Tortoise enclosure update

[CaggyQ]

Hi everyone,

I want to give my little buddy a new enclosure to match my office, but I want to make it myself to avoid excessive design costs and make it look good (it's in my office, where I work). I was looking at bookshelves as a starting point, but am I right in saying something like this could be toxic?

Link: https://www.ikea.com/ie/en/p/billy-bookcase-white-00263850/

I was then thinking of using these to convert it into a table: https://www.ikea.com/ie/en/p/kallax-shelving-unit-white-20275814/

Let me know what you think, and feel free to share any ideas you may have. I want him to be happy and healthy, and to have an enclosure that is safe, tidy, and presentable!
Caggy Q and Yoshi

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Hi everyone,

I want to give my little buddy a new enclosure to match my office, but I want to make it myself to avoid excessive design costs and make it look good (it's in my office, where I work). I was looking at bookshelves as a starting point, but am I right in saying something like this could be toxic?

Link: https://www.ikea.com/ie/en/p/billy-bookcase-white-00263850/

I was then thinking of using these to convert it into a table: https://www.ikea.com/ie/en/p/kallax-shelving-unit-white-20275814/

Let me know what you think, and feel free to share any ideas you may have. I want him to be happy and healthy, and to have an enclosure that is safe, tidy, and presentable!
Caggy Q and Yoshi

Hello! I don't think that there is something toxic.

However, "Billy" line of furniture is basically pressed sawdust wrapped in laminated paper: cheap, fragile and not moisture-resistant. Not sure about "Kallax", though.

You can use these shelving units as a base, cover all the insides with a pond liner, reinforce the bottom and so on. Shelves can be used to build a frame for hanging lights.

 

[CaggyQ]

Hello! I don't think that there is something toxic.

However, "Billy" line of furniture is basically pressed sawdust wrapped in laminated paper: cheap, fragile and not moisture-resistant. Not sure about "Kallax", though.

You can use these shelving units as a base, cover all the insides with a pond liner, reinforce the bottom and so on. Shelves can be used to build a frame for hanging lights.

Thank you so much for this! do you think I could use laminate flooring as well to reinforce the bottom and then put pond liner on top of that? Just to make it extra waterproof! I am going to recycle some of his old materials for it as well: he has a lighting setup with rod poles that I’m going to screw into his new enclosure. He deserves new digs. He has quickly grown out of what he currently has!

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Thank you so much for this! do you think I could use laminate flooring as well to reinforce the bottom and then put pond liner on top of that? Just to make it extra waterproof! I am going to recycle some of his old materials for it as well: he has a lighting setup with rod poles that I’m going to screw into his new enclosure. He deserves new digs. He has quickly grown out of what he currently has!

I'm not sure if laminate flooring is rigid enough. A sheet of plywood (or OCB) should be more suitable.
Maybe it's worth looking into expanded PVC sheets (with enclosure standing on the floor, you can use just PVC cement to assemble it from pre-cut panels).

 

[NYJoe]

Hi everyone,

I want to give my little buddy a new enclosure to match my office, but I want to make it myself to avoid excessive design costs and make it look good (it's in my office, where I work). I was looking at bookshelves as a starting point, but am I right in saying something like this could be toxic?

Link: https://www.ikea.com/ie/en/p/billy-bookcase-white-00263850/

I was then thinking of using these to convert it into a table: https://www.ikea.com/ie/en/p/kallax-shelving-unit-white-20275814/

Let me know what you think, and feel free to share any ideas you may have. I want him to be happy and healthy, and to have an enclosure that is safe, tidy, and presentable!
Caggy Q and Yoshi

Your biggest challenge for an office enclosure is size. A red foot needs some space. An outdoor garden is best with indoor enclosures used for cold seasonal weather.

 

[CaggyQ]

Your biggest challenge for an office enclosure is size. A red foot needs some space. An outdoor garden is best with indoor enclosures used for cold seasonal weather.

Such a valuable point, but unfortunately Yoshi hails from Ireland. So keeping him inside and cosy is a must! He’s also a Russian tortoise - that’s also another reason why I’m upgrading cause he’s grown out of his current one

 

[CaggyQ]

I'm not sure if laminate flooring is rigid enough. A sheet of plywood (or OCB) should be more suitable.
Maybe it's worth looking into expanded PVC sheets (with enclosure standing on the floor, you can use just PVC cement to assemble it from pre-cut panels).

Brilliant. I’ll look into that! I’ll send photo updates as it progresses

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

I'm not sure if laminate flooring is rigid enough. A sheet of plywood (or OCB) should be more suitable.
Maybe it's worth looking into expanded PVC sheets (with enclosure standing on the floor, you can use just PVC cement to assemble it from pre-cut panels).

I’m thinking she meant to put the laminate flooring over the more robust base.

