Light bulbs

[Tony the tank]

MVB are great bulbs but they have there issues..The ones that are self ballasted put out alot of heat as well as UV rays..So if you set it at the manufactures suggest distance the basking site might get pretty hot especially if your ambient air temp is high to begin with( I say this because I doubt you were using the CFB as heat).Then she will just avoid it because the temp is to high..

To check the temp increase..find out what the manufactures suggested distance is for the bulb you are considering and pick up a regular cheap refector bulb at the same wattage.. set it up as you would your MVB and see how hot the basking area gets..

If you don't see her rubbing her eyes...I would say its not a flash burn...

Byerssusan..there are so many things that can effect reptiles especially when it comes to lighting..To much UVA to little UVA...to much UVB to little UVB... To close to far... not bright enough or just a fluke... Maybe you can try the light again in about a week or two...if she becomes lathargic again then you have our answer..

But remember a baby tort needs UVB.. So don't deny her to long..

Well I am not denying her..I set up an outside enclosure for her for a couple of hours a day to get sunshine until I can get the mvb bulb ..I believe that is the one everyone said is safest.

 

[Madkins007]

I am currently using an MVB with UVB capabilities, but will be changing things up when I have the bucks to do it.

Based on several reports and research, I am going to get a fluorescent, low-UVB bulb as long as I can get for my habitat, mounted at the correct height over the substrate. It will be on a timer for 8-10 hours a day. There will also be two (because of the tank length) low-wattage standard incandescent bulbs, or a warm white fluorescent, set to run 12 hours a day. Their job is to offer a dawn and dusk, as well as to help offer a true white balance without generating a ton of light or heat.

I currently use a CHE for primary overhead heat, and substrate heating ropes for heat and humidity and will continue to do so. If I need additional heat, I will add another small CHE. I also supplement the UVB, just to be safe, with a small amount of liquid vitamin D a couple times a week.

This way, they will get UVB everywhere they are in the open, not just under the MVB, and there won't be any bright spots- so no eye worries. The fluorescents should also cost less to run. Also, if something goes bad, everything should be OK until I can replace it since there are two independent sources for light, heat, and UVB/vit. D.

 

[Madkins007]

I went to the site that had written results on the survey they took regarding the damaged/blind eyes on reptiles, and this was what is there now...

The 2005 Reptile Lighting Survey is now extremely outdated. Many of the lamps are no longer on sale; others have different specifications; and new products have been launched.

ALL LAMP TEST RESULTS ARE TEMPORARILY UNAVAILABLE. THIS SECTION IS BEING COMPLETELY RE-WRITTEN. (OCTOBER-NOVEMBER 2010)

So I HAD that site and Emys to stick up for me...so all I can say now is I am so pissed off I can hardly type and I am afraid I am about to use 4 letter words and call names as I feel I have just been called a liar or an idiot who can't even use a flourscent bulb correctly by 2 newbies who have baby tortoises and are new to TFO. I am 65 years old and am experienced with the husbandry involved in keeping chelonia. I know how to use a light bulb flourscent or not. I know how to follow directions and how to measure distances. I know how to set up an enclosure for tortoises. I know how to take care of sick animals. I was using light bulbs before one of those newbies was even born. To say that maybe I didn't use the bulb correctly is unconscionable to me. These 2 new keepers have no clue how to keep tortoises and yet they are doubting MY care of my animals. It is ridiculous that I have to fing defend my care and treatment of my animals. My Tony Stewart and his pen mate were seriously damaged by a coil UVB bulb. The penmate was writhing in pain and caught his neck under the edge of a hide and suffocated to death. DIED. So I have a dead tortoise and a blind one and I have to defend myself that maybe I didn't use the damn bulb correctly or maybe it was a manufacturing error. It was many manufacturing errors. MANY reptiles were blinded in that time period but because some newbie can't find anything on the Internet in writing maybe *I* am either lying or cannot use a bulb correctly. I will stop now before I say more and get in trouble with the moderators.

I can understand your stance and your frustration, your heart and pain are clearly showing through here.

