My turtle drowned, survived, now dead again?

[rgalpin]

I have a Common Musk (Wild Turtle). I have had him since he was a baby. He is about 10 years old. Has lived in an aquarium where he has spent 99% of his time underwater. He got stuck/wedged under his fake log that has been in the tank for 5 years. He is at home is in that log.

Thursday morning I noticed he looked kind of stuck - but not really. Not struggling. Just in a weird spot that I don’t usually see him. I left him to his own devices figuring he was fine.

Thursday evening - he was still in that spot so I pulled him out of the log. His shell was slightly wedged when I freed him. But he was limp. He responded to touch by moving his legs and head a bit. I put him on his basking rock and he just laid there, limp. I figured he was dead and his reactions to touch were simply nerve responses.

Friday - all day he remained on that rock. Although I saw him do a couple things that looked like more than just nerve response. He picked up his head and opened his mouth - in a yawning type motion. Thought it might be him getting his last gasp of breath. ?? Other than that he just laid there looking dead for nearly 48 hours!

Saturday late afternoon - I looked in on him and he wasn’t on his rock. I figured he fell off and would be dead in the water. No! He was back in the log relaxing under water with his nose poking up as usual. I was astonished. I took him out of the log and removed the log from the tank since it was the original cause of the perceived drowning. His tank usually has about 12 inches of water. Without the log I was concerned he would be too weak to get a breath without the log to hang on to. So, I lowered the water down to about 4 inches and built a ramp out of the stones (that were already in the tank) to give him easy access to a breathing position.

Sunday afternoon - he is walking around on the bottom like his old self - awesome!

Sunday evening - I find him in a strange looking position. He is between the filter and the aquarium wall (though the filter is not locked in position - loose suction cups - he can easily push it out of his way if needed) - he appears to be forcing his head into the bottom corner of the enclosure. Looks like he is struggling to push his head “thru” the corner if he could… I pulled him out of this predicament figuring he might just be dazed and confused after the drowning incedent.

A half hour later I see he is doing the same thing but in a different corner of the enclosure. What is he trying to do? This time when I picked him up, he was super limp. Only the very slightest reaction to touching his back feet - and his head hanging way out his shell. Whatever he was doing jamming his head in the corner seems to have been the end of him. I have put him in a couple different positions in the tank hoping he will magically revive again like he did before. But he hasn’t moved at all now for 12 hours.

I am sharing this story in detail in case it might help someone else - and with some hope that someone may read this and be able to explain what happened. What happened to my turtle? How did he seem to resurrect from the dead - only to die a day later? Weird!

Thanks to anyone who has anything to share in regard to this upsetting - and possibly avoidable thing. Did I do something that caused his death after he recovered?

His name was Mr. Savage (because he ATE all his room mates).

I haven’t completely given up yet - after witnessing the resilience this little guy demonstrated the first time I thought he was dead.

The image is of him today - he stayed in this position all day. I think he is gone... too sad.

 

[KarenSoCal]

I don't know anything about musk turtles. But I do want to welcome you to the forum. I am so very sorry about the apparent loss of Mr. Savage. Lots of people don't understand grieving a turtle or tortoise, but we certainly do. Again, I'm sorry for the loss of your turtle. 😢

 

[KarenSoCal]

@Markw84
@Moozillion

Hey, water turtle folks! Can anybody help this new member?

 

[Moozillion]

Hi, rgalpin, and welcome.
So sorry to hear about your turtle.
I had an eastern mud turtle who drowned, was revived, and ultimately had to be euthanized.
That's her photo as my avatar.

Like you, I found her stuck under a tank object- in this case, her basking platform. She was entangled in a bunch of large plant roots that she had never had problems with before.
I did turtle CPR: hold body so that head is down, and allow water to drain out. Then grasp the feet and pump all of them (or as many as you can manage) in and out, ALL AT THE SAME TIME. They have no diaphragms, so it's the muscle and limb movement that moves the air. I've always been told that gently touching the open eyeball is the best sign of whether they're alive or not. She was alive, but limp as a wet noodle.
I set her on a platform, slanted with head down, under a warm light until she was moving ok.
She seemed to recover and acted fine.

