Please help - which enclosure for sulcata

[sully_baby]

Hi,

I have a 11in long, 6in wide, 4in tall sulcata (2 years and 2 months).

I want to get her a big enclosure until she is ready to go outside.

Is this ok?

Swell Premium PVC Vivarium Kit 244cm/8ft

Space-efficient, stackable vivarium kit with expansion set Durable anodised aluminium frame with non-reflective PVC panels Easy to assemble, lightweight, and low-maintenance

www.reptiles.swelluk.com

Or is this better?

https://southdown-aquatics.co.uk/shop/8ft/8ft-x-4ft-x-4ft-vivarium/

Right now she has a really small enclosure for her size.

The 1st one could be with us in 2 weeks, the second would take 7-8 weeks.

Please advice.

We cant build something outside right now.

@Tom?

 

[Markw84]

Unfortunately, your sulcata needs to be outdoors full time at the size it is now. Neither of those enclosures is adequate at all for a sulcata. Sulcatas are really active tortoises! They are from an area where it is extremely hot - winters have a normal high daily temperature of 31°C. The burrows they dig are to get away from the extreme daytime heat that averages 43°C in the "warmer" months. The burrows maintain a temperature of 27°C year-round. That is what they need. They are amongst the fastest, most active tortoises. They need room to move.

I wish I had better news for you, but the only way to house a sulcata in your climate would be a large outdoor greenhouse of at least 50 sq meters. Imagine trying to keep that above 27°! You live at 53° N lattitude. UP there the sun is rarely high enough to provide adequate exposure for D3 production. So in addition to heat you will need properly sized ambient and UVB/UVA lighting. Even that would not be ideal without ample outdoor access to a large area for exercise and grazing. It would cost £20,000+ to really properly house a sulcata in the UK.

 

[Tom]

Hi,

I have a 11in long, 6in wide, 4in tall sulcata (2 years and 2 months).

I want to get her a big enclosure until she is ready to go outside.

Is this ok?

Swell Premium PVC Vivarium Kit 244cm/8ft

Space-efficient, stackable vivarium kit with expansion set Durable anodised aluminium frame with non-reflective PVC panels Easy to assemble, lightweight, and low-maintenance

www.reptiles.swelluk.com

Or is this better?

https://southdown-aquatics.co.uk/shop/8ft/8ft-x-4ft-x-4ft-vivarium/

Right now she has a really small enclosure for her size.

The 1st one could be with us in 2 weeks, the second would take 7-8 weeks.

Please advice.

We cant build something outside right now.

@Tom?

Mark is right. You need a whole room for an 11 inch sulcata, and even that is too small. I move mine outside full time at around 8-10 inches and they have a 30x35 foot enclosure with a 4x8 foot heated night box at that size. They walk every inch of it daily.

The Southdown enclosure would be a good one to start a sulcata in, but at 11 inches, yours outgrew that one a long time ago.

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Unfortunately, your sulcata needs to be outdoors full time at the size it is now. Neither of those enclosures is adequate at all for a sulcata. Sulcatas are really active tortoises! They are from an area where it is extremely hot - winters have a normal high daily temperature of 31°C. The burrows they dig are to get away from the extreme daytime heat that averages 43°C in the "warmer" months. The burrows maintain a temperature of 27°C year-round. That is what they need. They are amongst the fastest, most active tortoises. They need room to move.

I wish I had better news for you, but the only way to house a sulcata in your climate would be a large outdoor greenhouse of at least 50 sq meters. Imagine trying to keep that above 27°! You live at 53° N lattitude. UP there the sun is rarely high enough to provide adequate exposure for D3 production. So in addition to heat you will need properly sized ambient and UVB/UVA lighting. Even that would not be ideal without ample outdoor access to a large area for exercise and grazing. It would cost £20,000+ to really properly house a sulcata in the UK.

The reality not many people like to talk about, is the majority of keepers of larger tortoise species in the uk simply don’t have the means to provide housing that would meet the forums standards of care. For the most part, people aren’t creating entirely heated and adapted outbuildings for their sulcatas in the uk, most just tend to free roam the home, or have dedicated rooms that are unfortunately too small for the time they have to use artificial heating in our climate. It’s a lot of creativity and making do, not saying that’s right, but it is the reality. There’s many species I really don’t think should be so readily available as pets in the uk, sulcatas are pretty up there on that list for me unfortunately. A lot of people get sold babies without been given the deeper understanding of what these animals need as adults to thrive, many people in the uk don’t have the kind of land a sulcata requires, our gardens generally aren’t as big as folks in the US. Those with the land can’t always fork out to heat the kind of space these animals need in our temperatures, it really is unfortunate

@sully_baby my heart goes out to you because I wish there was an easier answer for you, housing a sulcata in the average uk household just isn’t practical for so many reasons
I appreciate how clearly dedicated you’ve been in learning the best methods to raising your baby, I can see on your other threads you had some great advice, it’s clearly paid off because your sulcata has made some gains since your last posts, and that newer growth came in so nice and smooth!

