Sphagnum moss feels cold

[fifthdawn]

The moss holds humidity real well for my redfoots but I notice it gets real cold since its wet. The air temps usually around 80 degrees but the moss feels like 50 or lower on touch.

I only have moss in my hide, the rest is cypress mulch. Cypress mulch dries up but the temps stays the same as air temp.

Is this normal for the moss? I removed the moss from my redfoot's hide for now until I find out more about it. I really love how it stays moist but the temp scares me.

 

[Yvonne G]

Anything below your body temperature of 98.6 is going to feel cool to cold to your touch.

Yvonne

 

[fifthdawn]

So you're saying they'll be okay?

Just wanna be sure. I feel a huge temperature difference between the moss and the mulch.

 

[Madkins007]

Actually measure the temp. If it is below about 80, consider something to warm it from above or below. I find that under-substrate heaters work nicely for this.

 

[sammi]

Actually measure the temp. If it is below about 80, consider something to warm it from above or below. I find that under-substrate heaters work nicely for this.

What exactly is an under-substrate heater?

 

[terryo]

I was using the moss in the hide, but since he came in for the Fall, I have been using leaf litter mixed with the Cyprus mulch, and find it stays warmer. Also my hide is a half log, and it is hard for the heat to penetrate that, so it will be a little cooler in there, but since the whole enclosure is maintained at 85 - 88 degrees, I think it's OK for the hide to be cooler...don't know for sure though.

 

[fifthdawn]

Hmm I used a water thermameter to measure so I'm not sure how accurate it is, but the moss itself is 70 degrees. The hide moss is 75 degrees. One of my other tort likes sleeping outside instead of hide iono why. But thats 85 degrees (only cypress mulch outside)

 

[Madkins007]

You can get cables and mats that plug in and generate heat. Reptile suppliers and greenhouse suppliers are the most common sources. The heaters should be regulated with a thermostat or other controller.

Some can be used right in wet soils, others attach to the bottom of glass aquaria, etc.

 

[Yvonne G]

I have a heater for seedlings. It is a piece of mylar with imbedded heat coils all throughout it. You are supposed to put it under your seedlings in the greenhouse:

http://www.growerssolution.com/page/GS/PROD/seedstarting/seedtrayheater

Yvonne

 

[fifthdawn]

Oh? I've read the thermostat can break sometimes and overheat? or is that only for heat rocks?

I have two Zoomed Repti Heat Cave http://www.reptilesupply.com/product.php?products_id=241 coming in. It provides heat upwards and downwards. So it should heat the air a bit and warm the substrate underneath. Any uses this before?

My enclosure is in a cardboard box so I can't place it under the box so I'll have to put it inside the box and under substrate. Is it the mat waterproof and will it catch fire with my substrate if anything goes wrong?

 

[llamas55]

Interesting. I wrote reptile supply to see the inside dimensions of that heat cave.
I use a T Rex Cobra Heat Mat large size, which is half in and half out of her log hide. It doesn't stay together that well after a year of dampness and humidity tho, but she likes it and it does not have a thermostat as I couldn't find one. Curious exactly where Emysemys and others have found the gardening mats and the price range.
I need to solve the ambient air temp as my ceramic heater is out of use until I solve the plastic cover melting problem and raise the cover (was thinking of a pvc structure). I would like to go to a pretty aquarium if I can find a sufficiently big bottomed one. My fish tank is 55 gal. and I can see too small for Tommi Tortoise. That way plants go in, humidity goes up, and the heat bulb won't overheat.

 

[terryo]

Interesting. I wrote reptile supply to see the inside dimensions of that heat cave.
I use a T Rex Cobra Heat Mat large size, which is half in and half out of her log hide. It doesn't stay together that well after a year of dampness and humidity tho, but she likes it and it does not have a thermostat as I couldn't find one. Curious exactly where Emysemys and others have found the gardening mats and the price range.
I need to solve the ambient air temp as my ceramic heater is out of use until I solve the plastic cover melting problem and raise the cover (was thinking of a pvc structure). I would like to go to a pretty aquarium if I can find a sufficiently big bottomed one. My fish tank is 55 gal. and I can see too small for Tommi Tortoise. That way plants go in, humidity goes up, and the heat bulb won't overheat.

