Indoor enclosure idea? Possible?

[Liljae9263]

So I was doing research on how I could make Franklin a new bigger enclosure and I would love some feedback! I am in a small apartment and my dream was to get him his own room however, like a punch to the gut, I have come to realize I simply can’t afford a second room anytime soon.

SO my plan now is to somehow move Franklin into the bedroom with me as it should give more room for a bigger enclosure. (Rn he’s in like a small hallway with the water heater so not a lot of room to grow in there) If I can move him in with me it also would make it easier to heat us BOTH in the winter (I’ll buy a space heater for the room) and it opens up that little hallway for MORE STORAGE . Which turns out is a luxury in a small apartment so I’m excited for that! The whole transfer will be a feat of its own though so we’ll have to cross that bridge when we get there.

So while doing research I came across the concept for a double decker enclosure and wondered if that was actually doable for me. Ik other people have done it but I HAVE NO BUILDING SKILLS WHATSOEVER. Literally don’t know how to use a drill. I would love to learn tho! (I’m sure my folks will have to help me with this project regardless but I’m hoping to take care of most of it myself so I need to know HOW to do this logically. And what to buy.)

That said, with my limited knowledge I made this “blueprint”. I’ve found some cheap bookshelves online and I’m thinking that could make a good base. I’m assuming I’ll have to buy a piece of plywood and then some additional prices of wood to add to the bottoms (or backs) of the shelves for additional support for all the weight of dirt and decor since normally those r made of thin cardboard. I also kinda wanna have this on legs. I don’t like the idea of the whole things sitting directly on the ground but ik that complicates it more. At the v least I might buy something to put under the enclosure bc it’ll be sitting on carpet when in my room and for clean up it might help to have something like a hard plastic flooring underneath ?? I also will prob have to line both layers with a pond liner to keep from the dirt molding the wood. Altho most bookshelves I find say waterproof?? Idk if that changes that. Maybe it’s safe to still do the liner. And I may have to somehow make high sides on the shelves as well so Franklin can’t climb out . I really hope not but I have a feeling probably.

Not exactly sure how to attach the top bookshelf and make it supportive of the weight ? Also wondering if I should try to find a smaller bookshelf for the top or get the exact same size ? Same size gives more room but idk if it’s more of a hassle to stack.

I’m not sure how much humidity Franklin still needs but I like the idea of him having the option of an enclosed space even when he gets older just in case. So I’m thinking for the front of the bottom layer having two doors on a hinge like his current enclosure has (honestly might be able to reuse them from the old enclosure) and then get a tarp to line the sides of the bottom layer to hold in the humidity. (I was thinking of getting a clear tarp so he can see out but I’ve also heard if they can see out of their enclosures they go crazy. BUT I also know Franklin loves to look around and observe. So idk which is best! Plz someone let me no! Rn he’s in a completely closed off enclosure, cant see out.)

The top layer would be uncovered so humidity couldn’t be controlled but he could come out and observe the room or me if he pleased Ig ?? I honestly don’t no what to do for the top layer decorating wise. I’m not sure how much space the ramp I’ll have to make will take up either so not sure how much room I’ll be working with on the bottom layer. :/ I’m hoping to give lots of hide room but I’m not sure how it’ll actually work!

Also know I’ll have to buy more lights for the top layer (so expensive) do I need 2 UVB’s or is one on the bottom ok? That’s my most expensive light so I kinda don’t wanna have to buy two if I can help it! Like do I need the exact same setup for the top layer or is just a basking ok ?? Idk. I mean the bottom layer will have all the lights and temp/humidity regulation he needs so he can go there for that. Idk how set up the top should be. Plz help!

Most bookshelves I’m finding r 5 ft by 2 ft so double that is 10 x 4. Not as wide as I wanted for him :/ but it’ll be more than he has now if he ever get confident enough to use the ramp! I’m trying to make the best out of my situation!

The goal is to give him more enrichment and more room. Hopefully I can also finally add real plants to the enclosure but we’ll see. I’m still struggling on that front. Hoping to go out and buy some plants this weekend to start prepping. )

This project will prob take a LONG time to actually see to fruition as I’m tight on cash and will be for a while (got a new job and won’t get a raise for at least 3 months. ) for now I’m researching, planning, and maybe moving my room around to make room for new things. Then I’ll slowly buy the things one by one when I can afford it. THEN it’ll be set up and move in day

I want to make sure everything is all planned out b4 I spend the cash tho so I would love to no what yall think! Anyone who has had a double decker enclosure have any tips? How did it work for u and ur tort ?

