the vet suggested we run lab work which we did we did a series of bacterial study and for Mycoplasma. The results came back that she had the mycoplasma and some other bacteria. Which anabiotic’s to another one while we were waiting for the results to come back. She’s at the end of this course of anabiotic’s which was every three days I’m not sure the name but wanted to store in the freezer she’s been on it for almost 3 weeks and still has an issue with the runny nose. I’ve had her for a little over two months and she’s been on antibiotics the whole entire time except for a few days while we were trying to figure out what to do. She’s always been active she’s always eating and drinking and moving pooping all the normal things that a tortoise does except for the runny nose. I have her an open top tortoise table with the proper lighting and the temperatures are 90 under her heat lamp during the day and the room temp is about 70 to 75 at night. The vet said that those temperatures are perfect for her humidity level it’s only at 30-40 and Arizona is extremely dry and I cannot get it above 30-40 Even with missing her enclosure on a daily. Even with Misting the enclosure. I’m at a loss as to what to do at this point the vet that I’m going to is an exotic pet they only treat exotic animals so I’m seeing the correct Yvette I just wanna know if anyone out there has experienced the same issues and did they have any other treatment options. Sorry for the long post I was trying to make sure I include all the details so people don’t ask a lot of questions with background information hopefully I did a good job of that.
Update…. Took Bell to vet for follow visit. She is doing great. They decided that she doesn’t need anymore antibiotics. She been on a few rounds and still has runny nose on and off. They said she might have this on and off her entire life. As long as she eating and pooping and don’t have breathing problem they will let her be and her immune system will take over and put it at bay. I’ve changed her to a closed enclosure to keep heat and humidity temps where they should be and she loves it. She’s gained 60 grams in two weeks. And he runny nose has subsided. Thanks for all the advice and help.
 

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