Box Turtle with Large Scab on Face

nslimmo

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Hi all, I've had this three-toed box turtle for over a decade and never seen anything like this- after giving her a nightcrawler to eat I noticed she has a very large and deep scab hanging off around her nose area. She's had flaky skin from low humidity before but I've since fixed that. Any idea what could be happening here? Planning to put neosporin on it and keep her water very clean so I can avoid it getting infected
 

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nslimmo

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I'm guessing she might have scraped her face while trying to remove some food with her claws but really not sure
 

DoubleD1996!

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Keep it clean and it should be fine. You could put povidone iodine on it as well, but her beak is overgrown and kind of disfigured. They should look something like this.
 

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Yvonne G

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Probably nothing to worry about, but the over long beak IS a worry.
 

nslimmo

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Thanks for the quick responses. She's had the disfigured beak for many years due to a Vitamin A deficiency when I was a kid and first had her. The vet has always told me they can't trim the beak too much without hurting her due to the disfiguration...
I try feeding her on a slate rock to keep it down but it's still grown out somewhat since the last vet visit- any other suggestions?
 

TeamZissou

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This turtle most likely still has some nutritional deficiencies causing the beak overgrowth. IMO beak overgrowth is not a mechanical issue (such as eating off hard or soft surfaces) but rather improper or altered keratin synthesis due to calcium deficiency. I would most definitely trim the beak down to a normal shape so that the turtle can eat effectively. I would find a new vet who has experience with such trimming.

As for the scab, it looks like the scale (or entire section of epidermis) itself has separated and is lifting off. This could be nutritional as well.

What are you currently giving for supplements? If so, what products and at what frequency? Do you have UV lighting? How does the rest of the turtle look? Can you post a few pics?
 

nslimmo

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This turtle most likely still has some nutritional deficiencies causing the beak overgrowth. IMO beak overgrowth is not a mechanical issue (such as eating off hard or soft surfaces) but rather improper or altered keratin synthesis due to calcium deficiency. I would most definitely trim the beak down to a normal shape so that the turtle can eat effectively. I would find a new vet who has experience with such trimming.

As for the scab, it looks like the scale (or entire section of epidermis) itself has separated and is lifting off. This could be nutritional as well.

What are you currently giving for supplements? If so, what products and at what frequency? Do you have UV lighting? How does the rest of the turtle look? Can you post a few pics?
Got it- yeah I've always fed off hard surfaces and the beak grows out either way. Do you think a nail file would work for the beak? That's what I've seen others recommend.

My diet/supplement regimen is a rotation of veggies and greens for two feedings dusted with ZooMed Repti Calcium (w/ d3), then nightcrawlers for one feeding dusted with Repashy Calcium Plus. That might seem like a lot of supplementation but I've really been trying to make up for the nutritional deficits she had in the first 7-8 years of my care (I've had her about 13 years). Additionally she tends to be a really picky eater, which I think might be related to her possibly being wild caught - the pet store I originally got her from was not the best.

In terms of UVB I have 2 UVA/UVB emitting mercury vapor bulbs on either end of her stock tank. FYI I also have a high power humidifier that I added after I noticed she had issues with dry skin.

I've attached a pic below but I'd say her shell looks relatively normal? Let me know what you think- I've really tried to research and improve her care over the last few years but she's definitely still affected by my shortcomings early on.
 

TeamZissou

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The shell looks fairly normal.

The skin issue on the head could be a vitamin A overdose issue, which usually shows up as severe peeling skin and sometime scale loss. Do you see any other peeling skin aside from the primary area of concern? Repashy supplements have super high levels of vitamin A, which can cause overdose. Turtles are somewhat less likely to overdose on vitamin A given their more carnivorous diets, but if the turtle eats a lot of greens, it could happen. It's best not to overdo it with supplements; catching the turtle up over time is safer. What I would do is to to stop using the Repashy supplements altogether, and after several weeks/months (and seeing how the scale wound progresses) use Herptivite, which doesn't contain vitamin A, but rather beta carotene which is a safer form since it's a precursor to vitamin A.

Or, the scale problem could be an abscess or something that broke through. It's hard to tell from the pictures. Another possibility is a burn from the MVB if it's set too low/hot.

Have you measured the UV level coming out of the MVBs? Those bulbs have inconsistent UVB output and change over time. The height is also critical to dial in the UV level. Unless measuring with a Solarmeter 6.5, it's impossible to say if you're getting good, or too much UV output.

As for the beak, yes you could use a nail file, but in practice it's tough to get hold of a turtle's head, and tough to hold it for the lengthy amount of time needed to file. People usually use a Dremel and grinding stone to speed things up. It's good to have a helper to hold the turtle.
 

nslimmo

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The shell looks fairly normal.

The skin issue on the head could be a vitamin A overdose issue, which usually shows up as severe peeling skin and sometime scale loss. Do you see any other peeling skin aside from the primary area of concern? Repashy supplements have super high levels of vitamin A, which can cause overdose. Turtles are somewhat less likely to overdose on vitamin A given their more carnivorous diets, but if the turtle eats a lot of greens, it could happen. It's best not to overdo it with supplements; catching the turtle up over time is safer. What I would do is to to stop using the Repashy supplements altogether, and after several weeks/months (and seeing how the scale wound progresses) use Herptivite, which doesn't contain vitamin A, but rather beta carotene which is a safer form since it's a precursor to vitamin A.

Or, the scale problem could be an abscess or something that broke through. It's hard to tell from the pictures. Another possibility is a burn from the MVB if it's set too low/hot.

Have you measured the UV level coming out of the MVBs? Those bulbs have inconsistent UVB output and change over time. The height is also critical to dial in the UV level. Unless measuring with a Solarmeter 6.5, it's impossible to say if you're getting good, or too much UV output.

As for the beak, yes you could use a nail file, but in practice it's tough to get hold of a turtle's head, and tough to hold it for the lengthy amount of time needed to file. People usually use a Dremel and grinding stone to speed things up. It's good to have a helper to hold the turtle.
Hello, I just made a newer post on this site and realized I somehow never received a notification about this message! I assumed everyone stopped replying...

My boxie's doing a lot better now and the wound has completely healed up. I believe it was caused by a combination of overgrown nails and aggressive face scratching during a meal. As for supplements I've stopped using the Repashy for her protein and started adding some Herptivite and calcium supplement for every other veggie/greens feeding. In terms of lighting, I am trying to switch over to a UVB strip and heat bulb combo (this is is actually what my recent post was about - I'm sort of at a loss as to how to mount the strip haha).

Really appreciate the helpful advice and sorry for such a late response!
 

Ink

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Post a picture of the enclosure and light. Someone will be able to help.
 
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