Russian housing?

[burtandurny101]

i have had my russian tortoise for years now and i have just recently been redoing all my reptile setups.
i had this thought that his cage is prolly not good enough, he often seems very sad.
if they are a burrowing species should i pile on the substrate so he can dig a burrow, or make one for him?
if so, what type of substrate would i use and how deep should the substrate be?
his "clunking" (trying to walk through glass) has gotten much better lately but still keeps me up at night, could i just paint the lower 4 inches of the glass so he will know there is something there?
i have been using coconut husk chunks for all the time i have had him, never been satisfied with them, except with my gecko.
thank you.

 

[Yvonne G]

Hi Burtandurny101: We'll need to know a little more about how you have your Russian set up in order to help you. My first thought is that you have him in an aquarium. We advise against that mainly for the reason you stated. They don't understand why they can't walk right though the glass (hence the thumping you talked about). Its better to keep them in either a tort table, made out of wood, or a plastic tote. You can buy those under-the-bed plastic storage bins pretty cheaply and they make a great habitat. You can use a 50/50 mixture of Bed-A-Beast (coconut coir) and Play sand for the substrate. Then you put enough in the habitat that he can dig down into it. You also need a hiding place for him, such as a half log or shoe box. Send us a picture of your set-up so we can help you.

Yvonne

 

[burtandurny101]

Hi Burtandurny101: We'll need to know a little more about how you have your Russian set up in order to help you. My first thought is that you have him in an aquarium. We advise against that mainly for the reason you stated. They don't understand why they can't walk right though the glass (hence the thumping you talked about). Its better to keep them in either a tort table, made out of wood, or a plastic tote. You can buy those under-the-bed plastic storage bins pretty cheaply and they make a great habitat. You can use a 50/50 mixture of Bed-A-Beast (coconut coir) and Play sand for the substrate. Then you put enough in the habitat that he can dig down into it. You also need a hiding place for him, such as a half log or shoe box. Send us a picture of your set-up so we can help you.

Yvonne

we;; there is no need taking a pic, he is in a 20 gal aquarium with cocobark and nothing but a rock to put food on. i know it is all wrong now, what would be an ideal set up?

 

[Yvonne G]

The ideal set up is a nice, safe pen outside. But for inside the house, you want a very large Rubbermaid or Sterlite plastic tote. You want the sides to be tall enough so that if one tortoise stands on the other tortoise's back he can't reach the top. They are GOOD climbers. So go tote shopping, but bear in mind that the amount of substrate you put in makes the sides shorter. You want enough substrate that they can dig down while inside their hide. I think several inches. You need a piece of slate, a flat rock or a ceramic tile to feed them on; a plant saucer sunk down into the substrate to hold water; a hiding place or two. With two tortoises, two hiding places would be nice. If you want to dress up the habitat you can plant some artificial plants around inside. You can see, with this amount of "stuff" in the habitat, you'll need a fairly large tote. The under-the-bed storage or Christmas tree totes are good for this purpose. We also see a lot of used book cases for tort tables. Try to find a used wooden book case. Remove the shelves and line it with an old shower curtain or sheet of plastic. Then decorate as shown above. The book case is an even better idea than the tote because of its size. With all that room to roam around the tortoise doesn't become bored or keep trying to escape. You will need a UVB light. Read the info here:

http://www.tortoisetrust.org/articles/lighting.html

and maybe a light for night time. I use a regular incandescent bulb for daytime (but my tortoises are outside) and a black light for night time. You can buy the clamp fixtures at any hardware store or Wal-Mart, etc. Its cheaper buying there than at the pet store. You want your habitat to have a warm side and a not-quite-so-warm side. The tortoise needs to be able to get his body temperature up to 80 to 90 degrees in order to digest his food. Then he will move to the no-so-warm side to cool a bit.

I'm glad you have been re-thinking your tortoise-keeping practices. I hope I was able to give you a little insight.

Yvonne

 

[Crazy1]

Hi burtandurny101, welcome to the forum Yvonne has given you some solid advice for your enclosure to help make your tort a happy and healthy home.

 

[burtandurny101]

what substrate should i use? eco earth? peat moss? spagnum moss? mixture of 2 or all three of them? please be specific.
he has a uva/uvb sun glow bulb, i did get that much going for him. it is a high enough wattage he has a hot spot, but no night time heat. the room he is in never drops below 70 because of all the other animals heating that is 24/7
i have an infra red thermometer coming in the mail so i can truly dial in all my hot spots and such.

 

[Yvonne G]

My personal choice is #1 - orchid bark and #2 - cypress mulch. Quite a few people really go for the 50/50 mixture of Bed-A-Beast/Playsand. I don't like it because of the coconut husk strings in the Bed-A-Beast. That and the fact that it gets into everything. The larger pieces of orchid bark or cypress mulch never get stuck on the food or on the tortoise. You can find Bed-A-Beast (coconut coir) at the pet store. It comes in a compressed brick. You put it in a 5 gallon bucket of hot water and it expands. Then you wring out the water and mix it with Play Sand. You can buy Play Sand at any home improvement store. The reason to use Play Sand is because it is packaged to be used in kids' sand boxes so it is pretty much free of anything harmful. You spread the mixture around your enclosure, and the lights will dry out the top layer. But the bottom layers stay a bit moist, which is good for your little guy. Warm/moist=good....cold/moist=bad.

Yvonne

 

[burtandurny101]

ok, i got him set up in an odd sized 50 gallon aquarium, i know, totes, well i have this already and it is as big as any tote is can find. it is 15x38x17 (WxLxH)
his substrate is organic spagnum moss, it is 3 or 4 inches deep.
he has a self filling water dish and a nice stone tile for feeding on.
his light is above him by about a foot
just set it up so i dont have temeratures yet, but i will post them when i know them.

