Connie L
Member
He came out for a few so I measured him... actually he is just a hair under 5 inchs.
Crush
- Thread starter Connie L
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Welcome Connie and Crush! Happy tortkeeping!
The hole is great for him. My 17 year old does the same thing. You can wet it and that will make it humid and cooler for him. Another thing you can consider is using a mister.
Connie L
Member
Yep. I was concerned about the heat and how dry it is here so was glad to see he very quickly got to work on a hole under there. We are trying to figure out a way to get a mister into that area. The sprinkler system we have reachs "just" to the edge of that large yucca he has decided to take up residence under. We could adjust it so it does spray on it but it would be too much and the yucca would die. Lots of shade from it and the hole he is digging helps but yeah a mister sure would help. Might see to putting in another line on the system and can set that one on a different schedule then the one for the lawn. In the meantime Ive a large watering can that puts out a very fine stream and Im using it over there a couple of times a day.
Connie L
Member
Dinner time... then a good soak.
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I think he'll do fine. Where I live in California, it is also dry and hot, not quite as bad as Phoenix, but almost, and Charlie has done well here. I think the challenges we face are easier to overcome than those encountered by people trying to raise sulcatas in the North. There is probably more moisture in the ground than you realize. Charlie has always dug his burrows in areas where the sprinklers don't reach. You'll have to keep an eye on the digging. Sometimes they'll just a dig a hollow to lie in but other times they dig a full-fledged burrow, and when they do, they never stop making it bigger. If it is too close to plants, it could destroy the roots. Charlie has killed more than one plant.
Connie L
Member
Yep we figured we better keep an eye on just how much he is digging under there. When I dug out an area for him 2 days ago to put a good layer of organic garden soil on I was pretty surprised that it wasnt hard as a rock. Expected it to be. But then our neighbor has a raised garden right up against the block wall. She waters it often and the water goes thru into our yard there. First time he got in that area he went right to the large hole in the log and proceeded to start digging under it. Quit and wandered all around the yard and back to the yucca. Seems happy to be under there.
Personally, I would not leave a little one like that outside full time. I don't like to leave them outside full time until they are 8-10" at least. Some people in Phoenix get away with this with older tortoises, but many don't.
His burrow is allowing him to escape the intense heat of the day, but when fall sets in he is going to need some sort of heated shelter for over night and cooler winter days, and you'll have to block the burrow. Something like this: http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/another-night-box-thread.88966/
Please give these a read through:
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/how-to-raise-a-healthy-sulcata-or-leopard-version-2-0.79895/
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/for-those-who-have-a-young-sulcata.76744/
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/beginner-mistakes.45180/
His burrow is allowing him to escape the intense heat of the day, but when fall sets in he is going to need some sort of heated shelter for over night and cooler winter days, and you'll have to block the burrow. Something like this: http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/another-night-box-thread.88966/
Please give these a read through:
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/how-to-raise-a-healthy-sulcata-or-leopard-version-2-0.79895/
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/for-those-who-have-a-young-sulcata.76744/
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/beginner-mistakes.45180/
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Connie L
Member
Morning Tom! Thanks for the response. Ive read thru all those threads the past few days, as well as others about what to feed, etc.
Good information. Our neighbor (where this one wandered away from) has a large turtle house outside that has a heater in it. When we were discussing keeping the tort I purposedly asked him how he handles them in the winter months here as it can get very cold at night, even freezing. Doesn't last long, but it does happen. We have several neighbors with them so I've been talking with them about any concerns I have. We have several months to work out winter shelter and will definitely do so.
Morning Tom! Thanks for the response. Ive read thru all those threads the past few days, as well as others about what to feed, etc.
Sulcatas in AZ are like Desert tortoises here. Many people have been keeping them for years, and since their adult tortoises manage to survive, they think what they are doing is fine and recommend it to others. Survival should not be the goal. Thriving and providing "optimal" conditions, should be. You don't hear much from the people who did the same thing these others are doing and their tortoise didn't survive. I went through it here with a good friend of mine. He got the sulcata from a lady who "just left them outside in a horse barn". She didn't heat them and said they just "hibernated" in winter. He didn't listen to me when I told him the tortoise needed heat in winter and he lost his beloved tortoise.