Brilliant. I’ll look into that! I’ll send photo updates as it progresses

Look forward to seeing what you come up with!

 

[CaggyQ]

Hi everyone! Little update: his enclosure is going to be constructed this weekend. He needs it a wider one just to facilitate roaming. I have a little side question - I’m using Mediterranean soil tortoise substrate, and it’s drying out pretty quickly. How can I keep it most without potentially damaging lights? I live in Ireland, and I’m constantly battling to get the best substrate to encourage his natural digging behaviours. I’d love to make my own but I’m concerned about buying the wrong mix (includes fertilizer etc). Seeing as he’s hedging a lovely new setup over the weekend, if you could also share some ideas regarding this, that would be super.

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Hi everyone! Little update: his enclosure is going to be constructed this weekend. He needs it a wider one just to facilitate roaming. I have a little side question - I’m using Mediterranean soil tortoise substrate, and it’s drying out pretty quickly. How can I keep it most without potentially damaging lights? I live in Ireland, and I’m constantly battling to get the best substrate to encourage his natural digging behaviours. I’d love to make my own but I’m concerned about buying the wrong mix (includes fertilizer etc). Seeing as he’s hedging a lovely new setup over the weekend, if you could also share some ideas regarding this, that would be super.

Hey! Yay how exciting

If wanting a soil like substrate I’d recommend damp coco coir, though if I’m being 100% honest, I’m not personally the biggest fan of coir, or at least not on its own, don’t get me wrong it’s perfectly safe for use and works really well when maintained properly, hence it’s on my recommended substrate list, I just found it was trickier to maintain than something like orchid bark. The thing with the coir, it dries out on top quite quickly which can make it rather messy, you’ll probably have to keep spraying the top down for it to not go everywhere, you have to pay extra attention in making sure it’s all staying damp, as when left to dry it can technically draw moisture from the environment itself, firmly press it down with your hand so it’s not left loose and fluffy, that’ll dry it out quicker. Once you’re in the swing of maintenance it’s not too bad, but I have had people say they found it difficult at first, sometimes it’s easy to add too much moisture and you end up with a rather unpleasant standing water smell, I’d recommend giving it a regular mix to avoid this.
It does make for a good substrate for species that like a good dig, so it’s probably still worth the try for you! Just wanted to give you the heads up so you know what to expect, I’m sure you’ll soon figure out the up keep of it though, do a lukewarm water pour into the corners once a week or so, giving it a good mix and press down, do a little at a time.

I do think it tends to work better as a base, with a generous layer of orchid bark on top, it stops that top layer getting so messy and helps lock the moisture in. Or you could opt to use orchid bark on its own, though it is generally more expensive to do so, I will say you can make bark last a very long time in a large set up, as long as your doing daily spot cleans of any old food or poop etc, you can actually make it go up to a year or more in an appropriate sized enclosure

 

[CaggyQ]

Hey! Yay how exciting

If wanting a soil like substrate I’d recommend damp coco coir, though if I’m being 100% honest, I’m not personally the biggest fan of coir, or at least not on its own, don’t get me wrong it’s perfectly safe for use and works really well when maintained properly, hence it’s on my recommended substrate list, I just found it was trickier to maintain than something like orchid bark. The thing with the coir, it dries out on top quite quickly which can make it rather messy, you’ll probably have to keep spraying the top down for it to not go everywhere, you have to pay extra attention in making sure it’s all staying damp, as when left to dry it can technically draw moisture from the environment itself, firmly press it down with your hand so it’s not left loose and fluffy, that’ll dry it out quicker. Once you’re in the swing of maintenance it’s not too bad, but I have had people say they found it difficult at first, sometimes it’s easy to add too much moisture and you end up with a rather unpleasant standing water smell, I’d recommend giving it a regular mix to avoid this.
It does make for a good substrate for species that like a good dig, so it’s probably still worth the try for you! Just wanted to give you the heads up so you know what to expect, I’m sure you’ll soon figure out the up keep of it though, do a lukewarm water pour into the corners once a week or so, giving it a good mix and press down, do a little at a time.

I do think it tends to work better as a base, with a generous layer of orchid bark on top, it stops that top layer getting so messy and helps lock the moisture in. Or you could opt to use orchid bark on its own, though it is generally more expensive to do so, I will say you can make bark last a very long time in a large set up, as long as your doing daily spot cleans of any old food or poop etc, you can actually make it go up to a year or more in an appropriate sized enclosure

As always, thank you so much for all of your advice - @Littleredfootbigredheart! I am not the biggest fan of coir myself... It dries out very quickly. I have gotten a Mediterranean sand/soil mix and some orchid bark to offer more enrichment. I want him to be able to dig in deep! I also found a great website called "The Tortoise Hut"; they supply plants/seeds/substrates that are tortoise-approved. Now, I can't get some of their substrates because I am based in Ireland, but I have gotten some of the live plants for Yoshi to trash/hide under. I was also wondering about moss: I was going to place some of it in his two hides to add a little humidity. Have you used that before? Knowing Yoshi, he may take a nibble, so I am not sure this is the best idea!

