Hatchling Set Up - Advice?

[Vet]

Hey everyone,

I've been reading around the forum for the past month or so in preparation for my sulcata hatchling. I love all herps but have mostly owned lizards in the past. I've always been attracted to tortoises but I never had the space I felt they deserved. After following around my friend who is a herp keeper at the Oklahoma City Zoo, getting to handle the baby galaps and feed the giant galapagos tortoises, I became even more hooked! Thanks to all of you experienced keepers I have been able to find the right information!

Now for my first hatchling set up... we decided to start with a 55 gallon tub. My substrate is eco-earth on top and organic topsoil with some sand blended in underneath. The temperatures are correct according to your care sheets... I use a temp gun, not the crappy thermometer that's in there. Everything is on timers and dimmers... Looking into thermostats.

As far as the arrangement of things --where would you all suggest placing the humid hide, etc? Or what would you remove? I am thinking it's too crowded. Any feedback is much appreciated! My little guy arrives tomorrow from Arizona Tortoise Compound... he hatched the middle of May. I am hoping to do everything right!

My fiance is extremely handy so we will be building a large indoor enclosure when needed as well as an outdoor of course. To start with he built an extremely secure outdoor enclosure that when the tortie outgrows (which I'm expecting to be very soon!), the bearded dragon will take it over on nice days. My Great Danes had to oversee the work of course!

Any and all feedback much appreciated!!!

 

[Yvonne G]

Hi, and welcome to the Forum! Have you read the "Important Threads" at the top of the Sulcata section?

 

[Dizisdalife]

Welcome to the forum. I like that you have researched and prepared a home before your hatchling arrived. When my sulcata was a baby I like to keep the hide in the corner. It was on the periphery of the basking spot and stayed around 85°F most of the time. Also, the hide was filled with coir and moss to keep the humidity as high as possible. I placed a water container on top of the hide to add extra moisture to the enclosure, but also to block some of the light and make the hide dark. The plastic I used to make the hide was not clear, although I don't think that matters. I never like the 1/2 logs in my enclosure. They take up too much room and my hatchling would climb on it and flip himself over. Keep an eye out for that. Keep asking questions and you will get lots of help.

 

[DeanS]

I'm going to nitpick a little! Nothing personal...just my (tried and true) opinion. I'd prefer that tub be larger...and completely enclosed...i.e. no screen on top. The coir is a great idea...and preferred...I go so far as to blend it with coconut bark. I'd lose the topsoil (and especially the sand) immediately. As far as the hide goes...I'd like to see it solid (light/transparent don't give a secure feeling). For the first six months or so...85F plus is perfect...save the 100F temps for a yearling! Normally, I'd trash that enclosure as being unfit...but given the natural humidity in OKC...I won't say much...other than it is a nice build...but it would be more suited to a colony of chameleons Good luck...I'm raising a trio of Ivory sulcata hatchlings...and documenting their upbringing here on the forum. Check it out...

http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/ivory-sulcata-thread-aladars-babies-ultra-photo-heavy.92212/

 

[Vet]

*Yvonne G - Thank you! Yes, I believe I have read all of them - very helpful information!

*Dizisdalife - Thanks! The half log has definitely been removed and yes it took up way too much room and my hatchling did flip himself over. Thank you for the water on top of the humid hide idea! I will do that. I am still needing to bump my humidity a bit to get it to the 80%.

*DeanS - Thanks for the information! I take criticism well when it's for the benefit of my animals.

Aside from the tub being on the small size... Would covering the top area where the screen is with something like foil or metal essentially be the same as 'enclosed'? Please correct if I am wrong! I did not think the small opening around the fixtures would matter, but thanks for pointing that out. Surprisingly the humidity has been extremely high in OK recently and my humidity is in the 70s in the enclosure. I am finding it has taken far too much work to just keep it at 70. Looking into enclosing options/fogger... etc.

Does coco coir = eco earth? I am for sure dumping the top soil and sand tomorrow and going all eco earth/coconut coir. My humidity is a bit lower than I expected considering how much I've sprayed everything down today.

As far as the hide... I had a black dishwashing tub (read about it on here) and it is enormous compared to my teeny tiny 3wk old hatchling..not very "enclosed" or "safe" feeling at all... The CD case was the only small one I could find - in fact it being clear did throw up a yellow flag for me. I have since covered it with quite a bit of moss, inside & out.

Temps: I thought I had been reading that a 100-110 basking spot is ideal for hatchlings? I am 80 on the cool side. My warmest area is 85 at night.

The little guy is doing great so far other than flipping over on everything this morning. He seems to have stopped that since I rearranged everything to being in the middle. He looks TINY in this tub and is much smaller than I expected. He chomps at the grass, mazuri, dandelions hay, etc, loves to play around in the water dish (took 2 enormous poos in it of course) and has roamed around, basked, napped... loves being sprayed. Very happy with him! I will continue to edit my care techniques and of course a much larger enclosure is in the works. Unfortunately when we build, we want it to be so large that it will not fit in the house, but our shop. Luckily we have an insulated/heated/cooled shop out back that will be perfect for him. I wanted to keep him in my home near me so I can keep an extra close eye on him in the beginning. I was thinking the 55 gal tub would be sufficient for the tiny guy for now... but will make the larger enclosure more urgent now.

