Another nice November day here at the beach. This is Donald he is 3 years and 3 months old.
He is not normally this clean he got a coconut oil rub down today.
He is not normally this clean he got a coconut oil rub down today.Donald Today
- Thread starter Len B
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Another Beauty
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That's a good looking tortoise
Thank You, Donald and Thomas are proof that daily soaks aren't necessarily for smooth shell growth. Neither have been soaked past the age of 6 months. Even living outside during winter where the humidity in their houses seldom rises above 30%. Internal hydration works better than soakings. Think about it, in their natural habitat everyone says that they hatch out during the monsoon season. But the monsoon season only last for a short time. Then what?
Then they go underground and into little micro-climates where its humid. They also stop growing, or slow down significantly during the dry periods.
I read a paper on surveying sulcata numbers in the wild. In all their efforts, they resorted to relying heavily on collectors that lived in the area and familiar with hunting sulcatas. They said they would only try to count sulcata numbers in one month of the year - August when full monsoon. The rest of the year the sulcatas are underground in their burrows and rarely come out, and it was useless to try to find them.
I'm not advocating for people to stop soaking their tortoises which is a proven way to reduce pyramiding in all tortoises. Diet may not cause pyramiding but I believe diet can reduce it. We are feeding our tortoises things they they would never find to eat in their natural habitat. So we do the best we can with nutrition and moisture intake with what we have to work with. My situation is somewhat different than what most sulcata keepers deal with. But it's something I love doing even dealing with the sometimes super cold weather. When I got Walker as a hatchling in 1996 I had no thoughts about soaking him. I did notice he never drank water so along with his weeds and grasses I would give him different lettuces to eat not for the nutritional value, just for the moisture. Also I already had opuntia cactus growing he ate it, but at that time I didn't realize how beneficial it was for him. He has some pyramiding not extreme though. As the years passed I ended up raising more young and tried different ways of raising them. The most important thing is a hatchling getting started correctly right out of egg. Which I knew @Tom did that's why I wanted to raise one of his hatchlings. Donald is one of Walker's offspring and got the correct care right out of the egg also. I weighed Donald yesterday while taking the pics and he is 47 pounds.
DoubleD1996!
Well-Known Member
Looks great
Tomas Diagne reported similarly when he invited me to come to Senegal. He said that I should only come in June, as that is when the rainy season started. He said outside of the rainy season you could walk right by 100 sulcatas and never know they are there. He added that a couple few weeks after the start of the rainy season that the vegetation was impenetrable, noting that 12 men with machetes could chop all day and hardly get anywhere, and that vehicles could not even pass in some areas.
I feel it is important to note that few people have your understanding of tortoise needs, experience level with raising tortoises, and even fewer spend the time or give the attention to detail that you give. I really think that we could all learn some useful tips and tricks if you would type up a list of all the things you do and the attention to detail with all of those elements. The washcloth picture we previously talked about comes to mind, for just one example. The results of your efforts are obvious and fantastic, but I don't think most of us know what those efforts are. Without this knowledge, I worry that someone will read your statement about not soaking after a certain point, but not be doing all the things you are doing, and this would lead to a very different result than what you get.
I will try but sometimes I have a hard time explaining things using the keyboard. Some will be different than what is suggested here on the forum. I'll title it, Things I Do.
Winter has truly arrived here at the Beach. We got down to 20F last night. High temperature today was 40F but that doesn't slow down the sulcatas from their daily routines. With the shorter daylight hours and the cooler temps they are spending less time out to eat and drink. Donald has gained 4 pounds since his last weighing in the beginning of November.
Donald also eats the fallen leaves from this years trees just like his daddy Walker, who was out and about today also.
Donald also eats the fallen leaves from this years trees just like his daddy Walker, who was out and about today also.I know this to be true that the temp outside doesn't dissuade a sulcata from their plan for the day. Also, your comment on humidity was spot on as well. I lived in Liberia West Africa and recall the rainy season vs dry season as a young man.
