Question About Weight.

[ZombieTurtle]

Just a update and question,

Dexter is still eating daily, but hasn't really put on anymore weight, so he is going to the Vet this Friday morning, they said they are going to do 2 different fecal test (Swipe, and another one I can't remember) My question is how "Fresh" of a sample do they need and whats the best way to take it to them in... kinda odd question, I know...

 

[Meg90]

Put it in a plastic bag. Put it in the fridge.

About your light though---Is it the red bulb for heat? Or do you have a different one for day time? I don't think he's getting enough light.

They need a bright enclosure to stimulate them to feed.

 

[ZombieTurtle]

The red light is for nighttime heat, I was thinking it wasn't bright enough so during the day I replace it with a soft white light I'm also going to be getting another light fixture for the other side.

 

[Meg90]

That sounds like a great idea.

Also, those underbed boxes that I was telling you about are onsale at walmart for 12$! I bought mine for 17$. Its a great bin. Anouk is almost 4 inches, and still in it with no problems (though she will be upgraded soon to make room for her big girl furniture)

Just make sure that it doesn't mess to much with your temps.

Keep us updated on what the vet says.

 

[Stephanie Logan]

I don't know if it works for all tortoises, but for Red-foots, there is the Donahue Ratio- straight-line carapace length in centimeters to the third power, times 0.191 is the minimum weight in grams.

Your guy is about 6.5cm, 6.5^3 is 274.6250, times 0.9191 is 52.45 grams, so if it applies to your species, and the length measurement is accurate, then it is light.

But, new animals are often stressed and dehydrated.

Taco weighs 20.8 oz, and according to the Donohue ratio, she should be 22.8 oz. She is 2 full ounces lighter than she should be (though she's not a Redfoot, she's a Chaco tortoise from Argentina). My question: should I be worried about this?
I am feeding her a daily combination of curly endive, butternut squash, prickly pear fruit, radicchio, yellow squash, and one mazuri pellet, all chopped fine together, dusted with TNT and calcium powder, and "dressed" with one pureed fresh grape. She eats a pile about half her size each day.

 

[ZombieTurtle]

I just saw Dexter trying to eat his substrate, It's 70% Coco coir, and 30% playground sand, should I take him out of it, and just go with Coir?

 

[Meg90]

I would. The coir won't impact him.....

I saw Novalee trying to eat a rock this afternoon. She was such a goof---I just put down fresh greens, and instead, she's trying to chomp a rock.

Sometimes they just try to taste things....how much was he eating?

 

[tortoisenerd]

Stephanie-That formula is only for Redfoots. I don't know if there is one for Chacos. You can't use one breed's growth data for another one as they are all built differently. Are Chacos supposed to have so much of the squash, cactus, fruit, etc? For desert torts, I have heard primarily greens/weeds/lettuces with the squash/Mazuri/cactus as part of the diet on one day a week, and never fed fruit, but I am not familiar with Chacos. I'm curious. I try not to feed too much radicchio as the calcium/phosphorus ratio is lower than the other lettuces, and get the spring mix while rotating brands. As long as she is slowly gaining weight, I wouldn't be worrying that she may be underweight. Slow and steady weight gain is better than trying to rush it. Keep track of her weight and SCL on a regular basis such as every couple weeks until she starts to look more beefy, and feels like a rock of the same size. Some of the foods you are feeding are higher calorie (Mazuri for example) so that amount sounds about right. With just greens, my growing hatchling eats a pile his size, so less food for a tort nearing the end of growth with higher calorie foods sounds just fine to me. It's tough to compare though.

ZombieTurtle-I have heard within 24 hours is best for the fecal test (although you can only do so much and the worst they will say is drop off a fresher sample when you have it), and yes the fridge works fine. I have a vet appointment tomorrow and Trevor's sample is in our fridge lol. He usually is happy to provide the vet with one or more very fresh ones at the visit though! A taste or two of a substrate it fine, but not chowing down on it. If he continues to eat it, I would try switching to something like even plain organic potting soil if the plain coconut coir doesn't do the trick.

Meg-Trevor likes to take new test bites out of his cage furnishings, and also likes rocks. Goofy torts!

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Stephanie-That formula is only for Redfoots. I don't know if there is one for Chacos. You can't use one breed's growth data for another one as they are all built differently. Are Chacos supposed to have so much of the squash, cactus, fruit, etc? For desert torts, I have heard primarily greens/weeds/lettuces with the squash/Mazuri/cactus as part of the diet on one day a week, and never fed fruit, but I am not familiar with Chacos. I'm curious. I try not to feed too much radicchio as the calcium/phosphorus ratio is lower than the other lettuces, and get the spring mix while rotating brands. As long as she is slowly gaining weight, I wouldn't be worrying that she may be underweight. Slow and steady weight gain is better than trying to rush it. Keep track of her weight and SCL on a regular basis such as every couple weeks until she starts to look more beefy, and feels like a rock of the same size. Some of the foods you are feeding are higher calorie (Mazuri for example) so that amount sounds about right. With just greens, my growing hatchling eats a pile his size, so less food for a tort nearing the end of growth with higher calorie foods sounds just fine to me. It's tough to compare though.

ZombieTurtle-I have heard within 24 hours is best for the fecal test (although you can only do so much and the worst they will say is drop off a fresher sample when you have it), and yes the fridge works fine. I have a vet appointment tomorrow and Trevor's sample is in our fridge lol. He usually is happy to provide the vet with one or more very fresh ones at the visit though! A taste or two of a substrate it fine, but not chowing down on it. If he continues to eat it, I would try switching to something like even plain organic potting soil if the plain coconut coir doesn't do the trick.

