using vitamin suppliments
- Thread starter zekie
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Y'all are talking about two different issues here. Calcium supplementation is one thing and vitamin supplementation is another. It seems that the Repashy stuff in the OP might be some sort of combination of the two. I'm not familiar with that product.
I tend to side with GB here, but not all the way. If your set-up and diet is good, you shouldn't need a whole lot of supplementation, if any.
Here's what I do: For babies, calcium, with no D3, 2 or 3 times a week and vitamins once a week. For adults, calcium once or twice a month and almost never on the vitamins. I do all of this in very small amounts and I don't use D3 or any UV lights as all of mine get regular sun. I also leave cuttle bones around, but they almost never touch them. I supplement because of that "just in case" factor. I'm pretty sure my diet and routine are adequate, but just in case I'm wrong, a little supplementation shouldn't hurt.
Since I do mostly sulcatas, the amount of growing they do makes me worry that they need a little more than some other species. They can go from a few grams at hatching to over 100 pounds in 10 years! Since I don't use D3 and I go very light with the vitamins, I figure a little shouldn't hurt and it COULD help.
I tend to side with GB here, but not all the way. If your set-up and diet is good, you shouldn't need a whole lot of supplementation, if any.
Here's what I do: For babies, calcium, with no D3, 2 or 3 times a week and vitamins once a week. For adults, calcium once or twice a month and almost never on the vitamins. I do all of this in very small amounts and I don't use D3 or any UV lights as all of mine get regular sun. I also leave cuttle bones around, but they almost never touch them. I supplement because of that "just in case" factor. I'm pretty sure my diet and routine are adequate, but just in case I'm wrong, a little supplementation shouldn't hurt.
Since I do mostly sulcatas, the amount of growing they do makes me worry that they need a little more than some other species. They can go from a few grams at hatching to over 100 pounds in 10 years! Since I don't use D3 and I go very light with the vitamins, I figure a little shouldn't hurt and it COULD help.
Tom said:
I'm afraid I've learned the hard way about calcium supplementing. My two Aldabran tortoises were raised as naturally as is possible for a captive tortoise. For most of their life they were only fed whatever grazing they were able to do in their pen. Just within the last year, I've started feeding one meal a week of Mazuri tortoise diet.
I'm now seeing the sunken-over-the-hips look of mild MBD, and BO rarely walks up tall on his legs. He doesn't really drag along, but he's obviously weak in his legs. They both are 10 years old and weigh a little more than 110lbs.
I've bought a bottle of liquid calcium and I'm going to inject a fruit or veggie with the calcium every day from now on. And I'm going to be adding a few drops of liquid bird vitamins to their weekly Mazuri meal.
emysemys said:
Ouch! That had to be hard to type. Thanks for sharing, Yvonne.
So let me be clear, you are advocating more calcium supplementation for species that grow large and fast, right? Do you think I'm under doing it?
As long as you are not using a calcium supplement with added D3, you can't over do it right? Excess calcium will just pass through the GI tract unused, right? Or does it mess with the balance of other minerals?
I though I was all squared away on this one, now you are making me rethink what I thought I already knew.
C
champeter
Guest
The most popular method of adding additional calcium to food items is in the form of cuttlefish bone, many pet shops stock this for cage birds, some keepers prefer to soak this cuttlefish in water and dry it before hand to reduce the odour.Propagate your own supply and leave enough behind, this way you will not devastate the wild populations.
Tom-From my research on the subject I agree with your statement that you can't overdo the pure calcium. It is water soluble. There are some really rare cases of health issues from too much, but the amount of calcium to do that would be so high that it would be tough to get a tort to actually ingest that much. I am comfortable giving my hatchling/yearling daily calcium and when he gets to be a few years old then I'll do every other day. Although I sprinkle his food heavily and wet it down to try and get the calcium to sprinkle, the amount that actually gets in his tummy is quite small. His diet isn't as good as I'd want it to be (good grocery greens, but no garden stuff), so I think its even more important. Torts growing faster (like in captivity a lot of times) and those laying eggs would need more than just a regular growing tort. I don't use vitamins except some TNT powder 1-2 days a week.
tortoisenerd said:
That was a question, not a statement. I remember reading something years ago that said while excess calcium carbonate is not toxic, it can and does interfere with the balance and absorption of other minerals and trace elements. This is why I decided years ago to only use a little bit a couple times a week. I've never raised a Galop or Aldab, so I don't know if those need more or not. My sulcatas have always done well on my routine, but mine ARE very undersized for their age. Maybe mine did fine, because I was growing them so slowly.
I don't have the answer to this one, so I'll happily defer to someone with more experience or practical knowledge on the subject. I just know what has worked for for me.
I don't remember reading anything about it interfering with the absorption of other minerals so I'd be interested to see that. Hopefully someone else has an answer for you.
tortoisenerd said:
"Excessively high levels of calcium in the blood known as hypercalcemia impair kidney function, and lead to reduced absorption of other essential minerals, such as iron, zinc, magnesium, and phosphorus [1,116-119]. However, hypercalcemia rarely results from dietary or supplemental calcium intake and is most commonly associated with hyperparathyroidism, advanced cases of cancer or excessive intakes of vitamin D from supplements at doses of 50,000 IU/day or higher "
(http://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/calcium.asp)
This is talking about humans. Some other references also mention that too much calcium can interfere with iron, etc. but that it may happen more readily in small animals overfed calcium regularly.
To me, the fact that nutrient A can interfere with nutrient B and C is just another reason for a varied, healthy diet.
M
mjecson
Guest
You can use any of the supplements for the pet but it is necessary that it Will like that and progress should be noticed by you. Actually supplement can give you the best support to grow the pet very easily without any food defects. I personally recommend the supplement for the pets.
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