icky belly

[Bea]

This is Flash....his tummy shell is REALLY soft, discolored and has almost dry wrinkles in it. He's eating & drinking very well, stool is a bit loose by not unusually so. He has started this little odd almost bark like noise randomly(Im aware I sound bonkers). This dry wrinkle is only on his tummy. His top shell is bright and healthy looking(not a single unusual spot). I'm googlfooing the crap out of tortoise 'issues' and it doesn't look like shell rot at all(no white/smell/peeling nothing like that). I did change the bedding to ReptiBark a week ago, but no other changes. HELP!

 

[dmmj]

they are born with soft pliable shells, so it is not a concern unless the shell is getting softer than it previously was. descriptions and pictures of the enclosure will help temperature humidity things like that.

 

[Tom]

What substrate were you using before? Did you keep it wet for humidity? That looks like a raging case of shell rot to me.

 

[Jacqui]

I agree with Tom. Can you give us details on how you have his environment set up please.

 

[Jacqui]

P.S. love the red on those legs!

 

[Bea]

I have a 75gal tank I'm currently redoing for him, but as of now he's just a little fella and seems happy in his little digs. His current 20gal home is set up w reptibark(used aspen before)I don't moisten it at all, 2 terra cotta pots(halved) on their side as his caves and a dish that he feeds in and I put water in when he is done eating. It's not big enough for him to get in and soak, just feeding/watering. He also has a dual heat(75w)/UVB(15w)light-the temp says 80.

 

[Randi]

I agree with Tom, that's definitely shell rot. You will need to start treating it immediately. For the treatment - you initially start with Betadine but you must only use it for a scrub or two. You can use a toothbrush to scrub the plastron. Betadine inhibits new skin growth so it's not wise to use it more then once or twice. After the one to two Betadine scrubs, you will then start scrubbing with Chlorhexidine every day to every second day. After the scrubs, an ointment like Athletes Foot cream or Clotrimazole 1% must be applied. The cream must be allowed to dry completely. I find that it's easiest to keep them in a container while it's drying - once dry, you can put them back in the enclosure. This treatment must be given until the shell rot goes away and although you may not see it, to be on the safe side, I would continue treatment for a few weeks to a month after it's visibly gone. Please understand that treating shell rot can take months, even longer depending on how severe. It will not magically disappear overnight. Other then treating, you will need to figure out why it's happening. Generally the top layer of substrate is too moist. If you could post pictures of the enclosure as well as any other details, we will hopefully be able to offer more assistance. Best of luck to you and yours.

 

[Bea]

Dang it! I've had him for 2mths and his underbelly was like that when I got him. The 'breeder' said it was a normal baby red footed tummy and to just keep him dry. No treatment, no care, just keep him dry....so, because I'm a dummy, I believed him and listened to his instruction. Now I feel terrible for Flash. I've NEVER moistened his substrate. I change it often so he's not able to burrow in his piddle spot too. Would ketoconizole be a good cream for him? Do I stop bath time for a bit? I've read it's about moisture and that it smells terrible; but he's SO dry and has no smell at all. I'll do anything to keep him healthy, so any input is so greatly appreciated!

 

[MPRC]

Poor Flash! Looks like you're going to get to play doctor for a while.

Here's a shot of my little one's belly, she's a little dirty and practically lives in her soaking dish but we haven't had any issues.



And this is my big guy:

 

[Randi]

There's a strong possibility that this occurred where your baby was born and raised. I understand what you're going through - I had a similar situation occur but I was aware of the issue. My friend worked at a Petsmart and was dealing with a Cherry Head that had severe shell rot, wasn't eating for 6 months and was only offered carrots and kale, and no soaks whatsoever. After over six months in a sick room in a 5 gallon tank with soaking wet soil, the store didn't want to house her or spend any more money. They were going to euthanize her. They were giving her a week to find a home. My friend gave me the heads up so I went to the store to check her out. She was in rough shape and I'm surprised she wasn't dead. I adopted her out and started treating as soon as she was home. Mine smelled so bad that sometimes I almost threw up. I at least had knowledge of what was going on and why she needed a home. It's sad that you didn't know there was something wrong until now. Of course you had a feeling that something wasn't right, which is great. All you can do now is take it for what it is and repair it. I treated mine for 9 months, maybe more. She has some scarring left located in the places on her plastron that were the worst.