Just something to consider.
Connie L
Member
Heck even I (as new as I am to this) know they do not hibernate and do need heat in the winter. Twas why I asked him how he was managing them. I wouldnt just toss him in a barn and "figure" he would make it. That's not cool. When my husband said he wanted to keep him I told him we cannot just toss him in the back yard and hope he survives. Ive been talking over all concerns/needs and trying to give him a better/safer environment over here. He has been, since hatched, outside with 15 other torts, many that are very large. Im kinda surprised he has even made it this long, especially after the really intense heat we had a couple of weeks ago (approaching 120 degrees) Has been here about a week now, has settled in nicely; eating really good, no pacing and seems pretty content. The only thing I cannot do is bring him into the house. There just is no room at all to do that. When he escaped where he was and came over here I had the choice of giving him back to the owner, or keeping him when offered. Im not so sure the little ones make it very well over there
Connie L
Member
Brian yes and I totally understand (and expect) that
I do get all he is saying, honestly. He is in a better place today then he was a week ago. We do have a lot to do to make sure that is even better.
Ordinarily, I would be too, but there is something unusual and almost magical about the way sulcatas and leopards react to the climate in the Phoenix AZ area. Even though it is dry there, many seem to grow smooth.
I've tried to plug in all sorts of variables to reach some sort of explanation, and so far, nothing sticks. Its too hot during the day there. I mean dangerously hot, like it could kill them, but it doesn't. They get summer monsoons, where we don't. Their summer nights are warmer than mine, but my torts are in heated night boxes. Our daytime highs and humidity are similar in summer, but I can tell just by looking a tortoise that was grown in SoCal vs. Phoenix.
In looking at your pic, I would feed him on a tray of some sort, or on the grass, to reduce the incidental intake of substrate.
Connie L
Member
Ive been putting it on a slate slab and moving it a little closer to the grass each day trying to get him to go to the lawn on his own.Ill find something better to do that on and put it in the rocks instead of right on the substrate. I figured if i just keep picking him up and taking him into the lawn he isnt going to do that right now... after I soak him I do put him in the shade in the lawn and leave him to roam the grass. He always goes along the edge and is becoming a good little lawn trimmer. Been making sure he gets mostly the Bermuda grass in our lawn to eat. A little piece of minced up prickly pear once in awhile. I can watch thru the slider to be sure he isnt getting into trouble. He has figured out a spot to get back across to his area. He just hasnt yet gone TO the grass on his own. Thanks Tom!
Connie L
Member
With him in our yard now Im watching the weather all the time and wishing the dew point/humidity and our monsoon would kick back up. Usually I dread the humidity but now I want it back lol
Connie L
Member
I moved the slate into the rocks and put rocks in front of it so its not in the substrate. Can move it a little toward the yard each day. Is easy enough to push along. Have some bigger pieces actually... will replace it with one of them. Gonna put a cover over the water as well so its not right in direct sunlight and put more rocks in front of it so the dirts not going in it.
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Connie L
Member
My plan is to rip that huge cactus and the small one out of that area and flatten the area (from outside both of the yuccas). Surround the area with a 4 ft high pool fence with boards around the bottom until he is so big he cant get thru the openings. Build him a house (with heat for the winter) in the corner, A grassy area, mud pit area and more plants that are tort safe. I can grow some things in pots on the patio as well. The controls and everything for our sprinkler system are just to the left of that area. We can hook up another line with a mister and put it on a different schedule then the lawn is. Should help solve a lot of the issues. Having 2 dogs (who in one week have learned to leave him alone) and a 2 year old grandson who spends a lot of time here I want him in his own space. We also have a workshop that we leave the door open to during the day and there are too many dangers in there for him as he gets more mobile. He is in a better space then he was a week ago and its going to get better.
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