Back to his lethargic self...

[siwash]

Well, I doubt I would buy a hatchling in the future..rather stick to a healthy adult.. these things are just too stressful for someone like myself! and I've now spent $400 bucks between buying him and vets...

He's inactive again and I don't know why.. at this time he;s just sitting in front of the food dish i set out... not moving at all... weird

i don't know what i'm doing wrong - maybe it's too cold in there for him... maybe my temp probe is off... although he was in the cool end today

who the hell knows!

 

[Isa]

Hello Rob

I am really sorry to hear your little one is lethargic again, do you have another apointment with the vet? Does your little one still eat? or just sleep all day?

 

[siwash]

I was at the vet on Friday. As soon as I brought him home, he seemed better already. He was active and eating on Sat and Sunday. I came home from work today to find him completely inactive. I picked him up, bathed him, set some food out and he just sat there - didn't even budged..went back to sleep on the lettuce. I tried to entice him further by actually moving him to the warmer areas of the enclosure and even put greens right under his snout...he just sat there.. limp..

on sat and sun here was actually "running" around in the tank..i never seen him move like that in the 2 weeks I'e owned him. He didn't eat huge amounts but he's still so tiny so I don't expect him to... but i did notice that he didn't really eat much on Sunday, come to think of it..

this has been frustrating and I'm sorry that i've dominated the threads here lately.. i just don't want him to die on me..

 

[Crazy1]

Siwash, I know what you are going through with Leonardo is frustrating and I know you don't want to hear this but some torts just were not meant to thrive and survive. Have you soaked him in the Vita Sol or V8 or Baby food? And don't even worry about dominating this thread this is YOUR thread and we are here to help if we can. I know hatchlings can be difficult but if you can get them over the hump then it is very rewarding. Somebody had to fight for Leonardo and you are. I think I remember you talking to the breeder. Has he given you any insight as to what may ail him? Since you have not had him very long has he offered you any assistance or perhaps a replacement?

 

[siwash]

Siwash, I know what you are going through with Leonardo is frustrating and I know you don't want to hear this but some torts just were not meant to thrive and survive. Have you soaked him in the Vita Sol or V8 or Baby food? And don't even worry about dominating this thread this is YOUR thread and we are here to help if we can. I know hatchlings can be difficult but if you can get them over the hump then it is very rewarding. Somebody had to fight for Leonardo and you are. I think I remember you talking to the breeder. Has he given you any insight as to what may ail him? Since you have not had him very long has he offered you any assistance or perhaps a replacement?

Thank you... I have had two replies from the seller. He is not the breeder but the middleman - the breeder apparently prefers not to deal with people directly so the fellow that sells the torts is involved in the pet trade as a breeder of snakes and related stuff..

He has offered a few suggestions like soaking, keeping him warm, etc.. he's asked me about my enclosure... he also asked about the rag I used for a hide - whether the tort had ingested any of it or if there was something on it, like a chemical perhaps... far as I know, he did not ingest any part of it! he also said that perhaps it is "lazy" and not an active individual - is this possible?

otherwise, he hasn't offered anything constructive or replacement. not much "customer support"

The vet phoned today and left a message... i will call her tomorrow

 

[pebbles mom]

Hello - you are not alone!! I go thru that stress every couple days it seems. I have had my buddy for exactly one month now, and although I think he is doing good for the most part, some days I want to pull my hair out. Some mornings I hand feed him one leaf just to get him going. I think he fits us perfectly ... slow moving in the morning

 

[purpod]

Hi Guys & Gals ~

I've never heard of a "lazy" tortoise thats won't budge or eat, and so I would throw that one right out of the window; the only thing I can imagine is that he is not warm enuf... unless there is some virus or bug that has attacked Leonardo on the inside..?

You know, we have all been there before; I had a baby die on me once, and almost refused to try it again; but I have had great overall success with my lil' tort & also with my new baby leopard.

Keep the faith, and take what Robyn said to heart; you talk as much as you like, & know that not all tort's were meant to survive.

In addition, I would speak that your 'broker' and explain to him that if all of the conditions are right for health and thriving, then obviously, there is something wrong with the tortie; show him/her the vet bills and tell them you would appreciate a replacement.. It is just fair and good business to provide a healthy critter to a buyer..

Anyways, we feel for ya & will keep you & leonardo in our prayers!
Blessings,
Purpod

 

[Jentortmom]

Siwash, Don't feel bad about talking and posting on the forum, that is what it is here for. I don't have a hermanns, but I can say I have gone through what you are going through. I have a one year old sulcata that weighed 28 grams when I brought him home, and 11 months later he only weighs 34 grams and that is after him losing about 4 grams. Been to the vet nothing they can do, setup is right, just doesn't grow. But keep trying, I give him calcium at every feeding, I started placing ground up mazuri in his pen, along with mixing a little in to help with weight. Try soaking him in vitasol this is what I use, at each soaking, give him calcium every day. Try placing his food chopped up really tiny in his enclosure every morning and maybe he will eat once he is warmed up. Good Luck and I will keep you to in my prayers and hopefully this middleman will get you a healthy tort.

 

[siwash]

I gave him another good soaking in Vita Sol. He ate afterward! Not a lot but he ate..