I kept Stump very humid from months 3-9 between 80% and 100%. At month 9, Stump started sleeping 14 hours a day in a doggie bed -1- no/very low humidity. First thing in the morning it may eat but ALWAYS takes a 30-60 second drink of fresh water. Stays in the tote in my wife's office during the day, goes outside if its nice but then in the evening gets a warm soak, wood stove/which drys him/her out till about 105 degrees or so and then the doggie bed. In March Stump will be over 4 lbs, weighed 1736g this evening, and has no shell abnormalities. Eats grass/weeds and more recently walks past the Mazuri/greens in the morning if it's above 50 deg outside. I set up a cheap 13'x3' greenhouse are off of the 8'x8' enclosure so even on rainy days Stump is usually outside. Measured 82deg ground temp in the greenhouse today.
Probably the most valid point... exercise. This thing would graze, literally, 2-3 football fields of area in an afternoon. I experienced the when we took Stump to Orlando in January. Today Stump was all over the fenced back yard about 150'x80' or so and yesterday walked/grazed around the 1.5 acre properly with me in the cold. I used one of those stupid knitted things on his shell and another cut up Columbia jacket -w- a 1/2 spent hand warmer and the carapace got as low as 75 until he didn't fight me to go inside and soak. All around 1.5 acres in 2.5 hours. Ridiculous.
The reason I soak is not for humidity but for warmth and getting dirt off and my wife or I watch Stump drink for a long time EVERY day. A tortoise drinking water I would say is the more important factor for hydration and as Tom indicated, nobody sees them in the wild before they're big. They are probably drinking from some source, not just absorbing moisture.
I can confirm that their instinct/behavior is to poop in their burrow because Stump goes in his box every day, not outside any more and has never pooped during a soak since hatching.
For the first time last week, Stump noticed that his main giant (Kathleen) wasn't in the office during the day and left the box to find her. Came into the living room by the wood stove and she was uncharacteristically napping on the couch.
Did the same thing this evening when she left the office at the end of the day.
Growth in all seasons seems to be constant. Dillsburg PA.
I kept Stump very humid from months 3-9 between 80% and 100%. At month 9, Stump started sleeping 14 hours a day in a doggie bed -1- no/very low humidity. First thing in the morning it may eat but ALWAYS takes a 30-60 second drink of fresh water. Stays in the tote in my wife's office during the day, goes outside if its nice but then in the evening gets a warm soak, wood stove/which drys him/her out till about 105 degrees or so and then the doggie bed. In March Stump will be over 4 lbs, weighed 1736g this evening, and has no shell abnormalities. Eats grass/weeds and more recently walks past the Mazuri/greens in the morning if it's above 50 deg outside. I set up a cheap 13'x3' greenhouse are off of the 8'x8' enclosure so even on rainy days Stump is usually outside. Measured 82deg ground temp in the greenhouse today.
Probably the most valid point... exercise. This thing would graze, literally, 2-3 football fields of area in an afternoon. I experienced the when we took Stump to Orlando in January. Today Stump was all over the fenced back yard about 150'x80' or so and yesterday walked/grazed around the 1.5 acre properly with me in the cold. I used one of those stupid knitted things on his shell and another cut up Columbia jacket -w- a 1/2 spent hand warmer and the carapace got as low as 75 until he didn't fight me to go inside and soak. All around 1.5 acres in 2.5 hours. Ridiculous.
The reason I soak is not for humidity but for warmth and getting dirt off and my wife or I watch Stump drink for a long time EVERY day. A tortoise drinking water I would say is the more important factor for hydration and as Tom indicated, nobody sees them in the wild before they're big. They are probably drinking from some source, not just absorbing moisture.
I can confirm that their instinct/behavior is to poop in their burrow because Stump goes in his box every day, not outside any more and has never pooped during a soak since hatching.
For the first time last week, Stump noticed that his main giant (Kathleen) wasn't in the office during the day and left the box to find her. Came into the living room by the wood stove and she was uncharacteristically napping on the couch.
Did the same thing this evening when she left the office at the end of the day.
Growth in all seasons seems to be constant. Dillsburg PA.
