New owner, does my Sulcata have a neurological disorder?

[ccjcc81]

Hi friends.

My family got our first reptile 2 days ago; a baby Sulcata that my son named Jerry Larry. He seems healthy; he eats and moves around. But he has a weird behavior; when he's perfectly still, he spasms. He does it quite frequently. Here's a video. Does he have a neurological disorder or something? Also, the first time I soaked him, he had a healthy BM, but there was some crusty, chunky, flaky white substance on the bottom of the bowl after. I can't tell where it came from.

I cut a small video of his spasms, can you watch it and tell me what you think he's doing? Is it normal, or should I be concerned? Thanks!

 

[zolasmum]

Hi friends.

My family got our first reptile 2 days ago; a baby Sulcata that my son named Jerry Larry. He seems healthy; he eats and moves around. But he has a weird behavior; when he's perfectly still, he spasms. He does it quite frequently. Here's a video. Does he have a neurological disorder or something? Also, the first time I soaked him, he had a healthy BM, but there was some crusty, chunky, flaky white substance on the bottom of the bowl after. I can't tell where it came from.

I cut a small video of his spasms, can you watch it and tell me what you think he's doing? Is it normal, or should I be concerned? Thanks!

Hello and welcome. My computer won't let me upload your video, but I can reassure you that the white stuff your tortoise excreted is something called urates - this is something some tortoises produce every day, and some produce less often. It is a way of getting rid of impurities etc Totally normal - in fact it shows his insides are functioning well.
It can sometimes look like toothpaste.
He looks a real sweetie.
Angie

 

[Ink]

Hopefully @Tom can help you out. What are your temperatures? Welcome

 

[Markw84]

Welcome to the forum. You have found the best place for tortoise information. Please browse and ask questions!

I see nothing alarming. The "spasms" you are seeing are how they breathe. With no diaphragm, they need to pump their legs and throat to breathe, especially when they are trying to smell and figure out what is going on around them. I did see just a bit of stretching the head and neck out and back in to breathe at least once in the soak. If isolated, that is OK but if that persists, that is a possible indication of a respiratory infection and difficulty in breathing.

The hard white is urates, but hard is not a good thing. You want more of a toothpaste consistency. The hard indicated a degree of dehydration and possibly being kept too cold at night. The start of pyramiding also shows the tortoise has been kept too dry. Be sure to read the care sheet here and really compare to the methods you are using to ensure you are giving your tortoise the best care you can.

The Best Way To Raise A Sulcata, Leopard, Or Star Tortoise

I chose the title of this care sheet very carefully. Are there other ways to raise babies? Yes. Yes there are, but those ways are not as good. What follows is the BEST way, according to 30 years of research and experimentation with hundreds of babies of many species. Babies hatch during the...

www.tortoiseforum.org

 

[Gillian M]

Welcome to the forum.

Your cute little tortoise seems fine. I do not think there's anything to worry about, but we'll ask @Yvonne G to confirm.

 

[ccjcc81]

Great info. I've seen him stretch his neck like that a couple of times, but only when soaking. I haven't seen him do that outside of his soaking tub. I'm currently redesigning his enclosure. I built a tortoise table before I got him, but I read Tom's guide the day after getting him. I'm considering using walls and a top to enclose the habitat, but that might not be feasible for us right now, so I'm also going to research how to keep him hydrated in the current setup, if that's possible. I'm soaking him daily and trying to keep his substrate moist. I'm also working on his temps, they may be too high right under the hotspot of his light. I'll keep reading. Thanks for helping. More advise is certainly welcome.

 

[Gillian M]

Great info. I've seen him stretch his neck like that a couple of times, but only when soaking. I haven't seen him do that outside of his soaking tub. I'm currently redesigning his enclosure. I built a tortoise table before I got him, but I read Tom's guide the day after getting him. I'm considering using walls and a top to enclose the habitat, but that might not be feasible for us right now, so I'm also going to research how to keep him hydrated in the current setup, if that's possible. I'm soaking him daily and trying to keep his substrate moist. I'm also working on his temps, they may be too high right under the hotspot of his light. I'll keep reading. Thanks for helping. More advise is certainly welcome.