Then several weeks later I noticed that when she swam or floated, she was lop-sided: her right shoulder was lower in the water than the rest of her. This is almost a SURE sign of pneumonia.
Long story short: over the next 18 months we had multiple trips first to an exotic vet then to the state veterinary school- I live in Louisiana, and our vet school has an especially good reputation with reptiles. She indeed had pneumonia, and despite repeated, intensive, state-of-the-art treatment, the pneumonia would just come back. When she quit eating for 3 months, after all that, it was clear her quality of life was deteriorating and I opted for euthanasia.
The necropsy showed that she STILL had common debris/mulm from the aquarium water in her airways after a year and a half from the original incident!!!!! Without a diaphragm, they can't cough, so they can't clear their airways. All the treatments would fix the current pneumonias, but the debris in her airways acted like seeds and would just start another pneumonia.

I don't know if this is much help to you, other than to reassure you that even when we provide excellent care and do all that is possible for us to do, sometimes we lose them.

The situation with Mr. Savage certainly does not sound good. I have no idea why he did the odd things that he did.
I see that it's been a couple of days since your post- how are things going?

Kindest regards,
Moozillion/Bea

 

[Moozillion]

@Markw84
@Moozillion

Hey, water turtle folks! Can anybody help this new member?

Thank you, KarenSoCal.

 

[EppsDynasty]

@rgalpin Thank you for all the info, it must have been hard to re-live it as you typed it. So sorry for your loss and wish you and your family peace when it comes to this turtle (your avatar has a kid in it). When we have a pet for years and it is part of your everyday life we tend to forget it is "An Animal." Animals do strange things and get in strange situations with no explanation, no sense of WHY. Being an intellectual animal we have a real hard time with this. It might not be exactly the answer your looking for but it sounds like you provided a Loving and Comfortable life for for as long as his life was! Sometimes Life Sucks....

 

[EppsDynasty]

Forgot to answer you question ... My guess (and thats what it is) would be difficulty breathing. I would think that from the original Drowning there was water in the lungs. The stretching the head is a reaction to the discomfort of not being able to take a "Full" breath. It is the Turtle trying to relieve that uncomfortable feeling. Not much different than you lifting your arms when your out of breath. Again this is just a guess. I imagine he was in discomfort and trying to relieve that discomfort in anyway he could.

 

[rgalpin]

Thank you all for taking the time and sharing your thoughtful replies. It helps to hear other folks' stories and that gives us some context. Much appreciated!

Tuesday morning, I tried all the things I had learned that might help us see signs of life - to no avail.

So, my son and I took him to the spot where, 11 years ago, he swam up to us at a boat ramp on the Potomac River. We gave him a respectable "burial at sea." The current in the area where we lowered him in moved him such that in my imagination he appeared to swim away.

I always thought it might be better for him if I took him down there and set him free - over the years, I almost did it a number of times. But I would always arrive at the idea that it wasn't fair to put him in the wild with no experience to survive. Maybe the instincts would take over and "experience" is not really A THING for a reptile - I don't know. What I do know is, over the years, we enjoyed watching him swim around his tank and he was most definitely part of the fabric of our home.

I was in the habit of having him chase my finger as I moved it across the aquarium glass for him to follow. I made him follow my finger a couple times up and down the glass before I would move it toward his food pellets that would usually end up at the edge of the water where were playing follow the finger. I would then, lead him to a pellet and he would STRIKE the pellet with SAVAGE ferocity! Then I would gently tap my finger against the glass to mimic his prey struggling to withstand the crunching jaws of the savage attack!! I wonder how many times we played that game over TEN YEARS! I did it every time I fed him. I tend to anthropomorphize, but I swear he understood "THE GAME."