I’m bad at knowing how things will logically work, esp when it comes to big items as I’m size blind. I would look at a 2 ft box and think a 4 ft item could fit in it until I physically saw it ain’t gonna work haha. I’m a v visual person so trying to map this out is TOUGH.

Also side question: can I use organic soil for his dirt bc the cococoir I buy now is SO EXPENSIVE. It’ll prob cost as much as the enclosure itself to fill both layers like that. Ik it prob won’t hold humidity as well but DANG.

For now Franklin seems happy with what he has but I feel like I’m failing him again. That nagging little voice telling me to do better so I wanna start on this now since ik it’ll take a long time. one day I just know he’ll have an amazing set up and be the happiest little tort. And I can’t wait for that day! I’m so impatient for it haha. But we gotta take baby steps so *I* dont go insane. One day at a time

 

[zovick]

View attachment 399060

So I was doing research on how I could make Franklin a new bigger enclosure and I would love some feedback! I am in a small apartment and my dream was to get him his own room however, like a punch to the gut, I have come to realize I simply can’t afford a second room anytime soon.

SO my plan now is to somehow move Franklin into the bedroom with me as it should give more room for a bigger enclosure. (Rn he’s in like a small hallway with the water heater so not a lot of room to grow in there) If I can move him in with me it also would make it easier to heat us BOTH in the winter (I’ll buy a space heater for the room) and it opens up that little hallway for MORE STORAGE . Which turns out is a luxury in a small apartment so I’m excited for that! The whole transfer will be a feat of its own though so we’ll have to cross that bridge when we get there.

So while doing research I came across the concept for a double decker enclosure and wondered if that was actually doable for me. Ik other people have done it but I HAVE NO BUILDING SKILLS WHATSOEVER. Literally don’t know how to use a drill. I would love to learn tho! (I’m sure my folks will have to help me with this project regardless but I’m hoping to take care of most of it myself so I need to know HOW to do this logically. And what to buy.)

That said, with my limited knowledge I made this “blueprint”. I’ve found some cheap bookshelves online and I’m thinking that could make a good base. I’m assuming I’ll have to buy a piece of plywood and then some additional prices of wood to add to the bottoms (or backs) of the shelves for additional support for all the weight of dirt and decor since normally those r made of thin cardboard. I also kinda wanna have this on legs. I don’t like the idea of the whole things sitting directly on the ground but ik that complicates it more. At the v least I might buy something to put under the enclosure bc it’ll be sitting on carpet when in my room and for clean up it might help to have something like a hard plastic flooring underneath ?? I also will prob have to line both layers with a pond liner to keep from the dirt molding the wood. Altho most bookshelves I find say waterproof?? Idk if that changes that. Maybe it’s safe to still do the liner. And I may have to somehow make high sides on the shelves as well so Franklin can’t climb out . I really hope not but I have a feeling probably.

Not exactly sure how to attach the top bookshelf and make it supportive of the weight ? Also wondering if I should try to find a smaller bookshelf for the top or get the exact same size ? Same size gives more room but idk if it’s more of a hassle to stack.

I’m not sure how much humidity Franklin still needs but I like the idea of him having the option of an enclosed space even when he gets older just in case. So I’m thinking for the front of the bottom layer having two doors on a hinge like his current enclosure has (honestly might be able to reuse them from the old enclosure) and then get a tarp to line the sides of the bottom layer to hold in the humidity. (I was thinking of getting a clear tarp so he can see out but I’ve also heard if they can see out of their enclosures they go crazy. BUT I also know Franklin loves to look around and observe. So idk which is best! Plz someone let me no! Rn he’s in a completely closed off enclosure, cant see out.)

The top layer would be uncovered so humidity couldn’t be controlled but he could come out and observe the room or me if he pleased Ig ?? I honestly don’t no what to do for the top layer decorating wise. I’m not sure how much space the ramp I’ll have to make will take up either so not sure how much room I’ll be working with on the bottom layer. :/ I’m hoping to give lots of hide room but I’m not sure how it’ll actually work!

Also know I’ll have to buy more lights for the top layer (so expensive) do I need 2 UVB’s or is one on the bottom ok? That’s my most expensive light so I kinda don’t wanna have to buy two if I can help it! Like do I need the exact same setup for the top layer or is just a basking ok ?? Idk. I mean the bottom layer will have all the lights and temp/humidity regulation he needs so he can go there for that. Idk how set up the top should be. Plz help!