Any images of your tort's enclosure?

 

[ccjcc81]

You're already seeing signs of pyramiding?

Here is the current enclosure. It's 18"x38". I'm preparing another one now which should be about 32"x70", hopefully that one will last a while before he outgrows it.

 

[ccjcc81]

Oh, and another question. I read that sullies need grass, not lettuce, but I didn't read until yesterday that they won't eat hay yet. Unfortunately my grass has been treated with chemicals, so I was planning to grow a bunch of wheat grass wherever I can. Unfortunately I need it now, are there places where you can go buy grown fresh wheatgrass? If I can't find any, what would be better than Romaine until I can get some tort food or wheatgrass shipped? What's the best food pellet? And the cuttlebone, just any bird cuttlebone? Do you think I could get wheatgrass to grow right there in the enclosure?

 

[Ray--Opo]

Welcome, when I was growing wheatgrass. I used 3 small terracotta flower pots. Planted the seeds in 3 day intervals. That way each pot will be at a different stage of growing. Then I would take scissors and cut 1/2" peices on top of his food. Iceberg is the worst, romaine and other lettuces are fine. But look at the caresheets for food. There are many greens to feed. Do not feed fruit or carrots because of the sugar content. Mazuri tortoise diet is good also. It has needed vitamins in it. The 5m21 type of mazuri is more desirable to torts opposed to the mazuri LS. Since he is so small you can find smaller bags online. Feed about 8 pellets twice a week and soak them in water just to soften up. Try not to get to mushy. Do you soak Jerry Larry daily for 1/2 hour? Use a small container big enough for him to turn around with sides tall enough for him not to see out. Keep the water warm at all time during the 1/2 hour.
One of the best tools you can get for many reasons checking the soaking water and different locations in the enclosure. Is a infrared temp sensor. Well worth the money, just don't point at anyone's eyes human or animal. You can temporarily cover your enclosure with tin foil to help hold in humidity and heat. Humidity should be at 80% or above. But soon you will need a bigger enclosure with a solid top. 2 of these hydrometers will be needed to place in the enclosure at your torts level.

Om

 

[zolasmum]

Cuttle bone as sold for birds is fine - I think it often has a metal clip on it, which you should obviously remove - he may take a while to show any interest - just leave it out for him all the time. Zola loved it for a while, but then lost interest - I still leave it in hope !
Angie

 

[wellington]

Get the table enclosed asap. You can add a few pieces of 2x4's and drape plastic over the frame. Open tables can't hold in heat or humidity.
Basking should be 95-100 the rest of the area should be 80 day and night.
Grocery store greens like endive, radicchio, mustard and collard greens, spring mix without spinach, dandelion greens, optunia cactus pads thorns removed can be fed along with some romaine. Add soaked mazuri tortoise food to the diet as well. A wide variety is better then just one thing.
Soak twice a day in warm water until the urates get creamy like tooth paste then once daily until around 3 years then can cut back. The closed chamber also for around 3 years of age.

 

[ccjcc81]

Dude! Draped plastic is a fantastic idea, I wouldn't have thought of that. I'm going to need to re-think my light and CHE fixtures. What wattage will I need for the fixtures and bulbs for a covered habitat? It's probably going to take me about a month to recover from the expense of the current habitat. I'm now broke after having spent $200 in habitat supplies and $150 on the tort. How much harm will be done if I can't get the habitat covered for a month?

 

[lynnefay]

Oh, and another question. I read that sullies need grass, not lettuce, but I didn't read until yesterday that they won't eat hay yet. Unfortunately my grass has been treated with chemicals, so I was planning to grow a bunch of wheat grass wherever I can. Unfortunately I need it now, are there places where you can go buy grown fresh wheatgrass? If I can't find any, what would be better than Romaine until I can get some tort food or wheatgrass shipped? What's the best food pellet? And the cuttlebone, just any bird cuttlebone? Do you think I could get wheatgrass to grow right there in the enclosure?

natural grocery stores carry wheat grass. mazuri pellets, softened

 

[ccjcc81]

I'm not sure I'm in love with this light fixture setup I have to regulate heat. I have 1 200w fixture with a 100w mercury vapor bulb and another 250w fixture with a 150w (I think) CHE. What is a better solution with a thermostat to regulate heat that won't break the bank?