Well, so I guess I finally took him to set him free at the boat ramp after all. And now Mr. Savage is free indeed!

Blessings to all you all - and thank you for hearing my story. It helps.

 

[Maggie3fan]

Thank you all for taking the time and sharing your thoughtful replies. It helps to hear other folks' stories and that gives us some context. Much appreciated!

Tuesday morning, I tried all the things I had learned that might help us see signs of life - to no avail.

So, my son and I took him to the spot where, 11 years ago, he swam up to us at a boat ramp on the Potomac River. We gave him a respectable "burial at sea." The current in the area where we lowered him in moved him such that in my imagination he appeared to swim away.

I always thought it might be better for him if I took him down there and set him free - over the years, I almost did it a number of times. But I would always arrive at the idea that it wasn't fair to put him in the wild with no experience to survive. Maybe the instincts would take over and "experience" is not really A THING for a reptile - I don't know. What I do know is, over the years, we enjoyed watching him swim around his tank and he was most definitely part of the fabric of our home.

I was in the habit of having him chase my finger as I moved it across the aquarium glass for him to follow. I made him follow my finger a couple times up and down the glass before I would move it toward his food pellets that would usually end up at the edge of the water where were playing follow the finger. I would then, lead him to a pellet and he would STRIKE the pellet with SAVAGE ferocity! Then I would gently tap my finger against the glass to mimic his prey struggling to withstand the crunching jaws of the savage attack!! I wonder how many times we played that game over TEN YEARS! I did it every time I fed him. I tend to anthropomorphize, but I swear he understood "THE GAME."



Well, so I guess I finally took him to set him free at the boat ramp after all. And now Mr. Savage is free indeed!

Blessings to all you all - and thank you for hearing my story. It helps.

Thanks for sharing that painful story, I'm sure it was painful to write, it sure was painful to read...

 

[Moozillion]

So sorry for your loss, rgalpin.
It sounds like you gave him a really great life!
Hugs from Mooz

 

[Kr1st1n]

Thank you all for taking the time and sharing your thoughtful replies. It helps to hear other folks' stories and that gives us some context. Much appreciated!

Tuesday morning, I tried all the things I had learned that might help us see signs of life - to no avail.

So, my son and I took him to the spot where, 11 years ago, he swam up to us at a boat ramp on the Potomac River. We gave him a respectable "burial at sea." The current in the area where we lowered him in moved him such that in my imagination he appeared to swim away.

I always thought it might be better for him if I took him down there and set him free - over the years, I almost did it a number of times. But I would always arrive at the idea that it wasn't fair to put him in the wild with no experience to survive. Maybe the instincts would take over and "experience" is not really A THING for a reptile - I don't know. What I do know is, over the years, we enjoyed watching him swim around his tank and he was most definitely part of the fabric of our home.

I was in the habit of having him chase my finger as I moved it across the aquarium glass for him to follow. I made him follow my finger a couple times up and down the glass before I would move it toward his food pellets that would usually end up at the edge of the water where were playing follow the finger. I would then, lead him to a pellet and he would STRIKE the pellet with SAVAGE ferocity! Then I would gently tap my finger against the glass to mimic his prey struggling to withstand the crunching jaws of the savage attack!! I wonder how many times we played that game over TEN YEARS! I did it every time I fed him. I tend to anthropomorphize, but I swear he understood "THE GAME."



Well, so I guess I finally took him to set him free at the boat ramp after all. And now Mr. Savage is free indeed!

Blessings to all you all - and thank you for hearing my story. It helps.

💙 😢 🐢 💙 🌈 🌉
I'm not gonna lie, I totally teared up... I'm sooo sorry for your loss and thank you for sharing your story and loving good-bye.

 

[EppsDynasty]

Thank you all for taking the time and sharing your thoughtful replies. It helps to hear other folks' stories and that gives us some context. Much appreciated!

Tuesday morning, I tried all the things I had learned that might help us see signs of life - to no avail.