I have no personal experience with that cream so I can't advise you on that. However, I've had great success with Clotrimazole 1%.
Do not stop doing your daily (I hope) soaks, they still need them. I would wake up in the morning, soak for at least a half an hour (the longer the better) and then feed. Then I would do another long soak later in the evening. Then I would feed after the soak. Then I would wait until they've had enough to eat. I'd soak again, then I'd starting scrubbing with Chlorhexidine, wait for it to dry and then I'd apply the Athlete's Foot Cream or Clotrimazole 1%. I wouldn't wait until after the treatment to feed as they will be stressed and probably won't eat until they relax. After treatments they may hide away for a few hours and then they are calmed down enough to eat and be happy. Soon the treatment won't even phase them.. Mine started eating after being treated a few weeks into treating. As for smell, I don't think every tort or turt with shell rot will smell. Some do, some don't. You seem willing to do what you can. You'll be fine and your tort will be fine also. Best of luck to you and yours

 

[AnimalLady]

Poor Flash! Looks like you're going to get to play doctor for a while.

Here's a shot of my little one's belly, she's a little dirty and practically lives in her soaking dish but we haven't had any issues.



And this is my big guy:

I love your torts, they're gorgeous girl!

 

[AnimalLady]

Here's a shot of my little guys belly. He's about a year old. Wanted to show you for reference.

No worries, just follow the instructions Randi gave and you should be good. I don't think it was anything to do with how you're keeping him if he came to you already like that. Its a fungus, so it will continue to grow and spread once it starts....I have started to put a little bit of Athlethes Foot cream on my guys belly for "prevention". Ive read that Redfoots especially are prone to shell rot, so I'm trying to avoid it at all costs. I believe Alaska Mike was the one to mention him using it for prevention and I liked the idea of that so I followed suit..

Good luck with your little one! Keep us updated!

 

[Bea]

Thanks for all the info everyone! Flash got his first scrub-a-dub brushing and then cream massage the his morning. I don't think he was too happy w me, but it had to be done. He did get his revenge though....he pooped all over my arm. I used the ketoconizole, as its just a stronger bacterial/fungal cream. I'm going to keep changing out his bedding and move his soaks to every other day for a few days. I'll leave his small water dish for drinking and I'll syringe drop hi water, but no drowning allowed for a bit. I'll update & pic in a few days for some more feedback on progress. Thanks heaps again for help w Flash!!

 

[GRohr]

@AnimalLady How often do you apply it as a preventative measure?

 

[MPRC]

View attachment 157357

I know this pose well. it says, "Flip me back over dang it!!"

 

[AnimalLady]

@AnimalLady How often do you apply it as a preventative measure?

Once a month, I've had him for such a short period, I've only done it once lol, but the plan is once a month and a little bit.

 

[AnimalLady]

I know this pose well. it says, "Flip me back over dang it!!"

Exactly what it says lol!!

 

[Randi]

Thanks for all the info everyone! Flash got his first scrub-a-dub brushing and then cream massage the his morning. I don't think he was too happy w me, but it had to be done. He did get his revenge though....he pooped all over my arm. I used the ketoconizole, as its just a stronger bacterial/fungal cream. I'm going to keep changing out his bedding and move his soaks to every other day for a few days. I'll leave his small water dish for drinking and I'll syringe drop hi water, but no drowning allowed for a bit. I'll update & pic in a few days for some more feedback on progress. Thanks heaps again for help w Flash!!

Sorry, I was going to reply sooner but my dog had surgery this morning so I've been consumed with making sure he's ok, as he almost passed away last time he went under. Torts and turtles aren't happy when flipped - I think they panic and that's why they unload fecal matter all over us. I think that in the wild, flipping would be a death sentence - you get stuck or you're in a vulnerable position where it's easier to eat you. Mine always pooped on me whenever I'd treat. She also sometimes would kick her little foot back and forth, as if it tickled or felt good. Maybe it was irritating. Good to know about the cream, thanks for the info! I would take a picture and do an update in a week or two, there will most likely be a noticeable improvement then. You're doing great.

As per preventative treatment, I believe the Chlorhexidine scrubs can be given weekly or you could use the Clotrimazole 1% cream. I find the scrub is easier and more beneficial as it sanitizes the area whereas I find the cream is more to treat an affected area - they also dry a lot faster after a scrub vs. the cream so they aren't as stressed as long.