Pyramiding

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ismail

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Hi all,

I feed my one year old torts twice a week soaked komodo and a daily varied high fibre, rich calcium vegetable diet. I am getting obsessed that my torts are starting to pyramid.

Over here we have a high humidity and rarely it is below 60%. Apart from the ambient humidity i soak them every day.

Do you consider this as pyramiding?
 

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GeoTerraTestudo

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Yep, starting to pyramid. Babies grow fast, and are the most vulnerable to pyramiding. Even if your ambient humidity is moderate to high, you still need to make sure that they have access to all the moisture they need.

What kind of substrate is that? Might want to get something that holds moisture and allows them to burrow, like coco coir or soil free of perlite or vermiculite. That gives them a humid microclimate, about 20% higher than ambient. Also a good idea to provide them with a humid hide, where they can experience higher humidity.
 

ismail

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Substrate is a mix of 70% compost, 20% crushed oyster shell and 10% sand.

Could not find coco coir or topsoil where i live. (Malta)

GeoTerraTestudo said:
Yep, starting to pyramid. Babies grow fast, and are the most vulnerable to pyramiding. Even if your ambient humidity is moderate to high, you still need to make sure that they have access to all the moisture they need.

What kind of substrate is that? Might want to get something that holds moisture and allows them to burrow, like coco coir or soil free of perlite or vermiculite. That gives them a humid microclimate, about 20% higher than ambient. Also a good idea to provide them with a humid hide, where they can experience higher humidity.
 

GeoTerraTestudo

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ismail said:
Substrate is a mix of 70% compost, 20% crushed oyster shell and 10% sand.

Could not find coco coir or topsoil where i live. (Malta)

Well, it's too bad you've had trouble finding coco coir and topsoil in Malta. Does anyone here have advice on how to locate a better moisture-holding substrate where Ismail lives?

In the meantime, do a search in the Tortoise Forum website for "humid hide" and see if you can find some tips on that. The search field is in the upper right corner of the TFO screen.
 

Jd3

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Topsoil is just soil. Dirt. Removing the oyster shell and same would likely help. Just straight compost or clean dirt.
 

Yvonne G

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Don't forget heat, exercise and diet. All of these things play a big role in the pyramiding of the Mediterranean species.
 

GeoTerraTestudo

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Yvonne G said:
Don't forget heat, exercise and diet. All of these things play a big role in the pyramiding of the Mediterranean species.

Yes, Malta is part of the Mediterranean. Ismail, would it be possible for you to keep your tortoises outside? The climate should be ideal for them. They are, after all, Mediterranean tortoises. :)
 

ismail

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They hatched in my friend's garden and i brought them inside as he was losing them all during winter. i have a che and uv mv lamp. been saying to myself that i have to get them outside but i see them so small and fragile so i lack the courage to take the next step!
I promise that as soon as summer starts here they will be exercising in the sun! :rolleyes:

So you reckon if i use just compost will retain humidity?

GeoTerraTestudo said:
Yvonne G said:
Don't forget heat, exercise and diet. All of these things play a big role in the pyramiding of the Mediterranean species.

Yes, Malta is part of the Mediterranean. Ismail, would it be possible for you to keep your tortoises outside? The climate should be ideal for them. They are, after all, Mediterranean tortoises. :)
 

tortoise007

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Ok, a few things to do differently:

1, as other people suggested, switch to coco-coir (eco-earth). Just order it online! For three bricks it's only something like $3.50 on amazon.

2, Your diet should not mainly consist of veggies. Weeds from the yard or garden should be number one, fallowed by grass and veggies. Good veggies/fruits to feed are carrots, apples, romaine lettuce, bell peppers, escarole, endive and collard greens. 60 to 70 percent of your diet should be weeds. Good weeds are dandelion flowers and greens, prickly lettuce (best when it is young), and clovers.Fruit should make up no more than 5% of their diet.
 

Ansh

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What are your temperatures? If you are using a heat source, you must remember that the humidity is vastly reduced unless you have a closed chamber. A humid hide is also really useful to create the right micro-climate the little ones need.
 

ismail

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veggies was not the right word i should have used. Weeds is the right one. throughout this winter i fed them sowthistle, prickly sowthistle, dandelion, clover, prickly pear, lettuce (not iceberg), lamb's lettuce, grape leaves, mulberry leaves, hibiscus flowers and the komodo soft food three times a week.

i gave them tomatoes just three times in a year because over heere ive read it is considered a fruit.

tortoise007 said:
Ok, a few things to do differently:

1, as other people suggested, switch to coco-coir (eco-earth). Just order it online! For three bricks it's only something like $3.50 on amazon.

