Fridges!

[Sunshine]

Hi All

Just a question re fridge hibernation. Am going to my annual pre hibernation check up tomorrow with our reptile vet who's an advocate of fridge hibernation as the temps fluctuate up and down here in the UK over the winter. Does anyone else do it and any tips for us? Am scared to death so any advice welcome!

Very much appreciated
Helen & Herbie

 

[mainey34]

I will give you a bump to see if someone will chime in

 

[Sunshine]

Thankyou! Just been to the pre hibernation party and apparently everyone does it - feeling a bit better now but any advice if anyone's done it would be welcome!

 

[Terry Allan Hall]

Not an advocate of ever brumating (tortoise really don't hibernate in the true sese of the word) any pet tortoise...too many things can (and often do) go wrong!

It's absolutely optional and will not add anything to your tortoise's health...in almost 40 years, I've never brumated any of my tortoises, rather I bring them inside, keep them warm, feed them normally, and enjoy their company.

One advantage of "over-wintering" them is that you can monitor their health daily and catch any problems before they become life threatening.

Many tortoises have come out of brumation with health problems and some don't survive the experience, at all, so weigh the options carefully.

 

[CactusVinnie]

First, you put a probe thermometer in your fridge, to check how large are the amplitudes; it should oscillate only between 3-7*C, no way below or above! To be safe, wait for a week of stability, then proceed and put the animals in.

The accidents happen beyond your control, so, even if Hermanns can take even a few days of solid frozen state at -2...-4*C, you should set the safest limits at 3*C. Not sure if all individuals can take under 0*C, maybe only the fittest, and definitely depending on husbandry, to be closer to the wild. But you better not allow the slightest chance for the freezing to happen.

Usually, a good fridge will not play such bad taste jokes on you- so be careful to choose for hibernating tortoises the best one, not the old, disposable one!

A plastic box with a lid, some holes drilled in the lid and in the bottom, will do. Holes should not be that large, for instance for a 25x25x15cm box, a 2-3mm hole at every 5cm will do- we are not dealing with mammals! The bottom holes are intended to drain the CO2. Put some shredded newspaper on the bottom and sides, press it, then add paper-towels, and the soil-mix: it can be garden soil:cocos-fiber/peat:sand- 1:1:0,5, but sand no more than 1/4, even 1/5. Prepare and moisten the soil mix separately, and put it in the box after that. Mix, water a little, to be not dusty dry, but not too moist. You should feel the moisture by hand, but not getting wet from the mix. Put the tortoise, cover and press the lid.

There is no need of aquarium aerators pumping fresh air inside, with these holes drilled, it will be enough to open the fridge for 10 seconds every week. Perforated bottom will not allow CO2 build-up, and anyway, they can handle hypoxya very well when hibernating.

That is the last operation to do, and there are many variants. Until doing that final step:
Preparing the tortoises for hibernation is crucial- please let me know if you are new to hibernation.
Do not put tortoises in the fridge just like that, they should pass a gradual process of adjusting to cool temperatures, digest ALL food in the stomach and eliminate most of the faeces!

Waiting for your answer.

 

[Weldd]

I have hibernated Russian tortoises in the fridge for many years. Spotted turtles as well when I had them back in the day. I have them on dry cypress mulch/sandy soil mix and check on them periodically, soak them, etc.. I agree that they should be gradually cooled to allow them to move out any food they may have eaten.
I've never lost one of had any come out of hibernation ill...

 

[CactusVinnie]

Weld, did you soaked the Russians during hibernation?? Or the Spotted turtles? That would make sense.
Yes indeed, Russians prefer a little drier in hibernation compared to all Hermanni, wich is the most tolerant and even needs more moisture. Better not a woody aromatic essence like conifers, I would stay away from anything like that. Or I don't know the product, and the one you used does not emit fumes anymore, being practically dirt.

 

[Sunshine]

Thankyou so much everyone for your detailed responses, I love this forum and really apprecaite your time

Thanks Terry re Brumating too, this is my 1st hibernation for Herbie. Since the weekend I've had a themometer in the allocated fridge but it's ocillating between -5 and 0 degrees at the moment so won't consider this for hibernating Herbie.

Also Herbie has recently this year been indentified as a girl and we had her scanned at the weekend. I've since checked with the vet there are no eggs at the moment but her ovaries are producing follicles - my vet seems to think these will either be expelled or absorbed, they may influence her weight so this has made me question hibernating her or not.

Am going to keep monitoring the fridge, Herbie is definitely winding down in her own way as she has every other year. Am feeding her every other day at the moment, keeping her warm and bathing her every day.

I do appreciate your comments to thanks again!
Helen

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Also thanks Cactus Vinnie that's so helpful, I really appreciate it!!

 

[Terry Allan Hall]

Thankyou so much everyone for your detailed responses, I love this forum and really apprecaite your time

Thanks Terry re Brumating too, this is my 1st hibernation for Herbie. Since the weekend I've had a themometer in the allocated fridge but it's ocillating between -5 and 0 degrees at the moment so won't consider this for hibernating Herbie.

Also Herbie has recently this year been indentified as a girl and we had her scanned at the weekend. I've since checked with the vet there are no eggs at the moment but her ovaries are producing follicles - my vet seems to think these will either be expelled or absorbed, they may influence her weight so this has made me question hibernating her or not.

Am going to keep monitoring the fridge, Herbie is definitely winding down in her own way as she has every other year. Am feeding her every other day at the moment, keeping her warm and bathing her every day.

I do appreciate your comments to thanks again!
Helen

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Also thanks Cactus Vinnie that's so helpful, I really appreciate it!!

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One of my daughter's Box turtles started out as a Herbie, but now, particularily since laying 4 eggs, is an Alberta...

 

[Jacqui]

This is an article written by a friend of mine many years ago:

http://russiantortoise.net/hibernation_journey.htm

It's about Russians, but still it applies.

 

[Sunshine]

Thankyou!

I'll have a read of that now

I've just attached a picture of Herbie taken 4 weeks ago just as our Summer ended here in UK it shows her pre hibernation nicely

 

[CactusVinnie]

Sunshine, Jacqui

Article good enough, but a correction: 8 to 10 weeks is the minimum duration for a temperate Testudo, but for warmer locations as Middle East or N-Africa it can be that short, depending on origin. For all the rest- Ibera, Hermanni, Horsfieldi, 3-5 months long, complete duration is better. Even marginata are hibernate successfuly for 4 months, and even 5 by some keepers in Europe.
I did this with very late arrivals, that I considered healthy and fit enough to offer them a hibernation, but not knowing much about their husbandry (or knowing that it was not ok...) I preferred to shorten it, and leave the normal 4-5 months (for my area) one for the next year.
It is not at all advantageous that for only 8-10 weeks sleep to subject the animal to the effort of wind-down. That is A. Highfield approach, and I find it making sense.