I am beginning to wonder if temps are a problem in his env. He was active on the weekend. This weekend was very warm in Toronto. It reached 100F with the humidity (85 actual temp) and the house was warm...even though I turned on the AC. It's really cooled off again with overnight temps in 40's.. The house is close to 71 or so.. the enclsoure is between 71-74 in the middle and cool end. I think that's a little too cool for day time. That means only about 1/4 of the vivarium is over 80 - and it's over 90 only directly under the lamp (up to 96 actually) As soon as you move inches away it drops off a lot.

Maybe it's just too cold in there? How can I distribute the heat more evenly? The drops off seem to be to drastic and too low... He can't digest nor develop an appetite if it's only 75 (and even cooler in some spots) in most of the tank. Could this be the sourse of the problem? I don't know... The basking light is a combo. I think its a 125. Perhaps I will adjust it slightly lower and pointing in the centre more as opposed to on one extreme end. This way the heat is distributed more evenly on two sides.

What about stronger wattage? another light?

Thoughts/comments?!!

Thanks!

 

[Crazy1]

Here is something to try. Set up Leonardo’s basking spot at 90-92 F and the rest of his inside enclosure at 80-85 F.
At night set it up so it goes down to about 71-74 F.
You can raise the heat by setting up a regular light bulb, or you can use an infrared heat bulb or ceramic heat emitter.
You can get a rheostat that will help turn on and off the bulbs and keep the temps constant. Just can’t use it with a MVB. For that I use a timer so it is on about 10-12 hours a day.

Siwash, when you say your light is a 125 watt combo light, please explain what you mean by combo light?

The temp outside today here was 104 F, I do not have AC but I do leave a fan on in the living room. I have my hatchling (26 grams) in a medium size rabbit cage and have a 100 watt Mercury Vapor bulb that I had to move up to about 24 inches above him to get his basking temp down to 94. The cold end with just that one bulb is about 85 F.
If your daytime temps are 71-74 F what have your nighttime times been?

Having his daytime temps that low could be the problem what size is his viv?

 

[siwash]

Here is something to try. Set up Leonardo’s basking spot at 90-92 F and the rest of his inside enclosure at 80-85 F.
At night set it up so it goes down to about 71-74 F.
You can raise the heat by setting up a regular light bulb, or you can use an infrared heat bulb or ceramic heat emitter.
You can get a rheostat that will help turn on and off the bulbs and keep the temps constant. Just can’t use it with a MVB. For that I use a timer so it is on about 10-12 hours a day.

Siwash, when you say your light is a 125 watt combo light, please explain what you mean by combo light?

The temp outside today here was 104 F, I do not have AC but I do leave a fan on in the living room. I have my hatchling (26 grams) in a medium size rabbit cage and have a 100 watt Mercury Vapor bulb that I had to move up to about 24 inches above him to get his basking temp down to 94. The cold end with just that one bulb is about 85 F.


If your daytime temps are 71-74 F what have your nighttime times been?

Having his daytime temps that low could be the problem what size is his viv?

The day and night temps in the cool end should be about the same as he is kept indoors. My home is about 72ish right now so that is about as low as it goes..

I am using a 125W "Solar Glo" Sun Simulating Lamp that is sold under the EXO TERRA company. It's a combo because it is a UVB and UVA and heat source according to the packaging. It sates that it is a mercury vapour bulb

I am not familiar with infrared heat bulb or ceramic heat emitters.. are heat emitters those things that you place under the enclosure?



My tank is 30 gallons I think...

He did eat a bot yesterday and a tiny bit today... but still kinda tired looking...

 

[purpod]

Greetings again ~

The ceramic bulbs are just that, it emits no light at all, just a heat source... just some fired clay in the shape of a triangle {bascially} ~ the infrared bulbs are for nighttime and emit only red light, which is less obstrusive when one is tyring to snooze ~ The mats that go under the tank are under the tank heating source that some here do not think is good for the tortie, altho I have used one for a while now, and have had no issues with it.

The combo of UVA & UVB is good ~ they truly need that full sprectrum, in my past experiences, anyways ~

Keep taking the advice of Robyn ~ she won't steer ya wrong ~

Glad to hear Leonardo is starting to nibble ~ that's great news!
Here's praying all continues to improve ~
Purpod

 

[Yvonne G]

You might try putting a cover over the tank to hold the heat inside. I use aluminum foil. If your tank is too big for a strip of foil, tear off two pieces the same length and fold them together to make a larger piece. If it gets too hot in there you can open a corner or more.

Yvonne

 

[Crazy1]

Where (within the enclosure) does Leonardo spend most of his day?
Where does he spend most of his night?

 

[siwash]

He's almost always near the heat source side of the enclosure. Says something, doesn't it.. even overnight

On Friday, Sat, and Sunday, when temps were warmer in my house, he was all over the place. I think we're on to something here, but I'm still not sure why he wouldn't be more active at least on the warm side.

Should I aim for upper 70's or even 80 on the cooler side during the day and see what happens?

I think it would be cheaper to cover the tank at least partially

 

[Crazy1]

I agree, I think Yvonne has the right idea and it will surely let you know if it is the temps. Remember if you have your AC on you may be causing a draft within his enclosure. Covering it would eliminate that. I would raise his temps to at least 80 F on the cold side try and keep his basking area at about 90 and see how he does? Just remember when enclosing his tank be careful that the humidity is not raised too high. Keep a check on the temps until you are sure your not cooking the little fella. And there should be nothing between his MVB and him, no screen, not aluminum foil, no glass, nothing it will screen out the UVB and he can suffer from that. If the weekend is nice I would certainly get him outside for a couple of hours.