Most bookshelves I’m finding r 5 ft by 2 ft so double that is 10 x 4. Not as wide as I wanted for him :/ but it’ll be more than he has now if he ever get confident enough to use the ramp! I’m trying to make the best out of my situation!

The goal is to give him more enrichment and more room. Hopefully I can also finally add real plants to the enclosure but we’ll see. I’m still struggling on that front. Hoping to go out and buy some plants this weekend to start prepping. )

This project will prob take a LONG time to actually see to fruition as I’m tight on cash and will be for a while (got a new job and won’t get a raise for at least 3 months. ) for now I’m researching, planning, and maybe moving my room around to make room for new things. Then I’ll slowly buy the things one by one when I can afford it. THEN it’ll be set up and move in day

I want to make sure everything is all planned out b4 I spend the cash tho so I would love to no what yall think! Anyone who has had a double decker enclosure have any tips? How did it work for u and ur tort ?

I’m bad at knowing how things will logically work, esp when it comes to big items as I’m size blind. I would look at a 2 ft box and think a 4 ft item could fit in it until I physically saw it ain’t gonna work haha. I’m a v visual person so trying to map this out is TOUGH.

Also side question: can I use organic soil for his dirt bc the cococoir I buy now is SO EXPENSIVE. It’ll prob cost as much as the enclosure itself to fill both layers like that. Ik it prob won’t hold humidity as well but DANG.

For now Franklin seems happy with what he has but I feel like I’m failing him again. That nagging little voice telling me to do better so I wanna start on this now since ik it’ll take a long time. one day I just know he’ll have an amazing set up and be the happiest little tort. And I can’t wait for that day! I’m so impatient for it haha. But we gotta take baby steps so *I* dont go insane. One day at a time

Unfortunately, if the top layer is not a closed chamber, you will lose all the humidity from the bottom section through the ramp opening to the upper level. I know you are trying, but this whole project would just be a costly exercise in futility.

 

[jeff kushner]

My friend, those of us who cannot "build", learn to "repurpose" and we do so quite well!

Above is a response from one of the sharpest tools in the tortoise forum toolbox. My suggestion is that despite your wants, you pay attention. It will likely save you a world of frustration.

What species is Franklin? Great big plastic bins come with humidity trapping, light holding covers. Don't care what it looks like, Franky won't. Who's gonna see it but your mom and lovers and they won't care either. A plywood base allows you to screw multiple bins onto a single piece so you can join them with a razor knife and flexseal tape.....just spitballing but you get the idea.

Good luck....but remember KISS. You seem to get too detailed....lol

 

[Liljae9263]

My friend, those of us who cannot "build", learn to "repurpose" and we do so quite well!

Above is a response from one of the sharpest tools in the tortoise forum toolbox. My suggestion is that despite your wants, you pay attention. It will likely save you a world of frustration.

What species is Franklin? Great big plastic bins come with humidity trapping, light holding covers. Don't care what it looks like, Franky won't. Who's gonna see it but your mom and lovers and they won't care either. A plywood base allows you to screw multiple bins onto a single piece so you can join them with a razor knife and flexseal tape.....just spitballing but you get the idea.

Good luck....but remember KISS. You seem to get too detailed....lol

He’s a Hermanns. About 2 years old

 

[Liljae9263]

Unfortunately, if the top layer is not a closed chamber, you will lose all the humidity from the bottom section through the ramp opening to the upper level. I know you are trying, but this whole project would just be a costly exercise in futility.

He’s 2 years old now so idk if he still needs high humidity like he did when he was a baby. Tom has told me he’s basically done growing (tho I do see new growth on his shell slowly coming in). I just wanted the option of a section with slightly higher humidity.

However could I make a little hut/hide over the ramp opening on the top to help keep in humidity more? Ik I would still lose humidity thro the opening of the hide but it should help trap it having a top over it instead of a full opened top right ? Just spit ballin here.

 

[Liljae9263]

@Littleredfootbigredheart im just curious what ur thoughts r on this! Hope u not mind the tag! I got the inspo from ur enclosure ideas post!

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Hello!
1. You may also consider getting a bunk bed and making a single-level enclosure beneath. Way easier to build and maintain. It "unlocks" a few simple options like hydroponic grow tents, raised garden beds and above-ground pools for the enclosure.