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

As always, thank you so much for all of your advice - @Littleredfootbigredheart! I am not the biggest fan of coir myself... It dries out very quickly. I have gotten a Mediterranean sand/soil mix and some orchid bark to offer more enrichment. I want him to be able to dig in deep! I also found a great website called "The Tortoise Hut"; they supply plants/seeds/substrates that are tortoise-approved. Now, I can't get some of their substrates because I am based in Ireland, but I have gotten some of the live plants for Yoshi to trash/hide under. I was also wondering about moss: I was going to place some of it in his two hides to add a little humidity. Have you used that before? Knowing Yoshi, he may take a nibble, so I am not sure this is the best idea!

I think the main drawbacks with those soil mixes is unfortunately some folks have reported the sand in them has been ingested by their tortoise over time, which can sometimes lead to blockages, some have noted the sand seems to have caused eye/respiratory irritation in captivity, I don’t think they make the nicest consistency either when trying to add the moisture, kind of sticks to everythingI definitely understand wanting him to have a good dig though, perhaps you could primarily switch to orchid bark, and create smaller sections of coir that are easier for you to reach and keep on top of moisture wise? I’m thinking it’d help eliminate the mess it causes whilst still offering enrichment of a soil like substrate

Yes the tortoise hut is great! I’ve ordered some great quality plants from there! I couldn’t get most of them to hold up in the enclosure lol, so I opted to have them as house plants I can take cuttings of to offer
This is another great site! Not sure if they ship to you?

Live Plants & Seeds | Tortoise Den

www.tortoise-den.co.uk

I wouldn’t add the moss no, it can definitely pose an impaction hazard if eaten, if wanting to create a humid hide, I’d use an opaque tub, turned upside down with an entrance, plastic is good at holding the humidity with damp substrate inside

 

[COmtnLady]

Somehow I missed this when it first began. Sorry to be late to the party.

The glue that holds particleboard together makes me ill if I breathe it/near it, and I am in a room that is larger than a tortoise enclosure, where I can walk away from the bad influence. Thus, I would be concerned about putting my tortoise in a closed space made of it. Then there is the problem, as stated above, of it not doing well when it gets wet/damp. (Though its kind of fun to watch it puff up and shed sawdust all over the place.)

Real wood planks/boards and 2x4s, sealed/painted to make them impervious, and lined with a water-proof sheet, would be a lot better to use, in my never-to-be-humble opinion.

 

[CaggyQ]

Hi everyone! So sorry for not updating: had a busy few months. So I have acquired a raised plant bed that’s large enough to be a tortoise table. I got some pond liner too for the inner lining, and have been buying some pot plants for tort friendly plants for him to hide I have a substrate question though: would this playsand work for Yoshi? I want to offer him different substrate types to keep him happy. It is becoming so incredibly difficult to get appropriate substrate for him here!

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Hi everyone! So sorry for not updating: had a busy few months. So I have acquired a raised plant bed that’s large enough to be a tortoise table. I got some pond liner too for the inner lining, and have been buying some pot plants for tort friendly plants for him to hide I have a substrate question though: would this playsand work for Yoshi? I want to offer him different substrate types to keep him happy. It is becoming so incredibly difficult to get appropriate substrate for him here!

Hello!
I would not buy it. It's an impaction risk. Plain loose sand is not very natural for them either.

Coco coir works okay indoors. If you want to provide him different textures and enrichment you can add areas with slate or large flat pebbles, cork bark flats, orchid bark etc.

A replaceable tray with freshly sprouted greens, I guess, will make him happier than a sandbox.

 

[CaggyQ]

Hello!
I would not buy it. It's an impaction risk. Plain loose sand is not very natural for them either.

Coco coir works okay indoors. If you want to provide him different textures and enrichment you can add areas with slate or large flat pebbles, cork bark flats, orchid bark etc.

A replaceable tray with freshly sprouted greens, I guess, will make him happier than a sandbox.

Hi Alex,

You’re a superstar - thank you for the update! The idea of a tray with freshly sprouted greens is a brilliant idea. He’d love that! I’ve also ready ordered some orchid bark; I think I’ll get some large flat pebbles for him to try as well. Just want to keep him engaged and happy.

 

[COmtnLady]

The word "pebbles" concerns me. Large flat stones that can be walked across and pushed around are fine, anything smaller, especially that can even marginally fit into a mouth, can kill your tortoise. Even if you think its too big, trust your tortoise to try to fit it into its mouth. So, nothing smaller than your palm.

 

[CaggyQ]

Yes, @COmtnLady I’m aware of that, but thank you for checking in