Living with worms?

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sammi

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I seem to recall last year when I went to the vet, (back when Ernie had worms for the first time) that he could have contracted them a number of ways, including by bringing them in from the outside, or from eating his own feces. Then I also remember her telling me that it was nothing big to worry about, because most tortoises lived their lives with worms and had no problems, but that I should clear them up anyways to be safe. Now it's coming time for his vet check up again, and I happened to notice pinworms again. Should I be worried that they've surfaced again? It is true that they can live with them, as long as their numbers don't get out of hand, and still be considered healthy? Of course I'm going to get them taken care of, I'm just curious.
 

Yvonne G

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If the tortoise has enough pin worms that you can actually see them, then its time to have the tortoise de-wormed. Most animals DO have a small amount of parasites. Its only when the parasites grow in number that you need to worry about it. And usually this is caused by stress, or eating too much fruit, etc.
 

tortoisenerd

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Agree that if they are numerous enough to see, than definitely treat. If they show up on a fecal test, its a judgment call as to when to treat...hopefully your vet will re-test regularly for lower numbers and treat for higher numbers. In the wild, parasites such as worms aren't as much as a problem. In captivity, especially smaller indoor enclosures, parasites can be a huge problem as torts come into contact with their poop (vs. in the wild they roam). My vet said the two types of parasites my tort had the first couple years (pinworms and coccidia) were likely from his mom or shared housing. I was advised to treat both when they popped up (different times), as for a young tort, combined with another illness, it could be a huge problem.
 

sammi

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Okay. Good to know. The vet wasn't specific about the number of worms, but that makes sense.

So how do you think he contracted them? I would assume it was by eating his own poop, but if he was clean, and pooping clean, how is that possible?
 

tortoisenerd

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It is very likely the tort had the worms before you got it. I don't remember if wild caught or captive bred, but captive bred torts can have parasites just as easily as wild caught in some cases as their parents may be wild caught, they share housing at a breeder or pet store which hasn't been cleaned, etc. They can't get worms from eating their poop alone...this just multiplies the numbers quickly (why parasites in captivity are more dangerous). If you had clean parasite tests between acquiring the tort and now, it is still entirely possible the tort had the worms before you got it, as there are times the numbers are down so low they can't be picked up, they are in between breeding cycles, etc.

As to if the tort got worms after you got it, like Yvonne said about bird poop, or even produce you buy from the store could have a bit of something on it. The scenario that your tort had it before you got him is much more likely though. Using my tort as an example, the fecal test right after I got him showed pin worms. Treated that (two courses--one for worms, and one for the worms that hatch from the eggs after the first treatment). Re-test came back clean. 6 months later tested positive for coccidia. Vet thinks he had that the first time and it was dormant. Treated that. Re-test came back clean. Had a clean test at his next check-up. This most current one, the pinworms came back. Vet thinks it is still the same pinworms as that first time! Treated it. Re-test came back clean.

Hopefully next year we will remain in the clear. My vet says she commonly sees multiple parasites in the tort's first few years of life, and after that, they are clean (as there is no exposure to new ones in most cases, except for the more rare poop on food case). I found it very intriguing that my captive bred baby has had so many parasites (vet says they were all moderate--enough to treat, but not crazy amounts such as being able to see worms with the naked eye). I was under the impression that a captive bred tort would not have parasite issues, but now I now that isn't the case! Thus, I am very passionate about encouraging people to seek preventative vet care even in apparently healthy captive bred torts. You never know when treating the worms could save a tort's life down the road--a baby especially getting a RI who already has worms--that could be deadly.
 

sammi

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I actually had him de wormed about a year ago, so would that mean the worms were never cleared out during the first run?
 

Edna

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Some worms spend part of their life cycle encysted. During this time they are not harmed by wormers. I don't know if this applies to worms infesting torts, but it is true for worms in dogs. Maybe our resident vet could shed some light on this for us.
 

ALDABRAMAN

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emysemys said:
If the tortoise has enough pin worms that you can actually see them, then its time to have the tortoise de-wormed. Most animals DO have a small amount of parasites. Its only when the parasites grow in number that you need to worry about it. And usually this is caused by stress, or eating too much fruit, etc.
I agree.
 
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