On the other hand, we have a new member who just wants information based on something other than opinion or someone's personal experience. I can feel for him too- far too many care sheets and 'facts' are not based on anything concrete.

You and I are both 'old-timers' compared to many here (I'm 53, had my first reptile pet at like 6 years old- American anoles and Red-ear sliders- go figure, right? I got a Greek a couple years later.) We've both seen a lot of fads and trends come and go, and heard a lot of doofuses make grandiose claims of some sort. (Some of the biggest doofuses make the purest BS sound perfectly reasonable, don't they?)

I don't fault you in any way for your anger here- no one likes to be challenged, especially in something this painful, and with the depth of experience you have, but none of the rest of us was there, and we are curious as to what happened. It is a typical guy fault to want to 'solve' this sort of thing in a neat and tidy package.

I'm also glad you kept yourself from expressing your anger more bluntly, even if some of it managed to seep through.

On the other hand, I cannot and will not blame or censure someone just for wondering about an incident that seems contrary to the norm.

 

[Tony the tank]

I went to the site that had written results on the survey they took regarding the damaged/blind eyes on reptiles, and this was what is there now...

The 2005 Reptile Lighting Survey is now extremely outdated. Many of the lamps are no longer on sale; others have different specifications; and new products have been launched.

ALL LAMP TEST RESULTS ARE TEMPORARILY UNAVAILABLE. THIS SECTION IS BEING COMPLETELY RE-WRITTEN. (OCTOBER-NOVEMBER 2010)

So I HAD that site and Emys to stick up for me...so all I can say now is I am so pissed off I can hardly type and I am afraid I am about to use 4 letter words and call names as I feel I have just been called a liar or an idiot who can't even use a flourscent bulb correctly by 2 newbies who have baby tortoises and are new to TFO. I am 65 years old and am experienced with the husbandry involved in keeping chelonia. I know how to use a light bulb flourscent or not. I know how to follow directions and how to measure distances. I know how to set up an enclosure for tortoises. I know how to take care of sick animals. I was using light bulbs before one of those newbies was even born. To say that maybe I didn't use the bulb correctly is unconscionable to me. These 2 new keepers have no clue how to keep tortoises and yet they are doubting MY care of my animals. It is ridiculous that I have to fing defend my care and treatment of my animals. My Tony Stewart and his pen mate were seriously damaged by a coil UVB bulb. The penmate was writhing in pain and caught his neck under the edge of a hide and suffocated to death. DIED. So I have a dead tortoise and a blind one and I have to defend myself that maybe I didn't use the damn bulb correctly or maybe it was a manufacturing error. It was many manufacturing errors. MANY reptiles were blinded in that time period but because some newbie can't find anything on the Internet in writing maybe *I* am either lying or cannot use a bulb correctly. I will stop now before I say more and get in trouble with the moderators.

Wow..I wonder why I didn't see this before..Maggie where do you see me calling you a liar or saying that you did not take care of your animals... On the contrary the only explanation i find viable is a manufacturing issue...you say many were blinded but i cant find anything to confirm that... Please share with me this information...also calling me a newbi ..yes I'm a newbi to this forum and to torts...But I have kept and bred reptiles for over 22yrs.. I ask question and do research to make sure i give my animals the best care...Also I have personaly used those lights on my own charges for many yrs without issues....

You know Maggie this issue isn't about you..its about correctly identifying the cause of the blindness and sharing it with others...To avoid it from happening again to someone else... It's simple to say its the bulb.. When I could be the position of the bulb, the angle of the bulb, the fixture the bulb is in if the dome is polished it all makes a difference...

So you can play the victim and attempt to belittle me... But the truth is I never said anything negative about you or your care of animals..

My law professor told me this a while ago

If you have the truth.you pound the truth, if you have the law you pound the law, if you have nothing you pound your chest and hope no one notices..enough said

 

[Yvonne G]

Yvonne.. I gather you have kept torts for quite a while... Before these incidents did you ever use CFB..and did any of your animals suffer Photokeratitis...I have without incident

All of my tortoises are outside 24/7/265, even the ones in "indoor" habitats. So when the sun is shining, the habitats on the covered carport, that contain babies have their lids propped open. So I never felt the need to use any kind of UV lighting. Ever since my first tortoise, I've never used UV lighting until last year when I purchased my first T-Rex Active UV/heat bulb.