Meg-Trevor likes to take new test bites out of his cage furnishings, and also likes rocks. Goofy torts!

 

[Meg90]

Nova is a silly girl. I cleaned everyone's enclosure today, and added fresh aspen, and that rock was uncovered. First time I saw her try to eat anything not edible. She's growing like crazy. Little piggy. I have never had to wake her up and put her by the tile. She's the first one up in the morning out of my three to eat, waiting there all grumpy and impatient. Can't wait to measure her at her 3 mos mark on the 25th.

 

[ZombieTurtle]

Well, I got back fro the vet yesterday, He said Dexter is looking good, but was underweight, We found that He did have parasites, Gave him some medicine, and I have to go back in 3 weeks with another fecal test. I'm hoping now he will start to gain weight, this morning is the most active I have seen him in awhile, he seems to be doing a lot better, Also I did add another light a couple days ago. I will try to get some more pics up today.



-Matt

 

[Yvonne G]

Matt: Usually after the first dose of de-wormer, you give a second dose in 10 days. I'm not sure why your vet wants to wait 3 weeks. The first dose kills the mature parasites, but then eggs that were floating around the system will hatch, so you go back in 10 days to kill them before they have a chance to lay eggs too.

Yvonne

 

[tortoisenerd]

What kind of parasite? I also agree if it is worms, and a single dose medication, then a second dose in 10-14 days is in order before the re-test (and I've heard waiting a bit longer to re-test as well). Did they do a stomach tube type of medication? Which one? My tort has pinworms and got a take-home medications with multiple doses (two rounds) so I'm interested in learning about the options in treatments. Glad you got some answers. Looking forward to more pictures. Does the light help with the temperature gradient? Best wishes.

 

[ZombieTurtle]

Ok, well, I talked to the vet, and I guess I misunderstood him yesterday, He didn't perform a fecal test ( he said that it was almost positive that he would have parasites) so instead of charging us for the fecal and medicine he just gave Dex a dose of meds, and he wants me to bring a fecal sample in in the next 3 weeks (My wife apparently knew all of this, some how i missed all of that conversation, ADD can be a pain). The vet did say if I want to bring him in and get a fecal done sometime this week he will. But he said as long as Dex is slowly gaining weight right now I shouldn't be too worried.

-Matt

 

[Meg90]

What meds were those? Shots? or Oral?

If it was vitamin A shots, don't let them give him another one.

 

[ZombieTurtle]

It was a oral med that he said would get rid of any parasites, Unless it was life or death I would never let anyone stick Dex with a needle. when he was using the syringe to give him the oral meds I made sure it had a plastic tip and I wouldn't let him even try to force his mouth open we had to wait until Dex was about to bite a piece of lettuce.

 

[Meg90]

What is the brand? There is a dog wormer that if given to tortoises is fatal.

 

[Stephanie Logan]

Stephanie-That formula is only for Redfoots. I don't know if there is one for Chacos. You can't use one breed's growth data for another one as they are all built differently. Are Chacos supposed to have so much of the squash, cactus, fruit, etc? For desert torts, I have heard primarily greens/weeds/lettuces with the squash/Mazuri/cactus as part of the diet on one day a week, and never fed fruit, but I am not familiar with Chacos. I'm curious. I try not to feed too much radicchio as the calcium/phosphorus ratio is lower than the other lettuces, and get the spring mix while rotating brands. As long as she is slowly gaining weight, I wouldn't be worrying that she may be underweight. Slow and steady weight gain is better than trying to rush it. Keep track of her weight and SCL on a regular basis such as every couple weeks until she starts to look more beefy, and feels like a rock of the same size. Some of the foods you are feeding are higher calorie (Mazuri for example) so that amount sounds about right. With just greens, my growing hatchling eats a pile his size, so less food for a tort nearing the end of growth with higher calorie foods sounds just fine to me. It's tough to compare though.

Hi Kate,
Thanks for the input and reassurance. I have read every online article and the Vinke and Vetter South American Tortoise book sections about Chacos, and the authors of the book said that Chaco's could be classified as "selective eaters", in that without cactus pads and fruits, they failed to thrive, and it was only after introducing these food items to their Chaco's (which were being kept in Paraguay) diets that the animals' energy, well being, and even their ability to breed, was renewed. Chaco's are pretty rare and have much less research data than the other South American species; one reliable study reported that up to 30% of Chaco's kept as pets died within their first three years of captivity. So yes, I am trying very hard to glean all applicable husbandry skills from the sparse data base to supply my little Taco Bean with every necessity and comfort that I can.

Zombie Turtle, I am sorry I did not mean to hijack your thread. I just got overexcited at the prospect of a growth chart I could use on Taco.

 

[ZombieTurtle]

No prob Stephanie,

Meg, I have no idea what brand it was, but the vet does specialize in Torts.


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Great now I'm gonna worry that he got the wrong med.. thanks... lol,j/k.

Umm, but when would he show signs if it was....?

-Matt

 

[Meg90]

Wrong wormer would = death. It doesn't say on the bottle? Ivermectin is poisonous to tortoises (its a common dog wormer)

 

[ZombieTurtle]

There is no bottle, the vet gave him the meds, just one dose, he siad it was safe for tort's and he does specialize in them.....


But just for my peace of mind, if it was the worng med, wouldn't Dex have shown symptoms already?