2, Your diet should not mainly consist of veggies. Weeds from the yard or garden should be number one, fallowed by grass and veggies. Good veggies/fruits to feed are carrots, apples, romaine lettuce, bell peppers, escarole, endive and collard greens. 60 to 70 percent of your diet should be weeds. Good weeds are dandelion flowers and greens, prickly lettuce (best when it is young), and clovers.Fruit should make up no more than 5% of their diet.
 

conservation

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I would make an outdoor enslosure. Seems like nature will take care of your tortoise if you let it.
 

ismail

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So i did some research today and found a seller that can actually ship substrate. He sells exo terra products and does not have coco coir. the three items which are labelled as good to improve humidity are: forest bark, coco husk or jungle earth...Actually for coco husk, the label says it increases the humidity.

Anyone has some sort of experience on these substrates please? Which ones would you recommend?

Cheers all:)
 

colatoise

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My greek likes cypress mulch. Holds moisture well and great for burrowing. Homedepot.com has it for less than $2 a bag. Not sure about the shipping to Malta.
 

GeoTerraTestudo

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ismail said:
So you reckon if i use just compost will retain humidity?

In my opinion, compost makes a poor substrate for live animals. Compost is basically organic matter that microbes have broken down, but that have not yet turned into soil. Compost is rich in nutrients, which is why it's good for growing plants. However, despite holding moisture like soil and coco coir, I think it is too rich and uncomfortable for animals, and possibly even hazardous to their health. Use compost in the garden, but use true soil or woody substrates, like coco coir or cypress mulch, as a safer, more stable bedding material.
 

james1974

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Re: RE: Pyramiding

GeoTerraTestudo said:
ismail said:
Substrate is a mix of 70% compost, 20% crushed oyster shell and 10% sand.

Could not find coco coir or topsoil where i live. (Malta)

Well, it's too bad you've had trouble finding coco coir and topsoil in Malta. Does anyone here have advice on how to locate a better moisture-holding substrate where Ismail lives?

In the meantime, do a search in the Tortoise Forum website for "humid hide" and see if you can find some tips on that. The search field is in the upper right corner of the TFO screen.

You can order it from anyone who sells reptile supplies.Buy the zoomed three bricks soak in warm water and it breaks up a lot.You get more from the bricks then the bags more than twice as much for the same price.The cheapest place to but it is at DrsFosterSmith.com it's only $4.29 for three brick pack of the zoomed.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using TortForum mobile app
 

Hybrid

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How to to revert back the pyramiding?

I initially thought it was designed by God that way, silly me.
 

GeoTerraTestudo

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Hybrid said:
How to to revert back the pyramiding?

I initially thought it was designed by God that way, silly me.

You can never reverse pyramiding that has already occurred, you can only prevent further pyramiding from occurring in the first place. Sometimes, existing pyramiding may wear down a little bit as the tortoise moves through the bushes or burrows underground. Also, as tortoises get older and bigger, the small bumps on their scutes become less noticeable compared to the rest of the carapace. But basically, pyramiding that has formed is always going to be there.

Again, there are a few tortoise species (like the leopard tortoise) that naturally exhibit a small degree of pyramiding in the wild, although it's still not much. However, most tortoises are meant to have a smoother curvature to their carapace. Wild Greek tortoises have a moderately domed carapace with no pyramiding.
 

Hybrid

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GeoTerraTestudo said:
Hybrid said:
How to to revert back the pyramiding?

I initially thought it was designed by God that way, silly me.

You can never reverse pyramiding that has already occurred, you can only prevent further pyramiding from occurring in the first place. Sometimes, existing pyramiding may wear down a little bit as the tortoise moves through the bushes or burrows underground. Also, as tortoises get older and bigger, the small bumps on their scutes become less noticeable compared to the rest of the carapace. But basically, pyramiding that has formed is always going to be there.

Again, there are a few tortoise species (like the leopard tortoise) that naturally exhibit a small degree of pyramiding in the wild, although it's still not much. However, most tortoises are meant to have a smoother curvature to their carapace. Wild Greek tortoises have a moderately domed carapace with no pyramiding.
Thank you very much for your brilliant insight sir!
 
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