Beak, Vets, Red flags

[RainsOn]

BEAK: Posting pics of beak. I've been told a dremmel gets too hot to trim a beak. I've been told to cut with nail clippers. I've been told that filing is the best. I cannot work dremmel and hold Digger at the same time. Nail clippers won't cut the beak. I decided to try a coarse emery board after a soak. After every soak (hoping it is softened a little), I file a little. Planned to get it to a place where I could keep it under control. Something happened; don't even know when. But, the beak is now longer on one side and pointed. Did I break it off? Did he break it off? Can't say for sure. Last time he was trimmed (a couple years ago), I posted pics here. Again, see below.
VETS: I hate this. I have managed to care for my Russian tort, Digger for about 11 years BUT . . . every couple years he needs his beak trimmed, even though he eats on a slate rock.
Have not been very happy with vets. Well, after all, Digger is "mama's little prince". LOL Have had them refuse to let me in the treatment room. One vet, who told me she worked with reptiles, asked me what sex he was. I have had them want to run tests, even though he has no symptoms. And, they want to administer worm meds when there are no worms showing. (They do tend to carry a few naturally; as I understand.)
Anyway, today takes the cake. I looked up local vets, as we moved here 5 years ago, hoping there might be a change in the roster. There was a vet listed as dealing with reptiles. I decided to make a personal appointment to check out the shop. I was greeted by a young vet and a 10 year old feeding animals in cages along with a very strong urine ammonia smell that stayed in my nose all the way home. The vet was the only worker - no assistants, no helpers (except the ten year old). the reception room was cluttered with filing, books, papers, general clutter on the counter and around the room. A bearded dragon was in an aquarium that barely fit him, on cardboard stained with poop, no limb for climbing, no food or water dishes. There was a tall cage with a couple geckos that had poop all down each of the screen sides. A large aquarium, the length of a short wall with "green" water - did not see any fish. Wonder why?!
She told me that she uses a dremmel and, in order to handle the tort without help, sedates them. RED FLAGS ! I thanked her and left.
From another local vet, I did get a referral that I looked up on line. They appear to be very upscale, knowledgeable and professional with a full staff and 4 vets. The web site shows pics of bearded dragon, rabbit and chinchilla along with dogs and cats. There is a mention of one vet working with aviary. Have to drive 2 hours. No real problem; would just like to be sure before going that far.
Will be making an appointment later this week IF . . . . . a majority who answer think I need to.



P.S. I have a dremmel but cannot hold Digger and operate it at the same time. My husband could neither hold Digger's head or work the dremmel. What do any/all of you do ?

 

[zovick]

BEAK: Posting pics of beak. I've been told a dremmel gets too hot to trim a beak. I've been told to cut with nail clippers. I've been told that filing is the best. I cannot work dremmel and hold Digger at the same time. Nail clippers won't cut the beak. I decided to try a coarse emery board after a soak. After every soak (hoping it is softened a little), I file a little. Planned to get it to a place where I could keep it under control. Something happened; don't even know when. But, the beak is now longer on one side and pointed. Did I break it off? Did he break it off? Can't say for sure. Last time he was trimmed (a couple years ago), I posted pics here. Again, see below.
VETS: I hate this. I have managed to care for my Russian tort, Digger for about 11 years BUT . . . every couple years he needs his beak trimmed, even though he eats on a slate rock.
Have not been very happy with vets. Well, after all, Digger is "mama's little prince". LOL Have had them refuse to let me in the treatment room. One vet, who told me she worked with reptiles, asked me what sex he was. I have had them want to run tests, even though he has no symptoms. And, they want to administer worm meds when there are no worms showing. (They do tend to carry a few naturally; as I understand.)
Anyway, today takes the cake. I looked up local vets, as we moved here 5 years ago, hoping there might be a change in the roster. There was a vet listed as dealing with reptiles. I decided to make a personal appointment to check out the shop. I was greeted by a young vet and a 10 year old feeding animals in cages along with a very strong urine ammonia smell that stayed in my nose all the way home. The vet was the only worker - no assistants, no helpers (except the ten year old). the reception room was cluttered with filing, books, papers, general clutter on the counter and around the room. A bearded dragon was in an aquarium that barely fit him, on cardboard stained with poop, no limb for climbing, no food or water dishes. There was a tall cage with a couple geckos that had poop all down each of the screen sides. A large aquarium, the length of a short wall with "green" water - did not see any fish. Wonder why?!
She told me that she uses a dremmel and, in order to handle the tort without help, sedates them. RED FLAGS ! I thanked her and left.
From another local vet, I did get a referral that I looked up on line. They appear to be very upscale, knowledgeable and professional with a full staff and 4 vets. The web site shows pics of bearded dragon, rabbit and chinchilla along with dogs and cats. There is a mention of one vet working with aviary. Have to drive 2 hours. No real problem; would just like to be sure before going that far.
Will be making an appointment later this week IF . . . . . a majority who answer think I need to.