2. To decide if you need to keep high humidity - look how much Franklin has to grow. If he's close to adult tortoises size, humidity requitements are far less strict and you do not need a "close chamber" - just a humid hide will do.

3. In any case, lining walls and bottom of each level with a pond liner is a good idea. I doubt anyone makes waterproof bookcases, maybe just splash proof. Even melamine bathroom cabinets warp after prolonged contact with water.

4. Bottom (floors) should be reinforced with plywood or OCB board (make sure it's protected from moisture). Support beams for the second level are a must.

5. Castors or legs aren't strictly necessary but make it easier to move enclosure around. You can just lay pond liner and a sheet of polystyrene insulation instead.

6. For "stiching" first and second level you can use wooden posts (inside the perimeter, so they can be fixed in the corners). But I'm not sure about that..

7. Height of the first level can be around 15-18" above substrate - enough to safely install ambient LED lights and a heat panel (not necessary if you keep the room warm enough). UVB and basking light are placed over the second level at proper distance (shelves can be used to build a Π-shaped frame for mounting lights).

8. You may also look at warehouse/storage shelving racks - these are likely easier to work with (perforated metallic posts, extra shelves to use as walls and so on). But pricing can be higher.

Overall, the plan is good (and a doodle of Franklin is super cute).

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

@Littleredfootbigredheart im just curious what ur thoughts r on this! Hope u not mind the tag! I got the inspo from ur enclosure ideas post!

Hello dear! Sorry for the delay in my response! I’ve been swamped with stuff lately

View attachment 399060

So I was doing research on how I could make Franklin a new bigger enclosure and I would love some feedback! I am in a small apartment and my dream was to get him his own room however, like a punch to the gut, I have come to realize I simply can’t afford a second room anytime soon.

SO my plan now is to somehow move Franklin into the bedroom with me as it should give more room for a bigger enclosure. (Rn he’s in like a small hallway with the water heater so not a lot of room to grow in there) If I can move him in with me it also would make it easier to heat us BOTH in the winter (I’ll buy a space heater for the room) and it opens up that little hallway for MORE STORAGE . Which turns out is a luxury in a small apartment so I’m excited for that! The whole transfer will be a feat of its own though so we’ll have to cross that bridge when we get there.

So while doing research I came across the concept for a double decker enclosure and wondered if that was actually doable for me. Ik other people have done it but I HAVE NO BUILDING SKILLS WHATSOEVER. Literally don’t know how to use a drill. I would love to learn tho! (I’m sure my folks will have to help me with this project regardless but I’m hoping to take care of most of it myself so I need to know HOW to do this logically. And what to buy.)

That said, with my limited knowledge I made this “blueprint”. I’ve found some cheap bookshelves online and I’m thinking that could make a good base. I’m assuming I’ll have to buy a piece of plywood and then some additional prices of wood to add to the bottoms (or backs) of the shelves for additional support for all the weight of dirt and decor since normally those r made of thin cardboard. I also kinda wanna have this on legs. I don’t like the idea of the whole things sitting directly on the ground but ik that complicates it more. At the v least I might buy something to put under the enclosure bc it’ll be sitting on carpet when in my room and for clean up it might help to have something like a hard plastic flooring underneath ?? I also will prob have to line both layers with a pond liner to keep from the dirt molding the wood. Altho most bookshelves I find say waterproof?? Idk if that changes that. Maybe it’s safe to still do the liner. And I may have to somehow make high sides on the shelves as well so Franklin can’t climb out . I really hope not but I have a feeling probably.

Not exactly sure how to attach the top bookshelf and make it supportive of the weight ? Also wondering if I should try to find a smaller bookshelf for the top or get the exact same size ? Same size gives more room but idk if it’s more of a hassle to stack.

I’m not sure how much humidity Franklin still needs but I like the idea of him having the option of an enclosed space even when he gets older just in case. So I’m thinking for the front of the bottom layer having two doors on a hinge like his current enclosure has (honestly might be able to reuse them from the old enclosure) and then get a tarp to line the sides of the bottom layer to hold in the humidity. (I was thinking of getting a clear tarp so he can see out but I’ve also heard if they can see out of their enclosures they go crazy. BUT I also know Franklin loves to look around and observe. So idk which is best! Plz someone let me no! Rn he’s in a completely closed off enclosure, cant see out.)

