Slight concern but staying positive

[Rynan]

So if anyone remembers, I got a hatchling from a backyard breeder few months ago. They were kept dry, and the first baby I took home had dry scabs over the egg sack. I know that I was warned by several members from this thread, was given caresheets by Tom, Wellington, etc. I took care of that baby until it showed signs of improvement. I drove 40 miles and took the baby back to the lady, showed her the difference soaking and keeping it in a humid tank made. Gave her a copy of the caresheet and asked her if she would follow it. I couldn't bring myself just returning the baby comepletely and ended up taking another home with me thinking if I could at least save one. Lady did remove her post so maybe she had a change of heart. Now it's been two months. He/she has been eating well, made an outdoor enclosure to get direct sun daily. Been giving him/her soaks and keeping the tank humid at 80+% and 80+ temp. But he/she hasn't grown much from the initial 4.5 cm. It's been at 6.2 cm ish. I can't help but worry about HFS or Breeder failure syndrome. He/she eats a lot and poops big green logs. But I'm just worried that I'm gonna fail at saving him/her.

 

[TammyJ]

Have you been taking pictures of the tortoise from you got him? What about the weight? What kind of tortoise is he? I did not see your previous posts.

 

[zolasmum]

So if anyone remembers, I got a hatchling from a backyard breeder few months ago. They were kept dry, and the first baby I took home had dry scabs over the egg sack. I know that I was warned by several members from this thread, was given caresheets by Tom, Wellington, etc. I took care of that baby until it showed signs of improvement. I drove 40 miles and took the baby back to the lady, showed her the difference soaking and keeping it in a humid tank made. Gave her a copy of the caresheet and asked her if she would follow it. I couldn't bring myself just returning the baby comepletely and ended up taking another home with me thinking if I could at least save one. Lady did remove her post so maybe she had a change of heart. Now it's been two months. He/she has been eating well, made an outdoor enclosure to get direct sun daily. Been giving him/her soaks and keeping the tank humid at 80+% and 80+ temp. But he/she hasn't grown much from the initial 4.5 cm. It's been at 6.2 cm ish. I can't help but worry about HFS or Breeder failure syndrome. He/she eats a lot and poops big green logs. But I'm just worried that I'm gonna fail at saving him/her.

If indeed the tortoise doesn't survive, it certainly not that you have failed him/her - you have given him a much better chance of survival. If he is doing well now, that is thanks to you - he may always be rather small, but hopefully you are giving him a good and healthy future.
Angie

 

[Lyn W]

You have done really well, if you are seeing signs of improvement and it's great that you have taken the time to try to improve the care and life of other torts by educating the breeder.
I hope your little one continues to make progress and, I've no doubt that he will with you looking out for him.

 

[Avuwyy]

[ Wrote all this without realising how long it is, if you can’t tell I’m a psychology student, I’m so sorry for rambling ]

When I received my tortoise he was 34g, dropping down to 22g shortly after bringing him home due to parasites obtained due to bad care in the pet store I recieved him from. No water in sight. No humidity. Living on straw pellets. Was told their leopards were being soaked twice a week (Though I doubted that). When I walked in the only food I could see in their food bowl (Not suitable for tortoises, let alone hatchlings), was some sort of cabbage which no tortoise seemed too fond of (They had to drag my tortoise over to eat, and by that point the food was limp, so it was obvious it had been out for some time).

By the end of the first year, he was 74g. It looked like he had barely grown, there were still only small spots of white on his shell. I could still hold him in one hand comfortably. I was giving him daily soaks. He was on a diet of mixed greens: Grass I had trimmed from outdoors that I managed to slip into his food, campanula, geranium, dog rose, dandelion, bristly oxtongue, mixed greens from the supermarket, to name a chunk. I gave him constant access to his own calcium. I sprinkled a small amount of calcium atop his food every few days. I tried different substrates, maintaining the enclosure at 80% as best I could, covering the top of the table to avoid humidity escaping. I took him to the vet. “His eyes are bright and alert, his shell is firm and you’ve done well keeping his pyramiding down” is all I got whilst I saw everyone else’s year old leopards growing like weeds. This was a thing up until recently.

In the last 3 months, he has almost doubled in weight. I weighed him on 17th January: 140g (This is a THREE YEAR OLD LEOPARD). I weighed him on the 19th this month: 236g. This is an unthinkable jump in weight for him. He can still be held in one hand, but when he struggles, he is able to kick himself out of my grip. The vets told me the same thing they have always said about a month ago when he was medicated for Parasites. “His eyes are bright and alert, his shell is firm and you’ve done well keeping his pyramiding down” as though nothing had changed. The only thing I had altered during this period? Adding Pre Alpin and Nutrazu (Mazuri) to his diet. Not nearly enough to allow my stunted tortoise to grow this much in such a short time.