View attachment 395233View attachment 395234View attachment 395237

P.S. I have a dremmel but cannot hold Digger and operate it at the same time. My husband could neither hold Digger's head or work the dremmel. What do any/all of you do ?

The beak definitely needs a good trim. I would recommend finding a good reptile or avian vet who can do the job. Note that more than one appointment can be necessary for beaks which are quite overgrown such as this one.

That is so that the beak can regrow over the bone a bit in between trimmings. Taking all the overgrowth off at once would expose the underlying bone and be like cutting a dog's nails into the quick.

 

[wellington]

Let him rip his food, not cut it up small for him. Grazing does wonders too. I had to cut my rescue Russians beak when I first got him and haven't since. That was over 12 years ago. He grazes in the summer and gets large pieces of greens or mulberry leaves. Winter I feed on flat rock or tile and do not cut up any of his food. Only babies need to have their food cut smaller and that's for a short time

 

[Tom]

BEAK: Posting pics of beak. I've been told a dremmel gets too hot to trim a beak. I've been told to cut with nail clippers. I've been told that filing is the best. I cannot work dremmel and hold Digger at the same time. Nail clippers won't cut the beak. I decided to try a coarse emery board after a soak. After every soak (hoping it is softened a little), I file a little. Planned to get it to a place where I could keep it under control. Something happened; don't even know when. But, the beak is now longer on one side and pointed. Did I break it off? Did he break it off? Can't say for sure. Last time he was trimmed (a couple years ago), I posted pics here. Again, see below.
VETS: I hate this. I have managed to care for my Russian tort, Digger for about 11 years BUT . . . every couple years he needs his beak trimmed, even though he eats on a slate rock.
Have not been very happy with vets. Well, after all, Digger is "mama's little prince". LOL Have had them refuse to let me in the treatment room. One vet, who told me she worked with reptiles, asked me what sex he was. I have had them want to run tests, even though he has no symptoms. And, they want to administer worm meds when there are no worms showing. (They do tend to carry a few naturally; as I understand.)
Anyway, today takes the cake. I looked up local vets, as we moved here 5 years ago, hoping there might be a change in the roster. There was a vet listed as dealing with reptiles. I decided to make a personal appointment to check out the shop. I was greeted by a young vet and a 10 year old feeding animals in cages along with a very strong urine ammonia smell that stayed in my nose all the way home. The vet was the only worker - no assistants, no helpers (except the ten year old). the reception room was cluttered with filing, books, papers, general clutter on the counter and around the room. A bearded dragon was in an aquarium that barely fit him, on cardboard stained with poop, no limb for climbing, no food or water dishes. There was a tall cage with a couple geckos that had poop all down each of the screen sides. A large aquarium, the length of a short wall with "green" water - did not see any fish. Wonder why?!
She told me that she uses a dremmel and, in order to handle the tort without help, sedates them. RED FLAGS ! I thanked her and left.
From another local vet, I did get a referral that I looked up on line. They appear to be very upscale, knowledgeable and professional with a full staff and 4 vets. The web site shows pics of bearded dragon, rabbit and chinchilla along with dogs and cats. There is a mention of one vet working with aviary. Have to drive 2 hours. No real problem; would just like to be sure before going that far.
Will be making an appointment later this week IF . . . . . a majority who answer think I need to.

View attachment 395233View attachment 395234View attachment 395237

P.S. I have a dremmel but cannot hold Digger and operate it at the same time. My husband could neither hold Digger's head or work the dremmel. What do any/all of you do ?

Some toe nail clippers or even diagonal pliers would work well on that.

Dremmels do not overheat anything. That's just silly. I use a dremmel on bird beaks, dog nails, and lots of other stuff like that regularly and have for decades.

I've received tortoises in this condition and the beak self corrects in a short time without me doing anything. Much the way Wellington described. Something must be off in your care or housing. I don't think feeding on a slate does anything. I use terra cotta saucers sunk into the substrate for food and water. I have 60 tortoises and babies hatching all the time, I have never have beak problems. Could be diet, temps, calcium, UV, enclosure size... What do you typically feed your tortoise? Does it live inside or outside? What is the UV source inside? Let's see if we can figure out the problem and correct it rather than continually dealing with the symptom.

