Setting up a closed chamber, hoping to rehab tiny tort

[Reptilian Feline]

I decided I couldn't wait any longer, I needed to set up the closed chamber for my little one ASAP. The last couple of days he hasn't been very active, though once I say that he suddenly becomes lively again.
I wanted to test the settings for the CHE and flood light before transferring him, but that turned out to be impossible... the CHE I could adjust, but he was already using the flood light (basking light) so I couldn't really remove that for a proper testing. I decided to wing it, watch the temp throughout the evening and then double check in the morning.

I bought a dimmer for the CHE and a dimmer for the flood light as well. They are both on timers. The CHE turns on 30 min after the light goes out, and then turns off when the light goes on again. The CHE is on a 50% dimmer setting at the moment and the temp is about 27-30 celcius depending on where I measure. The flood basking light is also on a dimmer, and I kind of panicked this morning, and turned that down to 50% as well (I had it on 75%) because I don't want to day temp to pass 39 celcius. I figure heat will accumulate a little at least. The humidity ended up at 92% but there is a margin of error at 5%. At least there is condensation on the lid and sides.

The CHE is 25W and the flood basking light is 50W.

He seemed to like the new box. I planted some grass to hide in, and some plantain to nibble at, and will add more plants. It's small, the box, but he is only 4 cm long so it isn't cramped. I want to see if he starts to eat better, become more active, before I transfer him to a more suitable closed chamber sizewise. The water dish is halfway below the flood light so it can hopefully keep warmer so he uses it on his own.

I also have a plastic tray for his soaks. I have put some sheet moss in it so he has something to climb up on. He likes the water to be above his margin scutes, that's when he really starts to do his poop-motions.

Some pictures:

 

[Markw84]

I decided I couldn't wait any longer, I needed to set up the closed chamber for my little one ASAP. The last couple of days he hasn't been very active, though once I say that he suddenly becomes lively again.
I wanted to test the settings for the CHE and flood light before transferring him, but that turned out to be impossible... the CHE I could adjust, but he was already using the flood light (basking light) so I couldn't really remove that for a proper testing. I decided to wing it, watch the temp throughout the evening and then double check in the morning.

I bought a dimmer for the CHE and a dimmer for the flood light as well. They are both on timers. The CHE turns on 30 min after the light goes out, and then turns off when the light goes on again. The CHE is on a 50% dimmer setting at the moment and the temp is about 27-30 celcius depending on where I measure. The flood basking light is also on a dimmer, and I kind of panicked this morning, and turned that down to 50% as well (I had it on 75%) because I don't want to day temp to pass 39 celcius. I figure heat will accumulate a little at least. The humidity ended up at 92% but there is a margin of error at 5%. At least there is condensation on the lid and sides.

The CHE is 25W and the flood basking light is 50W.

He seemed to like the new box. I planted some grass to hide in, and some plantain to nibble at, and will add more plants. It's small, the box, but he is only 4 cm long so it isn't cramped. I want to see if he starts to eat better, become more active, before I transfer him to a more suitable closed chamber sizewise. The water dish is halfway below the flood light so it can hopefully keep warmer so he uses it on his own.

I also have a plastic tray for his soaks. I have put some sheet moss in it so he has something to climb up on. He likes the water to be above his margin scutes, that's when he really starts to do his poop-motions.

Some pictures:

I would really recommend you put the CHE on a thermostat. That will automatically maintain a set temperature. With what looks like a Mercury Vapor Bulb (basking bulb) in that small an enclosure, you will potentially have issues with it getting too hot as it is. If it is a MVB bulb, it cannot be on a rheostat. At night the thermostat will ensure the CHE does not overheat the enclosure at all.

I like a lot of what you've done in creating an environment for your little leopard. However, in such a small enclosed system, the issue becomes potential overheating. To really get a handle on this issue, I think you will need to end up with a remote ballasted fluorescent UVB source, a standard lower wattage, incandescent flood bulb on rheostat for basking, and a CHE on thermostat.

I am really impressed with your effort and determination to get things right for your tortoise!

 

[Reptilian Feline]

I've tried finding a thermostat that's easy to plug in and doesn't cost and arm and a leg, but when I google for them in Swedish I end up with the kind you put on your wall heaters or the kind you build into a circuit. None of that would work of course. I did find a build-it-yourself circuit from Velleman that might work, I just need to change some of the resitors to make it more sensitiv and so on... there is info on-line.
I needed something now, not next week or month if ordered from abroad. I know the dimmer isn't perfect for the task, but it seems to be working so far.
I've gradually pulled up the dimmer for the basking light since my panic yesterday, and at the moment, the basking temp is at 33.5 celcius. I'm watching it closely, and will do so this whole weekend. This will have to do for now, and I will continue to look for a thermostat that I can use.

The humidity is at 94% at the moment. At least that's what it says. There is condensation on the lid and sides, there are drops on the grass, but the little one's shell looks dry. I hope that's OK.

To boost him, I'll make a food smoothy for him for his bath today, so I know he get something to eat.

Question: The MVB compact lights, are they dimmable?

Question 2: When setting up the thermostat, what should I aim it at? The basking spot? The coolest spot? Should I have one for the CHE and another for the basking spot?

 

[wellington]

The mercury vapor bulbs can not be dimmed but can be put on a timer. Does your basking bulb have UVB in it?
The enclosure as Mark said it way too small. The cheapest way to fix that is to get a plastic tote box with a lid. Cut a hole in the side of it and another hole in the side of your enclosure and fix the two together or put a tunnel between them. I did this years ago and used a plastic cup for the tunnel, cutting the bottom out. They need to be in 80F as an over all temp and then the basking spot of 95-100F. A baby can over heat very quickly.
Also, baby's do sleep a lot and don't usually eat grass and weeds right away unless that is all they were offered from the start.