But this isn’t me attempting to advertise wonderfoods which will cause your tortoise to have unthinkable growth spurts (I can not and will not guarantee same results, it is a coincidence). What I’m saying is: Hatchlings that aren’t started correctly are going to suffer because of it. They will grow slowly, and you will watch other people’s tortoises that are the same age as your own shoot up in size, whilst you wonder “What is it I’m doing wrong?” Or “Surely there is something I can do to help them reach the weight and size of everyone else’s tortoise?”. I’ve had this. Feeling inadequate as a keeper whilst attempting to feed my tortoise new foods, alter his enclosure, or taking him to the vets looking for some miracle that will help him reach the same size as others of his species and age. It’s heartbreaking. I spent hours researching Breeder Failure Syndrome, scared that any time he was spending too much time sleeping he would pass away. For some time I was waking up every 3 hours during the night like a new parent to check on him, hoping he hadn’t passed whilst I was asleep. I even took time off of work one time because I was afraid that if I left him alone for too long I would come home to a dead tortoise.

Keep doing what you’re doing. The soaks, feeding good foods, humidity, giving them good heat, and UVB. Motivate them, make them work for their food sometimes to develop their leg muscles, movement helps them digest. That is all you can really do for your tortoise. I can assure you. The slow growth is normal given the circumstances, there will be some damage, but you can repair that with keeping up with hydration to repair the damage done to their kidneys. When your tortoise will finally start hitting the growth you have been dreaming of, seeing those growth lines stretch across their shell (And for me who owns a leopard… Watching their beautiful spots slowly emerge from the growth) is an incredible feeling. It is absolutely worth every bit of stress you had endured up until that point.

I can’t really say much as far as ‘well your tortoise probably doesn’t have xyz’. Because I don’t have the ability to say that, I’m not a vet, and it’s not my tortoise. But I will tell you that every bit of effort you’re putting in is not in vain, and many tortoise keepers have gone through the same thing. You’re not alone in your worries and you won’t be alone in your experiences. Your concerns are valid.

Anyways, I will leave two pictures I took of my stunted guy recently after a soak (Ft. Small pyramiding, the product of being told off for wanting to use a Vivarium for your leopard tortoise in Facebook groups). Herbie and I both have our fingers crossed (Metaphorically for him), for you and your tortoise. You can do this!!

 

[Rynan]

Just an update, lil Lime House grew a bit. jumped to almost 7 cm from the original 4.5 ish. a day shy of 3 months. Oh, and coco coir plus organic orchid bark is heaven. It smells so good.

 

[wellington]

Just an update, lil Lime House grew a bit. jumped to almost 7 cm from the original 4.5 ish. a day shy of 3 months. Oh, and coco coir plus organic orchid bark is heaven. It smells so good.

That's great. Keep doing what you are doing. He may start out slow as he has to make up for his bad start. Now that he has grown some, you might see it happen more often. You might want to have a stil sample checked for parasites as that will affect his growth if he is loaded with them. You could wait on that if he starts to now grow steadily.
If he doesn't make it that's not on you. You are doing great by him. If he does make it that is only on you.
Good luck and keep us posted.

 

[Rynan]

Been a while but here's an update. Lime House grew another half inch. Switch him/her to a big hutch with compressed coconut substrate, P
planted bermuda seeds and he/she is thriving. Seeing nice growth lines and shell is becoming hard. Really don't like the calcium powder stuff tho. The head looks dry after every feed with that stuff even with soaks. But I know it's just calcium, don't want to brush too hard.

 

[wellington]

Been a while but here's an update. Lime House grew another half inch. Switch him/her to a big hutch with compressed coconut substrate, P
planted bermuda seeds and he/she is thriving. Seeing nice growth lines and shell is becoming hard. Really don't like the calcium powder stuff tho. The head looks dry after every feed with that stuff even with soaks. But I know it's just calcium, don't want to brush too hard.

Don't give calcium every day. Small pinch 3 times a week is all. Too much is as bad as too little.
Glad to see still growing. You are doing a fantastic job!

 

[Yvonne G]

I'm confused (didn't read your long post, not enough time). You posed the thread in the Sulcata section, so I'm thinking you're talking about a baby sulcata with scabs on the yolk sac. But then further down in the thread you post pictures of a leopard tortoise. Do you have leopard tortoises or sulcatas? I'll move the thread to leopards if that's the case.

 

[Rynan]

That's not my post

 

[Rynan]

Don't give calcium every day. Small pinch 3 times a week is all. Too much is as bad as too little.
Glad to see still growing. You are doing a fantastic job!

Yeah, I do it once a week actually. He/she does get sun daily