What do you think? i tried to post a pic but cant figure out how too. wanna teach me how so i can get some before and after pics going?

 

[Yvonne G]

Well, I'm not a big fan of glass habitats for tortoises. They get stressed because they can't figure out why they can't walk through the glass. Also, glass aquariums are hard to have a warm side and a no-so-warm side. They usually are the same temp all over the habitat. So, I can't comment on your set up, as I don't use that kind. Its not what I would have for any of my animals.

The easiest way (for me) to post pictures is to establish a free Photobucket account. Put your pictures in Photobucket. Then open a new window and start your reply in the forum. Go back to your Photobucket window and move your mouse over the picture you want, scrolling down to under the picture where letters and numbers will appear. Left click on the "img code" and you will see a little yellow "copied" Then come back to your reply on the forum and right click in your reply window and choose "paste" You will see a whole string of letters and numbers, but when you post your reply, those change to the picture you just copied.

Yvonne

 

[burtandurny101]

i understand the animal getting stressed by the glass, but first thing tomorrow i am going to paint the bottom 5 or so inches black so he knows there is something there.
as for the temperature gradient, i suppose i will have to go out and get yet another heat bulb or hybridize the heating of another herp in my collection. what should the temperature difference be on the hot and cold side be?

---

correction, just painted the bottom few inches black

 

[Maggie Cummings]

ok, i got him set up in an odd sized 50 gallon aquarium, i know, totes, well i have this already and it is as big as any tote is can find. it is 15x38x17 (WxLxH)
his substrate is organic spagnum moss, it is 3 or 4 inches deep.
he has a self filling water dish and a nice stone tile for feeding on.
his light is above him by about a foot
just set it up so i dont have temeratures yet, but i will post them when i know them.

What do you think? i tried to post a pic but cant figure out how too. wanna teach me how so i can get some before and after pics going?

Russian tort shouldn't be kept on moss...he needs a substantial substrate...eco earth and sand is good, orchid bark is better...

 

[Crazy1]

burtandurny101, you can use eco earth an sand50/50 mix, orchid bark or plain old clean yard dirt (clean as in no pesticides or chemicals).
Under his basking spot he should have a temp of about 90-95 degrees F the cool end should be in the low 70’s F. Night time temps need to drop to no lower than the mid 60’s F.
Humidity is very important. You can dampen one side of the enclosure to give him a humid side and a dry side.
Remember cold & damp is bad. Warm & damp is OK.
Here is a site that gives you lots of information on how to set up a habitat for your Russian, proper diet etc. http://www.russiantortoise.org/care_sheet.htm

 

[burtandurny101]

i finally broke down and went out and got some eco earth and play sand, all surprisingly cheap compared to what i expected.
he is all set up with a 50/50 mix, he has a heat rock sunk under the sand mix under his tile to provide belly heat and a 100 watt day full spectrum bulb.
he has a water dish.
Any body see an issue here? besides he is in a glass tank, it is a really big one, an older company, abnormally wide.
please let me know if there is anything you think i could do to make his life any more happy.

 

[tortoisenerd]

If the heat rock produces heat, I would recommend taking it out. Tortoises in the wild only get their heat from above from the sun, not underneath. There is a risk it could overheat the tortoise or even burn them. It messes with their thermoregulation (they move area to area to cool or warm themselves since they don't have a sweat glands; I'm sure someone can give a more scientific explanation though!). Thermoregulation is usually also more difficult in a tank as the temperature tends to be more constant rather than providing a gradient/range.

Putting up some wallpaper on the glass may help until you can get an enclosure with solid walls (whatever type of paper you wouldn't mind looking at).

What kind of bulb do you have (brand/type)?

Is the water dish big enough for him to climb into it? Does he use it?

If you order the eco earth online, it may be even cheaper than what you found in the store. Just a fyi for when you need to replace it. With spot cleaning, I've heard some people can get several months out of their substrate. It's also important to pour water on it and mix it up again for it to retain humidity.

I'm sure your tort appreciates all your hard work! Welcome to the forum.

 

[nrfitchett4]

burtandurny101, you can use eco earth an sand50/50 mix, orchid bark or plain old clean yard dirt (clean as in no pesticides or chemicals).
Under his basking spot he should have a temp of about 90-95 degrees F the cool end should be in the low 70’s F. Night time temps need to drop to no lower than the mid 60’s F.
Humidity is very important. You can dampen one side of the enclosure to give him a humid side and a dry side.
Remember cold & damp is bad. Warm & damp is OK.
Here is a site that gives you lots of information on how to set up a habitat for your Russian, proper diet etc. http://www.russiantortoise.org/care_sheet.htm

"clean" dirt??? where kind I find some of that???

 

[burtandurny101]

i am not worried about the rock burning him, it is under over an inch of substrate and under a tile. the tile is warm to the touch but by no means hot.
i have an infrared thermometer on its way so i can pinpoint the temps of all the basking spots.
His water dish is not big enough for him to climb into and i doubt he uses it, never seen him do it.
i do soak him once a week so he isnt going to get dehydrated too easily.

What should i provide for a hide? i tried an upturned tub with a hole cut into the side large enough for him to walk through. but he just fills it up with substrate and pushes it around, never actually using it.
any sugestions for a hide?

 

[nrfitchett4]

I use premade ones, but my sulcata is a baby. if those don't work, why not make one out of wood that will be harder to push around. Sink it down in the substrate to anchor it. Mine uses all her hides.

 

[Chadam]

We have a half log cut out from Petco, our Russian uses it quite a bit and doesn't move it around.