I have mine in a 75 gal planted viv. and it is plenty big for now. In another year or so I will have to up grade, and was thinking of having one made to order. I started him in the 55. I put on a screen cover and made a hole in it for the heat emitter. On the other side I have the long tube 10.0. I have had no problems with that. The plants are the best to hold in humidity...IMHO. Some of it is covered with clear wrapping tape.

 

[Redfoot NERD]

Heat from BELOW is for big Galops, etc. designed to help with digestion.

At least one heat-emitter should be directly above the humid-hide. The temps IN the hide should be the warmest in the entire enclosure.

Yours are outside the hide because it's warmer there! They like the darkness instead of light.. and the heat and humidity best where they can crawl INTO the warm moss.

Keep in mind - unless or until you can create the "Micro-climate" that TerryO has.. her examples ONLY apply for that exact set-up! She has the AMBIENT temps and humidity perfect.. so take that into consideration when you provide the needs for your redfoot.

R Nerd

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Interesting. I wrote reptile supply to see the inside dimensions of that heat cave.
I use a T Rex Cobra Heat Mat large size, which is half in and half out of her log hide. It doesn't stay together that well after a year of dampness and humidity tho, but she likes it and it does not have a thermostat as I couldn't find one. Curious exactly where Emysemys and others have found the gardening mats and the price range.
I need to solve the ambient air temp as my ceramic heater is out of use until I solve the plastic cover melting problem and raise the cover (was thinking of a pvc structure). I would like to go to a pretty aquarium if I can find a sufficiently big bottomed one. My fish tank is 55 gal. and I can see too small for Tommi Tortoise. That way plants go in, humidity goes up, and the heat bulb won't overheat.

Plastic cover melting.. ? What is that about?

A dimmer switch on your heat-emitter will adjust the temps exactly as you need them. Unfortunately the "server" for Turtletary is down so maybe you can see what I'm talking about here.. [ you may even know this ].. http://www.redfoots.com/emitter/color.htm

R NERD

 

[Madkins007]

Curious exactly where Emysemys and others have found the gardening mats and the price range.

Doing a google search for soil warming mat (or cable) shows a lot of good results. www.charleysgreenhouse.com has a nice selection. There are 'automatic' cables that only hit the low 70's, and 'manual' cables that need a thermostat, and a selection of mats as well.

Big Apple Herp and others offer FlexWatt, a 3 or 11" wide strip with heating elements built in that you finish wiring and can use, with proper insulating, in wet soils. (Which is kind of redundant, most soil heating elements work in wet soils, as it is the moisture that carries the heat around.)

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Keep in mind - unless or until you can create the "Micro-climate" that TerryO has.. her examples ONLY apply for that exact set-up! She has the AMBIENT temps and humidity perfect.. so take that into consideration when you provide the needs for your redfoot.

R NERD

True- but doesn't that also apply to your set-up? I matched your set-up as closely as I could at first, but with the differences in room temps and humidities between Tennessee and Nebraska, I had to make some adjustments to the program.

Galapagos and other herps benefit from HEATING from below- we are just talking about WARMING from below to offset the cooling effect of damp substrates.


As long as we are on the topic...

Wild torts live on sun-warmed soil, but in some of our habitats, the heating elements cannot heat the moist substrate enough to keep the temps up- especially if the room is cool, or the habitat sits in a way that there is cooler air below it. The heating element heats the top layer, and the heat rises, bringing cooler temps from below.

We can help some with good insulation, but gentle warmth from below does this just as well, with the added benefit of increased humidity and usually the ability to drop the overhead temps a little as well.

Of course, if the air around the habitat is already warm, then none of this really applies!