Beginner Questions

[arangno]

Hi Everyone,

We just brought our sulcata home this weekend, and after combing through many, many (MANY!) posts on this forum, I have a couple of beginner questions.

Our girl is 2 years old (according to her breeder) and just under 4 inches. The breeder told me to soak her in warm water for 30 minutes every other day, which I've been doing.

Her substrate right now is DRY, but after reading what Tom wrote about keeping a more humid environment, I'd like to give that a shot.

I was wondering, since she's not necessarily a hatchling anymore (right??), if I could separate her enclosure into a "dry" side and a "wet" side (her enclosure is a tortoise table, about 3 x 5 feet). I would do this by cutting a hole into the side of a large plastic box, filling it with damp coco coir, and placing it on one side of her enclosure (the "cool" side).

On the "dry" side I would have her basking spot, her water bowl, her food, etc.

Does this seem like a reasonable setup for her age and size?

ALSO:

We currently have a red ceramic bulb hanging over her table for her basking spot, and a heated reptile pad that is place underneath her table to keep it warm. I don't have a UVB light, because we planned to let her go outside in an enclosed playpen for at least an hour every day.

Is this enough for her UVB needs? I keep reading SUCH different things.

Thank you for any and all feedback!

 

[mainey34]

Well, unfortunately you cannot have damp and cold..this equals sickness..it does not seem to me that your tort would be 2 years old at 4 inches..maybe 1. Unless it was raised under poor. Conditions. Please post a pic of your tort . In this case I would not use a table at this point. You need humid enclosure.

 

[Tom]

Hello arangno.

They can reach twice that size by two years under optimal conditions. Most people don't keep them under optimal conditions in my opinion. But don't worry about this. Give her the best you can and she should grow up just fine.

Charmaine is correct about the humid hide. A humid hide is great, but it must be on the warm side. Your humid hide should not get cooler than 80 ever. Even at night when the lights are out.

You will need to clear up what you are using for lighting. Ceramic heating elements emit no light. If you are seeing red light, that is an incandescent bulb. I don't like colored bulbs. I think it makes things look funny to the tortoises. If your tortoise is getting regular sunshine, you can just use a regular incandescent flood bulb inside during the day. I like to put these on a 12 hour timer. Then I like to run a ceramic heating element or two on a thermostat to maintain ambient temps day and night. This leaves it dark at night, but still suitably warm.

The problem with an open topped table is that it is very difficult to keep the whole thing warm enough. You could run six bulbs over it, but then you'd be really drying things out which will significantly contribute to pyramiding. The best and easiest solution I have found is to use a closed chamber with all of the heating and lighting equipment inside. These are easy to keep warm and humid, day or night.

An hour of sun a day will meet your tortoise UV needs very well. No need for indoor artificial UV, if that is the case.

Even though your baby is two years old, she is still at the somewhat vulnerable hatchling size. Be careful with temps and hydration. She should really have a humid set up, which is near impossible in an open topped tortoise table. Once they hit 6-8" you can relax a bit with the wet routine, but yours isn't there yet.

Good luck. Hope this helps. Keep asking lots of questions.

 

[arangno]

Thanks so much for the responses Tom and Charmaine.

What if I put the heated reptile pad underneath the humid hide and monitored the humidity and temperature in there?

I will definitely switch out my red heating light for a regular flood light. Will the floodlight produce enough heat for a basking spot? Also, I'll definitely be getting a ceramic heating element. I looked on amazon and found one for $18, does that sound about right?

I'll take some more pictures of her tonight, but for now all I have is this one.

Her breeder seemed to know what she was doing, but who the heck knows. She told me that this sulcata was nearly two years old, but the more I looked around on this forum, the more I realized that she is wayyy too small to be 2 years old. I hope that the breeder was just exaggerating, and that this poor girl was not housed in poor conditions!

 

[L82lalaland]

She looks about the size of mine that are about 6 months old. A while back I bought another one from a pet store they said she was the same age as the two I raised from 3 weeks old but half the size. I learned you can't determine age by size. The pet store one is growing like a weed now I am sure yours will do the same. She is already off to a great start by having you as an owner. Just adorable. Congrats.

 

[Tom]

Heating pads can work, but I'm not comfortable using them. Too worried about over heating. If you do use it just monitor temps carefully. Several people here use them as part of an effective heating and lighting strategy.

$18 for a CHE is pretty cheap.

All breeders and long term keepers sound like they know what they are doing. They all read the same books and learned from the same experts. They all now read the same stuff on the Internet. The problem? All that info is based on incorrect assumptions and its WRONG. I know. I was in the same boat with them. It took me 20 years to figure it all out, but I got it now. When sulcata hatchlings are raised incorrectly, they grow slow and they pyramid. Your baby very well may be as old as she said it is. It's level of pyramiding tells me everything I need to know about what your breeder "knows". Look at her two year olds and then look at mine. Then just pick the result you want and copy that person's style.

When I say poor conditions, I am referring to the level of dryness primarily. Most breeders have the mistaken notion that sulcatas are desert animals. They keep them far too dry. They start them on rabbit pellets with no water bowl, rarely soak them, no humid hide, and these babies dehydrate. It kills their internal organs and causes them to grow very slowly and pyramid. Sulcatas are NOT a desert species. The babies hatch at the start of the rainy season. Their first three or four months are hot, rainy, wet, humid, marshy, and their is abundant food everywhere. They disappear into their food right after hatching. When the dry season arrives, the adults and juveniles retreat in to their extensive under ground burrow complexes. No one knows where the babies go or what they do. We DO know that if you simulate the African desert in captivity, they don't thrive and they pyramid. Simulate the African rainy season and they thrive, grow, and remain super smooth.

Your flood bulb should be fine for a basking spot. Adjust the height to get the right temperature, or adjust the wattage. Usually 65-100 watts works for most applications, but every enclosure is different. My goal is to maintain an ambient of 80 day and night, and then offer a 100 degree basking spot for 12 hours a day. This is most easily accomplished in a closed chamber.