Yet another shell question

[Macaulay]

Hi there everyone. I have come across this forum many times and read lots of posts, however I have never had a need to post until now.

To preface, I have read all the shell related questions, but would still like some opinions. I am feeling like a bad tortoise keeper this month. I lost a 3 month old hatchling to unknown causes and found a few of my torts to have some questionable marks on their shells. I haven't been able to take care of my torts much this year due to on and off illnesses that I have had, so the care has fallen to my husband and he is still learning.

So here's the situation. I have 2 sets of hatchlings that live together. 1 ground hatched in September and the other in November. A couple of weeks ago an individual from the November hatching died suddenly with no prior symptoms. Now today I noticed some marks on the plastrons of 2 of the September individuals. For the picture of the baby with the spot in the upper leg region, ignore the substrate on the lower belly.

Plus last night my husband found some damage to the plastron of my adult females. Her plastron really looks to be shell rot. For the babies, I'm not so sure.

 

[Tom]

What species? Russians?

Are you in West TX where its dry, or South East Texas where its wet?

Ground hatched babies are often compromised because they haven't been cared for and hydrated as well as they should be. It takes me months to get most ground hatched babies up to the level of their siblings that I hatch in my incubator and start correctly from day one. Do these babies live outside, or are they indoors with stable controlled temps and daily soaks?

I'm more worried about the over all husbandry than I am the shells.

 

[Macaulay]

What species? Russians?

Are you in West TX where its dry, or South East Texas where its wet?

Ground hatched babies are often compromised because they haven't been cared for and hydrated as well as they should be. It takes me months to get most ground hatched babies up to the level of their siblings that I hatch in my incubator and start correctly from day one. Do these babies live outside, or are they indoors with stable controlled temps and daily soaks?

I'm more worried about the over all husbandry than I am the shells.

These are eastern Hermann's. The September group did hatch outside but I was able to find 3 of them within 2-3 days of them hatching and brought them inside. They have been inside since. They seem to be growing well and have good appetites. They get a mix of produce and yard collected greens. They typically soak daily but I have not been able to attend to them much in the last 2 months so I can't say their conditions are as ideal as I would want. I am planning to remedy the husbandy ASAP. The others hatched inside. I happened to see my female laying the eggs and was able to collect them. One of those was the one that died.

I am in south east Texas. My adults live outside most or all of the year. I've brought them in the past 2 winters due to the crazy unexpected freezes we've had. They have brumated underground in recent years. They are currently inside/outside depending on weather lately.

 

[Tom]

These are eastern Hermann's. The September group did hatch outside but I was able to find 3 of them within 2-3 days of them hatching and brought them inside. They have been inside since. They seem to be growing well and have good appetites. They get a mix of produce and yard collected greens. They typically soak daily but I have not been able to attend to them much in the last 2 months so I can't say their conditions are as ideal as I would want. I am planning to remedy the husbandy ASAP. The others hatched inside. I happened to see my female laying the eggs and was able to collect them. One of those was the one that died.

I am in south east Texas. My adults live outside most or all of the year. I've brought them in the past 2 winters due to the crazy unexpected freezes we've had. They have brumated underground in recent years. They are currently inside/outside depending on weather lately.

Well you have eliminated most of what I suspected. Let's look elsewhere.

What substrate are they on, and how damp is it?

 

[Macaulay]

I had a layer of eco earth with cypress mulch on top. They are currently housed in a 3ft long by 18in wide plastic bin with 3/4 of the bin covered to retain humidity.

I keep the humidity in the upper 70-85% range. Overall room humidity is typically between 40-65%.

Yesterday upon inspection of the babies, I felt the substrate could possibly be too wet near the water dish, but the other side of the bin was dry. So it's not like they are constantly damp.

I've had success with this set up for 3 other hatchlings, that I've raised, so I'm at a loss right now.

 

[wellington]

First if you have all five in this very small 3 foot x 18 inch enclosure I would separate the bigger ones from the smaller ones. A size usually used for one hatchling is 4x2 foot. The bigger ones could hurt and stress out the smaller ones.
Other than that, not sure what your concern is?

 

[Macaulay]

First if you have all five in this very small 3 foot x 18 inch enclosure I would separate the bigger ones from the smaller ones. A size usually used for one hatchling is 4x2 foot. The bigger ones could hurt and stress out the smaller ones.
Other than that, not sure what your concern is?

I didn't want to put them together but ran out of room. I honestly wasn't anticipating this many babies this year. I am in the process of correcting the situation. I guess I was having a moment of feeling like a failure at something I thought I was decent at and was worried had caused harm to my animals by not being as attentive as I usually am.

I believe a couple of the babies might have a bit of plastron fungus but I am confused as to why that would be unless the overcrowding was a major contribution and not the substrates wetness level 🤔

Anyway, I appreciate the input from the both of you. I've found some useful information from the guides posted that I will incorporate and i will ge some more habitats set up to separate the groups.

Thanks!

 

[Tom]

... so I'm at a loss right now.

Me too. You appear to be doing everything "right", so I don't see a reason for the problem. This species is not prone to shell rot, and even if you kept them swampy on wet substrate all the time, they wouldn't get shell rot.

If all else is good, like appetite, activity, hydration, etc..., I would keep an eye on these areas, but not worry too much about it.

 

[wellington]

If you want to put some athletes foot cream on the areas, it wouldn't hurt and if it is a fungus it would help. Do it daily after a warm water soak, dry the areas off and rub in a little of the cream. Be sure to wipe away the days before application of the cream during the soak.