On the subject of the CFL's I'm only going by what our members have said and the pictures they've shown here on the forum. When all this first started happening, The Tortoise Trust had a paper on their site about it, but I can't find it now. I'll keep trying.

---

Here it is:

http://www.uvguide.co.uk/phototherapyphosphor.htm

And please note, that all of the reports of lethargic babies and swollen eyes concerned very young hatchlings...never an older tortoise.

 

[Tony the tank]

Thank you Yvonne.. That was some interesting reading.. But from what I gathered from the quick read...they couldn't come down with a solid cause for it either...placing most of it on possible user error (distance ,angle ,fixture,burn in)and maybe the older style phosphorus coating....

But it's a very good article showing the effects of distance, angle, fixture dimension, and fixture reflectors...

 

[byerssusan]

Yes thank you for adding that. I have saved it in my favs.

 

[RogerTheTortoise]

Goodness! Im so nervous now! I dont want little Rogie in pain : (
At the moment Roger is just using a halogen bulb, no UVB.. But I take him outside all the time. I'm going to Repticon this weekend (so stoked) and was planning on getting a mercury vapor there (cost is way better) but I've been reading that they aren't as good as they seem. So I'm thinking about using the repti sun 10.0 florescent tubes..
Anyone had any problems with those?
what do y'all use in your enclosures?

 

[Tony the tank]

Roger..There is nothing wrong with a MVB... If it will work with your application..just be aware that they put out some heat... If the ambient temp in your enclosure is on the cool side it shouldn't be an issue..

If you go straight flourecent tubes.. Just know they put out hardly no heat...so you would need a separate basking light... I personally believe this to be the best setup..the animal can bask to raise his temp then lay under the UVB bulb as long as he wants with no chance of over heating..

What ever you decide make sure you use the manufactures min and max distance..and burn in the bulbs fr a few hrs

Good luck

 

[RogerTheTortoise]

Thank you. I think I'll do the tubes across his tank and leave the basking light I already have.

Thank you to everyone for all the advice and input! It has helped me tremendously!!

 

[Morty the Torty]

Goodness! Im so nervous now! I dont want little Rogie in pain : (
At the moment Roger is just using a halogen bulb, no UVB.. But I take him outside all the time. I'm going to Repticon this weekend (so stoked) and was planning on getting a mercury vapor there (cost is way better) but I've been reading that they aren't as good as they seem. So I'm thinking about using the repti sun 10.0 florescent tubes..
Anyone had any problems with those?
what do y'all use in your enclosures?

That's what I was thinking of getting so let me know how you like it!

 

[ascott]

The long uvb tube type bulbs are good..along with a heat bulb for basking...especially if you are dealing with hatchling/young tortoise or turtle. 5.0 is great for species that are found in the wild not doing alot of direct open air basking and the 10.0 is better for species that have been observed in the wild direct open air basking. Please remember that hatchlings and younger tortoise and turtle GENERALLY are hiding alot of their lives until they are a bit older due to high predation risk ....therefore as many have determined they need humid hides as well as some require humid enclosures...they require a heat source..they require dark safe hiding places...they require low grade uvb .....they require a diverse diet .....they require a water source for soaking or sipping...they also require" calm quiet alone to do what they do time" and they require a keeper to do their homework on what will increase their success in thriving in captivity.....and in my own personal unsolicited opinion. They require outside natural sun time with places to wander and muck around in the free flowing air...they require outside time to spark their curious nature...to allow them to exercise...to allow, well hell...for them to be what they are...solitary, private, curious, tenacious survivors...we simply should play the roll of provider and observer...again, IMHO

 

[RogerTheTortoise]

Are the tubes T12 or T8?

 

[BrinnANDTorts]

Are the tubes T12 or T8?

T8