So, my son and I took him to the spot where, 11 years ago, he swam up to us at a boat ramp on the Potomac River. We gave him a respectable "burial at sea." The current in the area where we lowered him in moved him such that in my imagination he appeared to swim away.

I always thought it might be better for him if I took him down there and set him free - over the years, I almost did it a number of times. But I would always arrive at the idea that it wasn't fair to put him in the wild with no experience to survive. Maybe the instincts would take over and "experience" is not really A THING for a reptile - I don't know. What I do know is, over the years, we enjoyed watching him swim around his tank and he was most definitely part of the fabric of our home.

I was in the habit of having him chase my finger as I moved it across the aquarium glass for him to follow. I made him follow my finger a couple times up and down the glass before I would move it toward his food pellets that would usually end up at the edge of the water where were playing follow the finger. I would then, lead him to a pellet and he would STRIKE the pellet with SAVAGE ferocity! Then I would gently tap my finger against the glass to mimic his prey struggling to withstand the crunching jaws of the savage attack!! I wonder how many times we played that game over TEN YEARS! I did it every time I fed him. I tend to anthropomorphize, but I swear he understood "THE GAME."



Well, so I guess I finally took him to set him free at the boat ramp after all. And now Mr. Savage is free indeed!

Blessings to all you all - and thank you for hearing my story. It helps.

This is another great story of 2 different creatures sharing 1 life, together. Now Mr. Savage will live forever in this thread.

 

[methos75]

My Mississippi Mud Turtle got her head stuck in the intake of a filter back in 2013, I'm not sure how long she was there but when I got home and saw her I immediately removed her and started turtle cpr and after about 20 mins of doing so she was revived and started moving. Since then I've kept her in a cement mixing tub with a sponge filter and 11 years later she is still kicking.

 

[methos75]

Hi, rgalpin, and welcome.
So sorry to hear about your turtle.
I had an eastern mud turtle who drowned, was revived, and ultimately had to be euthanized.
That's her photo as my avatar.

Like you, I found her stuck under a tank object- in this case, her basking platform. She was entangled in a bunch of large plant roots that she had never had problems with before.
I did turtle CPR: hold body so that head is down, and allow water to drain out. Then grasp the feet and pump all of them (or as many as you can manage) in and out, ALL AT THE SAME TIME. They have no diaphragms, so it's the muscle and limb movement that moves the air. I've always been told that gently touching the open eyeball is the best sign of whether they're alive or not. She was alive, but limp as a wet noodle.
I set her on a platform, slanted with head down, under a warm light until she was moving ok.
She seemed to recover and acted fine.

Then several weeks later I noticed that when she swam or floated, she was lop-sided: her right shoulder was lower in the water than the rest of her. This is almost a SURE sign of pneumonia.
Long story short: over the next 18 months we had multiple trips first to an exotic vet then to the state veterinary school- I live in Louisiana, and our vet school has an especially good reputation with reptiles. She indeed had pneumonia, and despite repeated, intensive, state-of-the-art treatment, the pneumonia would just come back. When she quit eating for 3 months, after all that, it was clear her quality of life was deteriorating and I opted for euthanasia.
The necropsy showed that she STILL had common debris/mulm from the aquarium water in her airways after a year and a half from the original incident!!!!! Without a diaphragm, they can't cough, so they can't clear their airways. All the treatments would fix the current pneumonias, but the debris in her airways acted like seeds and would just start another pneumonia.

I don't know if this is much help to you, other than to reassure you that even when we provide excellent care and do all that is possible for us to do, sometimes we lose them.

The situation with Mr. Savage certainly does not sound good. I have no idea why he did the odd things that he did.
I see that it's been a couple of days since your post- how are things going?

Kindest regards,
Moozillion/Bea

Where about in Louisana? I'm orginally from Walker but moved to Illinois following the 2016 flood.

 

[Moozillion]

Where about in Louisana? I'm orginally from Walker but moved to Illinois following the 2016 flood.

I'm in Covington. Howdy, (past) neighbor!