Sick tortoise...please help.

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DeeCee

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Hello everyone. I am hoping that you may be able to offer me some advice. My russian tortoise is sick and I do not know what else to do.

It all started last week. I noticed that he had not eaten in a few days. There are times of the year where my tortoise is much more inactive than others and does not have the best appetite (when it is very cold in the winter, and when it is very hot in the summer like right now) so at first I was not extremely alarmed. I went to pick him up after giving him new food, and I noticed that the back of his legs were swollen and it looked like the skin around his arms and head were swollen too. He also hates being handled and will always pull his legs in when I pick him up, and he did not retract them this time.

I brought my tortoise to a vet the next day. The vet asked me what I was feeding him and I told him that I fed my tortoise romaine, and spring mix with the occasional fruit. The vet told me the diet I was feeding my tortoise was very inadequate and he is likely suffering from malnourishment. I always thought this diet was ok, and that is what his previous owner fed him, so I am extremely upset at the news. The vet gave my tortoise a vitamin A and D shot, and said I needed to try to get him to eat to hope for any type of recovery. I immediately went home and gave my tortoise the food that the vet had given me, but my tortoise still will not eat. He does not look as inactive as he did a few days ago, but he still will not touch his food and he still won't walk. I have tried feeding it to him, he still will not eat it. I really do not know what else to do - the vet said if he does not eat in a few more days that I have to bring my tortoise back or I will be "burying him." Does anyone have any other advice in the meantime? I just feel so bad for the little guy :(
 

dmmj

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Swelling in the legs like that is usually edema, basically retention of fluids. There can be many reasons for this from the simple an infection of some type to the serious kidney failure. A long term diet of heavy fruit feeding could have something to do with this, to much sugar but it depends on how often you were feeding and it would have to be long term.
 

DeeCee

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dmmj said:
Swelling in the legs like that is usually edema, basically retention of fluids. There can be many reasons for this from the simple an infection of some type to the serious kidney failure. A long term diet of heavy fruit feeding could have something to do with this, to much sugar but it depends on how often you were feeding and it would have to be long term.

Thanks for your response. I would give my tortoise fruit very sparingly, maybe once a month IF that. It was not a regular occurrence. I've had my tortoise for 2 1/2 years now.
 

ascott

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the vet said if he does not eat in a few more days that I have to bring my tortoise back or I will be "burying him." Does anyone have any other advice in the meantime? I just feel so bad for the little guy

Yes, the first advise I would give you is to find a new vet, the one you have sounds like a real idiot....

As mentioned swelling can have many meanings and the worst thing that your vet did was give vit a injection....really? How does he equate swelling limbs with malnutrition?...not a very good vet...

May we please see a pic of your tort? Pics from the front, side and underside---also a pic of his face please....

I would stop offering him food right now...but please get pics posted for us to look at...pics can speak volumes...
 

kimber_lee_314

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Get a new vet ASAP! The diet you were feeding him was was probably not the cause of this. What you were feeding him was fine (higher calcium greens and more natural foods would be better.) I'm not sure what the vet gave you to feed him, but I would keep feeding him whatever he was eating before he got sick. This is not the time to change his diet. I am also concerned about the vitamin shot he was given. I would get him to reptile vet as soon as you can. Where are you located?
 

DeeCee

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kimber_lee_314 said:
Get a new vet ASAP! The diet you were feeding him was was probably not the cause of this. What you were feeding him was fine (higher calcium greens and more natural foods would be better.) I'm not sure what the vet gave you to feed him, but I would keep feeding him whatever he was eating before he got sick. This is not the time to change his diet. I am also concerned about the vitamin shot he was given. I would get him to reptile vet as soon as you can. Where are you located?

I'm located in CT. Will try to get the pictures up ASAP
 

reticguy76

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Wow, your vet did not say that ??!!!

Run and dont look back (and post some feedback on your experiences on websites)


I wont even touch the injection of vitamins thing (wow !!!)

Can you post some pics of whats exactly going on ? First things that come to mind with swelling is - edema, inflammations, infection, injury (soft tissue swelling), poor circulatory issue, etc.
 

DeeCee

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Here is one picture of his underside.. you can see some of the swelling in his back legs.

He still won't eat :(


24oyq6c.jpg
 

kimber_lee_314

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He does look like he has edema which could be caused by a number of things. I hope you can get him into a vet tomorrow. I would think he needs to be started on antibiotics. The vitamin A shot could have seriously hurt him, so be sure to tell your vet that he was given that. I'm not sure what can be done about it now, but at least the vet will know so that further damage won't be done. In the meantime, soak him in warm water at least once a day and increase the temperatures in his enclosure. Keep offering him food - any of his favorites (although avoid the fruit) and get him to a qualified reptile vet as soon as possible. Poor guy! Keep us informed on how he's doing. Good luck!
 

ascott

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How long have you had him in your home? You said "prior owner" so that tells me he lived somewhere else and had prior host caring for him....
 