The top layer would be uncovered so humidity couldn’t be controlled but he could come out and observe the room or me if he pleased Ig ?? I honestly don’t no what to do for the top layer decorating wise. I’m not sure how much space the ramp I’ll have to make will take up either so not sure how much room I’ll be working with on the bottom layer. :/ I’m hoping to give lots of hide room but I’m not sure how it’ll actually work!

Also know I’ll have to buy more lights for the top layer (so expensive) do I need 2 UVB’s or is one on the bottom ok? That’s my most expensive light so I kinda don’t wanna have to buy two if I can help it! Like do I need the exact same setup for the top layer or is just a basking ok ?? Idk. I mean the bottom layer will have all the lights and temp/humidity regulation he needs so he can go there for that. Idk how set up the top should be. Plz help!

Most bookshelves I’m finding r 5 ft by 2 ft so double that is 10 x 4. Not as wide as I wanted for him :/ but it’ll be more than he has now if he ever get confident enough to use the ramp! I’m trying to make the best out of my situation!

The goal is to give him more enrichment and more room. Hopefully I can also finally add real plants to the enclosure but we’ll see. I’m still struggling on that front. Hoping to go out and buy some plants this weekend to start prepping. )

This project will prob take a LONG time to actually see to fruition as I’m tight on cash and will be for a while (got a new job and won’t get a raise for at least 3 months. ) for now I’m researching, planning, and maybe moving my room around to make room for new things. Then I’ll slowly buy the things one by one when I can afford it. THEN it’ll be set up and move in day

I want to make sure everything is all planned out b4 I spend the cash tho so I would love to no what yall think! Anyone who has had a double decker enclosure have any tips? How did it work for u and ur tort ?

I’m bad at knowing how things will logically work, esp when it comes to big items as I’m size blind. I would look at a 2 ft box and think a 4 ft item could fit in it until I physically saw it ain’t gonna work haha. I’m a v visual person so trying to map this out is TOUGH.

Also side question: can I use organic soil for his dirt bc the cococoir I buy now is SO EXPENSIVE. It’ll prob cost as much as the enclosure itself to fill both layers like that. Ik it prob won’t hold humidity as well but DANG.

For now Franklin seems happy with what he has but I feel like I’m failing him again. That nagging little voice telling me to do better so I wanna start on this now since ik it’ll take a long time. one day I just know he’ll have an amazing set up and be the happiest little tort. And I can’t wait for that day! I’m so impatient for it haha. But we gotta take baby steps so *I* dont go insane. One day at a time

I LOVE Alex’s response above! He’s broke everything down pretty perfectly, I’ll throw in my take with a few ideas you can weigh up too

I always think double decker enclosures for small species, where indoors room is limited, is a fantastic way to offer your tortoise more space and enrichment! I’m liking your line of thinking and the plans are pretty good, there’s certainly multiple ways to tackle a project like this, I’ll admit I’m the exact same as you in that I’m not a very diy oriented personthough my moms partner has been great teaching me to use some power tools lol, but when it comes to measurements and blue prints, I’ll admit it takes me longer to get my head around haha.

Do you have links to the specific shelves you were looking at? I’m curious how high the sides are, I definitely second what Alex said about lining both bases.

I like Alex’s bunkbed idea!

Now technically having both levels be the same size would offer him more room, but it depends on the logistics of the ramps incline with a 5x2 base, as Alex mentioned above, height of the first level can be around 15-18”, you’d need to gauge the angle the ramp would need to be to the next level.

In terms of it being a closed chamber, by time you come to complete this project, it may well be he no longer really needs the higher humidity a closed set up provides, he doesn’t have much growing to do. Though covers can be beneficial for retaining your temperatures easier. There’s a design idea here I’m wondering would work for you, it would technically have both levels being closed

There’s also this one, ambitious, but both levels are the same size and both are closed with what looks like pvc panels

You could also consider a design similar to the one on post #18 of this thread, might be easier to achieve

Russian Ramp

I tried doing some TFO searching but didn't feel I could find a direct answer to some of my questions regarding ramps intended for Russian tortoises. I apologize if I'm an idiot and completely over looked already hashed out and agreed upon solutions. Situation: I am in the design phase of a new...

tortoiseforum.org

I’d go with lighting the way Alex suggests, you certainly don’t need to worry about getting two uvb lights.

Hopefully some of these ideas can help get the creative juices flowing, perhaps even show your parents and see if they’d have a better idea on the building logistics

PS I love your detailed posts! Your remind me of myself haha