Sand.

[ShellyTurtlesCats]

Why is sand being used as substrate and why do people continue to debate it? Every single time I try to offer advice, people shut me down and treat me like I am trying to micro-manage them. I truly just want to help!

Just venting...

_________
~ Shelly ~

 

[Yvonne G]

All of your sentences are so out of context that I don't understand where you're coming from.

In my opinion, sand shouldn't be used, however, in some instances it may be ok to use it. As long as the tortoise is well hydrated it may not end up being a problem to use sand.

As long as there are two sides to every story, there will be a debate.

I'm sorry your advice is shut down, however, I looked back over a couple of your most recent posts and don't see what you mean.

Micro-manage? Sorry...just don't get that at all.

Every opinion is valuable. Good opinions help keep tortoises alive and help keep everyone learning of other ways to take care of their tortoises.

Bad opinions also serve a purpose, usually by bringing out the opposing arguments of the subject.

All I can say is just keep on offering up the help you want to give. Whether or not it is accepted is up to the people reading your posts.

 

[Millerlite]

It's one of those things that will always be debated in the reptile world, you can just offer advice and hope people take it. There are also sides to every story and when people believe in something they tend to have a hard time being convinced otherwise

 

[wellington]

Yes, don't stop. In my opinion, unless you are a veteran with tortoises, and you have adults only, sand might, again, might be okay. However, I would never recommend sand for someone to use. Just keep pushing along no matter what others might say. It's good advice to advise against it. Some people tried shutting me down over a year ago, almost two years ago because I am every place pushing Toms threads. Heck, even had a nasty email or two. Guess what, I keep doing what I believe and I believe in Tom.

 

[ShellyTurtlesCats]

It wasn't a debate here, Yvonne. It was on Facebook. I was only venting...

I've been told that I am a turtle/tortoise Nazi a few times after offering genuinely good advice.

I get that I can't force people into believing, but when there is proof? How can we deny it? Ah. Such is life...

I'll keep offering, and keep scratching my head. Haha

_________
~ Shelly ~

---

All of your sentences are so out of context that I don't understand where you're coming from.

In my opinion, sand shouldn't be used, however, in some instances it may be ok to use it. As long as the tortoise is well hydrated it may not end up being a problem to use sand.

As long as there are two sides to every story, there will be a debate.

I'm sorry your advice is shut down, however, I looked back over a couple of your most recent posts and don't see what you mean.

Micro-manage? Sorry...just don't get that at all.

Every opinion is valuable. Good opinions help keep tortoises alive and help keep everyone learning of other ways to take care of their tortoises.

Bad opinions also serve a purpose, usually by bringing out the opposing arguments of the subject.

All I can say is just keep on offering up the help you want to give. Whether or not it is accepted is up to the people reading your posts.

And I don't see why it is out of context, unless you thought the debate was on TFO.

Micromanage: To direct or control in a detailed, often meddlesome manner.

_________
~ Shelly ~

 

[wellington]

Yes, I thought you meant on here too, so I am sure Yvonne did too.

 

[Levi the Leopard]

Don't worry turtle Nazi...
I've been called a "crazy turtle lady" because I told a friend she needs to provide her Russian (that I gave her) with a water dish!

 

[ShellyTurtlesCats]

Re: RE: Sand.

Yes, I thought you meant on here too, so I am sure Yvonne did too.

I figured.
Haha! Sorry about that. I'm really not that passive-aggressive. If I had something to say during/in a debate, I'd say it there instead of making a whole new post.

Don't worry turtle Nazi...
I've been called a "crazy turtle lady" because I told a friend she needs to provide her Russian (that I gave her) with a water dish!

Heh. Yeah, go steal all her cups and then her water off and see how she'd like it



_________
~ Shelly ~

 

[mike taylor]

Yep, just walk into any pet store and tell them they are keeping there sulcatas to dry . They tell you I've been breeding and keeping them for years . You say the wrong way . They say get out . But keep trucking if you get one person to change your on the right road . Like all my racing friends say hammer down .

 

[Tom]

Welcome to MY world! Heather knows what I'm talking about.

I learned a technique along the way that helps. When I joined here I had lots of arguments about keeping sulcatas hot and humid. Over the years many other people have tried to shoot it down with a wide variety of tactics. I found the best way to end the argument was to put up or shut up. Hence came "The End of Pyramiding" thread. We could exchange words all day long and argue whatever points we wanted, but how do you argue with living, smooth, healthy, growing babies? Then to drive the point home, I did it again with leopards. Those pictures and stats said more than I ever could.

My point for you is, talk to some vets. They often hold on to old radiographs that show sand impaction. You could probably do an internet search and come up with some too. When people want to argue or don't believe you, simply start posting pics of sand impacted tortoises. What is there to argue after that?

 

[ShellyTurtlesCats]

Re: RE: Sand.

Welcome to MY world! Heather knows what I'm talking about.

I learned a technique along the way that helps. When I joined here I had lots of arguments about keeping sulcatas hot and humid. Over the years many other people have tried to shoot it down with a wide variety of tactics. I found the best way to end the argument was to put up or shut up. Hence came "The End of Pyramiding" thread. We could exchange words all day long and argue whatever points we wanted, but how do you argue with living, smooth, healthy, growing babies? Then to drive the point home, I did it again with leopards. Those pictures and stats said more than I ever could.

My point for you is, talk to some vets. They often hold on to old radiographs that show sand impaction. You could probably do an internet search and come up with some too. When people want to argue or don't believe you, simply start posting pics of sand impacted tortoises. What is there to argue after that?

I keep sending them here. Usually, they take a look and quit responding. Haha

_________
~ Shelly ~

 

[Levi the Leopard]

Welcome to MY world! Heather knows what I'm talking about.

ya but there is good company in "this world"

 

[Tom]

One other point to emphasize: It is likely that the first person who tells a pet store or long time keeper about this will be summarily dismissed, or sometimes worse. But keep in mind that that first person is planting a seed. The next 5 people that come along and say the same thing will also likely be shot down or ignored. Eventually, when they hear the same story from enough people, it will start to sink in and the info will start to be considered and husbandry changes possibly made. It takes time for people to trust, believe and accept new info.

Don't be afraid to plant that seed even though you may never see it grow. If you don't plant it, nobody else might plant it either.