 

[144 Grandpa Turtle]

Put your tortoise's food on a slab of tile That will ware his beak down

 

[144 Grandpa Turtle]

Feed him Half his Food twice Aday so he will eat down to the slab of tile

 

[RainsOn]

All interesting and good ideas.
TOM: He eats well; lots of greens and some veggies. Does not like fruit.
I recently went over your care sheet and lighting is right.
Indoors he is misted frequently and get regular soaks. This Russian loves the water.
This year, our weather is rainy and cooler. He has been in more. Does not stay out since we saw a raccoon in the habitat at 4:00 am a couple weeks ago. (I have brought him in most nights this year due to cool rains. He was in this night.)
He has an outdoor run, 4 x 9 feet with water pool, hides and I plant in the spring: dandelion, cucumber, kale, succulents, etc. Different each year; some grows, some doesn't.
He is indoors in cooler weather and I brumated him last winter for the first time.
I am presently working on the indoor habitat to add a second story with ramp.
> I think my biggest problem is that I cut everything pretty small, except large leaves. I will get a tile and stop cutting the food. Will also change the water dish to terra cotta; presently using glazed clay.
> I will also get the dremmel out. I absolutely don't like the idea of any sedation.

 

[RainsOn]

Tom,
P.S. When you say a tile, you man a clay tile like is on the kitchen wall - ?

 

[144 Grandpa Turtle]

I mean slate like on your patio floor

 

[COmtnLady]

None of us are trying to give you a hard time - we're all just trying to help get your Little Prince's beak worn down a bit. (And I agree with you a hundred percent about the Vet problem. Not being able to tell his gender is as bad as not knowing what species he is!!! It just really is a huge red flag. )


If you feed in one terracotta saucer and have water in another it will be far better than doing anything else at the moment. The terracotta wears down nails and beaks. The saucers need to be big enough for your tortoise to turn around when sitting inside of (bigger is better ), and you need to countersink it into the substrate so that its easy to walk into and out of. Don't use one that was already used under a flower pot - they can absorb chemicals from the fertilizer that are not good for your tortoise to be exposed to.


Also, you said something about spraying his enclosure. That only produces droplets, not humidity. If you look at the size of his nostrils and the size of the droplets you can see how that is like throwing water in his face. It can cause respiratory problems. The other aspect of spraying is that it lands on the substrate surface and evaporates off, like a swamp cooler, and makes the enclosure cooler. Having the lowest half-inch to inch of coco coir saturated, and the upper three or four inches of orchid bark be relatively dry maintains humidity with a lot less effort and provides more balanced humidity.

Here are some of the Russian care sheets that may help. (Russians aren't fruit eaters - or rather, aren't able to digest it well.)

Russian Tortoise Care Sheet

Russian tortoises have great personalities, are very hardy, tolerate a wide variety of enclosure parameters, stay small, and are generally a good "starter" tortoise in my opinion. Here is how I like to set them up: Indoor Enclosure type and size: Most people want to know the minimum size...

tortoiseforum.org

Housing adult Russian and Hermans indoors

Hello there! In this thread I’m going to include some information an example of an appropriate indoor set up for an older Herman/russian. As much as it’s encouraged to have tortoises in a safe outdoor enclosure, I understand being from the uk myself, that some climates make it difficult to...

tortoiseforum.org

 

[RainsOn]

144 Grandpa Turtle, I really appreciate your short, direct comments and hate to be dense but, I stated that I was using slate and was told to use a tile. Isn't the patio floor slate? (When I think of tile, I think of porcelain.)

COmtnLady, Thank you for the detailed explanation of the terra cotta. I went and go them too small. Tonight I went and got the appropriate size. Great insight to the spraying - which is a new thing I started when I moved Digger out of an aquarium into a wooden box. The waterproof aquarium was deep so I did keep the bottom layer of substrate damp. With a shallow pan underneath, misting seemed to be the way to go. I am back to keeping the substrate damp.
I've read the care sheets and find a lot of conflicting advice on care and diet; even on this site. After 11 years watching Digger, getting advice and doing my own research, we've got a pretty good hold on most of this.
I stopped offering berries, Digger has no desire for any fruit.

 

[Cathie G]

144 Grandpa Turtle, I really appreciate your short, direct comments and hate to be dense but, I stated that I was using slate and was told to use a tile. Isn't the patio floor slate? (When I think of tile, I think of porcelain.)

COmtnLady, Thank you for the detailed explanation of the terra cotta. I went and go them too small. Tonight I went and got the appropriate size. Great insight to the spraying - which is a new thing I started when I moved Digger out of an aquarium into a wooden box. The waterproof aquarium was deep so I did keep the bottom layer of substrate damp. With a shallow pan underneath, misting seemed to be the way to go. I am back to keeping the substrate damp.
I've read the care sheets and find a lot of conflicting advice on care and diet; even on this site. After 11 years watching Digger, getting advice and doing my own research, we've got a pretty good hold on most of this.
I stopped offering berries, Digger has no desire for any fruit.