 

[Vet]

Oh and thanks for the link! I will for sure check it out!

Megan

 

[Tom]

When the lights and stuff are on top and outside it creates a chimney effect where they hot air around the bulbs and fixtures rises drawing your warm humid air up and out into the room, while sucking cooler drier air into the enclosure. This is why your humidity is lower than you were expecting. When you make a large closed chamber with the lights and heating elements contained INSIDE the enclosure things get MUCH easier and more efficient.

A 50 is okay for a little hatchling, but I prefer larger for just the reasons you are noticing.

The black dishwashing tubs as humid hides work great for hatchlings. He will grow into it. (And out of it sooner than you think.)

Yes. Coco coir = Eco Earth.

About the basking temps: This is an area of debate and an area that we are learning more about as time goes on. Incandescent basking bulbs are EXTREMELY desiccating. They dry out the carapace and greatly contribute to pyramiding. They are (for now) a seemingly necessary evil, but we are always looking for ways to improve the situation. Dean is trying out a different technique with his babies. I look forward to the day when we have this all figured out, but for now we still need a basking source. The high humidity, hydration, shell spraying, humid hides, and closed chambers are all means of combating this desiccation.

 

[DeanS]

*DeanS - Thanks for the information! I take criticism well when it's for the benefit of my animals.

Aside from the tub being on the small size... Would covering the top area where the screen is with something like foil or metal essentially be the same as 'enclosed'? Please correct if I am wrong! I did not think the small opening around the fixtures would matter, but thanks for pointing that out. Surprisingly the humidity has been extremely high in OK recently and my humidity is in the 70s in the enclosure. I am finding it has taken far too much work to just keep it at 70. Looking into enclosing options/fogger... etc.

Does coco coir = eco earth? I am for sure dumping the top soil and sand tomorrow and going all eco earth/coconut coir. My humidity is a bit lower than I expected considering how much I've sprayed everything down today.

As far as the hide... I had a black dishwashing tub (read about it on here) and it is enormous compared to my teeny tiny 3wk old hatchling..not very "enclosed" or "safe" feeling at all... The CD case was the only small one I could find - in fact it being clear did throw up a yellow flag for me. I have since covered it with quite a bit of moss, inside & out.

Temps: I thought I had been reading that a 100-110 basking spot is ideal for hatchlings? I am 80 on the cool side. My warmest area is 85 at night.

The little guy is doing great so far other than flipping over on everything this morning. He seems to have stopped that since I rearranged everything to being in the middle. He looks TINY in this tub and is much smaller than I expected. He chomps at the grass, mazuri, dandelions hay, etc, loves to play around in the water dish (took 2 enormous poos in it of course) and has roamed around, basked, napped... loves being sprayed. Very happy with him! I will continue to edit my care techniques and of course a much larger enclosure is in the works. Unfortunately when we build, we want it to be so large that it will not fit in the house, but our shop. Luckily we have an insulated/heated/cooled shop out back that will be perfect for him. I wanted to keep him in my home near me so I can keep an extra close eye on him in the beginning. I was thinking the 55 gal tub would be sufficient for the tiny guy for now... but will make the larger enclosure more urgent now.

 

[Vet]

Thanks Tom and everyone for your replies. We have since gotten a humidifier that we used a hose through a dremeled hole in the side of the enclosure to direct it. It brought the humidity up incredibly high -- maybe even too high? Upper 90's after being on only a bit -- temps stayed perfect. The condensation from the side and lid drips down and keeps everything nice and moist. Not to mention this guy soaks himself all the time....absolutely loves his saucer water dish. Going to get a timer for the humidifier to come on every hour. Will definitely do a FULLY enclosed enclosure next... and a large one at that. I will post pics of the adorable little guy soon. He is thriving!

If anyone knows the cheapest way to get large amounts of coconut coir please let me know. I'm sure you guys go through a LOT with all your large enclosures.

 

[Dizisdalife]

If anyone knows the cheapest way to get large amounts of coconut coir please let me know. I'm sure you guys go through a LOT with all your large enclosures.

If you spot clean it will last a long time. Long enough for this guy to become a full time outdoor dweller. I originally bought a little more than I needed. About six months later I took it all out of the enclosure and baked it for 45 minutes. I just repeated this process when it was necessary. Oh, I bought the coir at LLL Reptile. They have a store about 2 miles from me. Very convenient.

 

[Vet]

Thanks for the info! Makes sense...mine has only defecated in the water dish so far.

 

[DeanS]

I'm still using the same two bricks of coir...and 5 qt bag of bark that I've been using for four years now! NO BUGS! NO MOLD! NO BS! In regards to high humidity...no such thing! If you can get it to 100%...GREAT! At that point, make sure your temps don't slip below 85F...no cooler...anywhere!

 

[Vet]

Awesome! Thanks for the info.

 

[DeanS]

This is how I have the ITs set-up...the last post in the thread shows pictures and explanation...

http://www.tortoiseforum.org/thread...aladars-babies-ultra-photo-heavy.92212/page-6