Best substrate to use that dosent dry out and cause dust please ? Using life bio but constantly drying out Horsefield tortoise
The_Four_Toed_Edward
Well-Known Member
Maybe @Littleredfootbigredheart can give you a UK based recommendation for orchid bark? You can probably find it for cheaper outside of pet stores, but you have to be careful that it doesn't have any additives etc.
Is your enclosure an open top or is it closed? What have you been doing to keep the substrate from getting too dry? How is your humidity?
Is your enclosure an open top or is it closed? What have you been doing to keep the substrate from getting too dry? How is your humidity?
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I've posted before on 'best substrate'. Locally avaiable is a large part of what drives the choice. If your a keyboard shopper, that's a bit different. https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/the-best-substrate-really-the-best-one.195823/
I prefer micro or small chunk fir bark. I use it several inches deep so the tortoise can shimmy down into it or sorta plow forward into it. It's not dusty, and when kept several inches deep the bottom can be kept very wet, as the water evaporates it increases surface humidity (not enough to compete with an open top enclosure's humidity deficit). But if the tortoise gets far enough down they are buried in it, then it will work against an open top enclosure constant loss of humidity.
If you're concerned about small flying insects that set up a home in the wet substrate use Mosquito dunks or mosquito bits (hey are safe to use in water pets drink). Google is your friend to follow up on this, which has also been chatted about here in TFO.
Small fir bark does not have the confier oils that are toxic, is more or less dust free, there are no long fiber that can impact a digestive track, and for whatever reason I've never had a tortoise think it's food.
Sometimes sold as orchid bark (at a slightly higher price per unit) which may include perlite and fertilizer that you don't want. The reptile branded small bark is marked up even more than the orchid packaging.
Usually Lowe's and Home Depot do NOT carry it. You'll have to find a indepent or small chain of nursery stores that stock it. The smallest pieces called 'micro' work well fro a Russian tortoise. ' small' and 'medium' work well for larger tortoises.
I prefer micro or small chunk fir bark. I use it several inches deep so the tortoise can shimmy down into it or sorta plow forward into it. It's not dusty, and when kept several inches deep the bottom can be kept very wet, as the water evaporates it increases surface humidity (not enough to compete with an open top enclosure's humidity deficit). But if the tortoise gets far enough down they are buried in it, then it will work against an open top enclosure constant loss of humidity.
If you're concerned about small flying insects that set up a home in the wet substrate use Mosquito dunks or mosquito bits (hey are safe to use in water pets drink). Google is your friend to follow up on this, which has also been chatted about here in TFO.
Small fir bark does not have the confier oils that are toxic, is more or less dust free, there are no long fiber that can impact a digestive track, and for whatever reason I've never had a tortoise think it's food.
Sometimes sold as orchid bark (at a slightly higher price per unit) which may include perlite and fertilizer that you don't want. The reptile branded small bark is marked up even more than the orchid packaging.
Usually Lowe's and Home Depot do NOT carry it. You'll have to find a indepent or small chain of nursery stores that stock it. The smallest pieces called 'micro' work well fro a Russian tortoise. ' small' and 'medium' work well for larger tortoises.
The_Four_Toed_Edward
Well-Known Member
Yeah, I hope a forum member from the UK can point out where to get bark.
Also, I recommend checking out this UK specific thread about sourcing bark.
Orchid bark saga
Hello folks! Hope everyone is well😁 I’m writing this because I’m very intrigued to get some input/information on where to research more into this. Last month a comment made on the forum to the effect of “Have you definitely got orchid fir bark, not pine, because they can be marketed as the...
tortoiseforum.org
Basically in different countries different species of trees are used to make the bark, so in some countries you might struggle to find the safe kind. As far as I understand it is available in the UK, but you have to be careful.
I myself seem to me stuck with coco coir for the foreseeable future as there is no safe bark available to me, but as long as the coco coir is kept moist and hand packed it isn't too bad, but I wouldn't recommend it as a dust free option per say.
It’s 56% humidity it’s closed but I’ve got 6 large vents and 2 large side vents. We’ve only had him 2 weeks he’s in his old set up that we got when we bought him . So not sure if moving to an open once might be best option. It’s clearly effecting him he’s gone in his shell twice today and what sounded like a sneeze can’t tell. But he stays in his shell for a few mins then comes out after. He’s eating all the time and moving very fast and active but seems the substrate is causing irrritation
Thanks
I’ve also been soraying it and mixing it
The_Four_Toed_Edward
Well-Known Member
The current substrate you have probably contains sand? I would recommend switching the substrate to fir bark if you can find it, it should be way less dusty.
To keep the bottom wet like Kapildo Farms describes spraying isn't very effective. Instead it is recommended to pour water in the corners of the enclosure and let the humidity rise up that way.
How much water we talking ? It’s the tortoise life bio Mediterranean I’ve already been back to were we bought it and they said just spray it
thanks
That is the wrong substrate for a tortoise. Sand and soil should never be used.How much water we talking ? It’s the tortoise life bio Mediterranean I’ve already been back to were we bought it and they said just spray it
All substrate dry out and get dusty. As you've noticed, spraying the surface does almost nothing except cool your enclosure through evaporation. You need to dump enough water into the substrate often enough to keep it damp. A 3-4 inch layer of orchid bark or coco coir makes this relatively easy. Thinner layers dry out faster. You can also try closing some vents to reduce evaporation.
Give this a read through for the correct substrate and care info:
Info For New People. Please Read This First.