I see that mercury vapor bulbs are not ideal, but because I completely built the wrong habitat I'm going to have to prioritize the corrections as I can't afford to re-do it all at once right now.

 

[KarenSoCal]

If you want more options for a closed chamber, read this post. It shows different ways to enclose an area.

Hi! New here

Hey! I am looking for the "frequently asked questions" and do not see it. Can someone guide me? Thanks

www.tortoiseforum.org

For more info on Mark's smart enclosures, he has a FB page. You can also contact him by PM. Check post # 4...that's him.

Smart Tortoise Keeper | Sacramento CA

Smart Tortoise Keeper, Sacramento, California. 1,606 likes. Designer, Engineer and Builder of Smart Reptile Enclosures. Precise environmental control habitats

www.facebook.com

 

[ccjcc81]

Ok, here's the best I could do for now. 71"x24"x24", enclosed on 5 sides with plastic on the 6th, velcro'd. How long can this enclosure keep him healthy?

I have hygrometers in the mail, should arrive today. Can someone recommend the best way to provide regulated heat for an enclosure this size? The CHE I'm using is too cold off and too hot on. I'd also like to get some better lighting with UV, any suggestions? Being outdoors is out of the question until probably late March.

Any other suggestions?

Thanks guys and gals.

 

[KarenSoCal]

What a great improvement in his enclosure!

To regulate the heat, you need to put the CHE on a thermostat, so it only comes on as needed, and shuts off when the temp is a bit above the set value. There are many kinds/brands, but I use a Zilla. Mine isn't digital, but here's a nice one. It's good to have more than one plug in on it...you might need a 2nd heat source down the line. You could plug both into the same t'stat (just don't exceed 1000 watts!)

For UVB, you want this:

https://www.petsmart.com/reptile/environmental-control-and-lighting/light-fixtures/arcadia-reptile-prot5-uv-b-kit-65058.html

The problem is that they are backordered everywhere. If you can find one, you want the 24" fixture, which takes a 22" bulb. You would need the 12% or 14%...not 6%.

When you are able to replace the merc vapor, you'll want to get an incandescent flood bulb...notice, flood, not spot. Try a 65 watt first, and raise or lower the bulb to get the right temp.

I don't know how long he will be able to stay in his new enclosure. Maybe you could start planning for the future by figuring out how you could double the width from 2 ft to 4 ft. You could make "doorways" for him to go from one side to the other side. They're smart...they learn things like that very quickly.

 

[ccjcc81]

What a great improvement in his enclosure!

To regulate the heat, you need to put the CHE on a thermostat, so it only comes on as needed, and shuts off when the temp is a bit above the set value. There are many kinds/brands, but I use a Zilla. Mine isn't digital, but here's a nice one. It's good to have more than one plug in on it...you might need a 2nd heat source down the line. You could plug both into the same t'stat (just don't exceed 1000 watts!)

For UVB, you want this:

https://www.petsmart.com/reptile/environmental-control-and-lighting/light-fixtures/arcadia-reptile-prot5-uv-b-kit-65058.html

The problem is that they are backordered everywhere. If you can find one, you want the 24" fixture, which takes a 22" bulb. You would need the 12% or 14%...not 6%.

When you are able to replace the merc vapor, you'll want to get an incandescent flood bulb...notice, flood, not spot. Try a 65 watt first, and raise or lower the bulb to get the right temp.

I don't know how long he will be able to stay in his new enclosure. Maybe you could start planning for the future by figuring out how you could double the width from 2 ft to 4 ft. You could make "doorways" for him to go from one side to the other side. They're smart...they learn things like that very quickly.

Awesome, thank you!

 

[KarenSoCal]

Well, it would be awesome if I actually posted the link! ?

Zilla Digital Temperature Controller https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08PC8NSB1/?tag=exoticpetnetw-20