Pyramiding? Overfeeding problem?

Souptugo

Active Member
5 Year Member
Joined
May 21, 2016
Messages
166
Hi there, my Eastern Hermann tortoise Charlie is 14 months old. I raised him from a hatchling. Photos attached.

I am starting to think he's gaining too much weight too quickly! His recent growth progress so far is:

Month Date - Weight (g) - Length (SCL) (cm) - Jackson's Ratio (g/cm^3)


June 27 77 grams 6.5 cm R: 0.28
July 6 78 grams 6.6 cm R: 0.27
July 23 88 grams 6.8 cm R: 0.28
July 30 93 grams 7 0 cm R: 0.27
Aug 1 97 grams 7.2 cm R: 0.26
Aug 27 104 grams 7.6 cm R: 0.24
Aug 31 109 grams 7.7 cm R: 0.24
Sept 10 112 grams 8.2 cm R: 0.20
Sept 14 115 grams 8.2 cm R: 0.21
Sept 23 108 grams 8.2 cm R: 0.20
Oct 1 140 grams 8.3 cm R: 0.24
Nov 10 150 grams 8.4 cm R: 0.25
Nov 20 161 grams 8.5 cm R: 0.26
Nov 24 174 grams 8.6 cm R: 0.27

Diet:

I am feeding him mixture of Zoo Med Natural Grassland Tortoise Food as a key source of fibre. This core food is mixed with organic dandelions from Whole Foods every day. For variety, I combine with kale, arugula, endives etc..(rotating through) - all plants are referenced for safety through the tortoisetable website database. Once a week I put dried plantain, strawberry leaves, hibiscus flowers (bought from https://www.mountainroseherbs.com/). I am not a fan of too much supplements so every day I scrape off cuttlebone with sharp scissors into a powder and put in with his food. I usually cut everything up and it's the size of his body the amount I give him each day.

He eats a lot. I feed once a day and sometimes at night after bath time.

Habitat:

I live in Vancouver, BC Canada in a condo. Condo is big but balcony is small and we have a lot of rain so he's always been an indoor tortoise.

Hi enclosure has PowerSun UVB mercury vapor bulb 100 W upstairs and Reptisun 10.0 UVB downstairs with 75 W heat lamp. He has a humid hide for sleep but if it's cold, I usually take it out and let it dry over a couple days to warm up. I have 4 Arlo Pro wireless cameras (just installed) to watch him while I'm at work to make sure he's walking around and basking properly. Temps are 30 C at lights and cool spots go down to 24 or room temp. Night time I leave radiator on and is usually 21-22 C.

I spray his enclosure down with water every other day or every day depending on how wet I got it the last time. He's on all coco coir from Petsmart. Used to have sand/organic soil/coco mix but didn't like it, the smell and sand got into his shell. Reptibark I had mixed in as well and he eats them so that was no good. I find the coco coir by itself was the best for him.

There is no definitive answer but I think he's starting to get some pyramiding at his vertebral scutes. I am worried he is eating too much? I am feeding all the right diet and don't want to take him off his normal growth schedule because he is very healthy and happy. Should I reduce the food intake to prevent further issues? If so how much food should I reduce it by?

Thanks for your help.

James
 

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Tom

The Dog Trainer
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Tom

The Dog Trainer
10 Year Member!
Platinum Tortoise Club
Joined
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Messages
63,264
Location (City and/or State)
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Thank you. Probably I need to mist and bathe him more.

What do you think about a reptifogger? http://www.petsmart.com/reptile/sup...ogger-reptile-terrarium-humidifier-14901.html

Would that keep humidity more stable? I'm worried about respiratory infection with the cold air.

J

I don't like foggers. To me they are the equivalent of using a bucket to bail out a boat that is taking on water. Just plug the leak.

Open topped enclosures make it impossible to keep the air in your enclosure warmer or more humid than the room air. I prefer to use closed chambers. These make it easy to create and maintain whatever temperature and humidity parameters a person desires since they are no open to the room air.

Soaking daily won't hurt and it might help. Misting doesn't do much, but it doesn't hurt anything either.

With damp substrate and a humid hide, I let all of my Testudo of all ages, as well as desert tortoises, which are another temperate species, drop into the 60s (17-20C) at night. Not once in all my years has this ever been a problem. In re-reading your post above, it looks like you do need to warm up our basking area. It should be 36-37C directly under the basking bulb. 30 is a little too cool.
 

Gillian M

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5 Year Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2014
Messages
15,417
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Jordan
Thank you. Probably I need to mist and bathe him more.

What do you think about a reptifogger? http://www.petsmart.com/reptile/sup...ogger-reptile-terrarium-humidifier-14901.html

Would that keep humidity more stable? I'm worried about respiratory infection with the cold air.

J
I for one live in Jordan (the Middle East), where the climate is EXTREMELY DRY. I learned to give Oli (my beloved Greek tort) a soak in warm water each and every day so as to avoid pyramiding. Moreover I spray his enclosure with water daily and mix the substrate with my hands.
 

Souptugo

Active Member
5 Year Member
Joined
May 21, 2016
Messages
166
I for one live in Jordan (the Middle East), where the climate is EXTREMELY DRY. I learned to give Oli (my beloved Greek tort) a soak in warm water each and every day so as to avoid pyramiding. Moreover I spray his enclosure with water daily and mix the substrate with my hands.

Thank you so much for the advice. I usually spray but don't mix. I will spray and then mix and then spray again. I hope to increase the humidity more. I will try and soak him more often. For now I will continue feeding as usual :) Thanks again.
 

Souptugo

Active Member
5 Year Member
Joined
May 21, 2016
Messages
166
I don't like foggers. To me they are the equivalent of using a bucket to bail out a boat that is taking on water. Just plug the leak.

Open topped enclosures make it impossible to keep the air in your enclosure warmer or more humid than the room air. I prefer to use closed chambers. These make it easy to create and maintain whatever temperature and humidity parameters a person desires since they are no open to the room air.

Soaking daily won't hurt and it might help. Misting doesn't do much, but it doesn't hurt anything either.

With damp substrate and a humid hide, I let all of my Testudo of all ages, as well as desert tortoises, which are another temperate species, drop into the 60s (17-20C) at night. Not once in all my years has this ever been a problem. In re-reading your post above, it looks like you do need to warm up our basking area. It should be 36-37C directly under the basking bulb. 30 is a little too cool.

Thanks for the advice! I will increase the temperature in his basking spot more. I will try to get rid of any hazards. I'm just worried that if he ever flips upside down at the basking spot it will be too hot! I live in fear over this every day I'm gone. Thanks again.

J
 

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