 

[Markw84]

I've tried finding a thermostat that's easy to plug in and doesn't cost and arm and a leg, but when I google for them in Swedish I end up with the kind you put on your wall heaters or the kind you build into a circuit. None of that would work of course. I did find a build-it-yourself circuit from Velleman that might work, I just need to change some of the resitors to make it more sensitiv and so on... there is info on-line.
I needed something now, not next week or month if ordered from abroad. I know the dimmer isn't perfect for the task, but it seems to be working so far.
I've gradually pulled up the dimmer for the basking light since my panic yesterday, and at the moment, the basking temp is at 33.5 celcius. I'm watching it closely, and will do so this whole weekend. This will have to do for now, and I will continue to look for a thermostat that I can use.

The humidity is at 94% at the moment. At least that's what it says. There is condensation on the lid and sides, there are drops on the grass, but the little one's shell looks dry. I hope that's OK.

To boost him, I'll make a food smoothy for him for his bath today, so I know he get something to eat.

Question: The MVB compact lights, are they dimmable?

Question 2: When setting up the thermostat, what should I aim it at? The basking spot? The coolest spot? Should I have one for the CHE and another for the basking spot?

Don't panic. Your setup right now is a definite improvement, and will work for such a tiny, hatchling sized tortoise for now. You basically have what I would use as a temporary "hospital" setup for a young tortoise. The way you have it set up is more work for you - to monitor, but also will work. So I don't think you need to stress. Looks like your humidity and temps are being carefully watched by you, and are what your little guy needs. Keep the temp so the low is never below 27°. Warm side daytime around 30°-34° is fine. Never let the enclosure get above 39°. A core body temp of 40° is lethal for a tortoise.

This time of year, can't you give your little guy some real outside sunshine for about 15 - 30 minutes at least a couple times a week? If so, that is all the UVB you need for him for now. You might find giving him 30 - 60 min in a secure outside, partially shaded enclosure will really perk him up and stimulate appetite as well. Just put some substrate in a little plastic kiddie pool. They are about 4 foot diameter and work perfectly and easy to clean. Even on a 20° sunny day, you will find the substrate and tortoise will easily heat to 27° and higher in the sun. I cover mine with 1/2" hardware cloth for security, or sit down with a soda or wine and stand guard for a bit.

I think you have plenty of time to get a new setup and all the things you want. what you have now will work especially with your monitoring and added outdoor time. Go ahead and order the proper things and don't worry about it taking a few weeks or month or so.

 

[Reptilian Feline]

I watched the basking light/daytime temp, and it never got over 34.5 celcius after upping the dimmer a bit more. Nighttime is steadily around 27-28 celcius.

The basking light is with UVA, but not UVB. I try to take him outside when the sun is shining, and he does seem to like that a lot. The summer hasn't properly arrived yet (and as I'm typing this, it's raining). I have an old plastic "baby bath-tub" type container I will put him in when the weather makes it possible to keep him out for longer than 15 min. The higher sides will provide shade and keep him from escaping, and keep the dogs away from him as well when I tell them. I'll look for a kiddie-pool

I think he enjoys the new chamber. He doesn't feel cold to the touch at all anymore. He used to fall asleep under the basking light, but now he walks into his burrow under the tuft of grass when he wants to. He sleeps a lot, but when I pick him up, he is quicker to wake up. Now when I mist him in his face, he retracts his head quickly.

Wellington - thanks for the idea, but as Mark stated, this is a hospital room. When the little one is feeling better and improving, I have the perfect closed chamber container in mind for him... I know where to get it and it comes with a lid, and is almost transparent. Plenty of space to walk around and plenty of space to plant things.

The weed smoothy turned out fine. He did drink and so got some food into himself as well. It looked then as if he was trying to graze in the water. Maybe babies do that in the wild? Get into a puddle with weeds, put their head down in the water and eats?
I've read about (and asked) the carrot soak, but I thought it would be better to use the weeds and plants he is supposed to eat, rather than carrots. Unless carrots have something special they need when not feeling well?

 

[Reptilian Feline]

I have a bad feeling about the little one.... yesterday he was very inactive and when I gave him his bath it didn't look as if he drank that much. He even had trouble keeping his head steady! I thought I would find him dead today, but he is still alive. It's a national holiday today (Swedish National Day) so I'm home and can check on him. I think it's time to write the breeder again... this time to tell him I am very very unhappy and ask if he is still willing to change the tortoise for me. I hate giving up on the little one, but what can I do? Is it possible to force feed tiny torts?

 

[Reptilian Feline]

UPDATE: The breeder answered my email. He will switch the tort for me. We just have to arrange time and place.

 

[Markw84]

UPDATE: The breeder answered my email. He will switch the tort for me. We just have to arrange time and place.

That's good news, but keep in mind this "breeder" sold you this baby as a completely normal baby. Most reputable breeders would have not sold this one until it was growing and doing well, or at least sold it with full disclosure that is was over 2 years old and not grown at all and was a "project tortoise". Others from this same source will have been kept the same way and hatched out and started the same way. So if you decide to accept another from him, be sure it is of good size for its age, active, good clear eyes, feels heavy for its size, and has fairly smooth growth with minimal pyramiding. Growth rates vary, but since you are picking one out, it would go for one that appears to be in a "normal" range. I would generally expect a 1 year old to be at least 4" and 200g if healthy and thriving. A 2 year old at least 6" and 575g.

Find out what he feeds and see if you could see the new one eat. You know enough now to judge the diet he is offering. Hopefully it is well varied.

Good luck and post pictures with the new one!

 

[Reptilian Feline]

Good advice Mark! I am a bit weary about accepting a new one from him, but now I know what to look for and what to ask.