You’re like many others that fall victim to buying the wrong species for our climate, I can see you’ve made a rehome post, I do want to warn, it’s not overly promising out there when it comes to rehoming this kind of tortoise in the uk, don’t get me wrong I’m sure you’d get plenty of offers, but I can’t say her housing would meet the standards of care set here by many prospective owners. There’s charities/sanctuaries, some of their husbandry practices can a little outdated, though I can’t speak on how they house larger species, most are taking in the smaller guys. I’m sure you’ll find someone that can offer more than what you’re currently able to, so I’m not saying not to go for it, I’m just saying standards aren’t always the highest unfortunately, so bear that in mind when searching.

There was another uk member @JoshyP that is currently in the midst of setting up a larger area for their sulcata, I wonder if you guys could offer each other some tips/tricks? There was a lot of discussion in this thread that you might find helpful to look through?

Large Indoor Sulcata Tortoise Enclosure

Hi all! A bit of background first - I've got young sulcata tortoise who's quickly outgrowing his current enclosure and so plans to build him a new enclosure are underway. Unfortunately, I live in the not so sunny UK so housing a tort outside is a bit more difficult. Whilst Stompy (my tort) has...

tortoiseforum.org

Whilst the enclosures you’ve posted are very well made, I do agree that your tortoise has already outgrown that kind of size.

This is a tricky situation because I can see on your other post she’s currently in a 4x2, painfully small as you know, so I absolutely understand the desperation in wanting to get her in something bigger, even if that’s too small, but it seems such a shame for you to spend so much money on something that she is already too small for

 

[JoshyP]

Hi @sully_baby. Apologies for not responding sooner, I've only just seen this thread. @Littleredfootbigredheart tagged me as I was in somewhat of a similar position a while ago. The enclosure my sully was in, he was quickly out growing and was reaching the size where it's best to house them outdoors. Very fortunately, we have the resources to adapt a summerhouse/guest house into an indoor enclosure for the colder months with a large outdoor space to roam whenever.

I won't repeat what the others have said above with regards to housing a Sulcata in the UK as they've said everything I would and by the sound of it you understand the position you're in. I'll also say that there a lot of other members on here far more knowledgeable and experienced then I am, but I'll still share my thoughts. Chances are most people who own Sulcata aren't looking after them the best we can, myself included and that's simply because we're always learning and testing new things. We're all just trying to do the best that we can with what we have, whether that's right or not is a different topic, but the fact is you have a Sulcata and you live in the UK. Things aren't very favourable or easy, but not impossible.

Giving your tort away might be the right thing to do, but chances are they could end up in a worse place then they are now and personally, I couldn't live with myself if I did that. So unless your 100% confident that someone is going to look after it better then you are, I'd keep it and try my best. If you do find someone or a sanctuary, share their details on here and I'm sure members will help look into them and advise.

Now for what I'd do if I was in your situation. I'd do the best that I can with what I have/can do. For us, we made sacrifices, like our guesthouse and parts of our garden. In the future, we have plans for a unit/warehouse and potentially opening a sanctuary in the UK. Both my wife and I love animals and want to open a family farm type thing in the future, but we'll see what happens. Understandably, not everyone has the desire or resources to do this, but it's always best to aim high!

I note in a previous post you mention how your garden isn't really much of a choice, so think about moving things around in your place and how you could give your Sulcata the most amount of room possible. Then, build a dedicated enclosure in that space. It's not ideal, but it's better then what she's in now. Likely, this will be the cheapest option as well as providing the most amount of room possible. I'm not saying that this is ideal, but simply what I'd do in your situation. This should only be temporary as well and you'll need a longer term solution on how you're going to house your sully. If you're willing to spend the time, effort and money you can make it work. It may never be ideal for you or for your Sulcata, but it hopefully will suffice and I use that word very loosely until you find something permanent and before it's too late for your sully.

As someone who was once in a similar position, I've learnt that everyone in this forum wants to help you. I've also learnt that most people are very passionate about torts and caring for them correctly, so please know that if a message comes across harsh or seem belittling, it's just because they're passionate. They want the best for the tort, we all do. Being a part of this forum means you'll have all of the knowledge on how to best keep your tort.

The last thing I will say is that your sully is part of the family, for life (literally), look after her. Please don't be one of those people who leaves a tort to fend for themselves, they won't survive over here and will likely just become a meal.

- Josh