Hello and welcome to tortoiseforum.org! We are all glad you are here! There is no other forum like this anywhere. We have tens of thousands of members from all over the world ranging from kids with their first tortoise to people who have been breeding and keeping high end tortoises since the...
tortoiseforum.org
Question are welcome.
- Joined
- Nov 7, 2012
- Messages
- 5,225
- Location (City and/or State)
- South of Southern California, but not Mexico
I have trouble with the use of "safe", what does that mean to you?Yeah, I hope a forum member from the UK can point out where to get bark.
Also, I recommend checking out this UK specific thread about sourcing bark.
Orchid bark saga
Hello folks! Hope everyone is well😁 I’m writing this because I’m very intrigued to get some input/information on where to research more into this. Last month a comment made on the forum to the effect of “Have you definitely got orchid fir bark, not pine, because they can be marketed as the...
Basically in different countries different species of trees are used to make the bark, so in some countries you might struggle to find the safe kind. As far as I understand it is available in the UK, but you have to be careful.
I myself seem to me stuck with coco coir for the foreseeable future as there is no safe bark available to me, but as long as the coco coir is kept moist and hand packed it isn't too bad, but I wouldn't recommend it as a dust free option per say.
The_Four_Toed_Edward
Well-Known Member
I don't know if it was the right wording here, but I meant that when it comes to bark sold here in Finland, due to the different tree species used the bark has more chances to have negative effects on tortoise health than the orchid bark you have in the states. I guess with not safe I mean that there are some risks that I know of for my tortoises health which I don't want to take.
Never use sprayers, humidifiers, foggers, or misters. They produce droplets that are too large, and cause reparatory problems. Those droplets don't create humidity, they only make the surface wet, then create an evaporative cycle that cools down the enclosure - thwarting your attempts to keep your temperatures steady and at the levels you need.
What size is your enclosure? Please post some pictures of it as it is infinitely easier to give suggestions when we know exactly what you have.
What sorts of lights and heating are you using? That affects how quickly the substrate can dry out and become dusty. How large are these vents you mention? A vent the size of a golfball may seem large to some, while a vent that runs the entirety of one side may not seem large to another (It really is easier if we can see your enclosure).
What is your enclosure constructed of? Is it molded/formed plastic, wood, etc. If its wood, is it "sealed", do you have a liner installed so that water can't leak out? Are all the spaces around lights and such sealed?
Did you read through the links provided in your other thread? They contain a lot of great info, including the best kinds of substrate materials, and there are pictures to illustrate things so that you have a good idea of what you need. Everything in those links has been tested and used by many here for lots of years.
I second getting @Littleredfootbigredheart into the discussion so that she can suggest where to get what is needed. Also, @zolasmum .
Show us pictures and we can be much more specific.
.
You have too many open vents...my tort tables are enclosed completely
GardiendeKoopa
Member
How much is an appropriate amount of vents for a solid top enclosure? To have decent air flow and prevent mould, but to still retain humidity and heat? Any recommendations on placement of the vents?
no vents...I have never had mold, no air flow necessary, you cannot have heat and humidity with air flow...think about it. Here is a greenhouse over a wooden tort table used for a Redfoot...no air flow heat at 85 degrees and humidity at 90% NO AIR flow, no mold
I've been using a finely ground coconut shell based substrate. Perfect for my red-foots, as it retains moisture and does not produce fungal or bacterial infections. Would probably work for Russian Tortoises, though perhaps would not be kept quite as moist. If coco fiber is kept at least slightly moist, it is not dusty.
GardiendeKoopa
Member
What substrate do you use in there?
Fine grade orchid bark
OrThat is the wrong substrate for a tortoise. Sand and soil should never be used.
All substrate dry out and get dusty. As you've noticed, spraying the surface does almost nothing except cool your enclosure through evaporation. You need to dump enough water into the substrate often enough to keep it damp. A 3-4 inch layer of orchid bark or coco coir makes this relatively easy. Thinner layers dry out faster. You can also try closing some vents to reduce evaporation.
Give this a read through for the correct substrate and care info:
Info For New People. Please Read This First.
Hello and welcome to tortoiseforum.org! We are all glad you are here! There is no other forum like this anywhere. We have tens of thousands of members from all over the world ranging from kids with their first tortoise to people who have been breeding and keeping high end tortoises since the...
So I can just use coco coir on its own?
so I can use just coco on its own ?That is the wrong substrate for a tortoise. Sand and soil should never be used.
All substrate dry out and get dusty. As you've noticed, spraying the surface does almost nothing except cool your enclosure through evaporation. You need to dump enough water into the substrate often enough to keep it damp. A 3-4 inch layer of orchid bark or coco coir makes this relatively easy. Thinner layers dry out faster. You can also try closing some vents to reduce evaporation.
Give this a read through for the correct substrate and care info:
Info For New People. Please Read This First.
Hello and welcome to tortoiseforum.org! We are all glad you are here! There is no other forum like this anywhere. We have tens of thousands of members from all over the world ranging from kids with their first tortoise to people who have been breeding and keeping high end tortoises since the...
Question are welcome.
Or bark on its own?
Or shall I use both ?
And do you know what the best ones are?
Thanks for your help
I have read the forum you sent but I just want to be absolutely certain I’m using correct thingsOr
so I can use just coco on its own ?
Or bark on its own?
Or shall I use both ?
And do you know what the best ones are?
Thanks for your help
Thanks again for your help
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