I have a Russian about 24 years old. He has his own room but is in an open enclosure. I keep the substrate moist but not wet. I like a humidifier in the room and keep the humidity around 40-60 percent. The best humidifier I've found is a Levoit. It's the easiest to clean and you can actually do an app on your phone to control it from anywhere. I don't use that feature because I'm usually home. My favorite part is how easy it is to clean . It keeps the whole room just right and comfortable with around a gallon of water a day in the winter. In the summer I don't need to use it. I don't know how old your tortoise is. If Digger is still a baby the care would be different.

 

[Cathie G]

I have a Russian about 24 years old. He has his own room but is in an open enclosure. I keep the substrate moist but not wet. I like a humidifier in the room and keep the humidity around 40-60 percent. The best humidifier I've found is a Levoit. It's the easiest to clean and you can actually do an app on your phone to control it from anywhere. I don't use that feature because I'm usually home. My favorite part is how easy it is to clean . It keeps the whole room just right and comfortable with around a gallon of water a day in the winter. In the summer I don't need to use it. I don't know how old your tortoise is. If Digger is still a baby the care would be different.

Also I changed Sapphire's feeding tile today too to a Terra Cotta plant dish. So I'm really glad this subject came up again. I just had to do a second beak trim and maybe this will make the difference he needs.

 

[RainsOn]

I have a Russian about 24 years old. He has his own room but is in an open enclosure. I keep the substrate moist but not wet. I like a humidifier in the room and keep the humidity around 40-60 percent. The best humidifier I've found is a Levoit. It's the easiest to clean and you can actually do an app on your phone to control it from anywhere. I don't use that feature because I'm usually home. My favorite part is how easy it is to clean . It keeps the whole room just right and comfortable with around a gallon of water a day in the winter. In the summer I don't need to use it. I don't know how old your tortoise is. If Digger is still a baby the care would be different.

Digger is around 20 years. Thanks for the info; never considered anything like this. Makes lots of sense but not with a retired husband who thinks the thermostat needs to be set a 71 degrees all the time. His shell is in good shape so I assume he is getting proper humidity.

 

[RainsOn]

Also I changed Sapphire's feeding tile today too to a Terra Cotta plant dish. So I'm really glad this subject came up again. I just had to do a second beak trim and maybe this will make the difference he needs.

I did a check before posting and found some old information that didn't directly answer my questions - and lacked a bit of detail. Digger is my first, and only tort, so I need the details. So many here are experts, they don't always realize a novice needs details. Good talk.

 

[Maggie3fan]

I mean slate like on your patio floor

that doesn't work...grazing generally fixes that...

 

[144 Grandpa Turtle]

Any flat stone surface will at least stop impaction While it sands down the beak

 

[Cathie G]

Well today I tried the terra cotta plant dish and Sapphire doesn't like it. I couldn't find a flat one so I'll have to find something different. He loves climbing on rocks but not necessarily his food tile. So I'm going to turn the old tile upside down until I do. It's rougher kind of like an emery board. I just worry that it's more porous and could harbor bacteria.

 

[Cathie G]

Digger is around 20 years. Thanks for the info; never considered anything like this. Makes lots of sense but not with a retired husband who thinks the thermostat needs to be set a 71 degrees all the time. His shell is in good shape so I assume he is getting proper humidity.

I'm not an expert on tortoise care at all. But something I did find out about a Russian and myself is that both of us need 40-60% humidity. In the winter months you can't believe how dry the air can get and that's not healthy for people let alone a tortoise. I've seen it at 2%. That's dry unhealthy air. My doctor loved it that I started using a couple of humidifiers in our home in the winter for our health. That's something having my little tortoise taught me. It's helped with my breathing also. I usually only try to keep it around 40-50%. 60% is getting high so just turn it down for awhile or off.

 

[Sarah2020]

All interesting and good ideas.
TOM: He eats well; lots of greens and some veggies. Does not like fruit.
I recently went over your care sheet and lighting is right.
Indoors he is misted frequently and get regular soaks. This Russian loves the water.
This year, our weather is rainy and cooler. He has been in more. Does not stay out since we saw a raccoon in the habitat at 4:00 am a couple weeks ago. (I have brought him in most nights this year due to cool rains. He was in this night.)
He has an outdoor run, 4 x 9 feet with water pool, hides and I plant in the spring: dandelion, cucumber, kale, succulents, etc. Different each year; some grows, some doesn't.
He is indoors in cooler weather and I brumated him last winter for the first time.
I am presently working on the indoor habitat to add a second story with ramp.
> I think my biggest problem is that I cut everything pretty small, except large leaves. I will get a tile and stop cutting the food. Will also change the water dish to terra cotta; presently using glazed clay.
> I will also get the dremmel out. I absolutely don't like the idea of any sedation.

Holding the tort in a towel may help you hold it. Shape your fingers in a v and that prevents the neck returning. Little at at time is the golden rule. Feed on a largish terracotta plant dish which acts like a nail file.