DeeCee

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I've had him for 2.5 years now. I believe the previous owner had him for 3-4.
 

dmmj

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One thing to consider no matter how sad it may be, it might be dying, males are usually full grown at about that size, and it could have been an older imported tortoise. I am not trying to be mean, just a possibility, a vet visit should give you a better idea.
 

Yvonne G

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Hi DeeCee:

I'm sorry to have to welcome you to the forum under such stressful conditions.

Giving a tortoise that has a poor appetite, a vitamin injection, is the old school way of vet thinking. The vitamin a,d,e shot is supposed to stimulate the appetite, and it might be ok if the vitamin a portion wasn't included. What you have to watch for now is the skin sloughing off because of an overdose of vitamin a.

I know that it sounds counter to what's going on, and with edema it seems like you don't want to add more water to his system, however, I believe that daily soaking in warm water with liquid bird vitamins added to the water will be helpful. Tortoises usually will pee in the soak, and that's what you want him to do, to try to get rid of some of the fluids he's retaining. He will also get some benefit from the vitamins, even if he doesn't drink, he will absorb some of the nutrients through the thin skin along his neck and around his cloaca.

Try to keep him warm and quiet and don't worry about him eating until he gets better.

Spring Mix is fine, however I've noticed lately that it has an awful lot of spinach in it, so I've quit using it. I buy the Santa Barbara mix now. I would also stop using the romaine. Go out into the yard and look for some weeds - fillaree, sow thistle, clover, dichondra, dandelion...any of the broad-leaf plants. You can also offer plantain, grape leaves, mullberry leaves. Put out fresh food for him every day, but don't force him into eating it. Just have it there in case he gets interested.

Good luck with him. I hope you are able to find a vet who knows about tortoises.
 

DeeCee

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emysemys said:
Hi DeeCee:

I'm sorry to have to welcome you to the forum under such stressful conditions.

Giving a tortoise that has a poor appetite is the old school way of vet thinking. The vitamin a,d,e shot is supposed to stimulate the appetite, and it might be ok if the vitamin a portion wasn't included. What you have to watch for now is the skin sloughing off because of an overdose of vitamin a.

I know that it sounds counter to what's going on, and with edema it seems like you don't want to add more water to his system, however, I believe that daily soaking in warm water with liquid bird vitamins added to the water will be helpful. Tortoises usually will pee in the soak, and that's what you want him to do, to try to get rid of some of the fluids he's retaining. He will also get some benefit from the vitamins, even if he doesn't drink, he will absorb some of the nutrients through the thin skin along his neck and around his cloaca.

Try to keep him warm and quiet and don't worry about him eating until he gets better.

Spring Mix is fine, however I've noticed lately that it has an awful lot of spinach in it, so I've quit using it. I buy the Santa Barbara mix now. I would also stop using the romaine. Go out into the yard and look for some weeds - fillaree, sow thistle, clover, dichondra, dandelion...any of the broad-leaf plants. You can also offer plantain, grape leaves, mullberry leaves. Put out fresh food for him every day, but don't force him into eating it. Just have it there in case he gets interested.

Good luck with him. I hope you are able to find a vet who knows about tortoises.

Thank you for your advice, emysemys. I am keeping food nearby in case he wants to eat again. I can't tell if the edema is getting worse, he does look more swollen :( What is typically done to reverse the edema? Supposedly the vet I went to treats reptiles, but after reading these comments I am very nervous.
 

dmmj

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If it is an infection of some type, antibiotics will be used to treat it. Sadly kidney failure usually can't be treated, but it is better to wait and see what a vet says before making any decisions.
 

ascott

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Renal dysfunction: Signs include oedema (water retention), pale mucous membranes, lethargy, reluctance/inability to urinate, weight increase due to fluid retention. Often seen following long term anorexia, dehydration and bacterial infection. Get veterinary help immediately. In early stages, regular warm baths and physiotherapy of back legs can help release any blockage.

Just for reference....As Yvonne shared, I too would do the soaks, warm water soaks...also, locate a for real reptile vet that you can go to with your tort....

Please keep us posted..if you do not mind that is..
 

DeeCee

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I have a vet appt for him today at 4:30. Things were still status quo this morning when I checked up on him. Will do my best to post updates.
 
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